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mama2many
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| Posted: June 09 2010 at 7:42am | IP Logged
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We started hs'ing the girls (K and 3) in March, pulled them from a public school, using Seton. I am 33 weeks pg. I am feeling a pull away from Seton, but I'm thinking that this upcoming "school year" isn't the year to make this change.
So, if I use Seton again for 4 and 1, what should I do to really examine what I like and don't like about the program? With a newborn, toddler and preschooler, I'd LOVE to make learning more hands on and FUN!! And Seton feels like it's book work.
Being new to this I'm still VERY MUCH disorganized and not sure I'm really ready for the full CM approach. (see last thread I started, I got some wonderful advice from you ladies)
I'm sorry if this is the same exact question I asked before.. again I'm 33 weeks pg and not sure how much my cogs are firing anymore! 
God Bless
__________________
Krystin
wife to Kevin
mama to
M (12/00)
J (12/01)
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J (7/08)
A (7/10)
C (11/12)
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10 Bright Stars
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| Posted: June 09 2010 at 8:04am | IP Logged
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Krystin,
I too use Seton. The older kids aged 15 and 13 are fully enrolled. For the other kids 8, 10, and 6 I use some of their curriculum, but not all of it. (There are a few other littles too that are not in school yet.)
My advice would be to use what you want for Seton. Even enroll them if you want to, but then don't feel pressured to check every box in their lesson plans. Sometimes go over a topic broadly as opposed to the week by week way they give you to explain some things. Remember, they HAVE to include every little thing for their accredidation. That doesn't mean that you need to use every little thing to teach your own child since they may pick it up faster.
Also, I would NOT switch to something new with a newborn on the way OR think that you will be able to pull off a bunch of cool crafts, nature studies etc. with a nursing baby in tow. I have tried this and it proves disappointing and unrealistic when I am busy with newborn needs, low on sleep etc. Why not try adding in just a few CM type goals such as A nature walk a week and then just adding in a lot of really fun books! They are all so little still and you can read while you nurse or feed the baby very easily while recovering etc. Then, maybe look forward to planning more "project" or fun oriented school time in the summer after this year. That way, you have all year to plan, think about and attempt to implement the way you think you want things to go, which will help you know more when you are planning the following school year. Seton is great for being there for the busy mom and helping make sure SOMETHING actually gets done when you have a major life change which is what a new baby is.
Hope this helps and congratualtions on the baby! 
__________________
Kim married to Bob (22y)
Mom of 11 blessings:
Bobby 19, David 17, Noah 14,
Mary 12, Gracie 10,
Isabelle and Sophia 8,
Gabrielle 6,
William Anthony 4, Joseph 3 and Luisa Marie - born in M
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mama2many
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| Posted: June 09 2010 at 8:22am | IP Logged
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Thank you so much!!! I think right now I feel like I don't want to make my 3rd grader do a book report.. LOL
I've given up on handwriting b/c hers is AMAZING.. I got upset with her b/c I thought she hadn't done anything but it looked JUST like the sample in the book! 
So those things aren't required w/ Seton?
We still are trying to find time to get the CAT taken for the county regulations.. 
Thank you so much again for the help!!
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Krystin
wife to Kevin
mama to
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CrunchyMom
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| Posted: June 09 2010 at 9:30am | IP Logged
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Krystin,
Perhaps you could make those lists that Jen laid out so nicely in this thread and figure out the subject(s) for which you most feel that pull.
Handwriting is a good example. If you don't use a handwriting program that would open up some time to include dictation and copywork in a CM type way.
Perhaps if you also decided to do your own history or literature, you could integrate that. I don't know much about Seton's curriculum, but you could probably use their history text as a spine and incorporate a book of centuries/timeline approach and find living books to read instead of relying on the text for the bulk of your reading. You might still use the lesson plans to help you set your pace or check off the things covered.
I think that CM does start written narrations at around 3rd or 4th grade, which might be sort of like a book report, but you could start out the year with oral and only require written as you feel she is ready.
