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teachingmyown
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| Posted: July 18 2005 at 12:40pm | IP Logged
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This is related in a way to Jen's question about her son's behavior which she views as stemming from his time at the local school. We are planning on letting Charlie, who just turned 14 and will be in 9th grade, take Algebra at the local public high school. Our county allows homeschoolers to take up to two classes.
I was really thinking this was a good idea. Math is a point of serious contention between us. Also, I thought it might help him to see other kids doing schoolwork. However, I was wondering if any of you had experience with this sort of limited use of school. I am wondering what the impact will be.
Some of my concerns are:
What kind of mood will he come home in? Will he be willing to work or have an attitude of "I am done for the day". (Yes, he would say this even after only one class!)
Will it make him more determined to go to school full-time?
What kind of impact will it have on my day? Is it worth driving him for one class vs fighting with him over doing it at home?
I would appreciate any input, whether you have first hand experience or not. I am not TOO worried about the peer interaction, at least not anymore than I am with sports. Except, I guess, that he will sitting in a classroom with immodestly dressed girls, who are bound to flirt with him.  He is a little too handsome for his own good!
My husband really wants him to play high school sports and he thinks he would have a better chance of making the teams if he is enrolled in at least one class.
Thanks so much!
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In Christ,
Molly
wife to Court & mom to ds '91, dd '96, ds '97, dds '99, '01, '03, '06, and dss '07 and 01/20/11
Remembering Today
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ALmom
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| Posted: July 18 2005 at 6:04pm | IP Logged
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I would be hesitant to send a 14 yo to the local high school for a course. The peer pressure right at that vulnerable age really can have terrible consequences and the peer pressure in a ps situation is really hard on the teens. You have more supervisory ability at sports etc. At least anticipate the kinds of problems they might face and the consequences for succumbing.
When we allowed our ds to play baseball at a young age, we were quite aware of how crude talk could get on a baseball team of boys and also the discipline problems of spitting, climbing the fence, etc. When we talked about baseball these are some things we discussed well ahead of our entry -
He is there to play baseball, to learn the technique and the game. The best way to do that is to practice, be attentive to coaches instructions on form, etc. and to watch and study the game even when he isn't in the field - learn from the fielding mistakes, etc.
He would be around all different children who may or may not have been taught the same standards of conduct that we expect. He would not climb the fence, get involved in bad conversations (listening or talking). We told him how to politely remove himself from anything that seemed inappropriate (we told him he didn't have to hang around wondering - if it was whispered conversations and especially something that he would be embarrassed for mom and dad to hear - then move away and become very occupied in the game). If we found behvioural problems as a result of baseball, we would not hesitate to pull him out even mid-season. We told him this and he knew we meant it. We had no problems but he had not yet hit the pre-teen years. We are glad to no longer be in baseball for many reasons, but this did allow our child to decide whether or not he liked the sport itself and give instructions we could not give ourselves. It did not involve everyday for months but only 1 or 2 days per week for an hour at a time for about 2 months in the summer. We very closely watched the dug-out the entire time he was in baseball - which meant being at every game.
In a school situation, the contact is everyday in an environment known to be opposed to all that we teach and for 9 - 10 months. Most teens expect the class to be a sort of social outlet more than the academic instruction and you have no way to know what is being taught by the teacher or what discussions are going on before and after class (and often during class). You are not there to see how the child is handling the pressure - is he being berated every day, called names, offered drugs repeatedly. All of us can get worn down under a constant barage - a 14 yo even if he is wonderful is being sent to battle in the halls of hell. You may not know all this until after there are problems and then it is hard to restrict was has already been allowed. I would ask a few really important questions:
How solid is his faith in God and confidence in himself?
How clear is he in the moral law? How innocent is he? How much exposure has he already had to current issues? It's certain that someone will introduce him to talk of sex, etc. and it may be far cruder than you imagined. Kids are now "dating" and "breaking up" in elementary school. Does he have the courage to remove himself from the conversation and be called a homosexual because he doesn't want to talk dirty? My nephew spent 1 year in middle school (5th grade) and he was called a homosexual that entire year and ostracized by other students because 1) he came in as a homeschooler 2) he excused himself from inappropriate conversations and discussions 3) he was nice, refused to pick on people and defended whoever was being picked on. This was in a Catholic school and the teacher did nothing to foster appropriate interaction among students, introduced sex-ed materials and pornographic type reading material not listed on the book list that his mom had very carefully screened before allowing him to attend.
How much experience does he have in resisting peer pressure? Most 13/14 yo are going through a difficult adjustment in self-confidence. Looking back, I think it is safer to wait until they have weathered most of that at home before sending them into a large classroom of any kind. We got our dd involved in a number of group activities at 13/14 because of anxiety and lonliness. She did need an outlet for contact with a wider group of people, but her self-confidence was so low, I think we should have proceeded a little more slowly. We got her involved with sports and music and peer pressure (from other homeschoolers)did pull her away from us in some areas. I cannot imagine dealing with a ps situation at that age with her. I think it would have been safer and wiser to do the music (it was a real passion) and skip the sports (it was just to be around other girls) for that first year and then widen the activities if the need was still there. Some children are more vulnerable than others - but I have noticed that those that have very limited contact with parental guidance until they have shown signs of a certain maturity and confidence fare best when they are faced with peer pressure. Too much peer pressure, too soon, can undo years of training. I am not talking about isolating the 14 yo - just having more control and influence over the setting. Let them test their wings in something more limited while you closely observe how they respond to peer pressure and are there to show them how to handle it.
