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Elizabeth
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We are! At least I think we are very often what could be classified as unschoolers--following our interests where they lead and learning a whole lot along the way. This late winter and early spring have been a perfect example of that. My big boys put aside their regularly planned studies for a couple of weeks to research and plan an itinerary to go tour the UK. Then, they left the country for two weeks and put it into practice. While they were gone, I abandoned my plans (I can't even remember what they were) to take up Alice's Easter Vigil notebook with my children at home. Then, the big boys returned; we did a week of jet lag and Easter prep and it was Easter. Directly following that, the Holy Father died. We have all been utterly immersed in creating notebooks chronicling the current events and the lives of both John Paul II and Bendict XVI.
This ALWAYS happens. I plan and then I change plans to follow extreme rabbit trails. To me, this is unschooling. Unschooling is also stepping out with confidence to deviate from the typical scope and sequence of education. Last year, Michael took an entire year off from math. He couldn't get it. We put the books aside (with more than a little handholding from unschooling compatriots). Then, a little unschooling bird whispered "math U see." We ordered the whole kit and caboodle and he's done two years of high school math in six months, all the while singing the praises of MUS! Personally, I'm singing the praises of the little bird, who, by the way, suggested this board. 
Hey Lissa, your turn!
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Elizabeth Foss is no longer a member of this forum. Discussions now reflect the current management & are not necessarily expressions of her book, *Real Learning*, her current work, or her philosophy. (posted by E. Foss, Jan 2011)
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tovlo4801
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Elizabeth,
Interesting. I don't think I'm an unschooler and I doubt my scheduler nature will ever let me be completely, but the recent conversation about CE vs. CM style of education has made me really think about what it is I do. I think there are strong unschooling desires running through what I believe our school should look like. My temperment just runs so against it! Maybe I'll watch this topic to get a little hand holding of my own. 
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amiefriedl
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Elizabeth,
The image I've always had of unschoolers were moms and dads who never did anything and just let their kids 'be'. I know this isn't the case, as apparently you consider yourself to be an 'unschooler' and you do lots! More than me for sure!
'Unschooler' is just probably a word that has had no real way to find a consistent definition. What are some authors/books that you would call core 'unschooling' philosophy? Would you personally like to set some parameters or give us your definition?  I've done no reading on unschooling.
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Amie
Blessed with an awesome hubby and Mom of ds10, dd7, dd3 and dd 10months.
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stefoodie
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another unschooler here checking in. we haven't done formal work in over 2 weeks. been sidetracked from "the plans" again. i'm busy writing and the kids have copied me by starting their own blogs and working on their books. to top that, i had set a deadline for myself and it's getting awfully close, so the house has been "let go" the past week. we go through cycles of formal schoolwork - real life learning - anything goes. sometimes i despair that i'm not disciplined enough, but truly i don't think it has hurt the kids all that much. if anything it's fueled their imaginations (what to do when mom's busy at the keyboard?)....
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Elizabeth
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Here are a few books to read:
Homeschooling Our children, Unschooling Ourselves
The Unschooling Handbook
Learning All the Time
The Unprocessed Child (I've not read this one but it's in my shoopping cart)
Homeschooling with Gentleness
Better Than School
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Elizabeth Foss is no longer a member of this forum. Discussions now reflect the current management & are not necessarily expressions of her book, *Real Learning*, her current work, or her philosophy. (posted by E. Foss, Jan 2011)
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momwise
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[QUOTE=Elizabeth] We are! At least I think we are very often what could be classified as unschoolers--following our interests where they lead and learning a whole lot along the way.
QUOTE]
I was truly shocked to find out that people who follow "unschooling" a la John Holt were adamant that even suggesting a library book to your children on a topic they are not currently interested in (interested meaning SELF-Discovery) was *not* unschooling. In other words the kids are following their interests and you are never taking the lead. Okay fine.