I'm not sure how much you can modify this and still be *enrolled* with Seton (you would need to speak to someone at Seton about that), but if you were just following their lesson plans as a guide, you could do whatever you wanted.
__________________
Lindsay
Five Boys(6/04) (6/06) (9/08)(3/11),(7/13), and 1 girl (5/16)
My Symphony
[URL=http://mysymphonygarden.blogspot.com/]Lost in the Cosmos[/UR
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ALmom
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You can enroll in Seton in the elementary years and do whatever you want to do - honestly! If you want grades from them, then hand in the few required things. If you don't and just want their plans, you pay the same amount, but do what you want, don't get grades from them, and move them up to the next grade when it is time to. It helps if you tell them upfront that you just want their plans but you might only hand in a few things - and maybe nothing at all. This is more psychologically freeing - ie reminder to you and them that you will not be controlled by the program - you will do things your own way. There may even be a counselor or two who did this in the elementary years with their own children. I've heard Seton conference speakers talk about some very creative things they did - projects in history, etc. There is way more freedom to modify programs in the elementary level.
You can use Seton materials as a sort of overview - what kinds of things are typically covered in x grade and as an emergency worktext for those inevitable (and with a baby there may be many of them)days when life is just stressful, busy and full of interruptions. Then as you have time and energy, cover the concepts in whatever way you want. Use whatever you want to introduce the concepts - Montessori, CM, your own mix of things and then when you have a hairy day, you have the workbooks to fall back on for an occassional review.
In 3rd, they have reading comp workbooks - glance at the questions and what they are doing. You can certainly use this to learn from - but you can also do this by simply reading aloud and discussing things. Occassionally pull out something and do a studied dictation.
Read real books and discuss it as you want to - but if you have a rough day or no time with a newborn or .... you can pull out the workbook for a day and still cover the same thing. Pick the thing that must be handed in if that is what you want to do - or pick ones that you think most beneficial to your child.
Or if all that workbook writing is overwhelming you and the child, then curl up in the bed together doing a read aloud and discussing it while the baby nurses - or sleeps.
Seton's supplemental and book report reading recommendations are really good - just read them and do a oral retelling as someone else mentioned. Discuss things in it together.
Have times when your child reads aloud to you and the baby. It doesn't have to be Seton's reader - use living books. However, if you know you will be at the docs the entire day - take the Seton worktext with you and let the child do the one handed in assignment while you wait.
Look at the time period covered in history - you can use Seton as an emergency safety valve like a workbox idea - and branch off gently as you are both inspired. So if you are reading the history worktext from Seton - and you know you have 3 or 4 books on the shelf that would be way more interesting - put the workbook aside, read the books, talk about them and move on. Instead of verifying that they comprehend something by answering questions, nothing says you cannot achieve the same thing by doing a project together, re-enacting or drawing or even making a big crafty thing (not super likely with a newborn, but certainly countable if dad/grandma has a fun day - or takes the children off to a history museum or something) - all depends on your time, energy, interests of you both and time and what fits in the dynamics of the family. You can also simply discuss things, make/buy timelines, have the child do a timeline notebook (and you can use DVD printouts to color if prefered or let the child practice drawing skills and writing skills by putting header or sentence about the person/event. You don't have to answer all the questions - but maybe you decide to have them do a few just to practice writing or coming up with sentences. But another day you are more energetic, the baby is taking a long nap - you can have fun and do the same things however you want. But you have an outline, you don't have to create on your own when you are not likely to have the time or energy to do it. Of course, if you have a wave of inspiration and whatever - nothing says you cannot totally substitute your own thing for history. That is perfectly acceptable.
Science - get the Seton worktexts. They have some built in experiments, but nothing says you cannot order a few self contained kits recommended on other sites - or take a nature walk day which allows you and the children, including the baby to get a nice walk at the same time. Do anything messy outside for a while. Also do a library visit and supplement with interesting books on the same materials - but you don't have to stress because if it doesn't happen today, you still have the other stuff.
