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MicheleQ
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I'm hoping we can have a discussion about living the liturgical year using both calendars --the 1970 calendar of Pope Paul VI used in what is properly called the Ordinary Form (OF) of the Mass but still often referred to as the "Novus Ordo", and 1962 calendar of Pope John XXIII used in what is properly called the Extraordinary Form(EF) of the Mass though still often referred to as the "Traditional Latin Mass".
Whether one feels it should or should not have been done the reality is that we DO have both calendars in use with the two different forms of the Roman Rite and many of us now attend both forms with regularity. It would seem to me that it might be helpful to all of us if we could better understand both and share ways in which we make the meshing of the two work.
A lot of books, still in use, were written before the new calendar came into use and now that the EF is becoming more widespread many pre-conciliar materials are coming back into print. With little understanding of the 1962 calendar they can at times be confusing and hard to understand. I do not wish to start controversy about which is better or any of that but HOW exactly we can make it work.
I read this quote yesterday and it's been on my mind
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| “One of the weaknesses of the postconciliar liturgical reform can doubtless be traced to the armchair strategy of academics, drawing up things on paper which, in fact, would presuppose years of organic growth. The most blatant example of this is the reform of the Calendar: those responsible simply did not realize how much the various annual feasts had influenced Christian people's relation to time” Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger, The Feast of Faith, 81-82 (published by Ignatius Press). |
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Please note he says weakness --my point in posting that quote isn't to argue about what should or shouldn't have been done because it IS done but rather I do think he makes a very interesting point,
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| "drawing up things on paper which, in fact, would presuppose years of organic growth" |
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Many Catholic adults grew up with little or no reference to the liturgical year. Many of us have, for years now, been talking about these things and drawing upon one another's knowledge, building on ideas etc. We have been attempting to "fill in the gap" that was left when, without those years of organic growth, things just suddenly changed.
So now we have two forms of the mass offered widely (comparatively speaking) and many more people who attend both forms. I believe we are forging new ground here and I wonder, are we serving our children well if we only teach them one form of the mass and use only one calendar to celebrate the liturgical year? I am not saying we MUST do both but wonder if it would be wiser if we did. At some point they will hear about it they may even decide they prefer one or the other and it may be different from what we prefer.
What the mass and the calendar will look like years from now one cannot say though I do think that Pope Benedict XVI perhaps is trying to do exactly what wasn't done by the Council reforms --allow for years of organic growth. Well WE are the families of those years and we are the one's it falls to to try and fill the gap.
I am in no way an expert on any of this. I have come to it lately in life and I am still learning daily. Publishing a calendar (day planner) that has both the Ordinary and Extraordinary Forms has taught me quite a lot but it has also clearly shown me how much I don't know. What it has also done is spark a desire in me to know more. To understand better what the old customs were and to not see them lost. My late father-in-law would often talk about these things that were his life as a Catholic boy growing up in the Depression. But as a convert married to a non catechized Catholic I had no frame of reference for any of it. I understand so much more now of what he was talking about and I wish he was still here because I would love to ask him questions I didn't know to ask then.
In the recent thread Abstinence during octave? I posted a quote from the Pope's Epiphany address. He said:
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| "The liturgical celebration of Christmas, then, is not only a remembrance but is above all a mystery; it is not only a memory but also a presence. To appreciate the meaning of these two indissoluble aspects, one must live intensely the whole Christmas season as the Church presents it. If we consider it in a broad sense, it extends for 40 days, from Dec. 25 to Feb. 2, from the celebration of Christmas Eve to Mary's Maternity, to the Epiphany, to the Baptism of Jesus, to the wedding of Cana, to the Presentation in the Temple, precisely in analogy with Eastertide, which forms a unity of 50 days, until Pentecost." |
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When I read that I realized the that the Holy Father was himself meshing the two calendars and showing us that we aren't to just drop one for the other. If you read the entire text you'll see he mentions the Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy from the Second Vatican Council so he isn't just speaking of one or the other. I truly believe he is trying to lead us in that organic growth mentioned earlier (the fact that his masses are all ad orientum now might also be an indicator of this).
