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mom2mpr
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Can someone recommend a book? Really 
When my kids were little I devoured Dr. Sears, went to LaLeche, and had a blast. It was all good and I loved being a mom.
I am floating now. The only teen "help" I have is that someone told me many years ago not to take anything my kids do, in their teens, personally  I need a little more.
My parents weren't that good at it, or maybe they were? They were pretty hands off but the rules were there-curfews and such. I just feel I didn't have any relationship with them. Maybe you are not supposed to when you have a teen?
Anyhow, suggestions would be appreciated. I see my relationship changing, I miss communication, I know nothing now , discipline is tough, and I am not having as much fun as when the kids were younger. And the big one, I feel like I am done parenting. Is this a phase? 
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Anne, married to dh 16 years!, ds,(97), Little One (02), and dd (02).
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guitarnan
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I don't have a book to recommend, but I certainly understand your wish for one!
I do have relationships with my teen and my post-teen (21, ack!), and I cherish those relationships. I try very hard not to act like a friend, but to be a parent - supportive, accessible, guiding and, on occasion, intervening. There are ups and downs, but, in general, I am really enjoying this phase of parenting.
In other words, you're not done! (In fact, when those college years arrive, you may find yourself doing more parenting of your teen than you are doing right now...)
My husband and I have used the "shared interest" approach to keep those communication lines open - even if the shared interest is video games or anime  , doing these things together offers opportunities to talk about other things. My daughter and I spend hours each week in the car together; sometimes we talk (and subjects range from pop music to choosing a college), other times we don't, but she knows I'm ready to listen.
Another way to open the communication lines is through prayer...not just you praying for your children, but you asking for their prayers for specific intentions. My children now ask me to pray for their friends - and, sometimes, they use that request to share their own concerns.
Every parent-child relationship is different, and, of course, with the pressures of the world weighing so heavily on our teens, there are many worries and concerns that affect these relationships. Home (and Mom) can be a haven from these pressures, a safe place where your teen knows he can turn to you for unconditional love and acceptance. (Accept and love him...that doesn't mean you have to love everything he does!)
I'm hoping other parents of teens have book titles to share with you, since I don't (a rarity!).
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Nancy in MD. Mom of ds (24) & dd (18); 31-year Navy wife, move coordinator and keeper of home fires. Writer and dance mom.
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Oh my, Anne!  You've got this though - really!
Our oldest two are the same age. I can relate to your childhood teen experiences - and didn't have good relationships either. It impacted my teen/young adult decisions tremendously. My dh and I discussed this aspect (common in both our growing up) and we've identified this relationship and communication as a priority for us. We both really have to work at it, each overcoming the challenges in our own temperaments!
No, you are DEFINITELY NOT done parenting, though there is a shift.
Some of my favorite teen parenting books:
Raise Happy Children, Teach Them Joy! by Mary Ann Budnik - this is the 4th in a series of books, each of which thoroughly cover (from a wonderful Catholic perspective) a different stage of childhood. *Teach Them Joy* covers the ages 13 - 18. Excellent book! I highly recommend the ENTIRE series, but this book will give you some great insight to put in your pocket/toolbox immediately!
Good Discipline, Great Teens by Dr. Ray Guarendi - I've loved Dr. Guarendi through many ages/stages of parenting and this book gives great insight and fantastic, practical tools for the teen years! His humorous style really speaks to me! His writing style and his advice communicate a light-ness that is reassuring and confidence-building. He breaks it down humorously, yet succinctly, and it's great for brainstorming because you can go to the book with specific problems and within 10-15 min you'll have concrete ideas to apply to your situation. I love it because you DON'T have to read the entire book to get the gist of it! The book is divided into simple, little sections subdivided by a specific behavior - you can target your need quickly. The basic premise: responsibility before privilege, teens NEED healthy boundaries, and you CAN have a great relationshiop with your teen!
