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knowloveserve
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| Posted: Aug 26 2011 at 6:43pm | IP Logged
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... What would you do? I'm trying to figure out my son and how to best address his needs.
He will be 7 years old in October. The second son. He is extremely bright. He taught himself to read last year; he has picked up many songs by ear on the piano and even composes his own little diddies here and there. After begging and pleading to do it last year, he is now half-way through Teaching Textbooks 3. I designed my own FIAR-style program with him last year that went well. He is distinctly at a 2nd grade level this year, so we are going to be preparing him for First Holy Communion in spring.
The trouble is that he has no motivation whatsoever to do schoolwork. He's on a Math strike right now and since he's so far ahead of his age level, I'm just letting that be. He has a spelling and handwriting book but he hates doing them. He pretty much dislikes doing any sit-down work. He puts his hand in his head, rubs his eyes, scribbles in the margins and looks for any kind of distraction, even though I know he could do the work in 5 minutes flat if he just tried. He is immune to punishments it seems. He'd rather get privileges taken away than do school (For the record, we have this problem with his chores too; he fights the simplest tasks nearly every day.)
I've read a million and a half books on homeschooling. I know young boys need lots of muscle movement and I'm trying to incorporate that into our day but it's difficult sometimes. I am attracted to the ideas of unschooling but wonder about my motives. Is it just because I'm sick of fighting him? I want the easy way out? Then I wonder if we really have a rich enough lifestyle to adequately 'unschool' our children. Here's what I CAN and CAN'T offer my kids right now:
CAN offer:
-We go to daily Mass, praise God; this is a huge blessing.
-We are always doing read alouds and have picture books galore.
-I get out in nature maybe every other week. The kids aren't really interested in journaling their discoveries, but I don't force it. I model it, but they'd rather throw rocks in the water.
-We have a huge, open attic space filled with legos, dress-up, and lots of educational board games.
-We don't watch TV and the occasional video is allowed as a treat.
-I cook our meals from scratch usually and I'm not adverse to sharing my kitchen prep space with curious children.
-We run errands and I give the kids chances to compare produce and prices of groceries and read nutrition labels and pay for things.
-Both the older boys do martial arts twice a week through the church.
-This son will be starting piano lessons weekly in October.
-Much of my day feels like it's playing catch-up on housework; we don't "do" a whole lot.
What I CAN'T offer:
-Tons of free, roaming time in the wilderness or in wide open spaces... much as my heart longs to. We live in the city and to get out in the wild blue yonder takes more gas and money than we can allot
-I don't sit down and do cool science experiments with the children.
-We don't do a whole lot of artwork.
-We don't dream up and research cool projects that are often hilighted on unschooly blogs.
- We go to Mass, we eat breakfast, we do morning chores, we plow through some school work, kids sometimes ride bikes in the alley, we eat lunch, we have quiet time, kids do afternoon chorese, the kids play or we run errands, we read something, I make dinner, we eat, kids do evening chores, occasionally we pray as a family, but usually the night ends with us exhausted pushing the kids into bed.
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At any rate, I feel like I need the structure of some kind of school or my kids will just fall victim to my rushing through my day without me really doing all the quality, wonderful things that it seems unschooly parents do.
My first son is 9. Academically average. He plods through the school day some but I figure it's typical for his age and gender. I don't worry about it. But I do worry that my second son is hating formal schoolwork and I'm just making it worse. Still, it would be the height of injustice to "unschool" or be totally lax on him while still doing regular school with the firstborn.
What would you do?
By the way, I'm due any day now with our 5th child... we schooled all through August so we can take all of September off and adjust to baby. So if that's relevant...
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Ellie
The Bleeding Pelican
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mom2mpr
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| Posted: Aug 26 2011 at 6:49pm | IP Logged
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He's 7 and a boy and ahead. Relax and enjoy having the baby. In a few months pick it up again and do some reading and math games. Sounds like my ds who is now 13. I am working with him to learn to "work" for school right now--preparing for high school. He learns well when he puts his mind to it and because of his age, he can see it now. At 7--he was clueless. Let him do his thing and maybe, to make it fair for 9 year old, give him school "projects" to have something to be accountable for. He is still going to learn.
