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time4tea
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| Posted: June 11 2009 at 2:36pm | IP Logged
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Well, ds went to day for his assessment at the local community college! He was extremely nervous, certain he would bomb out, but thanks to many prayers he ended up doing very well and has been filled with a new sense of confidence and accomplishment  . That of course is the good part! Now here's the sad part.
As ds and I went from place to place at the c.c., first to the assessment, then to advising, next to get the i.d. card, etc., many of the college staff would remark to me off to the side things like, "Oh, he's probably so embarrassed that you are here!". In advising, ds had to sign a release form so that I could be present in the room while he discussed course selection with the
advisor  . He had to set a date on paper as to how long he would like dh and I to have access to his college educational records (apparently a state law here). The advisor made a comment that "some kids just put down a date farther in the future because their parent is in the room, and then later they come back and change it to something more immediate." 
Overall, the comments made implied that of course, ALL parents must have a negative, adversarial relationship with their teens. I just found this so sad. Fortunately, of the fellow moms and dads I saw at the college today, NONE of us had that kind of relationship with our teens. The teen/parent pairs all seemed well connected to one another and genuinely enjoyed the shared experience of being together for the first time college enrollment process.
I guess the larger question is WHY does our society seem to erroneously believe the individuation process that teens go through as they hurtle toward adulthood has to include negativism and overtly strained relationships between parents and teens? While clearly arguments between parents and teens do occur, why would it be viewed as "normal" to have an ongoing, adversarial relationship between parents and teens? Historically, this has not always been the view throughout human history, even recent history. I am curious what ponderings the rest of you have on this.
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~Tea
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LLMom
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| Posted: June 11 2009 at 3:11pm | IP Logged
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Tea,
That is wonderful (that he did so well) and sad what was said. I too have wondered why everyone thinks that relationships with teens will be awful. For some reason, everyone has come to expect it and say, "Just wait until they are teenagers." I really think they live up to what we allow. I currently have 2 (and a third one in a few months) and they are all pleasant, well-mannered people. They are people I like to be around.
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Lisa
For veteran & former homeschool moms
homeschooling ideas
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JodieLyn
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| Posted: June 11 2009 at 3:29pm | IP Logged
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I think to some degree the people at the college expect that seperating from the parents is a good thing and even encourage it.. and so the negative comments come from the idea that parents should not be involved.
colleges do tend to be liberal and so it makes sense that they'd want to seperate young people from their families.. easier to influence them that way.
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All men who have turned out worth anything have had the chief hand in their own education.
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Lisbet
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| Posted: June 11 2009 at 3:36pm | IP Logged
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My mil has always said the most annoying thing when talking about teens: "The more they fight you, the more they love you." I DON'T understand this at all. I am fairly new to having teens, my oldest is only 14 - but so far it has been a pleasure!! (we are actually going out to dinner and the Glenn Beck show together tonight - just him and I! :) )
I have never understood this mentality myself. It excuses some pretty bad behavior from teens. I think some parents would rather excuse it than deal with it.
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cvbmom
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I can tell you one reason why teens would be so separate from their families. Mentalities like the one I heard between grandma and grandchild...
(Laughing) Grandma taking a picture of an art project proudly held by her grandchild: "Oh, I love this picture just I took of you. Just wait until I bring it out at your 16th birthday. It'll be so funny! You'll be so embarassed!!"
Grandchild: "Huh? Why would you want to do that to me?"
Grandma: "I did that to your daddy when he turned 16, it was SOOOO funny!"
My question: Who will it be funny for?
Grandma says that the children need to lighten up and learn to laugh at themselves (yeah, ok, maybe a little on some things, but this is something that the child is proud of, not one of those goofy childhood pictures of a child acting goofy. It's not to be mocked in my opinion).
When adults find it funny to tease and humiliate teens, rather than treating them with respect, of course teens want to be far from their elders. I would! And trust me, "daddy" didn't like the humor of the pictures shown at his 16th birthday 
Ok, enough of my ranting. I just had to share my .02 
I am with you, though, Tea. How sad it is that the assumed norm is that kids/teens are at odds with their parents. I get so sick of the "just wait until they're all teenagers" snide remarks. I am going to love my teens and have a respectful, loving relationship with them, thank-you-very-much.
God bless,
Christine
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jenk
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Aside from the disheartening norm of bad teen-parent relationships, an issue arises when teens have to sign permission for parents to see academic records. Aren't parents generally the ones footing the bill?
