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Claire F
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| Posted: Jan 23 2012 at 4:42pm | IP Logged
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(I apologize if this isn't the place for this - I wasn't quite sure where to post it. And I also apologize in advance if this is really long.)
Homeschooling is going wonderfully with my first grader, David. He tells me often how much he loves it and thanks me for being his teacher <3.
My 4 1/2 year old, Grayson, however, has taken to telling me that he will not be "doing homeschool" and wants to go to "real kindergarten" next year (by which he means the public school David went to for his kindergarten year).
I know that Grayson will always be a challenging child for me. It isn't so much that he exhibits bad behavior (any more than a typical little boy). His personality is just... difficult. For me, anyway. He likes doing things his own way, in his own time. He doesn't like being given hard and fast rules or directives. He's most likely to respond if he feels like he has some control over the situation, but he's also very random and will sometimes push back against even a previously "proven" tactic.
He is attending preschool this year, three mornings a week - our decision to homeschool our oldest was fairly last minute, and we decided not to pull Grayson out of preschool. But ever since we started talking to our oldest about homeschooling, Grayson has insisted he will not be doing school at home.
He does fine at school. They don't have any problems with him at all. From what I know, he listens fine and follows directions. He does the little letter tracing worksheets and coloring pages they do. It's light on academics, with lots of free play, art projects and read alouds. At school he seems to participate fairly well. At home, not so much.
It's hard to explain how he's challenging. It's almost like if he thinks I want him to do something, it better be a pretty fantastic idea to entice his interest, otherwise he automatically says no. He will not sit and read with us unless it is a picture book (and not always). He rarely wants to sit and color if David is doing a coloring page. He'll usually want to do one later, or he'll want to do it on the floor or otherwise make the situation his own (if he participates at all). I'm not asking anything of him during school time - just offering if we're doing something simple like a coloring page or read aloud.
Outside the home, we run into challenges as well. We let him try soccer through our YMCA in the fall and it was a disaster. He liked going to the practices, for the most part (although he very often would say he didn't want to go, but then have fun when he was there - something that happens nearly every school day as well). But he hated the games. He didn't want to play, and when his (very sweet) coaches would coax him out, he would try for a minute or two, but then take to shuffling up and down the field (well, court - it was indoors), or standing with his hands in his pockets. If they took him out of the game for a rest, he would cry and refuse to go back in. We didn't want to push it, so we didn't make a big deal out of it. But he kept saying he wanted to play, and then still having so much trouble during the games.
I guess the heart of my worry is that I wonder how I'm going to be able to teach him. I was talking to my mom last night and she asked why I don't just send him to kindergarten. Part of me is a little tempted, honestly. But the other problem (aside from the fact that in general, I feel that my kids will get a better education at home), is that he will grow quickly bored in public school. He's an early reader, and so much of what they do in kindergarten is reading. I volunteered a lot in David's classroom last year and I can tell Grayson already reads as well as or better than most of the kindergarten students. Kindergarten is so much more academic than his preschool and I think, without the all the free play, games and projects, he'd get tired of it pretty quickly - bored with the academics, but not getting the other things he likes about school now.
But I worry about how I'll be able to teach him. I don't want to butt heads with him all day long and make the whole thing a chore. But I also don't want to not do anything with him at all. I plan to keep kindergarten light - reading with each other, some work with numbers, and then tagging along for art projects and music with big brother (and anything else he is interested in that we're doing - but he generally doesn't). I guess the fact that he does well at his school now, in terms of participating and listening to his teachers, makes me wonder if he would do better at school away from me. :(
I realize he is really young and maybe I am getting way ahead of myself here.
I'm sorry this is so long. I just figured so many of you have homeschooled multiple children, all with their own unique needs, learning styles, personalities and challenges - and you manage to do it successfully! It has to be possible, even with my challenging little guy.
Right?
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Claire
Mom to DS 12/04, DS 5/07, DD 8/09
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Angie Mc
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| Posted: Jan 23 2012 at 4:56pm | IP Logged
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You are right!!!!! It is absolutely possible! By reaching out for support, good information, and encouragement, you are showing that you can take initiative to tackle your challenges.