What is it that you need from this class and is there any other way to achieve this end? IE if you just really need a classroom setting or someone with more confidence in math to teach, could you hire a tutor or get together with 3 or 4 friends and hire a tutor to teach the group for even one day a week? If it is being known for a better chance to play sports in the school, then could his sports abilities be developed to such a strong level that the school couldn't afford not to have him on the team?
How safe is the public school? We know middle schools in our area where middle school children are being raped in the bathroom. Most people only think of safety issues related to girls - but that is no longer the case. This is not published in the news - only heard word of mouth from parents whose elementary age students are supposed to go to this middle school next year. The best High School in our area has undercover cops in the halls and classes because of the drug problem. One child got pushed down the stairs because someone thought she was an undercover cop or snitch. Again, this stuff is not in the news - you hear it word of mouth chatting with the other moms in the area whose children go there.
What is the attitude of the teacher toward homeschooling? The teacher may consider it her duty to discuss how abusive it is for a parent to homeschool. I took teacher education classes many years ago and you would be surprised at how much social engineering goes on in innocent sounding subjects. Math would typically be safer than science or history - but guidance counselors, teachers, etc. may be looking for problems or trying to encourage the child to talk about things in the home that they may interpret as abusive. Obviously, there are great teachers out there, but don't expect it blindly. Know who the particular teacher will be. Relatives at the highest ranking school in our area (and we are not inner city)were in classes where the teacher did almost no teaching, had undisciplined classes and even didn't know when the child was present or not. (She would get 0s on quiz for a day which she had been sick but someone had answered for her in roll call and she was marked present).
No one can tell you what to do in the decision about your child, but I would proceed with great caution. Don't assume anything - but verify. It is so agonizing when we need outside support and find that what is there isn't always real support. We will pray that God will guide you to the very best solution for your family and ds.
Janet
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Leonie
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| Posted: July 18 2005 at 6:44pm | IP Logged
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Molly,
Is it possible for your son to attend a homeschool co-op or homeschool class or Maths Club?
I just think that this is often a simpler solution than school attendance - the group is usually smaller and often there are more families with similar ground rules.
Leonie in Sydney
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Leonie
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| Posted: July 20 2005 at 7:23pm | IP Logged
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Molly, I had another thought. 
Could your ds do an online course - if not in Maths, then in another area?
I thought that he might still benefit from a class that involves responsibility to someone other than mother and still beneift from the online discussions/contact - but this contact may be more controlled or positive than a public school?
Just another idea...
Leonie in Sydney
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teachingmyown
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| Posted: July 20 2005 at 7:57pm | IP Logged
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Thanks, Leonie. He will be doing MODG this fall, with three classes being Teacher Assisted. So he will be accountable to someone other than me.
I talked this evening with a friend whose oldest son took some classes at the high school. He was a senior though. Still, he had to deal with some teasing from the other students, some unfair treatment from teachers who were biased against homeschooling and he did have trouble adjusting to the schedule.
This friend is letting her next child, a girl, take two classes, but she isn't sure it will work out. Her son was older and very focused and sure of himself. Her daughter might not deal with the difficulties as well.
The more I think about it, the less appealing it is to me. Another thing I found out is that my son CANNOT play sports for the high school unless he is enrolled full-time. We were under the impression that homeschoolers were given equal access to extra-curricular activities in VA. Apparently not.
So I think in the end we will keep him home.
Thanks for all of your advice.
__________________
In Christ,
Molly
wife to Court & mom to ds '91, dd '96, ds '97, dds '99, '01, '03, '06, and dss '07 and 01/20/11
Remembering Today
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juliecinci
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| Posted: July 21 2005 at 7:57am | IP Logged
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We sent our son to 10th grade to do Algebra II for similar reasons that you mentioned. It was a mistake for us. He did not like school and did not do well in the class in spite of being really good at math. What it did for him is turn him off to any kind of classroom based learning and he is now less inerested in full time school of any kind including college. (He will be taking one class at the university in the fall but it is NT Greek and he's doing it for fun. I'm also in the class so we are doing it together.)
He also found the grind of school restrictions irksome.
My daughter goes to part time high school. It's taken her two years to feel that she likes it well enough to keep going. She is a different personality and wanted to be a part of the school world. Initially she wanted to go full time but one year of part time showed her she never wants to go full time. She seems to be doing well.
However, we decided to use a math tutor for her rather than high school and she takes mostly electives at school. We do the core subjects at home.
My next child wants to do part time enrollment and I am not up for it. After these two going, it really fragmented my life (all the driving in the middle of the day). So I've told him he'll have to wait until we can have him drive himself.
Hope those answers help a bit! (We did discover that public schools in this area do have a drug problem and lots of sexually active teens. Our kids have turned out to be great kids and are noticed for their sensitivity to others, hard work, eagerness to learn (even Noah who hated school enjoyed his teachers and what they taught and would seek opportunities to chat with them... he was just opposed to homework and studying for tests.  ).
Their characters have proven strong enough even if the school itself is not a great environment.
Julie
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Julie
Homeschooling five for fourteen years
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ALmom
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| Posted: July 28 2005 at 12:44pm | IP Logged
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As for sports - a dad here organized a homeschool team that competes in the private school leagues. If you want more information on how all that got started pm me and I'll (with everyone's permission) put you in touch with the dad who got it started here.
Janet
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4Real Forums : High School Years and Beyond
Topic: Classes at the local high school?