My oldest is only 14 and sometimes gets a little attitude (hormones?)but all in all, he is respectful, helpful and sweet... and I genuinely like him- think he likes me too I don't see any reason why that has to change.
Historically, I think teens looked to emulate parents, grandparents and respected adults in the community. Today (and this is a HUGE generalization) we have parents wanting to emulate teens and teens looking to Hollywood or their friends, who are just as lost, as a measure of success. Adverse teen/parent relationships seem pervasive in today's media too- no more "Father Knows Best" now it's mom and dad are dummies- kids know best.
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time4tea
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Jenk,
Yes, absolutely parents are footing the bill, and that is exactly what I said! She actually had the nerve to say that ds should detach the top portion of the tuition bill that contains his schedule, and just give me the bottom portion that contains the total amount due and payment information  ! If it weren't that I was sitting there and heard it firsthand, I wouldn't believe it, but unfortunately I heard it with my own ears.
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CatholicMommy
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| Posted: June 11 2009 at 9:32pm | IP Logged
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I started community college when I was in high school - and despite the fact that my mother did NOT get along (it wasn't that bad - we just avoided each other), I was so appreciative that she was there for me that first enrollment. It was a bonding experience for us (in that she was helping through one hurdle in my process of growing up), NOT a time of separation.
I too have seen fantastic parent/teen relationships - and they all seem based on firm foundations in early childhood, a mututal respect for one another, and an expectation that things will go well.
I think there is also less of an influence from all the common tv shows and other influences which display parents as stupid and kids as all-knowing, all-powerful and always needing to make up for their parents' mistakes - a general avoidance of all things of that genre. :)
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StephanieA
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Our college doesn't allow parents to be part of the course selection process either....but of course, we are expected to pay the bill
Son #2 signed up for a class "we" decided afterwards that he shouldn't take with this particular professor that he was assigned. So I gave him my .02 and he switched classes before school started. So....there are ways to work with (or should I say against) the system
As far as teens are concerned, they can be both exasperating and just darn fun. I am learning to "ease up" on my expectations. I sometimes expect too much wisdom in my 19 and 21 year olds. But the prevalent attitude that kids are a burden is sickening. Many of our friends are already entering the "empty nest" stage and they seem to be SO excited. Ummmm....doesn't sound exciting to me just yet.
Blessings,
Stephanie
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Tonya
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| Posted: June 12 2009 at 8:12am | IP Logged
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I was shocked and dismayed when I found out that we are not even allowed to see our college students grades. Like was said here, the bills come here but that is all the involvement that we are allowed. Luckily my kids always discuss their schedules with us and ask our advice and they show us their grades.
I truly enjoy my older children. Yes, sometimes they can get a little obnoxious and have a bit of an attitude but most of the time they are just plain fun to be around.
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Mom to 2 daughters (24 and 21), 4 sons (19, 15, 12, 12), and 3 in heaven
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Martha
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Quote:
| Yes, absolutely parents are footing the bill, and that is exactly what I said! She actually had the nerve to say that ds should detach the top portion of the tuition bill that contains his schedule, and just give me the bottom portion that contains the total amount due and payment information ! If it weren't that I was sitting there and heard it firsthand, I wouldn't believe it, but unfortunately I heard it with my own ears. |
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to which you reply that if you don't see grades and courses and books, you don't pay. it's really that simple. The miracle of canceled checks and suitcases.
now from the other side of the fence...
I was not funded in any way whatsoever by my parents by the age of 16, yet all the forms would not be accepted unless you have parental financial information. Well how much money my parents made was none of my business (and I felt the same way about them and my money) and they were not helping in any case. Didn't matter. So that meant ZERO financial aid b/c I couldn't apply without it.
The system presumes a handout mentality of parenting, that good parenting is really nothing more than financial backing on demand.
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Martha
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stacykay
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I just came home last night from #2 ds's college orientation (St. Vincent in PA.) They gave all the kids a waiver to sign, so that we, parents, can call and get their grades, if we want. The person who was speaking at that point stated it was due to some privacy laws, and that without the waiver, they can't tell us a thing. BUT, at least they OFFERED the waiver.
My #1 ds is at MI State, and when I was in his orientation, we were told that the only way to see our kids' grades is for our children to forward them to us. No waivers were offered.