The biggest thing with Seton, is don't be stressed with finishing everything. (Everything will be repeated again next year anyways - so go slowly, savor what you are learning and when you are at the end of the year, it is about what you have accomplished in terms of really learning - not whether or not you finished the texts or handed in all the assignments).
Also incorporate math into your kitchen/chores - so they work in their worktext most of the time - but you extend the lesson as you are going about your day, doing chores.
Janet
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SuzanneG
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| Posted: June 09 2010 at 10:45am | IP Logged
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Eight Wonders wrote:
Also, I would NOT switch to something new with a newborn on the way OR think that you will be able to pull off a bunch of cool crafts, nature studies etc. with a nursing baby in tow. |
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After the first 6 weeks or so, I think it's easier with a nursing baby....up until they start moving around. So, you're due in July, right? And, then you'd have August and Sept to "recover." You could start implementing a few things after September, depending on how things are going with the baby and your sleep, etc.
I'd go through Jen's list in the other thread and identify those things. Keep the "necessaries" with Seton for the 4th grader that you don't want to change. Then, take 1 or 2 CM things at a time and implement them after September. 1 thing at a time. You also have a few weeks right now to do 1 thing....maybe......
** begin simple narrating...getting them used to the idea
** begin a fun read aloud and talk about it
** do one sentence of very simple copy work every morning...maybe start copying a poem or a sentence from your read aloud.
** go outside once a week and find something to draw...you too!
And, this is just my personal opinion and comfort level, but I do not at ALL think it's necessary to have a formal curriculum for a 1st grader!!! So, if you're feeling a pull AWAY from the "set curriculum"...the 1st grader would be a good place to give it up!  It's pretty harmless at this stage!  Read tons of picture books, include her/him in your care for the baby, lots of drawing/writing, outside play. Depending on her reading / pre-reading level---working a couple times a week on reading. And, then everything else you're doing together counts!
Don't hesitate to come back and get specific! We can get more specific about the CM things that you identify and what that would look like for either the 1st or 4th grader in those specific forums.
__________________
Suzanne in ID
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Mom of 7 (Girls - 14, 12, 11, 9, 7 and Boys - 4, 1)
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Mackfam
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| Posted: June 09 2010 at 11:46am | IP Logged
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Krystin,
Sometimes it's easier for me to envision a change like this if I can *see* how someone else works it.
I'm going to share my 1st graders plans for next year so you can see what a Charlotte Mason day might look like in our family with a 1st grader (note...I'm not a purist, so you'll see some Montessori work thrown in there too!).
2010-06-09_111605_1st_grade_-_term_1.pdf
2010-06-09_111619_1st_grade_-_term_2.pdf
2010-06-09_111630_1st_grade_-_term_3.pdf
2010-06-09_111644_1st_grade_-_term_4.pdf
Just so you're able to *read* these plans...items which are bolded indicate the amount of material I want to cover in one term...below that I detail how much I will complete in a day.
I'm so glad others could help you with Seton-specific advice as I have no experience there.
If you're going to spend the year examining...ask yourself some specific questions...brainstorming...
** are your children enjoying the majority of their work?
** in terms of the subject matter - do your children enjoy the way it is conveyed or are they overwhelmed and/or bored?
** are you overwhelmed and/or bored?
** do you feel like you're consistently trying to shove square pegs into round holes? get creative with the curriculum (Janet gives great ideas in her post)...can you come at something from a different angle? supplement? is it fatally flawed? is a book/curriculum suffocating the joy in learning?
** can you call Seton and modify their plans?
** do the Seton plans fit your family?
** are you overwhelmed trying to think of home education in another way besides a Seton approach?
** are you overwhelmed with the Seton plans?
** are you helped by their lesson plans and guidance?
** do your children long for more freedom and creativity in terms of their work?
** do you feel that with a little effort on your part you could supply that?
** are your children encountering ideas which are good, true, and beautiful in their days?
Honestly, Krystin, this is more about finding where you fit and feel most comfortable in terms of educational philosophy than anything else. And even after finding that, tweaking so that it is a custom-family-fit. Whatever your educational philosophy - whether you fit best with a modified Seton approach, or you end up with a Charlotte Mason approach - it's going to take some effort and work on your part to further hone and apply that philosophy so that it works and translates for your family in your home.