Sorry I can't write more at the moment (I'm leaving for an appt) but wanted to give you a big  !
Love,
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Angie Mc
Maimeo to Henry! Dave's wife, mom to Mrs. Devin+Michael Pope, Aiden 20,Ian 17,John Paul 11,Catherine (heaven 6/07)
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kristinannie
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It sounds like you have a strong willed child and I completely get that!  First of all, know that most kids who see their friends going to PS and have attended preschool would complain about not going to "real school." I had this with my oldest. He went to preschool and pre-K and basically all they talked about for the last semester of pre-K was kindergarten. They even learned songs about how they were going to kindergarten. I wouldn't be surprised by this. This is how I dealt with that: I explained to him that we were homeschooling because God led us to that decision. It wasn't up for discussion because I believe strongly in doing this. I spent quite a bit of time talking to my son about the advantages of homeschooling: more free time to play, less worksheets and busywork, we can learn about more interesting things, we can sleep later, we have more time as a family, etc. We started homeschooling in June because I want to homeschool year round and also to get a couple of months in just in case we wanted to send him to PS if it wasn't working out. Once his friends started school, he understood the benefits right away. He kept wanting to have playdates, but the kids were in school or doing homework. He actually tells me quite often now that he loves homeschooling. He also loves it that we can take days off to play outside when the weather is gorgeous or go on fieldtrips or go to Grandma's or whatever.
As far as homeschooling a strong willed child, I think the most important focus of the first year or two should be obedience and respect. We are very much in the thick of that right now. I have found that the Catholic Treasure Box books and other Catholic picture books are wonderful for this purpose. I also liked the Children's Book of Virtues. It is important to also be consistent with how the child is supposed to behave. This is something that I have a lot of problem doing, but I am working on it.
I would make a really big deal of his first day of kindergarten. Get him his own set of colored pencils or crayons. Get him his own little organization system or however you organize your books. Have a really fun project planned. Take pictures. Maybe cook him a special breakfast or let him help you bake some cookies when he is done.
As far as read alouds, my 4 year old likes to listen in, but she needs to either be coloring or playing quietly with toys to be able to sit for that long. I hadn't really planned for her to do the chapter books with us, but she wanted to. She always wants to do school when we do it too so I do have it easier than you do (she is a girl though  ).
I would really pray about it. I have spent a lot of time in prayer about my son and God has really given me the grace and the wisdom to deal with him in constructive ways. God never leaves you alone. He will help you to raise any children that he blesses you with! Just know that you can homeschool him. We are all here to help you!
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mommy4ever
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| Posted: Jan 24 2012 at 11:33am | IP Logged
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Tough one. I agree with Kristinannie.
The decision really isn't his to make, is it? He may prove to be stubborn, to start, and with working on virtues, it will help.
I'd suggest working up to it. What does he really really love to do? What are his favorite things? Is he into space? Or jungle animals? Start creating a very interactive unit study, and let him see what you're doing. When he asks, tell him it's for kindergarten, and leave it at that. Entice his curiosity.
Start looking at field trips. What field trips were done with other home school families last year? What are some cool things in your area that could be done?
Is there indoor gymnastics? I know soccer was a bust, it was for my kids too. Practice is fun, everyone gets to do the drills, games, well not everyone gets to touch the ball. Individual sports are a great way to start.
Start considering plans. Let him see all the options, he'll start talking to the preschoolers and those that have older siblings will state what they didn't get to do. There is no field trip in Kindergarten that a homeschool group couldn't do.
Here we've the following opportunities;
swim lessons
art lessons
crafting lessons
cooking lessons
opera
symphony
ballet
science fairs
science workshops
piano lessons
rock climbing
down hill skiing
cross country skiing
dance
live theater
painting
sculpting
carving
pottery
Also matinees, play dates, swimming for fun, nature hikes, etc during 'school hours' when it's just a few kids vs the general public.