I don't have a clue as to what the privacy law is (I should have asked,) but, off-topic, it reminds me that we have also had the two over 18yos sign health care surrogate papers naming my husband and me, so if something were to ever happen and they were hospitalized, we could call and get info and make decisions for them, if needed. First hand experience with my dad taught me that even with these papers, getting info is like breaking into Fort Knox!
Way back when I was in college, my parents weren't at registration, and most colleges have fairly set curriculum for many majors, so their input wouldn't have been very helpful; but my grades did come via mail.
Oh how times have CHANGED! 
Both schools (MSU and SVC) are completely non-paper and all correspondance, including bills info, goes to their emails. My oldest gave us his password to his account and doesn't mind us checking at all. He is always quick to tell us about a bad grade, but when he made the Dean's list, he never mentioned it.
It is funny what you mentioned, Tea, about the "individuation ...negativism" towards parent/teen or young adult relations. Again, at MSU, we parents were highly discouraged, during the orientation, against calling our children, once they were to be in school in the fall. They stated that we needed to give them "time alone and without parental 'checkups' and interruption." However, at SVC, the tone was the complete opposite. There, they acknowledge how hard the transition can be for our dc, and to make sure we call and write, send care packages, and offer all the support we could, to HELP OUR children make a smooth transition to college and being away from family support! Quite the difference b/t a State university and a Catholic college!
I will pray for your son to do well and not feel intimidated in this big step for him!
God Bless,
Stacy in MI
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ALmom
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Ok, this whole issue goes waaay further than college. When your child turns 16, privacy laws take effect. This applies medically and to colleges and to a certain extent, the professionals involved have their hands tied. Now, that being said, you can experience huge variations in attitudes towards this. The professional who feels a strong legal obligation to hide their own personal aggravation with this and do it the way the law requires, a lot of ignorance and just doing things the way they're told, to the folks who are happy to wink and just get the job done (ignoring the law if they can get away with it) and to a lot of folks in between who try to be helpful, let you know about the forms, etc. or legal ways around the roadblock. Unfortunately, there are a significant number of folks whose attitude is that parents are the enemy - but it is better to numb parents and neutralize them than to get their feathers up. This seems to be the whole presumption behind college and the idea being that for the first year or so, we try to make things as painless as possible for mom and dad but in the end we are going to be educating their child and exposing them to much more than parents are really comfortable with and it will change these kids. Every once in a while the blatant presumptions come out in expressions like what you heard - how to divide kids from parental influence so we can conquer them with our agenda - but these are actually blessings because they open the eyes to an insiduous shift in presumption. Parents are no longer presumed to be loving, caring, capable people who know their child best and are more than willing to make sacrifices for their best interest - even seeking more experienced folks to advise - ie medical care, education, special interest areas, etc. Society seems to have shifted to believe that parents are incapable, it takes a village, etc. and often someone official must step in to assure that children are not kept from growing in ways the state deems appropriate. There are really people with an agenda and people who simply have mindlessly abosbed the latest societal assumptions. It sometimes comes out as more blatant indoctrination apart from tradtional values - like the kinds of comments you heard, or they assume that parents are the enemy that children must be freed from (overaggressive social workers/medical practitioners who decide that s* ed is their duty or homeschooling is de-facto child abuse)and of the virally anti-homeschooling comments not just the questioning because it is different, never heard of before or it seems strange or I'm worried about my grandkids kinds of things but the really angry, ugly type stuff.
While all the colleges I know of, try to remove parents from the registration process and are obligated by privacy laws in terms of release of info about the student and grades, not all have the same attitude as expressed above, though it does, in some degree or another, seem to be a hidden presumption of sorts since independence isn't equated with financial responsibility or any other real responsibility at this point, then independence = rejection of mom and dad's values or so it seems. Some even want to kindly make this shock a little less dramatic so they try to prepare you that your children will change (now what mother doesn't know her children will change - seems I'm the one that actually felt them bounce in the womb, then be born as 19 - 21 " in length and learn to talk and walk and figure out how to get into my top shelves, want to wear make-up, get a first job, etc. Yes, I believe I know my children grow and change, so why does the University think it so important to prepare me that my children will change in their first year of college. They even went so far as to tell me that I might not recognize them when they come home that first summer.)
