| Author | |
motherheart
Forum Rookie
Joined: May 24 2011
Location: California
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 83
|
| Posted: July 05 2013 at 6:35pm | IP Logged
|
 |
|
Hello everyone,
I hope this is the correct place for this post.
I have a question about school: What do you do when your child is S L O W at doing their work? For me, it is the 7th grade slowdown. My son hit it last year. We worked into the summer until I was about to scream for lack of a break. We started up again at the beginning of the school year and hea had about 4 weeks of work left before beginning 8th grade. So, now he'll finish 8th around Christmas time. He's doing about one week of work in two weeks. Help! Any advice?
My daughter did the same thing with 7th this year. She'll finish about Christmas time, too.
In the fall, I'll also have a 6th grader, a second grader, and a 4 year old doing some work, too.
Thank you in advance for prayers, sympathy, and advice!
__________________
Mary
Mom to  ds 16, dd 14, dd 13, ds 9, ds 6, and 4 in Heaven
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Mackfam
Board Moderator
Non Nobis
Joined: April 24 2006
Location: Alabama
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 14656
|
| Posted: July 05 2013 at 9:02pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
motherheart wrote:
What do you do when your child is S L O W at doing their work?
|
|
|
This could be because his work load is too heavy and/or the work assigned is too much for him, or because he is burdened with a lot of busywork that takes up excessive time, or he could be dawdling for another reason, thus meaning that he needs to work on good work habits.
In general, 7th grade boys aren't the most self-motivated individuals in the world!!  So, no doubt some of this is just that age.
I'd probably take a look at a few things first:
1) What am I asking him to complete on a daily basis?
2) Are the expectations realistic?
3) Is he struggling in an area that needs special attention and curbing of assignments?
4) How much busywork is being asked?
5) Is he struggling with his reading? Understanding it? Is it beyond his ability to understand right now?
6) Are his daily expectations spelled out clearly for him?
7) What are your lesson plans like?
8) Could a mortal person hope to complete the daily assignments as listed? Or, are there, in fact, two days worth of work listed under one day?
9) Could you drop a subject? Three?
10) Are your subjects compartmentalized so that the day is loaded with superfluous subjects?
11) Does he have enough free time to blow off some steam?
12) Is he getting plenty of outdoor time?
13) How about dad time? Is he spending worthy time with dad working on projects, doing manly work, getting "dad guidance"?
14) Have you considered just calling a year "good enough" and wrapping it up rather than checking every box for a given year? So that there is some down time in there.
15) Are you out of the home so often that he doesn't have time to sit down and complete his work?
16) What kind of distractions does he face during the day? Is he super visual and there are many visual distractions around him? (This can be a biggie for boys - and I definitely have some ideas for object distractions that have worked really well here!!!)
17) Does he have some quiet time during the day in which to get his work done? (And by the way, this is still possible even with your littles...a little more challenging to foster, but still possible.)
18) How about his workspace - does he have everything he needs for the day? Does he have to hunt for tools?
19) Does he have a space that is set aside for sitting down to do his work? Even if this is the kitchen table! Are you fastidious about clean-up after meals so that older children can sit down and get their work done without waiting on clean-up?
20) In reflecting on his 6th grade work, was there a huge jump in work expectations from 6th to 7th grade that perhaps caught him off guard, or even highlighted abstract thinking when he's not quite ready to think abstractly yet.
I'm just throwing out areas I'd look at - you don't have to answer all of these here (unless you just want to!). But these might get a few ideas rolling around for you. Often, half the problem is narrowing the issue down and really stepping back and just quietly observing what's going on.
Give us an idea of his work expectations and your home atmosphere and maybe we can help you narrow this challenge a little more!
__________________
Jen Mackintosh
Wife to Rob, mom to dd 19, ds 16, ds 11, dd 8, and dd 3
Wildflowers and Marbles
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
motherheart
Forum Rookie
Joined: May 24 2011
Location: California
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 83
|
| Posted: July 06 2013 at 12:45am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Thank you, Jen, for your detailed post. It gets me thinking on a lot of things I had not considered before.
