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Sarah
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Okay, my New Year's Resolution is to give up that mad feeling  that bubbles up inside me as I walk through the house viewing the mess. I usually have the baby in my arms and thus can't really do much about it. Unfortunately, I've gotten really mad in the past and yelled at the kids to come clean up their stuff. There must be a better way because I can't just let it pile up. The words "five minute room recovery" sends people running the other direction. My husband has no time or energy to lend a hand. I know there has to be lots of letting go that happens when you have a baby. Flylady's baby steps are a good idea, but I couldn't do the whole system because there were things like my sink that were the least of my problems. Large Family Logistics is even worse. I'm sorry but if I did that program we'd NEVER get anything done! I get seriously depressed when I go to her site. C'mon "town day"? Laundry day? Her kids must all take care of themselves. 
Does anyone have any tips towards establishing order without becoming insane? Sometimes I feel like I just can't get a grip and I so want to be cheerful most of the time.  What's wrong with me?
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Six boys ages 16, 14, 11, 7, 5, 2 and one girl age 9
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lilac hill
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Limited Flylady?
Set up your computer inbox and message rules to dump all the messages you do not want, just get a few? Would that be enough?
Without babies here I do not know how it would work.
I do appreciate the Flylady remark that partially cleaned/picked up is better than nothing.
Flylady suggests a shined sink but if that does not have enough impact for you, what would your "shined sink " be? A while ago for me it would be a couch without unfolded clothes or papers not all over every flat surface.
Here laundry day is every day--easier on a well and septic and town day coinsides with appointments and lessons.
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Viv
Wife to Rick (7/83), Mom to dd#1(6/87), dd#2(1/90), and dd#3(6/94) in central PA.
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TracyQ
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Flylady is wonderful, and so practical. But you don't have to USE it as written. You can adapt it to work for YOU, just like any curriculum we use!
I think the main things I've gotten from Flylady are:
*Keep your sink shiny (it really does give you a boost)
*Get yourself ready for the day (she says dressed to the shoes), when you get up, but the point is that you're much more productive if you are dressed and ready for the day
*Keep your *hotspots* clear. The flat surfaces that attract clutter will make your home look more cluttered, and will make you feel more frustrated. So if you clear them off DAILY, you will feel better, and will be less frustrated
*Plan ahead and be prepared as much as possible. If you have a simple menu plan, and stick to it,for example, you'll eat out less, save money, and feed your family more nutricious meals (at least more nutricious than McDonald's!)
*BABY STEPS!!! You need to develop habits slowly, and deliberately. Don't try to do too much at once. That's a recipe for failure. Move in baby steps, making progress slowly, but surely. Developing habits is the key!
*NO GUILT! START from where you are! If you are a perfectionist, you won't even start, and will become overwhelmed easily. Don't worry about perfect, just make it lovely.
I think those are the main themes of Flylady!!!
__________________
Blessings and Peace,
Tracy Q.
wife of Marty for 20 years, mom of 3 wonderful children (1 homeschool graduate, 1 12th grader, and a 9th grader),
 homeschooling in 15th year in Buffalo, NY
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Sarah
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You know, after rereading Tracy's description of Flylady, I guess I did get more out of it than I realized. Maybe I was expecting too much of myself-I couldn't get the hour of cleaning/week. I guess my sink thing could be the family room swept because that drives me crazy and its not really that hard!
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Six boys ages 16, 14, 11, 7, 5, 2 and one girl age 9
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mary
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| Posted: Jan 03 2006 at 5:51am | IP Logged
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i found flylady to be overwhelming, especially with a new baby in arms. have you looked at motivated moms? she's a hsing mom and the list of chores are pretty easy. I've been using her plan for almost 3 years and it really has changed how i view housecleaning as well as how clean my house actually is at any given moment.
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Erin
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Sarah,
What is it that depresses you the most? For me I always feel immensely better if I make my bed. That is a start. And I always feel better if the floor is picked up and better yet swept. I can handle clutter on benches for a time. Another woman couldn't. I have friends who can't handle mess in the kitchen, I can for short periods of time.
