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Lisa in NH
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| Posted: June 04 2009 at 10:27pm | IP Logged
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We have 5 children, ages 19, 16, 10, 7 and 4. The three in the middle are boys with the "bookends" being our daughters. We have homeschooled since the 19 year old was in Kindergarten, with a couple of short lived forays into the traditional school situation for the oldest two children.
Sports is HUGE in my husband's family, including with hubby himself (former star athlete in high school and college). Our oldest son is very athletically gifted. The problem has been that we see him not giving 100% effort when he plays (soccer, basketball, baseball). This lack of aggressiveness especially bothers my husband, who cannot understand why our son would not play to his potential. When this son turned 16 he seemed to turn a corner and now plays hard most of the time. My husband attributed the lack of aggressiveness on our son's part to the fact that he is homeschooled and wasn't confident with the other kids, since he didn't go to school with them and know them well. This son was always pretty sensitive, so I attributed it to that.
The issue with son #1 has mostly cleared up. The problem is that son #2 (10 year old) is also athletically gifted. He seems a bit more aggressive than his older brother, but we have seen the same "unaggressive" behavior on the field. Also he is currently "going through something" -- in his own words. He has become very clingy and weepy, and now so has our 7 year old son!!! The ten year old played a great game of soccer last Saturday (hubby was at another game), but Sunday he had his worst game ever (and of course, hubby was there!) My husband was beside himself and voiced his concern to me that homeschooling might be making them mama's boys. I completely disagree, but the boys' behavior is so bizarre lately I cannot explain it (although, our oldest daughter went through this kind of stage also). There has been no trauma in their lives...the ten year old got homesick at a friend's house a couple of months ago and that was the beginning of this behavior, which then traveled downstream to the 7 year old. My thought is that if they are more sensitive and compassionate and less aggressive on the sports field, I can live with that trade off. I don't think hubby can. As I said, sports are HUGE.
To top it off, hubby's business is suffering from this economic downturn and he has talked about me getting a job. I was assuming part time, but he did make reference to maybe putting them in school, and that it might "toughen them up". I think he is speaking from the load of stress that is on him right now and this is his "knee-jerk response". My heart would absolutely break if I had to put them in public school. As you can probably tell, I am feeling pretty desperate right now. If anyone has had a similar experience with sports and lack of effort, I could really use some advice right now.
Thank you all,
Lisa Sweet
Sweet Family Times
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Becky Parker
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| Posted: June 05 2009 at 6:02am | IP Logged
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This is just a quick thought, but I think A LOT of boys go through an emotional time around the age of 10-12. My son is very athletic and kind of a "tough kid", but I remember him crying over the littlest things back then. I don't think it's homeschooling. I think most boys go through it as part of a pre-puberty thing.
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Becky Parker
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| Posted: June 05 2009 at 6:08am | IP Logged
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Just another thought - could something at the overnight have troubled him and he's too afraid or embarrassed to talk about it? My friend's ds went through a difficult time after being told about a child that was kidnapped. Sometimes its hard to know what goes on in a child's mind.
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Becky
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Elizabeth
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| Posted: June 05 2009 at 6:26am | IP Logged
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Lisa,
I'm happy to point to the boys in my family as a assurance to you and your husband that homeschooling does not make them soft athletes. Perhaps he would page through the sports archive on my blog? My kids are very, very athletic, up through the Division 1 college level. My third son is the captain of the team that just won State Cup and a member of the Olympic Development pool at the regional level.
That said, boys go through stormy emotional emotional stages. Because I had no brothers, this fact surprised me.Because I've had four boys who have been ten-years-old now, I can say with some certainty that it seems like they all hit it in one way or another.
The single most important influence on my sons and how they conduct themselves like men on or off the field is their father. His involvement has made them the athletes they are more than any other factor. Homeschooling has been a benefit if anything, because it gives them flexibility of schedule. There's more in that archives. I need to get breakfast going.
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Elizabeth Foss is no longer a member of this forum. Discussions now reflect the current management & are not necessarily expressions of her book, *Real Learning*, her current work, or her philosophy. (posted by E. Foss, Jan 2011)
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Lisa in NH
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Becky and Elizabeth,
Thanks for your answers. It helps to hear that other ten year olds (or thereabouts) have the same experience with high emotions. I remember my two oldest (a girl and a boy)having a rough time with it at 10 also, and I assumed that it was a developmental thing, but I appreciate the confirmation.