So, sticking with Seton for another year is fine as long as you are aware of those areas that could lead to burnout or you're feeling overwhelmed. How about considering this a year of reflection? Live it, but ask yourself lots of questions and do lots of reading so you can find the educational philosophy that best fits your family and then you've given yourself time and permission to implement without feeling overwhelmed.
There is so much within Charlotte Mason's philosophy that speaks to me. Her belief that education is "a life" speaks so beautifully to what we try to do in our home. It's what we try to communicate here at 4Real - the many ways we *live* our learning. It's a lifestyle more than a curriculum. Miss Mason said, "the life of the mind grows upon ideas." Ideas. Your children can encounter ideas in so many places. If you choose to live out a year with Seton, provide an idea-rich environment. Ideas are found and shared in living books and ordinary moments exploring together!
I sure hope this helps, Krystin, and isn't more overwhelming as you consider and prepare. 
__________________
Jen Mackintosh
Wife to Rob, mom to dd 19 , ds 16, ds 11, dd 8, and dd 3
Wildflowers and Marbles
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mama2many
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| Posted: June 09 2010 at 11:56am | IP Logged
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I am so BLESSED to have been led to this group!! I have found so many honest women, willing to help!!! It is a great feeling! And I thank you!
I see I have a lot more prayer and research to do, thank you ever so much!!!
I was given the advice to take several months off to "de-school" and we didn't. DH and I have a hard time unlearning the stuff we learned in SCHOOL!!!
Like you sit at a desk with little breaks for 6+ hours a day.. gee, I wonder why I was a horrid student??
__________________
Krystin
wife to Kevin
mama to
M (12/00)
J (12/01)
K (6/06)
J (7/08)
A (7/10)
C (11/12)
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JennGM
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| Posted: June 09 2010 at 12:37pm | IP Logged
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Now, Jen, can you please share 2nd grade plans so I don't need to write mine?
mama2many wrote:
| I see I have a lot more prayer and research to do, thank you ever so much!!! |
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I'm still a major work in progress. A few notes for me on the process of answering those tugs. I've found that is important for me to do these steps.
::Pray, often and always.
::Research, which includes books, catalogs, internet info, asking questions, but most importantly asking friends who have been there, done that. Get the reality check.
::Frequent Discussions with Husband about his vision, sharing yours, coming to agreement on how we will school our children.
::Decision and Implemetation. At a reasonable point stop the research and just do it.
Trust in God.
Don't look back, don't look over the fence at the seemingly greener grass.
Keep your eyes on your own work. Realize that even though you can be inspired by others, leave it at inspiration.
Your needs and family are unique. Each child is unique. Nothing will look exactly like anyone else's.
::Make a plan. This is one of the harder areas for me. Commiting myself to paper, and making a plan. There is the yearly plan, overall/bird's eye view, then the seasonal/monthly/weekly/daily plans.
::Self-discipline. My biggest hurdle. Have a weekly and daily routine or schedule and implement the plans, update as needed.
::Revamping I do need to be open to the Holy Spirit when things are slipping. But where I look first at the failings is me. Am I getting up and getting into gear every day? Am I just trying to coast, or am I showing by my own example to pick myself up and perform my daily duty to the best of my ability?
After making sure it's not all me, areas might need to be tweaked or rejuvenated (January and February are the usual times, so knowing that I should actually have some changes in the plans for that time.) Maybe we just need a little rabbit trail to give a fresh start.
Anyway, this is what I see the process is to answer the tugs. You may be at the beginning, but I still have to go through this every year. It is a process, and I'd have to do these steps even with a boxed curriculum; my own curriculum just requires more research and planning.