It wasn't until I had my fifth child that I finally started to get a grip on these sort of issues. I agree Fly lady etc sounds good but not for me. The above and washing my dishes were the first big steps for me and the de-cluttering bought bigger changes in getting my house in order.
Hang in there and keep trying to see what works for you. Actually Terri Maxwell's book, "homeschooling with a Meek and Gentle spirit' bought big changes for me. There was a comment that she made that if something angered you in relation to mess, find a solution ie. she gave the example of shoes etc. in the foyer really bugged her. Her solution was to build cubbyholes for each child to tidy the mess. The second part of her message()I may paraphase incorrectly here) was if its not worth finding a solution too then its not worth getting mad over. This forced me to do something about my problems. (I'm not a consistent person by nature nor training).
Best of luck Sarah.
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Erin
Faith Filled Days
Seven Little Australians
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Mary Chris
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We set up our Peg System yesterday. We will see how it works.
In my laundry room I bought this bookcase . I added some dish pans to sort each kiddos clothes. So far it is working well. I like that I can hand them a dishpan of their pants and have them take it up, put it away, them return the empty dishpan and get the next one. I think it is easier than a huge laundry basket full of clothes
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Blessings, Mary Chris Beardsley
mom to MacKenzie3/95, Carter 12/97 Ronan 3/00 and wife to Jim since 1/92
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Mary Chris
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Let's see if it works this time......bookcase
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Blessings, Mary Chris Beardsley
mom to MacKenzie3/95, Carter 12/97 Ronan 3/00 and wife to Jim since 1/92
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TracyQ
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Sarah,
I forgot to mention yesterday too, that I *tweaked* Flylady to work for me by changing the DAILY ZONES to work for our house, something I'm sure she'd say *Yay! You've got the idea!* to!
For instance, we don't have a Dining Room, so that zone would make no sense for us. For my little home, I changed the zones for the DAYS that work best for me depending upon my schedule at this time (depending on easier days vs. more busy days, etc.), and for the rooms that make the most sense to do in those days.
For example, the Kitchen wouldn't make sense on Wednesdays, because we have guitar lesson in the afternoon, and choir at night. So a LESS labor intensive room is more important to put on Wednesdays.
I also did that for the MENU PLANNING that I do each week. If Wednesday for example is my more busy day, I would always plan for a crockpot meal that day.
These small changes to really think about what makes the most sense really makes a huge difference!
My Zones for example are:
Monday- Kitchen
Tuesday-Living Room/Front Entrance (our front entrance
is part of the living room, and small)
Wednesday- Bedrooms
Thursday- Bathrooms/Hallway
Friday- Schoolroom/Office (same room)
Saturday- Basement/Garage/Outside Work (switching off)
Sunday- Day of Rest (daily upkeep only)
Then I took each zone in OUR unique home, and decided on what needed to be done. I seperated it into DECLUTTERING, and CLEANING that needed to be done in that zone each week.
For example:
Monday- KITCHEN:
DECLUTTERING:
Counters, microwave, table, printer, computer desk (this is clearing the hotspots they become each week)
CLEANING:
counters, windows and windowsills, floor, oven (top and inside), and microwave (inside)
This is just an example of what I did for each *Zone* (area) for each day. This way, each room gets special attention once each week, and will be much easier to keep up once the house (in baby steps) gets organized and cleaner.
Then I came up with my DAILY UPKEEP (that makes sense to our home):
Dishes, Laundry, Daily pick up, Pet care, Bathroom wipe down, Schoolroom/Office pick up
DAILY PAPERWORK/CORRESPONDANCE:
Monday - Thurs.- emails, make calls, and appointments
Friday and Saturday- emails, make calls and appts., budget/pay bills, menu plan/grocery list for week ahead, put away school papers into binders, and schoolbooks away, school planning for next week
Some of these things are in the kids' chore lists to do, so I also enlisted the help of the kids to help with upkeep of this house.
I've tried SO many things over the years....Managers of Their Homes, and read countless books on organizing(some excellent and wonderful), and tried to implement them exactly as written.