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Anne, married to dh 16 years!, ds,(97), Little One (02), and dd (02).
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JodieLyn
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| Posted: Aug 26 2011 at 7:32pm | IP Logged
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Quote:
I get out in nature maybe every other week. The kids aren't really interested in journaling their discoveries, but I don't force it. I model it, but they'd rather throw rocks in the water.
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Why don't you journal after you come home.. great time to get out those not used much art supplies and let them express themselves in pictoral form instead of primarily writing. Taking pictures with a digatl camera can help with this too.. then you can have the pictoral record to refer to for journaling.
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Jodie, wife to Dave
G-18, B-17, G-15, G-14, B-13, B-11, G-9, B-7, B-5, B-4
All men who have turned out worth anything have had the chief hand in their own education.
-Sir Walter Scott
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Aagot
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| Posted: Aug 26 2011 at 8:47pm | IP Logged
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I agree with the suggestions already made.
Here is what I would do:
1. Don't worry at this stage. I'd back off on both of them for a while.
2.Is there a park near by that you could walk/bike to? After you are rested from the delivery of course.
3.Go to the library and check out books on science and history related topics that you can just have available for them to read. (Bethlehem Books and D'Aulaire books for the history esp.) Let them read as much as they like.
4.Go to the TOPS web site and print out a few (no more than 10 at this point) free experiments. When you get a chance gather the materials for each exp. into a zip lock baggie and include the one page instructions. You could put a new one out once a week for them to work on at their own pace.
5.Play math card games to keep their facts fresh. I love RightStarts card games. I know there are other ideas listed in previous thread on games.
6. Maybe BananaGrams or the like for spelling
Thats it! There you have Exercise,Reading, Science, History, Math and spelling. Religion can be covered with reading too and of course you have the Mass. Most of this won't take any of your time. It may take a week or so for the boys to realize that you aren't forcing them to do school and then they will gravitate to what you have available.
What do you think?
Aagot
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kristacecilia
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| Posted: Aug 26 2011 at 9:04pm | IP Logged
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Ummm... did you write this about MY seven year old son?
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God bless,
Krista
Wife to a great guy, mom to two boys ('04, '06) and three girls ('08, '10, '12!)
I blog at http://kristacecilia.wordpress.com/
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ekbell
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| Posted: Aug 26 2011 at 10:24pm | IP Logged
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My second daughter is also discinclined to change her behavior through removal of privileges or rewards. It's usually easier now but I remember the trials when she was seven.
This leads to Things That Have Helped
1)picking my battles: this covers both considering if a particular battle needs to be fought and fighting one battle at a time and waiting until good habits are formed before moving to another rather then fighting all battles at the same time. I chose to deal with chores first, myself.
2)with my daughter the most effective tactic has been a reasonably calm overseer continually redirecting her back to her task and breaking down tasks so that she can easily see an endpoint. For
many tasks using time limits and a timer work well (15 mins of actual work goes over better then 'finish this page' even if the page should take less then 15mins, I think it's because 15mins on a timer is a very definate amount of time and thus work). Time limits and timers have another great benefit from my point of view - I can set them to fit how long I can be a patient overseer 
3)what we are trying to do is develop good habits and that doesn't happen quickly but rather over weeks
4)giving choices is good when feasible but never offer a choice you can't live with. Realise that the normal reward/removal of privileges implicitly offers the choice of not doing the work and going without the reward/privileges so....
5) keep in mind that this disinterest to rewards/loss of privileges coupled with stubbornness have their good side, such a person is much less likely to be lead astray by superficial things.
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Tina P.
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| Posted: Aug 30 2011 at 1:33pm | IP Logged
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Something that works for my kids: exercise. I can tell them, "Finish math (or whatever -- or even several subjects) and you can spend 15 minutes on the trampoline." If you don't have a tramp, can you have them run races in the yard? How about informal soccer?
I don't know how old your oldest is, but he (I'm guessing) might get everyone in order, so that you don't have to be so physically involved. You can just cheer on the sidelines. 