I'm not really interested in defending my title, I'm more interested in what I would call "family learning." Like you, we've deviated from the planned to participate in real life. Around here, it's safe to call yourself whatever you want. Just don't try going on an unschooling board or to a conference and expect a tolerance for different viewpoints.
Anyway, my question to your post Elizabeth is what grade did Michael skip math? If it was high school, what did you decide to do about the trancript?
Alleluia.....He is Risen!!
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"If you want equal justice for all and true freedom and lasting peace, then America, defend life." JPII
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Leonie
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I don't know. 
I started a loop for Catholic unschoolers, so maybe I am one. Its a great loop, with gentle caring Catholic mothers, who each would have their own definition of Catholic unschooling.
But, I vaccillate. We are very often "radical" and, yet. sometimes also I ask the kids to get busy with something that may look like school. Thomas' current lapbook comes to mind, or Anthony and I and file folder games.
In person, in our support groups here, I call myself a relaxed CM-er or say I mix Charlotte Mason with natural learning.
What does being an unschooler mean? Can we be CM and "unschooly"?
These are questions I ponder. 
Leonie, in Sydney - and a Catholic CM unschooly?
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Elizabeth
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Michael skipped math in ninth grade. I'm going out on a limb here, but I have no intention of creating a transcript that fits those little blanks. His life won't fit in there. Instead, I'll list what he's done and I'll provide a portfolio explaining it and the rest I'll trust to the HOly Spirit. He wouldn't like a school that insists on blanks anyway. At the end of it all, he'll have four "years'" high school math. Does it matter when he took it?
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Elizabeth Foss is no longer a member of this forum. Discussions now reflect the current management & are not necessarily expressions of her book, *Real Learning*, her current work, or her philosophy. (posted by E. Foss, Jan 2011)
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Elizabeth
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Well, Leonie, please notice that there's no description attached to this board. The board was Lissa's idea and I told her I am all for it, but I wanted her to write the blurb. She's a master wordsmith, so we'll just have to see how she defines "unschooling." 
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Elizabeth Foss is no longer a member of this forum. Discussions now reflect the current management & are not necessarily expressions of her book, *Real Learning*, her current work, or her philosophy. (posted by E. Foss, Jan 2011)
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Leonie
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Hi Elizabeth,
Lissa and I talked recently about "the trail" - how sometimes we plant and soemtimes things bloom without planting. And how much of this is unschooling. Perhaps she will post that here.
I found the book "The Unprocessed Child" to be a bit too didactic - do this my way .
OTOH, I really enjoyed Suzie Andres' exploration of unschooling from a Catholic POV.
I also like Christian Unschooling and Teach Your Own
( by John Holt but with updates from Pat Farenga).
Leonie in Sydney
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momwise
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Leonie wrote:
I don't know.
I started a loop for Catholic unschoolers, so maybe I am one. Its a great loop, with gentle caring Catholic mothers, who each would have their own definition of Catholic unschooling.
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That's probably because it's led by a wonderful faith filled, easy going homeschool mom? I like the idea of "gentle" and allowing each one to have their own definition. Perhaps where I got this idea  (and friends of mine have too) was from a secular environment with a strict definition of its own (they would include religion and faith as topics you don't force upon your children unless they come up with an interest on their own). You are unschoolers among whom I don't feel intimidated!
Alleluia.....He is Risen
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"If you want equal justice for all and true freedom and lasting peace, then America, defend life." JPII
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momwise
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Leonie,
We posted at exactly the same time! I loved Suze Andries' Catholic unschooling book. I think anyone, even if they don't feel called to unschool could benefit from reading about her constant reliance on the Holy Spirit to lead her in finding the best way to reach each child and lead them to his/her vocation/calling in the Body of Christ. Perhaps I would define my unschooling way of learning as family Spirit led, with a lack of curriculum whenever I don't need it
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Gwen...wife for 30 years, mom of 7, grandma of 3.....
"If you want equal justice for all and true freedom and lasting peace, then America, defend life." JPII
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Genevieve
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I am! But then again my eldest is two and half and my second is only 4 months, so maybe I don't count? Could you possibly be anything else when your children are that age? Someone actually commented unschooling is like doing preschool forever.