There's one thing I realized. There is not one perfect system that works for me. And when I thought about that, I realized that it's because we are all SO unique, SO different in where we are in our lives. Some people have babies, some have toddlers, some have older children, some have none. Some work full time, some work part time, etc. Some people have huge homes, some have tiny homes, some have medium homes. Everyone's home is set up differently. Some people have home businesses, some go out to work, some people have really busy lives, constantly out of their home for many reasons, some are home more often. Some people have *perfectionism* to block their way, some are more lazy, and just don't like to clean or organize, some people are extremely organized, some are in between. Some people's husbands are really neat as a pin, some have more slobbish personalities, and same goes with the kids. The variables are endless! 
So when I figured out what would work best, I realized that nothing works best! I realized that what it took for REAL CHANGE first and foremost was a DECISION for ME to implement REAL CHANGE in our home.
THEN, I decided that the only way it could possibly work is if I implemented something that would work for our particular situation.
For example, we live in a TINY home. So I can do the living room and front entrance on the same day. Someone who had huge rooms may not be able to. My organization and the set up in our home must use more vertical storage, and I have to find solutions to use every space in a very clever way.
I am a *perfectionist*, which is something I have to work against every single day. I get very easily overwhelmed, so I need something that will develop habits in small, easy steps, so that I can LEARN how to not be a perfectionist, and accept the situation the Lord has given to me.
My family tends to be not very neat. I wouldn't say they're big slobs, but many doors are left open, and glasses not taken to the kitchen (not for lack of my teaching them, that's for sure!). So I constantly have to work against that as well.
We are a pretty busy family, with many activities, so I have work on creating the balance here and therefore, I know I also have to create something more simple, that will work for our situation.
In our home, the biggest clutter is PAPER clutter, so that's something I have to build into our system, knowing that's what we battle each day.
So these are just some of the things that are unique to our home, and as I'm coming up with the changes we need to implement, I'm really looking at OUR unique situation, and what will work best for us, because I'm so easily influenced by so many other systems, books, etc. I'm taking the BEST of all of the systems I've tried, from online systems,articles, and websites, from magazine articles or books I've read, and am using the information I've learned to come up with our unique system that will work here.
I think that people who write these articles, books, and systems they come up with are SO EXCITED about them, because they are the unique system that they came up with for THEIR unique situation!
I just wanted to show you how I've come to do what we're doing here. I think Flylady is wonderful, and practical, and works great for many people! But I don't think her system *as written* works for everyone either because of our different situations. That's why I've *tweaked* her system, and implemented others to find what works best for us.
I hope this helps!
__________________
Blessings and Peace,
Tracy Q.
wife of Marty for 20 years, mom of 3 wonderful children (1 homeschool graduate, 1 12th grader, and a 9th grader),
homeschooling in 15th year in Buffalo, NY
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JennGM
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Tracy,
I'm not Sara, but all your details really helped me! Thanks for taking the time. Now my big question, how much time did it take you to figure this all out? That's my hardest thing, finding the chunk of time to organize my organization!
I still haven't finished my meal planning, because I needed some clear blocks of time to get my recipes together! My perfectionist tendencies want to do it right and completely done the first time. So if I'm menu planning and trying to remember all the chicken recipes that work for me, I want to make sure I was thorough and didn't miss any! I find I'm my own worst enemy!
And as for FlyLady, I do need to tweak it for me...but did you do that initially on looking her stuff over, or implemented it "as is" and then changed it?
I did take a Kitchen Planning workshop sponsored by Opus Dei Cooperators in Novemeber. This woman was EXTREMELY practical, many ideas that FlyLady promotes. But some things I took away that I apply all the time:
1) Even if you don't menu plan, at 8:00 pm or so, before closing the kitchen, stand in the middle of the room and think about what you will make for dinner tomorrow...even if it's only the initial decision of "ground beef". Take it out to defrost, and half your stress is gone. You'll have defrosted meat, and during the day you can "decide" how you can cook it.
2) Plan your grocery lists, but try to do your weekly shopping trips on Tuesday, Wednesday or Thursday. Never weekends, and Monday everything is depleted. This way you avoid the crowds and extra stress.