And...for the idea of curfews and dating, etc, my favorite book is a really old one, and I'm afraid it isn't that easy to find, but it's worth looking for:
American Catholic Etiquette by Kay Toy Fenner - Though written in the early 60's, the advice and approach is quite fresh and sensible! The whole book is a total treasure for a Catholic family!! But there are several chapters toward the back of the book covering early/young tween/teens, teens, dating, etc. I found the book and those chapters EXTREMELY helpful!! Here is a list of the latter chapters (full of meat and practical ideas/tools):
** Guidance and Manners for Children (love the section on "Play Lessons"...but I digress...)
** Guidance and Manners for Sub-Teens - this section fosters a very healthy "moving forward" for the sub-teen, and encourages stepping out of childhood in ways that allow the young teen to exercise responsibility while inviting the young teen to age appropriate privilege. Some of the sections (so you get a sense of the "flavor"):
Stepping out of Childhood
Stick to your Guns!
Outside Jobs
Babysitting
Group Pressure
Entertainment Media (obviously has changed since the 60's, but the principle is still the same!)
Limits for Sub Teens
** Guidance and Manners for Teen-Agers - this section is HUGE and covers so many great topics!!!! Just a sampling of the sections:
Begin with Trust
Keep Close to God
Family Solidarity
Standards of Conduct
Rules of Conduct
Manners
Boys
Girls
Rules for Dating
For Boys
For Girls
Dress
Jobs
Managing Money
Enlarging Social Graces
What is Love?
After High School
Marriage
Marrying in College
NOTE ON PRUDENCE:
**Obviously, some of these topics are areas that individual families will exercise family prudence, so this is not meant to be a definitive statement on dating/courtship or other areas of prudence!! These are great resources for Mom & Dad to sit down with, pray about, brainstorm through!**
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Hope something here gives you a direction or an idea to move forward, Anne! I'll pray for you! Parenting my teens is rich, different from any other parenting stage, and does bring a shift; I do enjoy it so much! And it does bring its own very unique set of challenges, and challenges ME/MY TEMPERAMENT in new ways! I don't want to oversimplify it, but I certainly don't believe it's the end of parenting or communication either!!! We just need some additional tools and understanding in our toolbox!
and 
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Jen Mackintosh
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Mackfam
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Cross posting with Nancy!  So grateful to see her perspective here!
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Jen Mackintosh
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jawgee
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My oldest is approaching his teen years. I, too, like Dr. Ray Guarendi. I also like Dr. Gregory Popcak, and his book Parenting with Grace is very good.
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Kristie 4
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Hold Onto Your Kids- Gordon Neufeld and Gabor Mate.
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Kristie in Canada
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SallyT
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Those are helpful book recommendations, Jen. (eta: and everyone else -- we were cross-posting!) I love Dr. Ray!
And what Nancy said really resonates with me. My oldest two are 20 and 16 (I'm ready now for the parenting books about Your Young Adult Child!), and if I had to name the model we lean on most often, I would call it the Relational Model.
I enjoy the teen years no end so far, probably more than the little-kid or elementary years (which is weird, maybe, but there it is), because I like who my teenagers are as people. As a teenager myself, I often felt that a) my mother didn't like me very much (though we get along well enough now), and b) she was parenting me from the guidelines in a "How to Tell if Your Teenager is Using Drugs" pamphlet, which was odd because of my set of friends, I was the absolute non-drinker, even . . . in other words, she was parenting me without looking at me as the person I was.
Now, in my parenting, when I err it's probably in overcompensating for that! But I find that things work best when my husband and I enter into their lives -- as Nancy said, appreciating their interests, even when they aren't our own, for example. Listening a lot without giving advice, which is hard! When my first daughter was a teenager, we went for lots of long walks together during which she vented about various friend issues and I listened sympathetically and, when I talked, talked some about my own experiences and ventured my own thoughts about things like, say, dating. We've never, ourselves, had a hard-and-fast explicit rule about high-school dating, but apparently I was fairly persuasive in emphasizing the importance of being friends and socializing in groups . . . :)
Overall, we've just taken the approach of working *with* our teenaged children, rather than handing down unilateral decisions from above, about aspects of their lives. Currently, with our 16-year-old, the challenge is helping him to balance academics with his membership in a very competitive local runners' club AND a part-time job with an equine veterinarian. At times it's been tempting just to say no on his behalf to these extracurricular things, when they threaten to eat into his school schedule. But it's been better for our relationship to take a careful counseling role and to indicate our support for his participation in things he loves. I find he listens to us a lot more when he feels we're on his side, and we're able to work out solutions to the satisfaction of all parties.
