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Leonie
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I know this is a weird topic on an unschooling forum  , but I went to a homeschool conference on the weekend. Heard John Taylor Gatto speak. Managed to pick up a copy of the bookThe Latin Centred Curriculum.
Now, I have only perused parts of the book - need to find time for some more serious reading. 
But I like some of the ideas - introducing children to the ideas of others from the past, nature study for science, doing a few things rather than trying to do it all.
So, how does ths fit with unschooling? Or am I totally insane, to be drawn to both unschooling and classical education ( and Charlotte Mason?).
Is there a connection anywhere? 
I'm just pondering because I like the passion of unschooling with the living books and good habits of CM and the idea of Latin and the classics from a classical education...
So, our education tends to be a mish-mash of ideas, and I wondered if others share this mish-mash?
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Leonie in Sydney
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Leonie
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| Posted: June 03 2007 at 9:37pm | IP Logged
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Replying to my own message - here is a link to Lissa's blog and her take on the connections between Latin centred education/CM/unschooling...
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Leonie in Sydney
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jugglingpaynes
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There's nothing wrong with having an eclectic style. I draw my inspiration from many sources, so I've started considering us classically unschooled. It's the only way to make sense of what happens here. 
I loved the idea of teaching the kids Latin, but without a working knowledge of Latin, it was hard for me to do. I used Martha Wilson's Latin Primer for two years based on the recommendation from the Well-Trained Mind, but the second year was very difficult for my kids and they were quickly learning to hate Latin. We've probably used every Latin resource available, including Minimus, Lingua Latina, Fairy Tales in Latin, Learning Latin Through Mythology and a Latin picture book series by Marie Carducci Bolchazy you can see here
I've found that if I present things in an interesting way, my kids respond with interest. If I am enjoying the material, they usually will too. The beauty of homeschooling is not being locked into one teaching method.
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Leonie
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| Posted: June 05 2007 at 1:29am | IP Logged
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Hi Cristina, and thanks for your comment.I agree with your statement re not being locked into any one way of educating...
I am enjoying the LCC book and realizing, as I have said elsewhere on this board , that I am less interested in a LCC than I am in reading about education and finding inspiring ideas to add to our family's educational fare.
In this sense, I am finding LCC helpful .I've had a fun time searching the net for classical unschooling and added some thoughts to my blog. And probably some ideas to our melting pot homeschool/unschool... Now, enough philosophy ~ I'm off to deliver the local newsapers with the two youngest sons.
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Kristie 4
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In our home these three approaches are compatible. We enjoy Latin enjoy Math (mostly  ), enjoy Art and Nature Study and loads of living books which we muse through at our own speed depending on interest.
As Willa posted on another topic, if I enjoy the material I am using than my children are more apt to! We don't do these things every day (or every week) but as we get into our groove they seem to complement each other.
For a while we focused more on history and the basics and then one day my dd came to me and told me how she missed memorising poetry and reproducing the masters (this is my highly artistic one) and I realised how much we were missing the CM flavor we had had since our beginning. Now we pull out the poetry books more often, have more fine art hanging around etc. and all that beauty juices us (especially me!!)
Leonie, I loved hearing how you like reading about education and finding ideas to add to your generous table- I need to remind myself of this. Often when I read something new, like the LCC, I want to adopt it hook line and sinker. And then watch out!! New plan+not enough forsight+ too many other peoples ideas+driven Mom= grumpy kids and atmosphere (in our house).
I am off to bed after a long and great day of celebrations with my now 10yodd!!
Kristie
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Leonie
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Kristie 4 wrote:
| Often when I read something new, like the LCC, I want to adopt it hook line and sinker. And then watch out!! New plan+not enough forsight+ too many other peoples ideas+driven Mom= grumpy kids and atmosphere (in our house).Kristie |
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Congrats on your dd turning 10! 
I can relate to reading a homeschool book and then wanting to change everything in my home. I learned the hard way that this just doesn't work!
Instead I glean and peg or build on what is already there...