To me, unschooling is fulfilling God's intended purpose in a child, not one that is dictated by a curriculum board or even a mom. I believe God made each one of us for a special reason. In going through each phase of life and pursuing different interests, with discernment, we are all fulfilling our purposes. And ultimately, I believe that could be the greatest way to love and to serve God. Some interests are obvious in the development. For example, learning to walk. To walk is one more step to independence. I can't imagine any parent wanting to hinder that. But then, there are less obvious ones like interests in birds. Perhaps he was borned to be a naturalists Maybe, it's simply meant to be a phase by which he learns to appreciate one of God's creations. So it's the parents' job to help inspire and guide, to foster interests and also graciously allow them to die.
There is an arguement that unschooling parents simply leave their child alone. However, I think the opposite is true. Yes, they do leave children alone, but they leave them alone in a "rich environent", whether it be with books, enducational toys, nature, interesting people etc. Then they step back and let God's handiwork unfold! You never know how a child's thirst for knowledge might be sparked from a good read-aloud. My son's recent interests in birds started like that. We happened to read Make Way for the Ducklings. Then he noticed birds were migrating. Then Grandma just happened to give him a rubber duck, which he now plays with all the time. I just happen to see a bird's nest in one our bushes in the yard. Empty and the egg already hatched, he promptly takes it inside my house, grabs an egg out of the refrigerator, places it on the nest and of course places rubber ducky on top of it. Seeing this, I check out a few books at a time about birds. And now, he's asks to run around in our yard to catch real birds for the nest. What has he learnt? That birds need to clean themselves. That birds sit on eggs for them to hatch. That rubber ducky is not a real bird. And just today was introduced to the fact that ducks do not get wet through a Let's Read and Find Out book. Did I plan the study on ducks? Nope! But with each incremental interest I observed in him, I took it one step further by introducing another foreign concept to him. What he did with it was up to him. Sometimes I sit back and ponder about how I personally went about learning something new, and looking at the process is what I define unschooling to be.
Although I'm not formally homeschooling, my favourite underlying unschooling definition is by Patrick Farenga - Allow the children as much freedom to learn in the world as parents are comfortable with.
What would I do when I susposedly start formal schooling? I'm not sure, but definition aside, I know I'll keep on trying to listen to my child and help discern God's calling for him.
My very long two cents worth.
Genevieve
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Leonie
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Gwen,
I find that mothers attracted to CM and to unschooling tend to be gentle souls, on a faith filled search. I think that is what I liked about Homeschooling With Gentleness.
Genevieve,
I loved your post, especially - <<<but definition aside, I know I'll keep on trying to listen to my child and help discern God's calling for him. >>>>
Leonie in Sydney, grateful to be among such honest sharing and caring
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Kathryn UK
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momwise wrote:
| I loved Suze Andries' Catholic unschooling book. I think anyone, even if they don't feel called to unschool could benefit from reading about her constant reliance on the Holy Spirit to lead her in finding the best way to reach each child and lead them to his/her vocation/calling in the Body of Christ. |
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I agree. I'm not an unschooler, by any definition, but Homeschooling with Gentleness did help me homeschool more gently. It's only a short book, and I think I could usefully re-read it every year.
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Dh Michael,  Rachel(3/95) Hannah(8/98) Naomi(6/06)  (11/07)
The Bookworm
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Mary G
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OK, y'all -- I can't seem to find Homeschooling with Gentleness -- does anyone know where I can get a copy? Now, you've piqued by interest and I'm like a rat terrier ....
Blessings,
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MaryG
3 boys (22, 12, 8)2 girls (20, 11)
my website that combines my schooling, hand-knits work, writing and everything else in one spot!
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Leonie
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I got mine from all catholic books.
I have also seen it for sale at By Way of the Family
Leonie in Sydney
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Mary G
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Leonie:
Thanks for the contacts -- I've got it ordered!