I have to admit that I have personally become weary of the either/or mentality. In some of the blogs, some of the people I talk to etc. there's a bit of a spirit of discontent and yes it's on both "sides". But our Church has given us so much and while the way things were done may not have been ideal it is what we have and it would seem to be our best course is to try and make it work. That being said I do know many people are already doing that and we are too but I think we might talk about it more --give concrete examples etc. Learn, teach, share, mesh the two forms and calendars and allow for that organic growth. I do hope someone else shares my desire in this. 
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Michele Quigley
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Bridget
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Well, you know I do. I am glad you brought it up. I have been explaining a little of it to the children and for now I am just writing the day's feasts up on the white board using your planner as my reference. This is also where Maria Van Trapp's Around the Year book is so helpful, for visualizing how the old calendar looks in a family. But using both calendars is breaking new ground...
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JennGM
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I think there are some things we do naturally, without thinking "old vs. new" and I like that. I agree with you, Michele. I don't like the either/or mentality. I can see positives of both calendar. I keep praying the Holy Father will merge the two calendars, the pluses of both.
Anyway, there are little things we do. For example, at least in the US Epiphany was on Sunday. We will celebrate it then and sometimes also on the 6th, or do a switch.
Saints feasts are another area. St. Christopher is no longer on the current calendar, but we still mark his feast day. St. Thomas the Apostle was moved to July 3, but there are still terms like "A-Thomasing" and using his old feast December 21, as a date for baking.
St. Benedict was in March and now in July. We don't celebrate his feast in March, but we know the Benedictine family still honors the older feast day in addition to July 11, so we pray to him that day. It's interesting to see the historical reasons for the dates on both calendars.
If you belong to a religious order (Carmelite, Dominican, Franciscan, Benedictine, etc.), you are still marking some of the older feasts because it's part of the order's "family's dates". The Church wisely reduced the amount of feast days on the Universal/General Roman Calendar but there is still room for devotion in small communities. And that's we have at home, our little domestic church.
And the older calendar had more octaves. Our family naturally celebrates vigils and octaves within our own family dates (birthdays, anniversaries), so it feels like a natural extension to keep a feast in the forefront longer than just a day. Pentecost octave is the one in particular I like, so we keep our red up a week instead of just a day.
It gets trickier when merging the Lectionary. I like to read the meditations for the EF and OF, compare the two to see how things have changed and some things still the same. I have several books I like to use as meditation on the readings. I mainly use the OF meditations, because that is what Mass I attend, but I love reading some other classics. The meditations on the Liturgical Year don't exclusively talk about the readings, but also a focus on the feast, and also some aspects that haven't been removed, but not highlighted as much away from Rome, like the Station Churches during Advent and Lent.
I also tend to use the traditional Collects instead of the ICEL translations. I'm looking forward to some changes in that area for the Ordinary Form.
I also use some of the older forms of the Roman Ritual for blessings in the home throughout the year. Not all have been removed in the new Ritual, but less emphasized attached to the feasts, and the new translation, IMHO, is terrible.
And, like Bridget mentions, so many of the liturgical year living books were written before Vatican II, so following those makes it easier to merge the two?
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MicheleQ
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JennGM wrote:
| For example, at least in the US Epiphany was on Sunday. |
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Only in the Ordinary Form, in the Extraordinary it was still the 6th --and our priest came to our house and did the traditional Epiphany Blessing (in Latin). Sunday the 2nd was Holy Name of Jesus, this past Sunday was the feast of the Holy Family and tomorrow (Jan. 13th) is the Baptism of the Lord. I think this is one of those season's where there can be a lot of confusion and some finagling needs to happen. Honestly I am still trying to find the best way to do that.
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JennGM
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MicheleQ wrote:
JennGM wrote:
| For example, at least in the US Epiphany was on Sunday. |
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Only in the Ordinary Form, in the Extraordinary it was still the 6th. |
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Some countries Epiphany in the Ordinary Form is still on the 6th. Stephanie said in Germany, and the Holy Father's Mass was on the 6th.