__________________
Jennifer G. Miller
Wife to  & ds1  '03 & ds2  '07
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SuzanneG
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| Posted: June 09 2010 at 12:53pm | IP Logged
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Krystin~
I will have 1st grade plans for next year too, and would be happy to share.....but not for another month or so.
My daughter is 6.5 and just coming off a 1/2 day of Kindergarten in public school. She is reading pretty fluently, so, I'd put her somewhere in between 1st and 2nd grade, if I had to give it a number.
Jen's son is 5.5, and easing into reading. (correct me if you'd word that a different way, Jen) So you'd be able to see two different 1st grade plans, for very different kids, boy-girl, with a year age difference and different reading abilities. Can I use the word "different" any more???
Where is your 1st grader on the reading path?
__________________
Suzanne in ID
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Mom of 7 (Girls - 14, 12, 11, 9, 7 and Boys - 4, 1)
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Sarah
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Without reading the other responses on this thread, I will comment. With the ages you have and the newborn and all, I would pick a math book, Seton's reading comprehension 3, maybe a phonics workbook, some catechism, and the rest pursuing the likes of your kids. IMO, full enrollment in Seton *could* lead to burnout with too many subjects and workbooks. Although, some families like it. Its not the only way. Maybe pick some books for you 3rd grader to read for enjoyment, whether they are picture books or chapter books. This year for you is a transition year as last year was not a full year. GO EASY!!! A transition year combined with a newborn could seem tough. Make the goal this year to just get used to homeschooling while learning a little math and keeping up some reading skills. Your kids are very young and a simple year will do them no harm, but rather will make you more confident next year!
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Six boys ages 16, 14, 11, 7, 5, 2 and one girl age 9
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mama2many
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SuzanneG wrote:
Krystin~
I will have 1st grade plans for next year too, and would be happy to share.....but not for another month or so.
Where is your 1st grader on the reading path?
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OK my 6 1/2yo is.... starting to get motivated. I'm going to work with her on having peers as penpals this summer, just something FUN to work handwriting, reading and letter writing.. some social stuff, even if it isn't face ot face.
She sees her sister and I reading, so she's starting to show more interest. ANd I'm reading small chapter books, the disney fairies, we tried junie b jones and UGH.. I had a hard time reading her poor language out loud! LOL
Again, I am so humbled that you are all helping me so much!!
Thank you
__________________
Krystin
wife to Kevin
mama to
M (12/00)
J (12/01)
K (6/06)
J (7/08)
A (7/10)
C (11/12)
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Mackfam
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SuzanneG wrote:
Krystin~
I will have 1st grade plans for next year too, and would be happy to share.....but not for another month or so.
My daughter is 6.5 and just coming off a 1/2 day of Kindergarten in public school. She is reading pretty fluently, so, I'd put her somewhere in between 1st and 2nd grade, if I had to give it a number.
Jen's son is 5.5, and easing into reading. (correct me if you'd word that a different way, Jen) So you'd be able to see two different 1st grade plans, for very different kids, boy-girl, with a year age difference and different reading abilities. |
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I'm glad you brought that up, Suzanne. I call those plans 1st grade...cuz I have to call them something. But, they're really 1/2 grade. My son is right between K and 1st, and yes, easing into reading. He knows and writes very well all his letters and numbers, and is just beginning to read.
Seeing different plans would be a help so you could see the different levels that someone might call the same grade. I hope that's not too confusing? It's really...again...one of the wonderful benefits of addressing a child's needs individually with a set of plans, rather than investing $$ and time in a one-size-fits-all deal...which might not fit everywhere (I hope I'm not being to pointed with regard to Seton, I'm really just trying to illustrate one of the benefits of designing plans to fit the child, but of course, there are other things to consider!).
I can detail plans for an emerging reader, while Suzanne's plans will detail work for a fluent reader, and both will be called 1st grade plans. 
And...
mama2many wrote:
| I am so BLESSED to have been led to this group!! I have found so many honest women, willing to help!!! It is a great feeling! And I thank you! |
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We are blessed by your questions! It is a help to me to look with your fresh eyes at something I might do. So, you are a blessing to us as well!
