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melanie
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My 5yo has always been a sweetie and not usually given us much in the way of discipline problems. But lately he is going through a more aggressive phase...pulling the cats' tails, hitting siblings when he's mad, etc. We have been using time outs, that's our "default" for such things, but frankly I think we are wasting our time. I don't think he gets time outs. He can never tell us why he was put in time out, and he gets very upset about it and has to be held in the chair, etc. I told my dh today he might as well put the one year old in time out for all the good it does, but he (dh) wants something else to do instead. I have just been kind of correcting him verbally, having him apologize, and then distracting him with something else, but I think dh thinks this isn't enough. Neither method seems to be changing the behavior so far in any case.  Any thoughts?
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Melanie
homeschooling Maria (13yo), Kain (10yo), Jack (5yo), Tess (2yo), and our newest blessing, Henry Robert, born 4/23!
slightlycrunchycatholic.blogspot.com
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Kathryn
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It sounds like what you're doing is right: correcting him, having him apologize and then distraction...it could just take time and he could just take longer to "get it" since he's autistic. My son isn't diagnosed as autistic (we think his is something else) but he def. needs LOTS of reminders. But staying consistent is your best ally.
Your 5yo may be too young but my 9 1/2 yo sometimes has to write sentences depending on what he did. It could be something like: I will be kind to animals (siblings etc.); I will walk away when angry. If you think your son could even write that 1x, you might consider adding that to what you're doing if your DH wants to see more action. Sometimes we'll have him write a short Bible verse that applies to the action we are seeking.
Hope that helps,
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Taffy
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You're doing the same thing that I did with mine at that age. What you're doing will work but, as Kathryn said, it does take time. Consistency is VERY important.
One thing that I also did which proved effective was to teach the appropriate way of behaving. For instance, my son had a tendency to be very rough with the cat. After being disciplined for it, we would practice petting the cat nicely. I would also make a point of practicing how to be nice to the cat before my son had a chance to be rough. (I'd try and intervene as soon as he approached the cat and direct his interaction into a positive one.)
This emphasis on showing the proper way to behave proved to be very important in dealing with my son's rough treatment of his siblings when they were babies. I was at my wits' end when it was suggested that we practice with dolls how to treat the baby nicely.
Good luck! It's a long road but, with consistent discipline, it does get better.
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melanie
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No, he can't write at all yet. I do use the sentences for my 9yo though. :) It must be effective because he acts like it's a fate worse than death. 
The doll is a good idea. We are having a baby in April, so we should start practicing that soon!
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Melanie
homeschooling Maria (13yo), Kain (10yo), Jack (5yo), Tess (2yo), and our newest blessing, Henry Robert, born 4/23!
slightlycrunchycatholic.blogspot.com
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Willa
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Taffy wrote:
| One thing that I also did which proved effective was to teach the appropriate way of behaving. For instance, my son had a tendency to be very rough with the cat. After being disciplined for it, we would practice petting the cat nicely. I would also make a point of practicing how to be nice to the cat before my son had a chance to be rough. (I'd try and intervene as soon as he approached the cat and direct his interaction into a positive one.) |
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We used to do the same thing! I'd forgotten. We'd walk him through the correct behavior again and again so it was sort of like "muscle memory".
And we'd also put it together with a key phrase like "be kind to the cat" which we'd sort of sing-song (because he had some auditory processing difficulties plus being partially deaf, so saying things in a distinctive tone helped him key in better).
Then as time went by just the sing-song would remind him.
Yes, it took a LONG time. We had to be vigilant and jump in as soon as he approached the cat or whatever.
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Willa
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Taffy
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Oh yes, Willa, I forgot to mention our little phrases that we'd practice. My son had a bad habit of screaming for a while (as a 6-9 year old). He'd have to stop, head into the laundry room for a time out and be quiet for a whole minute, longer if he was really being obnoxious. When I would come to let him out he had to repeat, "Screaming is bad. I will use my inside voice." I don't know how much it helped but am very glad that he doesn't scream very often now.
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melanie
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That's great, tacking a little phrase to it would probably work great for him. He has these kinds of verbal tics anyway, where he'll latch onto phrases and repeat them over and over. Might as well make it something useful...as opposed to the recent one he picked up from a Looney Tunes episode, "lop-eared galoot". 
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Melanie
homeschooling Maria (13yo), Kain (10yo), Jack (5yo), Tess (2yo), and our newest blessing, Henry Robert, born 4/23!
slightlycrunchycatholic.blogspot.com
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Taffy
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Aren't those verbal tics funny? When LB was about 5 or 6, he was still pretty much non-verbal. His way of letting us know he was hungry was to chant the Subway slogan, "Subway, Eat Fresh!"
Don't ask us how long it took us to figure this out.
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melanie
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Heehee...
Jack used to say, often during mass, "BUUURRRRPPP! I'm an ogre!" Which apparently he got from some Shrek happy meal toy.
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Melanie
homeschooling Maria (13yo), Kain (10yo), Jack (5yo), Tess (2yo), and our newest blessing, Henry Robert, born 4/23!
slightlycrunchycatholic.blogspot.com
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Kathryn
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melanie wrote:
No, he can't write at all yet. I do use the sentences for my 9yo though. :) It must be effective because he acts like it's a fate worse than death.
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DITTO! I like the idea of having them verbally say the phrase too. I prob. should do that w/ my son b/c he does seem to have the auditory processing problems and that would prob. be more beneficial than the punishment of sentence writing. Sometimes it's hard to separate discipline from punishment. I suppose discipline would be to have him say the phrase and punishment for more severe infractions that he does on PURPOSE would be the sentences. I always try to look for intent but I think I forget that in the "heat of the moment" when I'm mad about whatever has occurred and start doling out sentences to get cooperation.