And sometimes, the Baptism can be on the 13th in the OF, so the calendars do merge.
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MicheleQ
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JennGM wrote:
MicheleQ wrote:
JennGM wrote:
| For example, at least in the US Epiphany was on Sunday. |
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Only in the Ordinary Form, in the Extraordinary it was still the 6th. |
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Some countries Epiphany in the Ordinary Form is still on the 6th. Stephanie said in Germany, and the Holy Father's Mass was on the 6th.
And sometimes, the Baptism can be on the 13th in the OF, so the calendars do merge. |
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Which raises the point that we aren't always so much dealing with the changes universally as we Americans are often dealing with the changes the USCCB and individual bishops make.
For instance we always celebrate Ascension Thursday ON Ascension Thursday in this diocese but not all do. Of course one can celebrate at home but recently a friend across the country told me that her older children expressed to her their puzzlement that it was called Ascension Thursday but never celebrated on a Thursday. She knew why but had never explained it to her children! 
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JennGM
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Yes, it does get confusing. There is the General Roman Calendar, then each country has a calendar, and then in Canon Law there is wiggle room for each diocese, like moving Ascension to Sunday.
So it's not just EF and OF Calendars!
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Mackfam
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This is an area we're working through as well - working with two calendars. We attend both forms, and accept them both as part of our Church - two rites, ONE Church. We mainly attend the EF, but do attend the OF. Frankly, it's painful to both see and experience the separation and disagreement that sometimes exists.
Though the differences in the two calendars are sometimes flummoxing, I have really appreciated that it has prompted me to dig and learn more...about why a Feast may have been moved, etc. We observe both calendars as best we can, but tend to focus primarily on the Old Calendar since the height of our liturgical celebrations - the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass - tends to be in the EF which follows the Old Calendar.
Some feasts we enjoy celebrating twice, explaining the reason for the moved date - St. Margaret of Scotland's Feast comes to mind. This falls in the category that Jenn mentioned above - that of a devotion observed in a small (domestic church) community. Our family (dh and the kids) are Scottish, therefore, St. Margaret of Scotland is a dear saint to us and we observe her Feast twice. There are other saints whose feasts we observe twice for the same reason.
In reading recently, I came across this quote from Pope XI:
Emphasis mine:
Quote:
| "...people are instructed in the truths of faith and brought to appreciate the inner joys of religion far more effectively by the annual celebration of our sacred mysteries than by any official pronouncement of the teaching of the Church. Such pronouncements usually reach only a few and the more learned among the faithful; feasts reach them all. The Church's teaching affects the mind primarily; the feasts affect both mind and heart and have a salutary effect upon man's whole nature." |
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Beautiful.
There is such great richness in observing and celebrating the Feasts of the Church's Calendar(s) that doing so can have beneficial effects on our whole nature...on our children!! I know! I'm preaching to the choir!  But, it did help me in trying to focus on the strengths of the two different calendars in order to reap the richness from both of them.
In taking this to prayer, I long to try to focus on simply plumbing the depth before me on the calendar with a quiet joy and sincerity - that doesn't always mean activity here. For our family, those "inner joys of religion" Pope Pius XI speaks of are often found in the quiet moments spent together uncovering the richness in the celebration of a feast.
I know each domestic church observes and celebrates in different ways, but for all of us, the deep and lavish feast is spread before us through the Church calendar. I truly enjoy learning the significance (sometimes historical and cultural) to the Feasts and Liturgical seasons as they were celebrated in pre-conciliar times. Learning this significance adds a depth for us, another layer, and the Feasts become so much more meaningful in our home. It helps me understand more, and I can enter into the Mystery of a season with more intensity as the Holy Father, Pope Benedict, calls for. There are so many beautiful explanations of pre-conciliar celebrations in the home - like the von Trapps, and Fr. Francis Weiser's amazing liturgical explanations, Elsa Chaney...and so many others. I really appreciate those as I learn!