3)Some hints from her cleaning and organizing workshops I applied, too. Set aside a few hours to clean the house, such as Monday or Tuesday. Start in the upstairs. If you start downstairs, you won't be motivated to go back up since you don't "see" the mess.
That's all that's coming to mind....My biggest problem here is finding a place for everything. We still have a few boxes from our move I need to empty and put away and/or purge.
__________________
Jennifer G. Miller
Wife to  & ds1  '03 & ds2  '07
Family in Feast and Feria
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TracyQ
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Jenn,
17 years! (that's how long I've been married).
Truthfully, it's so long that I've had the perfectionism that has blocked my ability to get anything done. I would just get so overwhelmed if I couldn't do it perfectly. So I wouldn't do it at all.  The Lord has really been teaching me many lessons this past year. I really tried many things, but if I couldn't do it *perfectly as written*, then in MY mind, it didn't work.
Truth be told, it was ME that didn't work. And God impressed upon me something VERY important, I believe. It was that being a perfectionist can be sinful, because I'm not allowing God to do the work He has called me to do, according to the ability to which I have in order to do it. I'm not allowing HIM to perfect me, and make me more holy. So for me, it was definitely not a good thing.
I believe we're all so unique, and our homes and situations are unique. But no matter what, nothing would have worked until I made the decision to be OBEDIENT to Christ, and allow Him to work through me to live out my vocation the best I possibly could. I am still a work in progress, but have progressed more than ever since making the decision to say YES to God about making the necessary changes to live out my vocation.
Many, many resources have helped me in the area of making our home a haven. I consider them all tools, and a blessing from God:
Flylady
The Organizer Lady
Time Management for Catholics (book)
Getting it Done (book)
Organizing from the Inside Out (book)
Managers of Their Homes
But the one resource that spoke right to my heart was the book, A Mother's Rule of Life. THAT's the one that was instrumental in saying YES to living out my vocation out of obedience and love for Christ. And it was the one that was instrumental in my beginning to implement CHANGE out of love and obedience to Christ.
Changes in my body (losing 40 pounds so far), and our home (decluttering, changing rooms, decorating), my faith (studying, praying/devotion), etc.
For me, change in our home didn't come in one book,or one website or one system. It had to come straight from my heart. Unfortunately, I'm a slow learner, but it's a start!
__________________
Blessings and Peace,
Tracy Q.
wife of Marty for 20 years, mom of 3 wonderful children (1 homeschool graduate, 1 12th grader, and a 9th grader),
homeschooling in 15th year in Buffalo, NY
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lilac hill
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Jenn,
Like you it is the having "blocks of time" to do it completely that gets me off track. Just doing it in little bits, like meal planning (use what is in the freezer and what is on sale with an eye to chicken, beef, vegetarian, crock pot, and fun nights)has worked without all my recipes and grocery lists prepared.
we may not be haing the most exciting meals but it is better than trying to wing it at 5PM.
__________________
Viv
Wife to Rick (7/83), Mom to dd#1(6/87), dd#2(1/90), and dd#3(6/94) in central PA.
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amyable
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| Posted: Jan 03 2006 at 4:31pm | IP Logged
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Tracy, your posts have really touched me!
One thing I'm personlly searching for with creating order in my home is *simplicity*. I'm overwhelmed much of the time with how complicated my life seems. (note my avatar, lol)
I'm hoping that I can somehow glean from all this advice and bring the joy back into our home. Is that possible with 4 strong willed little girls with wildly varying needs?
__________________
Amy
mom of 5, ages 6-16, and happy wife of
The Highly Sensitive Homeschooler
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jdostalik
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Mary Chris,
That PEGS system looks great and isn't that much compared to other products I've looked at...Where did you hear about it?
__________________
God Bless,
Jennifer in TX
wife to Bill, mom to six here on earth and eight in heaven.
Let the Little Ones Come
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Erin
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TracyQ wrote:
| I realized that what it took for REAL CHANGE first and foremost was a DECISION for ME to implement REAL CHANGE in our home. |
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I second and third this Tracy. I read about ideas for years  It wasn't till I had enough of chaos that I managed to stick to my goals. I am not a perfectionist, I don't bother even aspiring to geet there. And now that there is some order in my life I am so much happier, I take pride in being organised, I'm not over the top though. And its amazing how much more I get done.