My 10 y.o. never did sleep over at his friend's house. He said that he got homesick at Mass with his friend's family. He had spent the entire day with them for his friend's birthday, but by Sat evening Mass, he became homesick, which is when he asked to come home. That's the only information he has given me. I agree with you that it's hard to know what they are thinking and what has triggered an emotional reaction. They can be complex little creatures  I am keeping an eye and ear out, though, to see if perhaps I can pin it down. Thank you.
Elizabeth--
I am very familiar with your blog and visit it just about daily. I was very excited to read about Patrick's overtime goal to win the State Cup! Great job Patrick  I thought the excessive celebration was completely justified and totally worth a yellow  But, hey, I'm not a ref! What a terrific experience and memory for all of you!
Elizabeth, have you ever seen your boys look 'lazy' on the field at times, not all the time? Not going after balls, jogging, standing around watching? I know we all have our good days and bad days, and this is what I attribute it to, but it really concerns my husband. Even though the kids have some great games, he just cannot understand why someone who is good at a sport and loves it doesn't try his hardest all the time. I also think that perhaps the expectations of my husband and his family might be a bit too high, but maybe mine aren't high enough... I really don't think it has anything to do with homeschooling, but I feel like I am fighting for our homeschooling right now.
Thank you and God bless,
Lisa Sweet
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Blessings,
Lisa
Happy wife to Scott(since 87)
Grateful mom to dd 89, ds 92, ds 99, ds 02, dd 05 and two in heaven
Sweet Family Times
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teachingmyown
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Lisa,
Some kids just aren't aggressive on the field. That has nothing to do with homeschooling. Public school will not toughen them up, it will do the opposite.
"Mama's boys" are that way by temperament, I believe, not homeschooling. My boys are not Mama's boys, but my ds 11 is very emotional these days. They grow out of it if they are given understanding along with a firm expectation of the need to control their behavior.
If your boys feel enormous pressure to excel, rather than just encouragement, from your dh, they may be holding back rather than giving their all only to still disappoint. My oldest is a very gifted athlete, yet he quit playing. We could not figure out why, but my guess is that he wasn't getting the praise he wanted. He is a perfectionist type and I think he felt like if he wasn't going to be seen as the best on the field, then he wasn't going to try at all. 
I am sorry you are going through this. I will pray for your situation.
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Molly
wife to Court & mom to ds '91, dd '96, ds '97, dds '99, '01, '03, '06, and dss '07 and 01/20/11
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Elizabeth
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| Posted: June 05 2009 at 10:03am | IP Logged
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Lisa,
I agree with Molly. Much of it is temperament. Most of my boys are very intense and I don't see that laziness, but one of them is kind of the "take my time" type about most of life. He will look sluggish on occasion, but he does seem to rise to the necessity. That is, if it's a slow game and they're ahead anyway, he'll jog. But if there's any chance they could lose, he wakes up fast:-).
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Elizabeth Foss is no longer a member of this forum. Discussions now reflect the current management & are not necessarily expressions of her book, *Real Learning*, her current work, or her philosophy. (posted by E. Foss, Jan 2011)
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Cay Gibson
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| Posted: June 05 2009 at 10:13am | IP Logged
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No, hsing has not made my boys "mama's boys". Far from it. They both excell in sports.
My 16 yr old "turned a corner" much like you say yours did. He plays hard and furious and even won the All-State Award last season (w/ his best friend ) and the Best Offensive Player in the Christian Athletic Asso. which is the division our hs team plays under.
I think your other boys will come around. The preteen years seem to be harder than the teen years.
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Lisa in NH
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| Posted: June 05 2009 at 10:57am | IP Logged
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Thank you all for your encouragement. It definitely brought some relief to my frayed nerves.
Molly, thank you for your insight. You put into words the sentiments that have been in my heart.
Cay - Congratulations on your son's award! How wonderful!
God bless you all and thank you again.
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Blessings,
Lisa
Happy wife to Scott(since 87)
Grateful mom to dd 89, ds 92, ds 99, ds 02, dd 05 and two in heaven
Sweet Family Times
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Willa
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My third son is an excellent athlete. He went to public school this year so he could continue to play football on the varsity level. It is his first year in a school environment.