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MarilynW
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I just read LCC - some good ideas there especially about fewer subjects. My question is re writing ( as usual!) - do any of you follow a structured progymnasmata?
Now getting ready for my 3rd year of homeschooling I am more wise about following one approach and sticking to it rigidly. I am maybe going to use the "Classical Catholic CM Unschooling" label that someone (cannot remember who) uses.
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JuliaT
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Leonie, I am a mish-masher, too. I tried to just stick with one method, but I guess I am just too much of a free spririt to stick with one way of doing something. I tried doing LCC two years ago but it just didn't work for us. I have come back to it in the past few months, but on a much more relaxed level. I guess you could say that we do an unschooling version of LCC.
There is a part of me that always comes back to classical. There is something in that method that strikes a deep chord with me. So I am attempting to meld the two of them together. It is working now, but I am not too sure if it will as my children get older.
Marilyn, I started doing the progymnasmata with my dd, but then we went down the unschooling trail so I have left it for now. I really like the idea of teaching writing that way, but I am definitely going to wait until my dd is much older.
Blessings,
Julia
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http://www.homeschoolblogger.com/Juliainsk
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Leonie
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MarilynW wrote:
| I just read LCC - some good ideas there especially about fewer subjects. My question is re writing ( as usual!) - do any of you follow a structured progymnasmata? |
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I haven't- we haven't used any one thing in particular for writing, just good books and lots of writing and bits and pieces of different curricula. I guess very similar to the Bravewriter approach, but with grammar mostly learned alongside Latin and real writing.
Not very classical, more unschooling, but the good books and discussion and writing still makes us seem to take part in the Great Conversation.
I think you could ask about the progymnasmata at the classical or language arts forum and get more responses.
BTW, I like the term you used, blending a description of unschooling and classical and CM.
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Leonie
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JuliaT wrote:
Leonie, I am a mish-masher, too. I tried to just stick with one method, but I guess I am just too much of a free spririt to stick with one way of doing something. I tried doing LCC two years ago but it just didn't work for us. I have come back to it in the past few months, but on a much more relaxed level. I guess you could say that we do an unschooling version of LCC.
There is a part of me that always comes back to classical. There is something in that method that strikes a deep chord with me. |
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Julia, I think we have similarities - enjoying the idea of a classical education and of living books and of unschooling, but not wanting to be constrained within a One Right Way approach. I know I enjoyed your blog posts on your adaptations of the book A Thomas Jefferson Education.
I have come to the conclusion that I like reading about education, I like discussing this with others - keeps me thinking, keeps me inspired, I share my thoughts with dh and the kids, I avoid the trap of educational complacency.
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Leonie
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Okay, I can't help but add more to this thread.
I am resting from surgery right now and reading the rest of Campbell's LCC book. I must admit that it is making me feel peaceful - I see a connection between his "much not many" and Suzie Andres' book "Homeschooling with Gentlness" - which I dubbed the "little way" of unschooling.
The Latin Centred Curriculum book is not making me want to ( necessarily) follow a scope and sequence for classical education for my children. It is reminding me of the importance of reading, of reading aloud, of time to explore - and of not filling up time with many have tos. This seems to fit directly with Andres' take on unschooling.
Many other books that I have read on classical education strike me as "fillers of buckets" -but the sense I am getting from Campbell's book is not of filling buckets but of lighting fires ( to mis-quote Yeats! lol!).
So, I doubt that we will change much in the way we unschool, but I am inspired once again to blend our few have tos with the bulk of our day - movies, reading, music, reading, playing, reading,outings, doing, reading.....:-)
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Willa
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MarilynW wrote:
| I just read LCC - some good ideas there especially about fewer subjects. My question is re writing ( as usual!) - do any of you follow a structured progymnasmata? |
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I follow an unstructured progymnasmata. Love the progression and it fits nicely into my theories about how kids learn to write.
When I do a very formal writing curriculum, my kids don't do as well as when we move more gently. I was just thinking the other day that I have largely unschooled writing all along, because I like so few of the formal writing programs out there, and it has paid off. The older ones write well and think of themselves as writers.