As a side note, my husband and I have been reading The Five Love Languages, and this has given rise to a lot of good conversation about our children. One thing he noted was that our sixteen-year-old, even though he's a young giant, is still, underneath, the cuddly little boy he always was. My husband goes out of his way to touch and hug him and show him physical affection. What I realized through this conversation was that I had really backed away from physical engagement with this son -- he's such a man now that my natural, involuntary reaction is to feel kind of awkward, or to feel that he would feel awkward being hugged on by his mommy.
Since that conversation, though, I've been much more intentional about doing just that: hugging him, kissing him good night, ruffling his hair when I walk by, just touching him. And he does respond with affection. I've realized anew how important communications of our love are to our grown and almost-grown children -- if anything, they need that almost more than our younger children do, because they need affirmation that the people they've grown into are good people in our eyes. We tell them we love them -- it's how I close every phone conversation with our oldest -- but we also try to model that love in our interactions with them.
And wow, what Nancy said about prayer is on the mark. Prayer for them, prayer with them, asking them for prayer.
I do love this stage. Sometimes I find myself feeling nervous about my younger two, maybe because the older two have been relatively easy as teenagers, and my response to that is to renew my commitment to knowing and respecting them as people, and to be present in their lives. The first two crossed the line from pre-teen to teen without a whole lot of fireworks or alterations in our relationships, and my great hope is that that will hold true for the youngers. Who knows what surprises may be in store . . .
Sally
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CrunchyMom
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Kristie 4 wrote:
| Hold Onto Your Kids- Gordon Neufeld and Gabor Mate. |
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I don't have teens, but this is a favorite.
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Lindsay
Five Boys(6/04) (6/06) (9/08)(3/11),(7/13), and 1 girl (5/16)
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[URL=http://mysymphonygarden.blogspot.com/]Lost in the Cosmos[/UR
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MarilynW
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Dear Anne,
I don't know how possible this is for you - but maybe instead of/as well as a book, you could look around and find a family/friend (Irl/online) who has great teenagers and where the parents seem to have good relationships with their teenagers- and then ask them what has worked for them? Kind of like you are doing on this thread.
I generally love the teenage phase - I now have 3, and I feel we communicate a lot and well. But I have had to change my style of parenting and yet not compromise on any of our discipline and expectations. I find for the boys, having a great relationship with and spending lots of time with their dad is crucial.
I think the parenting is almost more important in the teenage years - I feel sad that often this is where people just tend to throw up their hands and say "well - they are grown up now, they have to make their choices and their mistakes"
Our teenagers learn so much from us and the way we live - and those teen years are so formative.
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Marilyn
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Willa
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How to Really Love Your Teenager
I found the non-teens version of this book really helpful for my mothering.
In some ways, parenting a teen is a bit like developing a friendship. I see it looks like I'm contradicting Nancy but I don't think I am -- I'm not talking about being a pal or peer but developing communication, building interests in common, looking towards the adult they will be someday. Rules and discipline are there but there is more taking the teen behind the scenes, showing them the context through books and discussion, because they are ready for that.
I look for things we have in common (or interests of theirs that I can somehow share) and we develop common ground on that basis. For example, my current 17 year old is fascinated by anime and moral philosophy. I've tried to watch some anime with him and read up about Catholic morality so we can have impromptu discussions. Another teen was fascinated by forest flora and fauna. We still discuss those things though now he is an adult.
My dad taught me to play classical guitar and that was common ground -- also, we were both very interested in literature and that was another thing.
Teens want to understand what makes parents tick. Sometimes some of mine challenged me (and still do) but I try to remember that really it's a process of trying to figure out what the parents TRULY believe and stand by vs what they have on the surface as just behavior. I remember that clearly from my teen years because I was sort of rebellious, but I saw my parents were totally on my side and lived lives of integrity even though sometimes I still disobeyed and questioned.