1) What am I asking him to complete on a daily basis? He has religion, math, english, spelling (just 10 minutes a day), vocabulary, history, and geography.
weekly: reading comprehension, literature, and composition. I just added reading comprehension for shorter pieces to his schedule since he seemed to be having difficulty drawing out themes from his literature books.
2) Are the expectations realistic?
I think so. Some days there is more to complete than others. If he needs more time for something, I'll give him that (ie and extra week to write a paper). I feel sometimes that I've slacked off in my expectations too much and do not challenge him enough. When I told him he had to finish 2 days worth of assignments in 2 days to go to a sleepover at a friend's, he said that it wasn't possible. I told him that I knew he was capable of it and he needed to make the effort. He got all of his work done, and still had some time to spare. So, I know that he is capable of more than he is doing.
3) Is he struggling in an area that needs special attention and curbing of assignments?
I have done that some-doing lessons oraly instead of in writing. I think I need to work more one on one with him in math and in discussing what he is reading.
4) How much busywork is being asked?
I try to cut down on busywork; when he gets something, move on instead of beat a dead horse. But I'll have to be more attentive to this to see what more I can do that I am not aware of.
5) Is he struggling with his reading? Understanding it? Is it beyond his ability to understand right now?
He does seem to have some difficulty. He can be black and white. If hea has a question to answer "How did he fight in the war?" My son looks for "He fought in the war by..." in the text, where many the answer is usually found in the descriptions of what ocurred and he needs to interpolate what it means. He does not like doing that!
6) Are his daily expectations spelled out clearly for him?
Yes. He had a lesson plan page with each assignment listed.
7) What are your lesson plans like?
I made a grid listing each subject's assignments each day.
8) Could a mortal person hope to complete the daily assignments as listed? Or, are there, in fact, two days worth of work listed under one day?
I think I could increase time alotted for some assignments, but for others, see #2 response.
9) Could you drop a subject? Three?
I could drop one or two and reduce the workload on another 1 or 2.
10) Are your subjects compartmentalized so that the day is loaded with superfluous subjects?
11) Does he have enough free time to blow off some steam?
No.
12) Is he getting plenty of outdoor time?
No
13) How about dad time? Is he spending worthy time with dad working on projects, doing manly work, getting "dad guidance"?
Not enough; my husband works 6 days a week.
14) Have you considered just calling a year "good enough" and wrapping it up rather than checking every box for a given year? So that there is some down time in there.
I have thought about it, but my fear is that he'll think he can slack off during the year and if he doesn't finish by summer, he's done anyway. I want him to finish what he starts. I found a natural break in each of his subjects and told him that when those things were done he'd be on summer break. When we start school again, he'll finish 8th grade before moving onto 9th.
15) Are you out of the home so often that he doesn't have time to sit down and complete his work?
No--we're home during the school day.
16) What kind of distractions does he face during the day? Is he super visual and there are many visual distractions around him? (This can be a biggie for boys - and I definitely have some ideas for object distractions that have worked really well here!!!)
Hum...we all work in one room. The radio is one part of the day. Out littlest one (4 years old) can be distracting, though I try to keep him out of everyone's way. Other than siblings and a window, there aren't many visual distractions. He is a bit visual and loves to draw, but he is also auditory and loves to talk! I'd love to hear your ideas. I have to make sure he keeps his desk as clean as possible because he likes to clutter it up with drawings, books, and art projects that he tries to work on instead of doing schoolwork when I'm working with another child or out of the room.
17) Does he have some quiet time during the day in which to get his work done? (And by the way, this is still possible even with your littles...a little more challenging to foster, but still possible.)
Sometimes he'll go into another room to work, but I don't see a remarkable difference in the time it takes him to complete his work in the schoolroom or by himself, which means it makes no difference and/or he's not working on schoolwork.
18) How about his workspace - does he have everything he needs for the day? Does he have to hunt for tools? He usually has what he needs. The searching for items or needing to sharpen pencils seems to occur mostly when he is avoiding something specific...
19) Does he have a space that is set aside for sitting down to do his work? Even if this is the kitchen table! Are you fastidious about clean-up after meals so that older children can sit down and get their work done without waiting on clean-up?
Yes he does have his own desk space.