Jenn, you dream about planning your menu. Don't try to do the master plan straight away. Just plan one week of meals. If you shop fortnightly keep most of the same meals for the second week, just changing a couple of meals. Type the ingredients on the computer, this will help you later to have a grocery list to print out. Don't try to do it all at once. When I finally started doing mine I picked basic meals, ie. Roast for Sunday, chips for Friday and then fleshed it out. Thjey were constants then I picked all favourites and only added one experimental meal per week. Hey if unorganized me did it anyone can. (It only took me a couple of years dreaming about it )
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Erin
Faith Filled Days
Seven Little Australians
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Sarah
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These posts have been a blessing. I have really had a hard time in this department.
Someone asked me what really depressed me about my house: any block of time I have before someone really needs me is spent on picking up.
I can't find time for mopping, toilet scrubbing, vacuuming, etc. And thus it snowballs out of control. I only have time on the computer because I'm holding a sleeping baby whose eyes seem to pop open the minute he's put down . I love my children, but they are a five man wrecking crew!
My kids do help a lot, but there is really more than they can take on since my oldest is only 9.
I'm really going to pray in 2006 for the letting go of what's out of my control. (does this sound like an AA mtg?)
Sometimes I feel like everyone has discovered the secret and I'm a dunce. Both my husabnd and I aren't "cleanies" to begin with so we take on things that add to the chaos i.e a dog, a cockatiel, sewing, carpentry, weird gardening things, starting your own seeds with grow lights, etc. While I love the creative side but it does add more chaos.
I have a cleanie neighbor with small children who's house is neat and tidy, even with 3 small ones and she commented on how brave I was to just go out in my yard and dig up grass and plant something, as she bends over to get that one stray piece of mulch off her grass. I love her, though! Even though we are so different. She'd never bring a cockatiel home from Mass that she found in a bush in front of the church like I did!  I feel like we're the Beverly Hillbillies sometimes!
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Six boys ages 16, 14, 11, 7, 5, 2 and one girl age 9
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Erin
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Sarah,
You sound so lovely. Remember God made you the way you are, St Francis would smile at you. He also loves your neighbour but gave her different talents.
However I do empathise. You need some sort of manageble life. Yours will never be like your neighbours, nor would you want it to be, that takes a lot of energy. Its for her but not for you. Okay you spend a lot of time picking up, does every thing have a home? If not create one or throw it. I used to spend so much time moving my clutter but I minimised it, room by room. Don't think however I am a clutter free person, I'm not but I have less than I did. It's manageable and when it starts spiralling out of control again its time for another purge.
Do you have set times for picking up? Not being a super neat nic I have one time in the day ( I know some families have many little cleanups throughtout the day) I'm satisified to start the day and end it with a fairly neat house. In between I live with it. At 5pm we do 'area jobs' every child has a living area to attack and I rove helping to make sure they also clean clutter. Garbage goes out at this time and the compost.
Toilets, bathrooms well they are a joke. Sarah I'm sure I'd be comfortable in your home.
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Erin
Faith Filled Days
Seven Little Australians
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JennGM
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lilac hill wrote:
Like you it is the having "blocks of time" to do it completely that gets me off track. Just doing it in little bits, like meal planning (use what is in the freezer and what is on sale with an eye to chicken, beef, vegetarian, crock pot, and fun nights)has worked without all my recipes and grocery lists prepared. we may not be haing the most exciting meals but it is better than trying to wing it at 5PM.
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This is where I am right now, but I feel like I'm always having to think it up...reinventing each week. I'm looking forward to go into more automatic pilot on the meals....have a few weeks planned and do rotations. I have Saving Dinner to get a feel, but because of our food allergies, I still have to start at square one.
Thanks for all the encouragement and advice. I guess I am on the right track, it's just slow going!
__________________
Jennifer G. Miller
Wife to & ds1 '03 & ds2 '07
Family in Feast and Feria
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TracyQ
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Oh wow! There are so many ways to do meal planning. It's one of the most difficult things, isn't it?