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Willa
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juliana147
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Such wisdom here. I would add that my teens appreciate the little family traditions we set up when they were younger, and have asked me to keep them up. I think it gives them a sense of stability and joy.
Sally, I am trying to hug my teenager more. I noticed the same things here that you did!
Praying together is so important. I am appreciating this even more as they get older. And laughter... finding something fun to share is good, too.
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Angie Mc
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Honestly, no book touches this topic for me. And I see 2 main types of parenting teens in the Catholic homeschooling circle. 1 is to keep teens deeply entrenched in their current family, with their parents making decisions. Our family falls into the other camp. We want our teens to choose their lives based on what God wants for them. We want them to make their mistakes now in order for them to be stronger, more clear, and humble down the road. We want them to be fully responsible for themselves so they are able to live good, right lives when they turn 18. That's the goal anyway
The teen years are in-the-trenches, hands-dirty, battle-and-be-defeated years. Now, that probably sounds very negative or that I think these years are scary. Not at all! It's just that it is one thing to be a great mama when you control most things. It is another thing entirely to let teens control most things as we prepare them to launch into adulthood. If a mama's self-confidence was in her ability to control things...well...things are going to change quickly.
So here are a few go-to tools that I use:
Confidence. If you lack confidence in yourself as a person or in your role as a mother, a teen can smell it a mile away and play that weakness. I'm not saying that they intend this, although some do, I'm saying that in their need to grow stronger they in part look for weakness to play off of.
Clarity. I you are vague or unsure about anything, they will use that as well. Their brains are rigged to "get what they want" so any lack of clarity opens doors to them filling in the blanks with what they want.
Directness. Using the plainest language possible, say it like it is. Do it like it is. And call them on their stuff...like it is. They need reality checks like at no other time in their lives.
Stand firm ONLY on what matters most. If you try to stand firm on everything...if you give nothing...you're sunk. You'll come across as a controlling person (which you just might be) and they will have no other choice but to acquiesce (which disallows them to practice making their own choices which stunts growth or may cover up mental health issues) or to rebel. it is normal to rebel during the teens years and if they aren't rebelling, their may be a problem with obedience actually being "I can't think or do for myself."
Hand over ALL discipline to their dad. Go with his judgement. Let it go and focus on being your best self, setting the finest example you can muster.
All of the above fit into the tough love part of parenting a teen. Below is how to fill up the love tank part...
Share your stories. Show your vulnerable side and be honest about being confused sometimes. Leave out details that can allow them to think "Well if mom did that then I can do that to" kind of brain warp to "get what they want."
Buy them gifts. Give them little cards. Tell them what they are doing right. Tell others what they are doing right, within their earshot. Hug and touch them. Tell them they are great. Take them out. Go for long walks. Listen to them late at night.
Play off of your strengths. If you are funny, laugh with them. If you are a reader, read with them. If you love music, listen with them.
Finally, and this may be THE MOST IMPORTANT THING...know that teens NEED other adults in their life! So give them great adults through your friendships! They need other adults because...the mother-teen relationship needs to be diluted. it's just too much for 2 people. Plus, if teens are going to move into the adult world well, they need other adults to show them the way. They need "aunts" and "uncles" to be with and turn to, especially when times get rough.
I'm a Tia to several teens. They call me (or sometimes their mother tells them "call Tia Angie!") When their teen brain has gone into override and they are blaming everything on their mother (oh yes, that's painfully common) I listen to them, from a detached emotional place I give them direct feedback and fill their love tank, and they return to their family better, plus mom got a break. And I send my teens to others adults too. This is a win-win-win situation for all involved!
Trust your gut! Earn their respect! Don't buy the lie that you have to be perfect! You imperfection is what makes you real! Know the truth that cannot be argued with, you have more years on this planet so by definition you are more experienced! And you ain't no fool! They may need to be reminded of that 
Dave and I want our adult children to want us. We want them to freely choose us to be in their lives. We don't want mini-me, we just want working adult relationships based on deep love and respect, not perfection. So far, we have 2 adults (Devin and her husband, Michael) and now, together, we're figuring out what THAT looks like. The teen years were rough and tumble but worth every, every, every effort
Go get 'em mama!