20) In reflecting on his 6th grade work, was there a huge jump in work expectations from 6th to 7th grade that perhaps caught him off guard, or even highlighted abstract thinking when he's not quite ready to think abstractly yet.
Perhaps; I'll have to think more about this one.
I'm just throwing out areas I'd look at - you don't have to answer all of these here (unless you just want to!). But these might get a few ideas rolling around for you. Often, half the problem is narrowing the issue down and really stepping back and just quietly observing what's going on.
Give us an idea of his work expectations and your home atmosphere and maybe we can help you narrow this challenge a little more!
Well, I did answer most of them. Thank you for taking the time to put them down for me to consider. You are right--narrowing them down makes a difference. I think I need to work more with him one on one, to initiate working with him more often rather than expecting him to come to me with questions or for help.
Thank you!
__________________
Mary
Mom to ds 16, dd 14, dd 13, ds 9, ds 6, and 4 in Heaven
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
motherheart
Forum Rookie
Joined: May 24 2011
Location: California
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 83
|
| Posted: July 06 2013 at 1:09pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
I was thinking more about this last night. He will stare off into space sitting at his desk. So, he's just wasting time, not working at all. He'll be diligent when it is a subject he thinks is easy, or when he has something he wants to do after school. He, like some of my other kids, seems to think things are too hard, he can't get it, etc. and go on and on about this instead of listening to directions and learning. They create a mental block, so to speak.
My older kids have karate 3 times a week. Sometimes he is as unmotivated there as at home with schoolwork
I wonder at how much this is my fault. Should I be sitting beside him every minute I'm not working with someone else? Should I be prompting him to keep going when he starts slowing down?
Anyway...just some more thoughts.
__________________
Mary
Mom to ds 16, dd 14, dd 13, ds 9, ds 6, and 4 in Heaven
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
pmeilaen
Forum All-Star
Joined: Sept 07 2008
Location: New York
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 565
|
| Posted: July 06 2013 at 1:20pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Have you ever asked your son why it's taking him so long? With that I mean asking him without criticizing him at the same time. And staring into space doesn't necessarily mean he is not doing anything. He might be thinking about things that are important to him, but they may not be connected to his assignments. Have you ever asked for his input in his assignments? Maybe he needs to talk about his work and doesn't do well when he is forced to work by himself at a desk. Another motivation might be enrollment in one of the Catholic homeschooling programs. If somebody else looks at his work he might put more effort into it. I have noticed that my teenagers are craving acknowledgement from other people for their work. Mother's input is still important, but they want more. Also, maybe there need to be more hands-on activities. Some children don't do well with just reading and writing. Does he have other children he would like to study with? That might also help.
__________________
Eva
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Mackfam
Board Moderator
Non Nobis
Joined: April 24 2006
Location: Alabama
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 14656
|
| Posted: July 06 2013 at 4:05pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Your answers really help, Mary! You're a great observer, and answering these kind of questions means you're halfway there in brainstorming this through!
Let's see...you've already observed:
motherheart wrote:
| I think I need to work more with him one on one, to initiate working with him more often rather than expecting him to come to me with questions or for help. |
|
|
I think you're on to something here, but I'm going to suggest that instead of sitting together and working that you let him do the work and instead you focus your energy on meeting with him - relationship building. My 7th grader, soon to be 8th grader son really does still need me as a partner, more so than his older sister did at this age and meeting together helps us build relationship, helps him know what he should do, and helps me know when there are issues I need to brainstorm.
I'm going to make a few other observations based on your answers. It all boils down to:
:: Keep assignments realistic, meaningful and efficient.
:: Build relationship by meeting together regularly
:: Adjust as needed
:: Use tools as leverage in your day
1) Keep assignments realistic, meaningful and efficient - He may not be ready for the abstract & complex type of assignment you're asking of him. An example would probably be found in the reading comprehension questions being asked of him. I am not a fan of them, especially for elem/middle school students. I do use them some in high school, when a student is clearly ready to draw conclusions based on the reading. So that is one area I'd cut - reading comp. questions. Instead, I would use narrations as a way of seeing what he understood. In case you're not familiar with it, it's simple - you ask him to tell you about what he just read. You don't ask for themes, symbolism, literary analysis, identification of the protagonist/antagonist (you can do all that a little later, when he's ready). Just ask him to tell you what he read, and enjoy his telling back.
motherheart wrote:
| I think I need to work more one on one with him in math and in discussing what he is reading. |
|
|
That's exactly what a narration leads to - more open-ended discussions. Narration promotes relationship building on top of cementing ideas of a book shared. All good things, especially with a growing son! AND...you'll notice that a narrations asks:
What DO YOU KNOW?