So do a brain storming session, include the older child for ideas. Then ask the younger one what types of things he'd like to do as field trips. Not to say you'll do everything. Be sure that's clear, but tell them that you want to know what they'd like to maybe try, and you'll see if you can find an opportunity.
As to getting the work done. Here i've made it very clear, that if the school doesn't get done, neither do the fun things.
Off to arrange a playdate for this afternoon..lol
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mamaslearning
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| Posted: Jan 24 2012 at 11:57am | IP Logged
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kristinannie wrote:
| As far as homeschooling a strong willed child, I think the most important focus of the first year or two should be obedience and respect. |
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Away school Kindergarten, besides teaching basic skills, is primarialy focused on teaching the children how to go to school - stand in line, raise your hand, sit quietly, obey the teacher, etc. So, K at home can be the same - respecting parents, sitting still, politely asking questions, etc. It's a training period, stepping stone to the next learning experience.
Sorry, nak is difficult with a toddler. I'll have to come back later.
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Claire F
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| Posted: Jan 24 2012 at 5:49pm | IP Logged
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Thank you all so much!
Thank you for the fantastic ideas. Getting him involved in planning will be a huge help, I think. He's much easier to deal with if he feels like he had a say in what is going on, so that is brilliant. I can get ideas and feedback from him which should help get him excited.
And no, it isn't his decision to make (and I didn't mean to imply I'd simply give him his way :)).
The encouragement and ideas are so helpful! Thank you!
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Claire
Mom to DS 12/04, DS 5/07, DD 8/09
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kristinannie
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| Posted: Jan 24 2012 at 9:02pm | IP Logged
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mommy4ever wrote:
Tough one. I agree with Kristinannie.
I'd suggest working up to it. What does he really really love to do? What are his favorite things? Is he into space? Or jungle animals? Start creating a very interactive unit study, and let him see what you're doing. When he asks, tell him it's for kindergarten, and leave it at that. Entice his curiosity.
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This is a great idea. I think going with the child's interest is so important in the early years especially. We did a space unit last fall. We aren't doing a dinosaurs unit, but we are learning A LOT about them right now! Let it be fun for him! Of course, he has to do handwriting and other subjects like that, but there can be a lot of fun! Good luck! You can do this!!!!!!!
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Elena
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I would encourage you to get this little guy into swimming - as often as you can possibly do it during the week. Boys are just a lot more malleable when they have been working against water for an hour or so. I had a boy just like this and I think swimming lessons and then the swim team was the only thing that saved us!
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SallyT
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I have two children who fit that "challenging" profile -- maybe I should think of them as my challengers . . . One is 18, a homeschool graduate, and in college; the other is 9.
Some random things I've learned in parenting these two (in company with a couple other more easygoing types):
*Some kids just have an automatic negative reaction. I'll never forget driving to visit a lighthouse when my oldest daughter was 3: the whole way there, strapped in her car seat, she was declaring, "And I DON'T LIKE LIGHTHOUSES. I am NOT GOING TO SEE A LIGHTHOUSE." Uh huh, we said, and kept driving. Once we got there, and she actually saw the lighthouse, she was interested, but as an abstract proposal originating in a source outside herself? No way. Again, often the appropriate response is to go, "Uh huh," and keep driving.
*Some kids like the idea of group activities, but hate the reality. Our 9yo son at 4 had watched his older brother playing soccer and given every indication of wanting to be on a team, until he actually was. After a couple of weeks of watching him lie in the grass wearing a uniform, we apologized to the coach and pulled him out. We should have known: when the 18yo was little, we went through any number of lessons and activities, all of which involved my paying to sit for half an hour with a crying child on my lap, until I decided that we could do that just as well for free at home. As much as people like my mother wanted to think that x, y, or z activity would be "good" for either of these kids, what I came to learn from them was that there was no point in pushing them into things until they gave serious signs of readiness. My daughter, for example, had to ask me for violin lessons for several years before I was finally convinced that she was serious enough actually to follow through without a meltdown. And at 8 she did have a level of maturity that she hadn't had at five or six. She still plays the violin, which I think is testimony to the power of waiting until the time is right, and the child can actually sort out what he/she really wants to do and commit to doing it.