Love,
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Angie Mc
Maimeo to Henry! Dave's wife, mom to Mrs. Devin+Michael Pope, Aiden 20,Ian 17,John Paul 11,Catherine (heaven 6/07)
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MarilynW
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Wow Angie - incredible wisdom. I am printing it out and putting it in my journal.
Maybe YOU should write a book!
I think that your thoughts on control are spot on. That is what can be frigtening about the teen years - letting them take the wheel, at first with you sitting by them, but then letting them ride alone. Scary. We want to protect them from suffering and mistakes and heartbreak and rejection.
I have this quote in my journal too - at first it was for my younger kids, but now I try to think about it for my teens too:
"Even suffering is part of the truth of our life. Thus, trying to shield the youngest from every difficulty and experience of suffering, we risk creating, despite our good intentions, fragile persons of little generosity:
The capacity to love, in fact, corresponds to the capacity to suffer, and to suffer together." Benedict XVI
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4 lads mom
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Angie, I have big tears reading your post....so.so.so true. Love it. I really LOVE my teens. It is always the ten year olds that I struggle with  So far, having 20 yr, 19 yr and 15 yr old guys, I love being with them. I really like who they are....we are all so Irish, and love to laugh, love to tell stories....and that is one of our main bonding points. I said in a recent blog post....as homeschooling moms, our relationship with our kids are above the academics!!! We need to be mentors, not task masters. Angie, your comment about teens needing other adults in the mother/teen relationship is too much for 2 people....amen!!!
Great advice from everyone, love this thread!
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mom2mpr
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Wow. I mean, WOW! Thank you all for your suggestions, insight, ideas, etc. I am feeling more confident and supported and....ahhhhhhh!!
THANK YOU!
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Anne, married to dh 16 years!, ds,(97), Little One (02), and dd (02).
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Kathryn
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Angie Mc wrote:
| Honestly, no book touches this topic for me. And I see 2 main types of parenting teens in the Catholic homeschooling circle. 1 is to keep teens deeply entrenched in their current family, with their parents making decisions. Our family falls into the other camp. We want our teens to choose their lives based on what God wants for them. We want them to make their mistakes now in order for them to be stronger, more clear, and humble down the road. We want them to be fully responsible for themselves so they are able to live good, right lives when they turn 18. That's the goal anyway |
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Such wisdom, Angie! Actually I must admit to being a family that falls into BOTH camps here. With one teen child, it is the way to make the child stronger by setting expectations and stepping back. With the other teen child, if we didn't hold the reins very tight, give very little leeway, this child would seriously self destruct. Now mine are in the early teens so I hope this changes with maturity. I only replied to say that sometimes it really does depend on the temperament of the child...some need more, some need less and by 16, many may have been "fully" parented per se while others are still needing so.much.guidance I suppose.
To your original question, maybe your day-to-day, needing to be in the nitty gritty has shifted at your child's age now so obviously your parenting isn't over, it's just changing and since it's a new phase, you're feeling a bit lost. ?? Hope everyone's advice here helps you through this time.
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mariB
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Angie is spot on! The teen years are a little tough and it is tough to be a young adult as well! If we can remember what is was like for us...what it felt like...reflect on our own mistakes, we will be able to be understanding to our teens. They need us just as much as a toddler does...but we need to let them walk on their own a lot of times just like when we let our toddler take off on their own 2 feet but were there for them when they needed that hug, or when they took that tumble.
God bless!
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Angie Mc
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Thank you all for sharing great information and for receiving my post so kindly!
Kathryn wrote:
Angie Mc wrote:
| Honestly, no book touches this topic for me. And I see 2 main types of parenting teens in the Catholic homeschooling circle. 1 is to keep teens deeply entrenched in their current family, with their parents making decisions. Our family falls into the other camp. We want our teens to choose their lives based on what God wants for them. We want them to make their mistakes now in order for them to be stronger, more clear, and humble down the road. We want them to be fully responsible for themselves so they are able to live good, right lives when they turn 18. That's the goal anyway |
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Such wisdom, Angie! Actually I must admit to being a family that falls into BOTH camps here. With one teen child, it is the way to make the child stronger by setting expectations and stepping back. With the other teen child, if we didn't hold the reins very tight, give very little leeway, this child would seriously self destruct. Now mine are in the early teens so I hope this changes with maturity. I only replied to say that sometimes it really does depend on the temperament of the child...some need more, some need less and by 16, many may have been "fully" parented per se while others are still needing so.much.guidance I suppose.