__________________
Jen Mackintosh
Wife to Rob, mom to dd 19, ds 16, ds 11, dd 8, and dd 3
Wildflowers and Marbles
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SuzanneG
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mama2many wrote:
| ANd I'm reading small chapter books, the disney fairies, we tried junie b jones and UGH.. I had a hard time reading her poor language out loud! LOL |
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  PAINFUL those books are!!!!! Simply PAINFUL!!!!!!!!!!!! Throw those out and head on over to these two threads for some great suggestions for read alouds for the 5-6 yo crowd. She will love them!!!
:: Favorite First Chapter Books
:: Need Real Aloud Suggestions
Also, for future reference, there is a Compilation of Many of the Read Aloud Threads here.
__________________
Suzanne in ID
Wife to Pete
Mom of 7 (Girls - 14, 12, 11, 9, 7 and Boys - 4, 1)
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time4tea
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| Posted: June 09 2010 at 7:04pm | IP Logged
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Krystin,
I have had 2 dc so far do Seton 1st and 4th, and it really is NOT too hard - really
The book reports are very easy at 4th grade, they provide just about everything the dc needs, just fill in a few sentences here and there. I used the books (we did Black Beauty and Heidi, both classics) as read-alouds, and ds narrated his entire book report to me, which I copied down for him. the comprehension study questions provided by Seton per download (and OPTIONAL, btw) are EXCELLENT - they provided wonderful discussion starters for us when we weren't feeling to motivated on a particular day.
The 4th grade Seton Science book is one of the most colorful and interesting of the grade school science books. We really enjoyed it.
If your dc doesn't enjoy the F&F readers, just have him/her read the couple of stories needed for the end of quarter tests (if you want the report card) and then shelve the books. Focus on the classic literature in the rest of the reading program instead. You could read the stories as read-alouds while the baby naps/nurses. Do what you can from the phonics workbook. If the dc understands the concept, delete redundant exercises.
The 1st grade program is really a breeze. The entire thing is parent graded. Very low pressure. Just cover the basics - what you and your d are up to doing each day is fine at that age.
I used many CM ideas over the years with the Seton K-5 program, and found them to be compatible. A lot of it depends on what you are looking for. Some moms like to have a schedule all laid out for them, others prefer to organize that schedule themselves. I wish I were better at organizing the schedule myself, but over the years I have found that my personality is better suited to having a framework from which to pick and choose.
One last thing. Seton will allow you to substitute math, science and history in grades K-8 with material other than what is in their standard curriculum. I would call and ask them about that.
I do not have much experience with Seton for high school, but I have used them quite a bit over the years for K-8. If I can help you out with any specific questions, please feel free to ask or p.m. me as well!
__________________
Blessings to you!
~Tea
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Adriatica
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Wow--this was incredibly helpful to me! Thanks.
~Maryanne
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Mackfam
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Oh, Maryanne...I'm so glad if they were a help!!!
__________________
Jen Mackintosh
Wife to Rob, mom to dd 19, ds 16, ds 11, dd 8, and dd 3
Wildflowers and Marbles
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MamaFence
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Joined: May 19 2010
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| Posted: June 09 2010 at 8:34pm | IP Logged
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suzanne, thanks for those links. I'm going to check them out for my kids and I.
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Paula in MN
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Joined: Nov 25 2006
Location: Minnesota
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| Posted: June 10 2010 at 6:34am | IP Logged
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JennGM wrote:
| Now, Jen, can you please share 2nd grade plans so I don't need to write mine? |
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Um, 6th grade too??? 
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Paula
A Catholic Harvest
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mama2many
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Joined: May 28 2010
Location: Georgia
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| Posted: June 10 2010 at 6:41am | IP Logged
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Keep this thread going ladies!!! This has been VERY informative!
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Krystin
wife to Kevin
mama to
M (12/00)
J (12/01)
K (6/06)
J (7/08)
A (7/10)
C (11/12)
My Clones in Action
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4Real Forums : Living Learning
Topic: Feeling a pull