...instead of a reading comprehension question, which identifies...
What YOU DO NOT KNOW?
From there, I'd probably consider a book to walk through a Socratic Dialogue. Sound intimidating? It's not! It's essentially a narration that naturally transitions into a conversation. Again, it's all about relationship. Read more about how you can use Socratic Dialogue in your homeschool, and if you're interested, What is the Socratic Method?. And do read about Maureen Wittmann's Socrates Cafe'.
Literature and book choices - I might also reconsider the kind of literature you're giving him just to ensure that he will really enjoy it. Perhaps make sure you're giving him something really enticing to a boy - things like Men of Iron and Ivanhoe. You probably can't change mid-stream since you're trying to wrap up your year, but maybe consider this for next year. Get him involved in this decision, too. What are his interests and passions? What would he like to learn more about? Within the age appropriate literature choices, there has to be something that fits him!
Assignments & Language Arts - I'd probably drop english, vocabulary and spelling, too. I know not everyone is ready to do that, but if you're at the end of the year, perhaps you could just do this as a compromise: - Assign his literature reading for the day and give him a simple little notebook.
- As he's reading: ask him to write words he doesn't know the meaning of, as well as words he can't spell, in his book. (If you don't think he'll do this, spend 5 minutes skimming the chapter and write down some words you know he can't define/spell
- Let those be your spelling/vocab for the week.
- This should be no more than 5 - 8 words a week.
- Teach him how to use spellcheck (on the computer) and a thesaurus
This ties spelling and vocabulary in with his literature reading and gives it context. It's actually much easier than keeping up with 4 different programs for language arts. You use 1 piece of literature to replace: reading comp, spelling, vocab, and english (which you can easily discuss in small chunks as you discuss spelling and vocab.
So that gives him as daily assignments:
history
geography
religion
math
literature (which I'd make a daily subject and ask for narrations)
2) Build relationship by meeting together regularly - Your son can, and should, be a partner in mapping out his work, so that he can be on board about agreeing to the part of his work which is a discipline (have to do, instead of want to do). This means he knows what he's getting himself into, he's had some say in it, you've been reasonable about what you're asking, considered his requests (that doesn't mean you say yes to everything!), and both you and he agree on the plan for the year, term, week, and day. Your theme here is reasonable, not over-challenging.
motherheart wrote:
| When I told him he had to finish 2 days worth of assignments in 2 days to go to a sleepover at a friend's |
|
|
This is great - responsibility before privilege. He should not have electronics, tv, friend, party privileges UNLESS work is done.
motherheart wrote:
| Should I be prompting him to keep going when he starts slowing down? |
|
|
We use simple prompting words to help out here. I don't do this until I've talked with the child and they understand the problem/challenge first. I do this by regularly talking with my kids, asking them about what's going on: why they're having trouble regularly finishing work -- is something too hard -- not interesting -- way over their head -- have I assigned too much in one day -- can I spread it out - etc. I do this in our weekly meetings. It keeps me in the loop, and we become partners. It builds our relationship. Anyway, through this meeting, I find out what's going on and I do what I can to give tools, and I identify clearly where the kid will need to do some "buckling up buttercup". That's when they may have to do something they don't want to do, but it's got to be done. And that's when I talk with them about using a prompter word. For us, we've agreed on "Focus please - B.U.B" (B.uckle U.p B.uttercup) said in a very neutral way. I only use the B.U.B. abbreviation because my son and I have identified together that this is just one of those things he's gotta do, and we agree it's a "buckle up buttercup" moment, and we agree that a simple reminder will help refocus his thoughts. I provide a tool (helpful, prompting words), he does the work.