Another thought: when I've been pregnant/just had a baby, I have used the time to read aloud. A LOT. We have devoured books like The Three Musketeers, Swiss Family Robinson, Robinson Crusoe, and Peter Pan (not to mention some of the Freddy the Pig series). The kids at this age often act out the book in their spare time.
Have him help you cook. Measuring things, combining things to make other things, even greasing pans ~ all this is an education in math and science. Oh, and it would be a great idea to train him in home economics in keeping house. CALL it home economics. Make it sound more important. And maybe offer treats for jobs well done ???
I found a cool little thing at a Montessori site where kids put beads into little suction cupped shapes to help build up their fine motor muscles for writing and drawing.
Every time my kids wear out of doing more traditional school, we fall back into a still-learning-not-so-schooly mode. I'm just throwing ideas out there, ideas they can still learn from but are not doing so much seatwork.
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Tina, wife to one and mom to 9 + 3 in heaven
Mary's Muse
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knowloveserve
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| Posted: Oct 18 2011 at 4:30pm | IP Logged
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I just came on here to reread this out of desperation. I pin myself in a corner sometimes because so often he gets treats or privileges confiscated due to poor behavior in non-academic areas... so I wonder how effective it would be to offer a treat when I already told him he was grounded from goodies that day.
He loves video games; but I don't use that as an incentive very often at all. I aim to minimize that not out of purely aesthetic reasons, but really because when my kids get screen time, it brings out the worst in them. They can't walk away from it without some kind of anger or tears.
I have to keep my eye on the prize: Heaven, not college. And so much of my day is spent in frustration with him being distracted or disobedient, and he in turn gets frustrated or unresponsive because Mom is in a bad mood... that I want to throw my hands in the air and say "I give up!!!"
I wonder if we'd be better off NOT doing any school work and just focusing on our relationships... the same amount of work would get done (none) but at least we'd be happy and loving. I know God didn't intend for us to homeschool just to push kids through checking items off a list come hell or highwater. It has to begin and end with Love.
I want to be a loose homeschooler... even an unschooler. But I am afraid of taking that leap. I tell myself that these are my education goals:
-That my children love to read and to learn.
-That they know HOW to learn anything they want to.
-That they know the basic mechanics of writing and math.
-That they grow in virtue and in the faith.
-That they know the rules of logic.
-That they know how to articulate their positions well.
And that's really it. There are secondary goals that are much more extensive, but really if my kids mastered this stuff, I'd be happy. I guess it's the final two points that concern me. While those don't really come up much until later years, I feel like I need to lay the groundwork now with formal work.
I don't even know what I'm getting at here. Just frustrated in trying to match my ideal homeschooling with what's REALLY happening in our home. Just trying to love my son better and meet his needs. Trying to figure him out.
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Ellie
The Bleeding Pelican
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JodieLyn
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You have lots of time to "lay the groundwork".. there are lots of resources out there about better late than early.. you HAVE TIME on your side... really. 
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Jodie, wife to Dave
G-18, B-17, G-15, G-14, B-13, B-11, G-9, B-7, B-5, B-4
All men who have turned out worth anything have had the chief hand in their own education.
-Sir Walter Scott
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CrunchyMom
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Ellie, I think you would really like A Little Way of Homeschooling. You can read the first chapter, "St. Therese and Unschooling" there. It is a lovely little book. It seems to echo and affirm some of your expressed desires, and I think you would find it refreshing. 
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Lindsay
Five Boys(6/04) (6/06) (9/08)(3/11),(7/13), and 1 girl (5/16)
My Symphony
[URL=http://mysymphonygarden.blogspot.com/]Lost in the Cosmos[/UR
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SuzanneG
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Ellie~
This book was mentioned years ago by MacBeth....but in case you haven't read it or come across it, I think you'd find it FASCINATING!
The Call To Brilliance
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Suzanne in ID
Wife to Pete
Mom of 7 (Girls - 14, 12, 11, 9, 7 and Boys - 4, 1)
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knowloveserve
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CrunchyMom wrote:
| Ellie, I think you would really like A Little Way of Homeschooling. You can read the first chapter, "St. Therese and Unschooling" there. It is a lovely little book. It seems to echo and affirm some of your expressed desires, and I think you would find it refreshing. |
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I did like it, a lot! I reviewed it for Suzie in my journal for this upcoming fall issue of Soul Gardening. (Our website is wonky, so I linked to an e-version of the summer journal. Enjoy!)