Blessings all.
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MaryG
3 boys (22, 12, 8)2 girls (20, 11)
my website that combines my schooling, hand-knits work, writing and everything else in one spot!
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Faith
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I would say no we are not unschoolers. I tried unschooling in its purer form twice in our 8 year homeschooling career. It definitely has its benefits. It is amazing to see what kids will learn when given freedom. I remember my kids spontaneously trying to figure out how big Noah's Ark must have been and then spontaneously measuring everything in the house and making all kinds of calculations. We hadn't done formal math in months!
I remember my two oldest taking a poetry book and sitting on top of the swing set and spending hours helping each other memorize poetry. They were having a blast!
However, true unschooling has its problems, at least in our house. My kids would not do work in the areas where they are weakest, that would be the physical act of writing, spelling and reading (to a certain extent). I would try to get games, projects etc to inspire them but they could smell any manipulation on my part a mile away! So all my efforts were to no avail. Also, discipline became a problem. There is a very artifical distinction in the pure unschooling world between a parent directing her child's education and a parent directing her child period! How come as a Mom I can't say, you must practice your penmanship everyday but I can say you must clean the bathroom, both fall under the authority of Mom's realm, but for some reason, pure unschoolers draw a distinction. This felt really phony after awhile.
I guess I like clear definitation and "unschooling" defies that, but to me unschooling means child-led. If Mom is doing the leading then it isn't unschooling no matter how much what is going on deviates from the lessons plans. To me changing plans because one is going on a trip or an historical event occurs like the Pope dying so you switch gears is not unschooling unless it is the children who say, Mom I want to keep a notebook on this. To me that is just being flexible!
I do believe natural learning goes on all the time, even in the most teacher led, structured conditions and sometimes events make it so that natural learning is the dominant method for a while. Again this is flexibility. I think flexibility is one of the keys to joy in the homeschool.
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mumofsix
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Faith, I think you have hit the nail on the head for me here. I have been quite confused by American descriptions of unschooling in the past as it seems very differently interpreted: to me the American model of unschooling is just flexibility, as you say, and a willingness to think outside the box in one's teaching and to respond to our children's individual learning styles and particular interests whenever possible. In that sense I am an unschooler and would no doubt be classed as such if I lived in the U.S. I could certainly never follow a boxed curriculum.
Here in the U.K. the proponents of unschooling are much more radical. Authors such as Roland Meighan and Gareth Lewis would consider it completely pointless not to say bordering on child abuse to decide a child's curriculum for him/her. Jan Fortune-Wood has taken things that logical step further and has written several books with the thesis that not only is setting a child's academic curriculum coercive, disrespectful and abusive, but deciding ANYTHING for a child is coercive and wrong. Yes, that means that a child has the right to decide what and when he will eat, when he will get up and go to bed every day, what he will wear, when (if) he will wash or take a bath, etc. His time is his own to fill as he sees fit. If he decides to spend 12 hours daily playing a computer game, that should be respected. Seriously. (There is a website called Taking Children Seriously that enlarges on all of this.)
I would argue that this model of unschooling is incompatible with Catholic church teaching. It ignores the reality of fallen nature (would deny it actually as this educational philosophy is based on secular humanism), and the right and responsibility of parents to exercise legitimate and loving authority over their children.
I am cautious about John Holt. He is an interesting writer and has lots of good ideas and some insight into children, though only some. He is quite crazy at times, such as when he suggests a single parent leave her seven year old at home alone all day rather than send her to school if that is the only option. That made me feel he didn't know as much about seven year olds as I do.
We need balance. Learning can and should be a joy, but it is not without effort at times. Children should trust and obey their parents, and parents should be sensitive to their children's needs and not drive them to resentment.
Maybe we need to develop a new paradigm for Catholic unschooling which marries the wisdom of Catholic teaching through the ages with a modern understanding of children's needs and developmental stages.
Jane.
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4Real Forums : Living Learning
Topic: Are you an unschooler?