Practically speaking - I'm trying to do as Bridget does - pointing out what both calendars observe for the day. If we're attending Mass for the day, we follow the calendar of the Form we are attending. For the higher ranking days, we tend to observe the old calendar since we primarily attend the EF for Mass, but again, I am prompted to wonder when there are differences and dig and learn for myself. Sometimes it's confusing/puzzling, sometimes it's quite an edifying learning experience.
I'm grateful for this conversation so I can gather some other practical ideas for observing and living these two calendars in the home in as harmonious a way as possible.
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JennGM
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Beautiful, Jen.
Mackfam wrote:
| In taking this to prayer, I long to try to focus on simply plumbing the depth before me on the calendar with a quiet joy and sincerity - that doesn't always mean activity here. For our family, those "inner joys of religion" Pope Pius XI speaks of are often found in the quiet moments spent together uncovering the richness in the celebration of a feast. |
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This is what I've been observing and focusing on here, too. The quiet joy and contemplation -- not always busyness.
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MicheleQ
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Really beautiful Jen --thanks so much for sharing this.
I do want to make one clarification though. The Ordinary and the Extraordinary are two FORMS of the SAME rite --the Roman Rite. It's an important distinction.
Apostolic Letter Summorum Pontificum issued Motu Proprio Benedict XVI wrote:
| The Roman Missal promulgated by Paul VI is the ordinary expression of the 'Lex orandi' (Law of prayer) of the Catholic Church of the Latin rite. Nonetheless, the Roman Missal promulgated by St. Pius V and reissued by Bl. John XXIII is to be considered as an extraordinary expression of that same 'Lex orandi,' and must be given due honour for its venerable and ancient usage. These two expressions of the Church's Lex orandi will in no any way lead to a division in the Church's 'Lex credendi' (Law of belief). They are, in fact two usages of the one Roman rite. |
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I am betting you already knew that but for the sake of others reading we should be clear.
God bless!
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Michele Quigley
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MicheleQ wrote:
I do want to make one clarification though. The Ordinary and the Extraordinary are two FORMS of the SAME rite --the Roman Rite. It's an important distinction.
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Oh, I'm so glad you clarified my inaccurate choice of wording, Michele! Thank you!
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I'm in agreement on some of the issues raised above. And I'll add this one:
Mass attendance - when the local parish is OF, and the routinely attended parish (but further away is EF) and there is bad weather, the differences between the two forms AND the typical Mass requirements can be quite confusing.
For example, any holy day of obligation that OF moves to Sunday - but I can't make it to the EF on the actual day due to weather, but I WILL be attending EF on that Sunday... it means I've now not attended Mass for that holy day.
This has happened a few times.
And Epiphany... we celebrated that one twice.
Mary, Mother of God/Circumcision - we missed it entirely (both feasts).
So what do we do?
Just the best we can. The gentleman courting me plays music for the EF parish we attend (so every Sunday, every Holy Day), and also plays for some of the OF parishes as a sub (so Saturdays, some Holy Days if they don't conflict, earlier Mass times on Sundays). And HE prefers the Eastern Rite himself! Throw that one into the mix and see what happens!
For the most part, we go with older, not just EF-older, but sometimes Early Church Fathers type of older (this then pulls in some of the Eastern Rite celebrations).
We take every feast day separately and decide how we will celebrate it for ourselves; and look at the weather and such to see which Mass we will end up attending (or not).
In this way, we are celebrating a variety of the richness that is our faith. JPII reached out to both sides of the Church; Benedict is looking to connect us in time.
It would be great to discuss more particulars :)
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dinasiano
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Thank you for all of this information. I am always amazed at the knowledge of all the women on this forum! I have only recently been celebrating the lit. year with my children. It is so beneficial as you all know.
I am so grateful to God for putting us on this path because I am learning so much right along with the children. Please keep the suggestions/comments coming.
And thank you, Michele, for including both forms in the calendar this year. That is really helpful!!!!