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Great point! The word that you reminded me of is "more". Some kids are just plain MORE than others and this shows clearly in the teen years in how we help them to transition. I'll be thinking on this during the week and get back to it next Wednesday!
Keep posting! And I would LOVE to hear from younger moms, those who are just beyond their own teen years. Thanks :)
Love,
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Angie Mc
Maimeo to Henry! Dave's wife, mom to Mrs. Devin+Michael Pope, Aiden 20,Ian 17,John Paul 11,Catherine (heaven 6/07)
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Erica Sanchez
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Angie Mc wrote:
Honestly, no book touches this topic for me. And I see 2 main types of parenting teens in the Catholic homeschooling circle. 1 is to keep teens deeply entrenched in their current family, with their parents making decisions. Our family falls into the other camp. We want our teens to choose their lives based on what God wants for them. We want them to make their mistakes now in order for them to be stronger, more clear, and humble down the road. We want them to be fully responsible for themselves so they are able to live good, right lives when they turn 18. That's the goal anyway
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I was thinking a lot about this last night. I don't know many Catholic homeschooling families in my area that fall into the first camp, maybe one or two and we have many here in San Diego.
I want my teens 'deeply entrenched in our family life', but probably not in the way you are implying. And, I want my teens to do all of the other things you mention, Angie. Can't I have both? :) In a healthy way, of course. :)
There is such a difference between a 13 or 14 year old teen and a 16 or 17 year old one, so maybe that distinction needs to be made when talking about teens in general. I know with my own, much changes between those ages and all of the things you listed just seemed to naturally happen between those ages. My two oldest are girls, though, and I am praying it is the same with the 14 year old son! Please, God! :)
Our oldest just turned 18 and is away at college. She is very responsible and mature and has been organizing her life and studies and work for several years now making mostly excellent decisions for herself while still being very entrenched in our family life. But, there have still been instances these past few months where she has needed our parenting. Nothing that was that big of a deal and maybe it was more of an advice thing.
I get what you are saying, Angie, and in no way do I mean to be argumentative - you make excellent points! For me, we homeschool high school for both. We are thrilled to have enormous amounts of time together because of homeschooling and equally thrilled to send them off into the world (classes, work, sports, college, etc.) and watch them blossom.
I liked Dr. Ray's book about teens a lot. He common sense style had me laughing out loud throughout. I think it's a good read for those who are tired and worn out from parenting a lot of kids or difficult kids.
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Have a beautiful and fun day!
Erica in San Diego
(dh)Cash, Emily, Grace, Nicholas, Isabella, Annie, Luke, Max, Peter, 2 little souls ++, and sweet Rose who is legally ours!
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Angie Mc
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| Posted: Nov 21 2013 at 3:44pm | IP Logged
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Erica Sanchez wrote:
I want my teens 'deeply entrenched in our family life', but probably not in the way you are implying. And, I want my teens to do all of the other things you mention, Angie. Can't I have both? :) In a healthy way, of course. :)
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~~~~~waving to you, Erica! I do look forward to fleshing out my blink response post next week.
Somehow I hope my words will match my intent and experience! I see 2 things that are mutually exclusive and I think it lands mainly in the area of who is making the decisions and the level of keeping the teenager's world small. When parents make all the decisions about what a 13 or 18 year old does, who they can befriend, where they spend their time, where they school...that's what I'm talking about.
I am so crazy connected, engaged, interacting, etc. with my teens...my whole family! So maybe instead of saying "entrenched" I'll need to think of something else....
Good stuff to ponder! Thanks so much <3
Love,
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Angie Mc
Maimeo to Henry! Dave's wife, mom to Mrs. Devin+Michael Pope, Aiden 20,Ian 17,John Paul 11,Catherine (heaven 6/07)
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4Real Forums : High School Years and Beyond
Topic: Parenting a teen