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Cay Gibson
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Leonie,
I've been anxious to see this book since Lissa mentioned it and I have often started to order it then thought of how many times I've started to observe a Latin-centered curriculum and how many times it has flopped with me.
So I held off ordering it.
This weekend I visited a hs friend of mine who moved to Tx. We got to spend a lovely weekend gapping about hsing and the Catholic Mass and raising holy Catholic children and I begged her to join us here. It was as good as visiting with all of you.
Lo and behold, this book was sitting on her desk near the computer. So I got to look through it firsthand.
All I can say is I hope they have it at the Kansas HS Conference this weekend. It's on my list as a must-have.
And I agree with you. It seems to expand beyond just Latin/Classical and into CM/Literature/Unschooling. It's a well-rounded little book.
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Leonie
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Cay Gibson wrote:
| And I agree with you. It seems to expand beyond just Latin/Classical and into CM/Literature/Unschooling. It's a well-rounded little book. |
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Cay, interesting to see how we are attracted to similar books and ideas.
I have been reading a few articles at Campbell's site and find a few that help me ( at any rate) with my melding of classical, CM and unschooling .
Here is one ~ Advice to a Harried Homeschooler
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I just ordered LLC and I am so excited I did since reading about your thoughts, Leonie! I am so attracted to the concept of fewer subjects because I always feel less is MORE! We have been studying Latin but in a very gentle manner. I kept telling my husband I would love to just do latin, math and "gathering time" and then let the kids go free on the rest of the day. And lo and behold I see you guys talking about this book!
I also feel the children's interests are born out of them without my influence. For instance, I have one naturalist in the family that relaxes with field guides, keeps bee hives, has 16 chickens, and two goslings and completely cares for them all on his own(or with his syblings assistance.) I love outdoors but would never aspire to keep any animals on my own. I have another child that is building things constantly and is currently making a guitar. I informed him the other day that I have never built anything! He looked at me like I was crazy!('')
Thumbs up to all you unschoolers! You are my inspiration.
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Willa
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It's interesting because on the classical forum there was an LCC conversation going on that focused on the more formal side of LCC.
Probably how you read the book, eh? If you try to follow it exactly it might be school-at-home but if you just focus on the "streamlining" and "room for informal learning" ideas, then you can do it in a much more unschooling way.
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Cay Gibson
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I missed that thread, Willa. Thanks! Too bad I don't have time to play catch-up. Maybe when you and I get back and I have the book in hand.
Leonie, You and I do think a lot the same way. I see a contradiction between you and the book and I sense that I'll meet the same contradiction in myself.
But, perhaps, contradictions aren't all bad.
"Do I contradict myself?
Very well, then, I contradict myself; I am large—I contain multitudes. "
—Walt Whitman
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Me thinks the Winds of the Spirit are blowin' about...I remember the year MacBeth and Dr. Taylor, author of Poetic Knowledge spoke at our conference and this reminds me of the great talks they gave about about classic and unschooling education. Several years ago JT Gatto also spoke here, and he was so inspiring; moms if you want to convince your dh about unschooling/eclectic approach, take him to a Gatto talk. What is he up to anyway Leonie? I know he fell away from the faith...now he's one person I would
love to see return to the Church!
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Leonie
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WJFR wrote:
Probably how you read the book, eh? If you try to follow it exactly it might be school-at-home but if you just focus on the "streamlining" and "room for informal learning" ideas, then you can do it in a much more unschooling way.
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Definitely - in fact, Campbell himself talks about adapting the programme, at his website.
I liken to think I can read and glean and not necessarily HAVE to stick to one, pure educational style - so, does this cover the contradictions, Cay?
Of Scheduling and Summer reading
On Being a Braveheart
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mariB
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I love the response of someone who read Campbell's Of Scheduling and Summer Reading(paraphrased) "Looking for the perfect curriculum is like being in search of the Holy Grail."
I love it! I think we can all RELAX now:) You are BRAVEHEARTS!
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Topic: A Latin Centred Curriculum ?