Oddly enough, he had a better work ethic on the field than a good proportion of his classmates that have gone to school throughout. There is a temptation in the school environment to do the minimum, to cut corners, to complain and blame others for bad plays instead of accepting responsibility, to lose one's temper -- etc. The coach is always fighting against this -- it's probably one of his main tasks. Even sheer aggressiveness isn't really enough if it doesn't go with good sportsmanship.
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Willa
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JodieLyn
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If someone is pushing that much for a child to excel, the child may well decide that doing less and disappointing is much easier than doing your best and STILL disappointing that person.
Much is temperment. I have 3 children playing boys lacrosse, two of them are girls.. the oldest girl is a typical girl, hangs back some from the contact etc. But the other.. she's taken some of the hardest hits of anyone on the field.. and is up on her feet with her stick in her hand even if she's crying at the same time.
(what's sweet is the older sister, check on the younger to be sure she's actually ok because the younger apparently doesn't have sense to stay down if she's really hurt)
But ALL the kids have days they're not agressive. And they all have different reasons for it. I watched their coach the other day helping with that. That is.. not critizing where they were.. but helping them know what to do next, but all the 10-12 yr olds tend to be emotional and rather inclined to cry over a small thing.
Mostly, it seems to help not to mollycoddle them (if it didnt' get a bandaid 2 years ago.. it won't now) but also not to critize them for the out of control emotions. I will try and remind them to take a deep breath to help them get back under control but mostly, I don't think they want to be like that either so the less said the better.
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MarilynW
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Elizabeth wrote:
The single most important influence on my sons and how they conduct themselves like men on or off the field is their father. His involvement has made them the athletes they are more than any other factor. Homeschooling has been a benefit if anything |
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Lisa - I was just going to post the exact same thing. It is something my husband and I have been discusssing a lot of - raising boys in general. My husband coaching and/or attending every game has helped to bring out their full potential. When I make a game it is icing on the cake.
My 9 almost 10 year old boys are also at a stage where they cry easily.
A book that your husband may enjoy is "Let boys be boys" - I will email you some other books/articles that may be helpful - when I go online tonight.
There are some discussions on raising boys in the John Taylor Gatto thread - the importance of a father's influence.
Praying for you and your husband Lisa.
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MarilynW
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Dear Lisa - I was thinking about you and your post and praying for you last night (nursing marathon with Anna!!)
Something that kept coming to mind was how our society defines what is manly - not necessarily how we judge manliness. I think athletic performance is important in raising boys and especially getting them to use their full talents. BUT just because someone is performing really well on the sports fields is no guarantee of them being manly or gentlemanly. (eg when I was in England, my job involved a lot of contact with major league soccer players - incredibly talented on the field, but their manners and behaviour off the field was certainly not in my opinion manly or gentlemanly)Just a different perspective....
Also - aggressive is not necessarily manly. From the perspective of a British immigrant to the US - sometimes Brits and other Europeans appear to be much less "aggressive" than the American abroad - but aggressiveness is not manliness. Again..just a different perspective...
This thread on 10 year old boys may be helpful to you too. I really recommend the books I have linked to in this thread.
Maybe you and your husband could discuss your goals for your sons. This is something my husband and I are doing a lot right now - I sometimes worry about whether I have the right approach with my boys - but I feel blessed that my husband spends a great deal of time with them and hopefully provides the things that I lack.
Continued prayers..
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Lisa in NH
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Marilyn,
Thank you for your advice, concern, and prayers! I completely agree with you on the aggressive vs. manly topic. I am checking out the thread you linked to and also the books.
Willa and Jodie, your experiences and perspectives are very helpful. Thank you for sharing.
I appreciate everyone's responses so much and am taking them all to prayer...and then to discussion
God bless you all.
Update: 10 y.o. was having a meltdown this morning about going to soccer practice. Thanks to the good advice of you wonderful ladies, I was able to have more confidence when dealing with the situation. I was able to remain calm (for the most part) but FIRM and encouraging. It was a rough start, but his coach (God bless that man!) was so intuitive and patient, he had that boy out on the field in short order. He had a great practice and felt SO good about himself that he had "faced his fear." Thank you all again.
Oh, interestingly enough, some of the other dads shared with me how their (public-schooled) sons were going through similar emotions. Imagine that!
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Blessings,
Lisa
Happy wife to Scott(since 87)
Grateful mom to dd 89, ds 92, ds 99, ds 02, dd 05 and two in heaven
Sweet Family Times
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4Real Forums : Philosophy of Education
Topic: Does homeschooling produce "mama's boys?"