3) Adjust as needed - Which means, you'll be noticing things that need to be brainstormed with your son/kids within a couple of months after starting school...and every couple of months as long as you're home schooling! Totally normal!! Just keep asking yourself questions, observing so you can get honest answers, and adjust your plan and their workload through the feedback you get in your meeting together.
motherheart wrote:
| I wonder at how much this is my fault. |
|
|
Oh goodness, don't blame yourself or consider that it's all your fault! Goodness, no! Home education is all about give and take. There will ALWAYS be challenges and areas we have to do this exact same thing with - sit down and observe the child in action, ask questions, be honest, brainstorm, make a few changes....lather, rinse, repeat! For every child, every gender, every age!
4) Use tools as leverage in your day
Distractions- for a boy, these can short-circuit an entire day! In general, anything that is a mystery, mildly interesting, confusing, perplexing, colorful, flashy, mechanical --> all these catch the young man's attention and he has to figure it out! Must.know.how.it.works!! Must.know.why.it.is.the.way.it.is! So...the key to distractions is to remove the mystery outside of lesson time so that when he sits down to work, he has already turned the gears of his brain enough that he doesn't have to *figure it out* right then and there! This does not remove every distraction, but it does remove several.
Look with *his eyes* - You can find more ways to give better tools when you sit down in *his chair* at *his desk* and look around with *his eyes*. See things the way he sees them. You'll find an old spring in his pen jar that begs to be coiled and released instead of working on math, his chair isn't perfectly level so he can sit there for half an hour rocking around on four legs, his table is pitted making his writing surface less than smooth and not pleasant to write on...and probably others, but you get the idea. Try to anticipate tools that may invite more distraction than fruitful work and see what you can do to make the way smoother.
Work on cultivating quiet work time in the day - you're cultivating silence. Start very, very small. Tell the whole family you're going to let everyone work in total silence for 5 minutes. No talking, singing, loud toys, radio. Set everyone up for success with books, color pencils, work that fits the bill for each little person. Set the timer and go. Encourage success by not engaging questions or sharing - just smile, put your finger over your mouth in the universal shush sign, smile, and refocus on your work. You can always invite sharing AFTER the quiet time. Then slowly stretch this each week until you can get the kids recognizing a quiet time of work! This is an EXTREMELY VALUABLE skill and habit! Take the time to cultivate it!
Daydreaming is not that unusual. I sometimes engage it and ask what they're thinking about. I enjoy the conversation, and then I might invite them to explore that after "x" is completed.
motherheart wrote:
| I made a grid listing each subject's assignments each day. |
|
|
Sounds fantastic! I'm a big fan of tables and grids!!   And boys really like the concrete expectations spelled out! You're doing great there!
motherheart wrote:
| Should I be sitt ing beside him every minute I'm not working with someone else? |
|
|
No way!!!! That's a misuse of your time, and spoon feeding him! You've got great tools! Tools act as leverage for moving the day --> lesson plans, meeting together, natural consequences. You're taking a critical look at what he's doing and how he's doing it so that it is a good fit and stretches him gently and appropriately. Let him grow into a man by exercising some responsibility here! Definitely do NOT sit next to him all day!!!
-----------------------------------------
Nothing here is meant to be taken as gospel - this is just me, brainstorming with you! They're ideas and some of them may be way off base!!! Take anything here that might work, bend and shape it some more so it really fits your son and you, and go with it. Leave everything else!
I think you're doing great, Mary!
__________________
Jen Mackintosh
Wife to Rob, mom to dd 19, ds 16, ds 11, dd 8, and dd 3
Wildflowers and Marbles
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
motherheart
Forum Rookie
Joined: May 24 2011
Location: California
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 83
|
| Posted: July 11 2013 at 12:00am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Thank you, Eva.
Yes, I have asked him why he is taking so long. School is boring. There is no point to it. There are so many other things to do. I did ask him again yesterday. He did say that he'll get distracted by someting in what he is doing and start thinking of other things and become proccupied and then not get his work done.
I did get his input about his work as we planned this school year together. For some of his subjects I let him select what materials to use. But now he is not entirely happy with his choices. I tell him that we can make school as fun or interesting as we can, and for the rest we just have to get through it.