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St. Ann
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In Catholic States in Germany, many Feast days are still honored as a work/school free day.
Jan. 1 Holy Mother of God, Easter Monday,Ascension Thursday, Pentecost Monday &Tuesday, Corpus Christi (Thursday). In Bavaria Aug. 15 the Feast of the Assumption is also honored. In Cologne the Feast of the Epiphany is so honored as the Cathedral there houses the Shrine of the remains of the 3 Wise Men. Many Saints' Feast days are so well known that the date itself is never mentioned, just the Saint's name to refer to a special day. For example: on Martini (Nov. 11) or on Johanni (June 24) or Sylvester (Dec. 31).
There may be more I can't recall at the moment.
This makes it incredibly convenient and helpful to celebrate these feasts in their fullness. Our society is getting so secularized that maybe 10% even go to Mass on those days. Most use these days for hiking, mountain climbing or bike rides. I don't know how long we will be so fortunate to be able to keep these days "free".
Our Pope was raised in Bavaria with the full celebration of these Feasts by the whole village where he lived. Back then they had even more days free to celebrate the liturgical year.
Even though Christopher may no longer be on the calender, his day is still acknowledged here.
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I really appreciate the conversation. It makes me miss our FSSP parish from our old town. One of our pastors had a real gift for explaining the meaning behind so much of the Liturgical calendar. My dh and I often bring up his homilies from 6-9 years ago, just so rich in history and goodness. I miss that. I hope and pray they somehow merge the two...there is so much to gain! Until then, I am taking gentle nudging from you all and plan on getting an EF calendar from my old parish!! Actually, it was an EF and OF on every day...loved it.
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JennGM
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4 lads mom wrote:
| I really appreciate the conversation. It makes me miss our FSSP parish from our old town. One of our pastors had a real gift for explaining the meaning behind so much of the Liturgical calendar. My dh and I often bring up his homilies from 6-9 years ago, just so rich in history and goodness. I miss that. I hope and pray they somehow merge the two...there is so much to gain! Until then, I am taking gentle nudging from you all and plan on getting an EF calendar from my old parish!! Actually, it was an EF and OF on every day...loved it. |
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BTW, that was the new addition for Michele's Family-Centered Planners, giving both the EF and OF. I know there are one or two others that give that option.
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Jennifer G. Miller
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Just for the sake of having these resources collected on one thread, linking the Saints Galore Catholic Calendar also includes both the EF and OF dates on their calendar.
Additionally, Catholic Culture includes both the EF and OF calendar in their daily summary of "today in the liturgical year".
Please add others if you know of them.
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JennGM
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Mackfam wrote:
Just for the sake of having these resources collected on one thread, linking the Saints Galore Catholic Calendar also includes both the EF and OF dates on their calendar.
Additionally, Catholic Culture includes both the EF and OF calendar in their daily summary of "today in the liturgical year".
Please add others if you know of them. |
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Good idea, Jen. I was looking around, and besides the two listed, not many others.
TAN has another planner, with both but it is sold out this year.
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Jennifer G. Miller
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Erica Sanchez
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Thank you for starting this thread, Michele. We have this past year been attending an EF Mass (a parish run by FSSP priests - we are very blessed!), and also had a discussion about the two calendars, etc. We are blessed by your calendar/planner which includes dates for both forms.
I usually purchase the large desk calendar from Liturgical Training Press and post it on our refrigerator which is the only way I can keep track of our many activities, but didn't this year and instead bought a cheepy one from Staples.....and then proceeded to try to add all the holy days, feast days, etc., for both forms.......
Does anyone know of a desk calendar that has both? That may be too much to ask. :)
We really love the EF and the richness and beauty it offers, but I've felt strongly these past few weeks to stay connected to our OF parish in some way. It's hard to know what to do. Having both calendars may be a start.
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One more calendar, Canons Regular of St. John Cantius
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Jennifer G. Miller
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4Real Forums : Domestic Church
Topic: Living the liturgical yr w/both calendars