*There's a reason why even some very bright boys don't start kindergarten at 5. I have a cousin whose kids go to school, and as she's generally a kind of driven person, I was heartened and encouraged when she delayed kindergarten for her son (a year older than my 9yo). She actually wound up doing that for both her children, but her delaying "big school" for her son gave me the encouragement to give my now-9yo an extra year to mature. Cognitively he probably would have been ready, but at just-turned-5 (he's a July baby) he was NOT ready to cooperate with me in any kind of lesson. If I tried to draw him into a reading lesson, for example, he would resist -- "I am NOT reading that book!" -- so I backed off. The year he was 5, I was schooling my two older kids in . . . whatever grades they were in at the time. 10th and 5th, I think? Anyway, with this boy and his little sister, I did lots of read-alouds, field trips, informal "life" math, etc, but no formal school. By the time he was 6, my son still wasn't an easy personality, but he had turned a certain corner in terms of willingness to participate. None of my kids have been early readers, but he followed the pattern set by my olders of learning very quickly and virtually on his own once we started. A few phonics lessons, some read-aloud practice, and he was off to the races. More formal math has happened pretty easily, too, and as he struggles with fine-motor coordination, the time to mature has helped him with the writing component of all our school. In short, when I saw that my choice was between fighting my son every step of the way, or just backing off and giving him more time, I chose the latter and haven't regretted it.
*"Know your child and work with him" is good advice. Knowing my child and working with him can mean, for example, that I'll pick a book that I know he'll like, but I'll also expect his first reaction to be negative, because that's just reality. So I leave it lying around. Or I read the first chapter aloud, saying that if he doesn't like it by the end of that chapter we'll put it away, but knowing that he'll be begging me to let him take it to his room and keep reading. Generally, with a little strategizing, I can get him to do what I want without a battle of wills in which I set him up to behave badly and be punished. The challenge with children like this, I think, is continually to figure out what's going to bring out their best and not their worst. I've noticed that both my children who fit this "challenger" profile thrive on a sense of their own success, and implode as soon as they feel "bad" or incapable -- they want to feel like good, smart kids who can do things, though their personalities and their perfectionism get in their way. They're also the kind of people who will even resist my efforts to make them partners in whatever we're doing -- if I ask my son what he wants to do for school, he'll invariably say, "Nothing." So I have to be a little bit crafty and manipulative . . .
*Telling yourself often that this child will be a fabulous adult really helps you through the difficult spots. The traits which make a young child hard to deal with really are the same traits which make a strong-minded, independent, clear-thinking adult. My oldest daughter was sometimes a nightmare as a little girl, but as a young woman, she is a great person and a pleasure to have around. The stubbornness and knowing her own mind which were tough to deal with when that mind was 4 are the same traits which have made her able to see through a lot of the nonsense that her peers get involved in, and to stand up for herself and her faith even to much older people. I can see her 9yo brother developing in the same way -- as he matures, I'm more and more able to respect and admire him as a person and to enjoy being with him, all of which helps the atmosphere of our schooling.
*It also really helps to encourage older kids to work independently as much as and as soon as possible, because at least in the beginning, the challengers do demand more time and attention. If you have a kid whom you can trust to do some work on his own, set up your days around that ability, to free yourself for some extra face time with the younger, more resistant child, whom you may have to woo more with read-alouds and games. This works better than trying to make that child fit into a standardized school schedule, at least to begin with.
Again, these are just random thoughts. I do have a lot of sympathy for my challengers, because I see a lot of myself in them -- I drove my mother frequently insane when I was growing up in many of the same ways, and I think that knowing that probably helps me to deal gently (at my best) with these two people in my life. I will say that though we've certainly had our bumps, both of them have been quite successful homeschoolers, and ultimately -- though I've sometimes had to grit my teeth and persevere -- I am truly glad to be educating them this way, and knowing them this intimately. I've been glad to be able to offer them my love in this way.
Hope this encourages you. Hang in there!