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Willa
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melanie wrote:
| Might as well make it something useful...as opposed to the recent one he picked up from a Looney Tunes episode, "lop-eared galoot". |
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LOL -- mine used to say "Get lost, you little brat!" (I think he got it from a Pokemon cartoon). We always wondered if people would think he got that from us  .
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Karnak
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Hi Melanie
I would be tempted to try Social stories with your son an see if that helps him understand why some things are not done. I am just venturing into this with my ASD son of 9.
There is a raft of helpful resource online, Wha tis more use to most ASD kids with photos of their own home and things taken with a digital camera to illustrate the social story
http://www.child-autism-parent-cafe.com/how-to-write-a-socia l-story.html
http://www.child-autism-parent-cafe.com/stress-on-families.h tml
http://www.child-autism-parent-cafe.com/after-school-I-can.h tml
http://www.ehow.com/how_4479088_write-social-stories-childre n-autism.html
http://www.ehow.com/how_2255108_write-aspergers-other-behavi or-issues.html
do2learn.com- FREE Picture Cards to use to make social stories.
setbc.org- PictureSET is a collection of downloadable visual supports that can be used by students for both receptive and expressive communication in the classroom, at home, and in the community. This searchable database allows you to find a wide range of useful visual supports for different curriculum areas, activities, and events.
I am hoping Deborah wh has 3 kid with ASD might have good advice for both of us
Karnak
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melanie
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Thanks, Karnak,
I remember reading about social stories a couple of years ago and had forgotten about that...that's something worth trying for sure.
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Melanie
homeschooling Maria (13yo), Kain (10yo), Jack (5yo), Tess (2yo), and our newest blessing, Henry Robert, born 4/23!
slightlycrunchycatholic.blogspot.com
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StephG
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Ahhh the joys of raising autistic children. DD 17 was diagnosed when she was between 2.5 and 3, after she stopped using words or being interested in her "Muppets" toys. To this day discipline can unfortunately be an issue.
She is now completely non-verbal, but understands the more basic and regular things (i.e. supper time, do-do (time for bed) etc.) For others we need to use either signing or PECS.
She's on pretty heavy-duty medication at the moment to help control physical violence. Unfortunately, this medication has also made her gain quite a bit of weight. Weight + strength when angry = mommy's wrist being broken a couple of times.
However, we have found one method (finally) that seems to work as a consequence to negative behavior. We take her music away. Now, you have to understand that DD without music is like a fish out of water. It doesn't take very long before she either a)comes and gives me (or person in question) a hug, or falls asleep.
Now I'm not sure what I had to say here would be much help to you, but just know you aren't alone. I'll pray for guidance and an easy solution for this "issue" for you.
God bless!
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Steph
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Patiently waiting to meet 9 more who have already gone home.
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mom3aut1not
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I don't know if I can contribute much, but .... here's my experience with three ASD kids.
The oldest ASD kid has never needed a lot of correction other than discussion. (She's my easiest kid. Really.)
The middle ASD kid was rather a handful. At three, a neuropsychologist said that she was "one of the two or three most noncompliant children" he'd ever seen. Coercion does *not* work with this now adult and did not work with her as a child. You can't force her to do anything without using criminal amounts of force.
Most of her difficult behaviors were the result of being overwhelmed, not understanding, or sensory issues. However, she will do for love what you cannot force her to do. Also, offering her choices helps a lot along with the "21 Day Agreement." I guess what worked with her was managing her environment, teaching, and managing her choices. (And the "21 Day Agreement" was a critical tool in my bag of tricks.)
Now, my little ASD child. Now, first of all, he is more aggressive than his sisters although he is also very sweet. Every so often he seems to test the boundaries, including mildly aggressive behavior. (I have also noticed that if he is very hungry, his behavior degrades noticeably and improves very quickly when he is fed.)
When he was little (and did not "get" timeouts), we would physically although gently restrain him for a very short time. He got the message. Now we use natural consequences (if he misbehaves at Cub Scouts, he may have to leave) or loss of privileges. These are big deterrents to him. I also try to work on social skills and social understanding as part of his homeschool. One of the things we are currently trying to teach is losing or winning with grace. This is definitely a long-term project! (It's wonderful that Cub Scouts has a Webelo badge for Sportsman that includes these as part of Good Sportmanship. Have I mentioned how much I love Cub Scouts?)
He has entered puberty (sigh) and I am trying to stay on top of this as I don't want problems to develop. I do have some materials on hand (No More Meltdowns, The Social Skills Picture Book, The Five-Point Scale, and The Way to A) that I plan to use or have used.
Melanie, fwiw, I think you are on the right track. You might want to consider the situation a little more. Are there specific conditions that make things worse? Can you manage his environment or choices? (I know that might be very, very hard.) Also, behavior (outside of adolescence or a new situation) that degrades is sometimes a signal of... something. Or it might just be that he is doing more *stuff* as he gets bigger and more capable without really comprehending the effects of his actions. (Or like one autie I knew, he might be enjoying having a predictable even if negative response. This kid was thrilled to get a consistent response to his hitting another child even if it was being hit and getting scolded. It was the only reaction from another child that he could predict.)
Hope something I have written helps.
In Christ,
Deborah
Who has to run off right now and hopes there are no typos
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4Real Forums : Special Blessings
Topic: autism and discipline