Suzanne, that other book recommendation looks great, thanks!!!
I need to just trust... and be at peace with taking time off right now; I don't want the power struggle.
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Ellie
The Bleeding Pelican
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CrunchyMom
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Thanks, Ellie, for the link.
Suzanne, that book does look really great!
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Lindsay
Five Boys(6/04) (6/06) (9/08)(3/11),(7/13), and 1 girl (5/16)
My Symphony
[URL=http://mysymphonygarden.blogspot.com/]Lost in the Cosmos[/UR
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SallyT
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Hm, if it's spelling and handwriting workbooks that he dislikes in particular, try a different tack to accomplish spelling and handwriting. What about letter writing? My 7yo (a girl, admittedly) loves writing letters, and with both my younger kids (girl/7 and boy/9) I've had them dictate a letter to me, then they copy what I've written down. It's their words, but spelled correctly, and they don't have to stress about thinking and writing at the same time. We write notes to grandmothers, to shut-ins in the parish, to friends, etc.
Otherwise, we do copywork for "language arts." I try to pick passages my 9yo son won't hate -- he's in a negative phase right now himself but needs the writing practice so much that I feel I really can't afford to back off. I just try to find stuff that's funny, or comes from a book he likes, or whatever it takes to make it palatable. I'm thinking that having him make a list of supplies for his upcoming Cub Scout camping trip would be a good exercise for this week, too. Anyway, maybe just a change from the workbook format, figuring out a "real life" way to have him do some writing and attend to his spelling, will help you accomplish some simple goals.
And I know you don't want more video games in your life (who does, really?), but I've found that judicious use of some selected online math and science games has been a pretty good thing for my youngers. We have liked the games and activities at CoolMath.com, and right now both the younger kids are enjoying the Wild Kratts games at PBSKids.org. They play together, and I find that these kinds of games don't wind them up in the way that their Gameboy games (mostly Star Wars Lego games) used to (I have hidden the Gameboys, forgotten where I put them, and plan to ease them out of my house altogether whenever I find them again). The kids have been regaling me at dinner with all kinds of wild-creature and habitat facts, and quizzing each other ("I'm thinking of three ocean fish. What could they be?"), so I figure that again, a judicious, as in not all day, use of these resources isn't a bad free-time occupation, particularly when the weather's rainy. These things have sparked some good interests, too -- just last night, while the boys were at Scouts, my 7yo and I looked up, talked about, and watched YouTube video footage of blue whales, because some deep-sea game she and her brother had been playing had made her want to learn more.
FWIW, though, I've been having these kinds of days with my 7yo. She doesn't downright refuse, but she can be pretty defiant and/or subversive, and we've had a LOT of that "Mom is in a bad mood, and school is a drag" dynamic. I try to highlight the things we all really do enjoy (read-alouds), to praise her to the skies when she does cooperate, to make anything that's going well a bonding experience (buddy-reading together on the couch -- I try to make that really a good, loving time), and -- the hardest part -- to keep my cool when she's not cooperating, while quietly, so as not to seem to be giving in to her moods, adjusting what we're doing so that we can get it done. I'm not a real hands-on science-y or arty mom, either, and my daily routine and household set-up looks a lot like yours . . . We just take it a day at a time . . .
Hang in there!
Sally
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Castle in the Sea
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AmandaV
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Soul Gardening looks like a great little journal!
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Amanda
wife since 6/03, Mom to son 7/04, daughter 2/06, twin sons 6/08 and son 7/11, son 1/2014
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knowloveserve
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| Posted: Oct 20 2011 at 11:51am | IP Logged
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AmandaV wrote:
Soul Gardening looks like a great little journal!
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Thank you! It is.  It's an honor to be a part of such an excellent little ministry and all our positive feedback has really encouraged us to keep pressing on despite this not being a print-friendly age. (Subscription info can be found at www.soulgardeningjournal.com)
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Ellie
The Bleeding Pelican
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4Real Forums : Living Learning
Topic: Pretend he was your child...