Sally
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mommy4ever
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Great post Sally!!! I'll be making some notes too...
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Claire F
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Sally, I could kiss you.
Thank you so much for sharing your experience - so much of what you said is really, really helpful.
One thing that I need to keep in mind is that I can do things at a pace that is appropriate not only to his level academically, but to his maturity level as well. This is why we're homeschooling (I remind myself)! If he isn't ready to do much formal work when he "should" be starting kindergarten, that is ok. I still have to remind myself of that.
I am bookmarking this thread! I'm sure I'll need to refer back to it often.
In some ways, I am getting spoiled by my oldest. He is such a good student most of the time. He's a pleaser, and he hates getting in trouble, so it takes so little to keep him on task. Plus he loves most of what we're doing for school, so his interest is high. Little brother is his opposite in so many ways - I continually have to remind myself that what works for David won't work well for Grayson. He challenges me to be creative on a daily basis!
And he comes by his propensity to be challenging very honestly. He is so much like my husband. He even looks the most like my husband out of our three. I often ask my husband for insight - how would you have felt about this/dealt with this as a child? Sometimes that helps :).
Thanks again!
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Claire
Mom to DS 12/04, DS 5/07, DD 8/09
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SallyT
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I know what you mean about the difference in your boys. My 9yo follows an older brother (now 14) who has always been the "easy" peacemaking child in our family. He's always cooperated and enjoyed schoolwork, and he's quite, quite bright and good at pretty much everything. His Scout leader goes on so much about him that I feel badly for the Scout leader's own son, who has to listen to it. I admit that I find myself sometimes falling into the trap of thinking, "If only I can hit the right formula, I can make B (the 9yo) turn out like J!" And this is such a lie! And so unfair to my younger son, who is his own person, with his own gifts, who should not have to live in his brother's shadow.
So I have to fight that in myself, and make myself look for what's endearing and noble in my younger son. Actually, I thought about that just now -- he just came downstairs, as he does every night about this time (10:30), to tell us he can't sleep and to try to mooch around the kitchen with the grownups. As I do every night, I said, "I'm sorry, but you'll have to go be awake in your bed." He shrugged, then came and gave me a long, sweet hug, and I was reminded of what a tender, loving heart he has, even when he's pushing the limits.
And although he was once the child I couldn't take my eyes off, ever, he'll now work through his routine of school "sit-down work" independently and without supervision. I can actually go put in a load of laundry and come back to find him doing math, instead of running up and down the front porch with a lightsaber. It really, really does get easier. The personality doesn't go away, but maturity makes all the difference -- and you begin to see that the investment you made in homeschooling on the front end, when it was so hard, is paying off in all kinds of ways. I am so glad I kept this child at home and close to me, because now we know and appreciate each other.
It's so hard not to compare kids, especially when an older child is kind of your ideal. The beauty of homeschooling is that you're there day by day with the challenging child, so that you see his different facets as they emerge.
My husband says our 9yo is just like him at that age. I now understand a lot of what my mother-in-law used to say when we were first married . . . things like, "Well, I hope you have some little boys just like you . . . " Let's just say I have renewed appreciation for my mother-in-law, too, so that's another gift!
Sally
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Mom21
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I won't touch on the homeschool part because you've received some really great responses!
My only suggestion is that maybe you back away from the sports for now and concentrate on the school part. Personally, I always thought preschool age was a bit young to start organized sports. Our kiddo, who's almost 11, didn't start until 2nd grade and even then I didn't expect too much. Maybe something low key at this point where he isn't on a team or has to compete in games but where he's getting some exercise.
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Claire F
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Yes, we've definitely backed off of sports. He can try again when he's older, but for now we might do swim lessons or preschool gymnastics as our schedule allows, but no more team sports. My older son was ready at this age, and has always really loved playing sports. So we've let him run with it. We let Grayson try, as he's always seen his brother playing, but he's definitely not ready. And that's totally fine! We didn't want to make a recreational activity into a chore, so we've just let it be.
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Claire
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4Real Forums : Living Learning
Topic: I think I could use a little pep talk