I let him work where he can get his work done (his desk, the couch, floor, another room) but if he is not in the same room with me he is more likely to be doing something other than schoolwork.
He is a hands on person, for sure. I'm such a book person that I'm not very good at thinking outside of the box. Thank you for reminding me of that facet of learning that will be helpful to him! Instead of assigning a written report on the biography of St. Paul that he just read, after I read yours and Jen's posts I told him he could make a booklet of drawings depicting parts of St. Paul's life. Wow! He smiled! And got to work.
Thank you for your time and helpful comments.
__________________
Mary
Mom to ds 16, dd 14, dd 13, ds 9, ds 6, and 4 in Heaven
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
motherheart
Forum Rookie
Joined: May 24 2011
Location: California
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 83
|
| Posted: July 11 2013 at 12:12am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Wow, Jen. Thank you! I like what you wrote:
:: Keep assignments realistic, meaningful and efficient.
:: Build relationship by meeting together regularly
:: Adjust as needed
:: Use tools as leverage in your day
I like nutshells to focus on.
I try to keep assignemts realistic, meaningful and efficient, but with he and I having different learning styles, what is meaningful to me is not always meaningful to him or meningful to the same degree. I need to look with his eyes, as you said, at this as well as his physical envoironment. This is his education, not mine. (Well, I'd say it is mine, too, in a different sense!)
Build relationship by meeting together regularly.
I like this. We do meet twice during the school year to check in and also to plan the next school year, but I need to check in more often and at a deeper level. I reminded him yesterday that we are partners in his education. Thank you for the helpful link.
I like the explanation of narration. We di it informally, but we definately need to do it more and deeper.
Adjust as needed
I need to think outside the box more.
Use tools as leverage in your day
I love your BUB!
When I wrote that I wonder how much is my fault, I meant that I let it get to that point that it it is--that I didn't get him back on track by re-evaluating and adjusting sooner in the year than now.
Thank you for the encourageent. Thank you for your time and thoughts. I appreciate then very much.
__________________
Mary
Mom to ds 16, dd 14, dd 13, ds 9, ds 6, and 4 in Heaven
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
pmeilaen
Forum All-Star
Joined: Sept 07 2008
Location: New York
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 565
|
| Posted: July 11 2013 at 2:03pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
motherheart wrote:
Thank you, Eva.
Yes, I have asked him why he is taking so long. School is boring. There is no point to it. There are so many other things to do. I did ask him again yesterday. He did say that he'll get distracted by someting in what he is doing and start thinking of other things and become proccupied and then not get his work done.
I did get his input about his work as we planned this school year together. For some of his subjects I let him select what materials to use. But now he is not entirely happy with his choices. I tell him that we can make school as fun or interesting as we can, and for the rest we just have to get through it.
I let him work where he can get his work done (his desk, the couch, floor, another room) but if he is not in the same room with me he is more likely to be doing something other than schoolwork.
He is a hands on person, for sure. I'm such a book person that I'm not very good at thinking outside of the box. Thank you for reminding me of that facet of learning that will be helpful to him! Instead of assigning a written report on the biography of St. Paul that he just read, after I read yours and Jen's posts I told him he could make a booklet of drawings depicting parts of St. Paul's life. Wow! He smiled! And got to work.
Thank you for your time and helpful comments.
|
|
|
You are welcome, maybe try to use his interests for school projects instead of just what the book says. Does he know what he wants to do after school? Maybe working towards a certain goal that is important to him will let him realize that certain subjects are necessary to reach that goal. Or let him do some kind of internship in a field he likes to kindle his joy in his studies again. If he knows for example, math is important to get into a good college that also offers a design program he would like to do then that might make him reconsider his way of not getting his work done. Or if he doesn't want to go to college it might help to choose his subjects so that he can do an apprenticeship later. I think High School of Your Dreams is a good source for students that don't want to go to college.
One additional idea: Do the Learning Style Test by Mercy Academy with your children. That helps a lot with choosing good materials for high school.
__________________
Eva
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
|
|
4Real Forums : Living Learning
Topic: Help! kids working s-l-o-w-l-y on school