One thing I did that helped was to make up a three week plan, and then rotate, as someone mentioned here. You could do a 4 week one or any # of weeks that works. I also did a Spring/Summer meal plan, and a Fall/Winter, because we eat very differently in each of these times of year.
That did work, but I had to be flexible, because things come up, and change.
Lately, I've been just writing out the days of the week on the left side of a piece of filler paper, with the dates beside it. Then I look at the calendar, and write notes about what we have that next week. Then, I write below all the meat I have in the freezer, look at the ads to see what's on sale, and then make up a plan according to the week we have ahead.
On the really busy days, I use the crockpot. The busier the week, the more simple the meals. And then I make the grocery list from that meal plan, and add in all of the other things we need for that week.
It's simple, but effective for us. This has always been one of my challenges. Thankfully, it's helped us to eat out less, and saved us some money, though, I must admit, this season, we've eaten out a bit too much.
Tracy
__________________
Blessings and Peace,
Tracy Q.
wife of Marty for 20 years, mom of 3 wonderful children (1 homeschool graduate, 1 12th grader, and a 9th grader),
homeschooling in 15th year in Buffalo, NY
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JennGM
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Sarah wrote:
Someone asked me what really depressed me about my house: any block of time I have before someone really needs me is spent on picking up.
I can't find time for mopping, toilet scrubbing, vacuuming, etc. And thus it snowballs out of control. I only have time on the computer because I'm holding a sleeping baby whose eyes seem to pop open the minute he's put down . I love my children, but they are a five man wrecking crew!
My kids do help a lot, but there is really more than they can take on since my oldest is only 9. |
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9 in my opinion is old enough to be helping out. My opinion comes from my own experience as an oldest child. If you let them, your children can help set the table, clear the table, clean dishes (DW), unload dishes, sweep the floor, clean their clutter, make their beds....and bathrooms. Teach the kids how, and they can do it. Wasn't there another thread about this? Give them Clorox wipes to wipe down the toilet, around the toilet, the sink, the door handles. Give them a checklist for morning chores, dinnertime routines, before bed pickup.
Since I don't have older ones, I'm only passing on what I hear from others and what I've read. But it's letting go a bit of our perfectionism to teach the child adult responsibilities and then allowing them to do it...sometimes it won't be done to our specifications completely, but isn't it better than nothing done at all? Plus, and it's a big plus, you're not fighting the battle alone. It's not all your mess. It's all in the family. It does create anger and resentment if you're being Supermom and doing it all.
I would also if (big IF) you can find the time, reduce the amount of clutter, and try to find homes for everything. Montessori classrooms have Many, many manipulatives, but when you walk in, the room is neat as a pin, because everything has its place. And the children are taught to put something away before they get the next thing out. Since most of yours are little, this is the time to train. Mine is still a work in progress, but we're aiming for it.
I just spent this week weeding out toys and clothes that are 1) not used 2) outgrown and 3) duplicates. Some I've shelved for later, but I'm trying to reduce MY own anger in picking up. I did it in piecemeal, very small snatches of time, so it wasn't an overwhelming project.
And, though it sounds harsh, my mother used a method that was effective on us. She had many littles, and couldn't handle constantly picking up OUR mess, so after several warnings and chances, she would pick up anything left out and put it in a plastic bag. These she would hold the items hostage for a while until we reformed a bit.
Mopping -- get a wet Swiffer to hit the hot spots. You don't need to mop all the time.
Don Aslett is the King of Clean and fast. I really like his cleaning supplies and tools. He has some great hints on doing things well but fast. I think Large Family Logistics praises the mop system. Check out some of his books on decluttering and cleaning. VERY helpful.
I'm just jotting down ideas, Sarah. My house isn't immaculate and I'm struggling keeping up with just one child, so ignore anything that seems irrevelant or impertinent.
__________________
Jennifer G. Miller
Wife to & ds1 '03 & ds2 '07
Family in Feast and Feria
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4Real Forums : Tea and Conversation
Topic: Steps toward order