Many have been quite helpful in that at the same time they inform on their restrictions, they suggest a few ways around it or how to assert your authority as mom and dad. But mostly it is about grades and paying the bill and rather contentious, not about keeping you connected as an anchor to real values. Being the type of environment typically found at a secular institution, you are bound to find at least a few with the "parents are the enemy" attitude directly expressed. What is more insiduous is the behind the scenes presumptions that underlay a lot of what goes on in official capacities. Having to vote about whether or not the bathrooms are co-ed on a floor, assumption that co-ed dorms are no big deal at all, no attempt at visitation schedules, etc., and the c* that were taped to every girls dorm freshman year - and mind you any attempt to post chastity info was thwarted and removed. A protest from mom and dad would have absolutely no effect - and would be rather rudely handled as this is what the students determined. Coming from the students, if they are lucky, they may get an opinion or two published in the student newspaper - but generally the attempt is to paint this view as hate diatribe or uneducated, religious fanaticism. Diversity, Academic Freedom, freedom of speech, etc. are buzz words - and only apply if you hold the liberal agenda. But a great deal of our ability to influence society into the future depends on getting an education in these very institutions. Talk to students attempting any kind of pro-life witness - and the meetings that are broken up by violent acting folks who are not particularly called to the table for their offensive behavior. Diversity just means making you accept as normal, things you know are not. It does not mean learning to be polite and work with people whose values differ greatly from your own. And there will be nothing to encourage a respectful listening to the pro-life, pro-chastity, there is an absolute right or wrong position. Professors who believe those things have to be very careful to avoid losing their jobs or having their jobs made a living nightmare. They are there and often quite courageous. Living in the secular world is living in a battleground. College campuses are extensions of that world. Expect it. You don't have to be ugly, but you do have to be alert and ready to be the odd ball often standing alone. You will certainly be exposed to a great deal. This doesn't mean you shouldn't be there to transform it one person at a time, necessarily - but it does mean you'd better know the reality of what you are facing, you'd better have a strong faith life, keep in touch with like minded folks (mom and dad in particular) who will support and encourage you to remain firm, to fight the good fight. Many, many students at these secular institutions are making disasterous choices, but they have never known any other way. Someone quietly living their faith, firmly, in the midst of these circumstances, can really, through the grace of God, make huge differences for people. Just be sure this is where God wants you to be.
We've found individuals tucked away in every University that are adamently, rock solid. Hopefully this was only an individual and not all the registrars there - the one down the road may have been happy to see you and certainly not given students ideas on how to keep mom out of the loop and may have even secretly complimented you for sticking to your guns. But be grateful that you are clearly informed of some of the hidden agendas - and, yes, they will not tell you anything about your child. Unless they set up an individual account at our University that allows mom and dad in, the college won't even be able to send us the bill  . We have had folks from the University inform us that if we are paying the bill, we still have some clout. Ie, I won't pay until I see grades. In our case, dd is primarily paying her own way, but it is easier for her if we get the bill and take it out of her local funds so she has arranged things that way. Still, the key is having a good relationship with your children no matter what. Our dd tells lots that University probably thinks we are ignorant about. I can tell you that Alcohol Edu is highly offensive - my dd showed me the questions and also shared with me some of the student opinion. It seemed to be to encourage illegal, underage drinking by assuming you would be doing it and just telling you how not to get caught (ie don't embarrass the university). She let them know exactly what she thought of it. This was one of those things touted to make mom and dad feel good that the University was attempting to address the drinking problems rampant on University campuses and act like they were on the side of the parent - then use the line, " but you know kids will sometimes just do foolish things" when surprise, surprise - things only get worse. I know about dorm situations where folks living somewhere other than college would be arrested and a lot of other stuff. I know it, however, because my dd talks to me regularly and we have a great relationship. Getting mom and dad out of the registration side of things may really be an attempt to give the child some time and space to try and attempt it on their own - but it seems more about distanceing child from mom and dad. Even though the colleges seem to universally try to remove mom and dad from the registration process entirely, what I have observed is a rather humorous dance. The college gets to pretend they are helping the child gain greater independence and self-reliance by keeping mom out while mom and dad are as much a part of the whole process as they ever were - just been made a lot less efficient now. (Either you plan classes ahead of time and child goes in armed with a cell phone and a list of what is wanted, or child comes out totally frustrated, cannot figure it out cause the advisor seems to have signed you up for all the wrong things and has disappeared and suddenly the room you are not supposed to be in, they are glad to have you there. Everything gets rearranged better, then you have to hunt down said advisor and finalize things. Oh, it may also be about being able to influence child towards certain classes. Talk to any student and they have the inside scoop on professors, classes, etc. Many classes sound great and turn out to be agenda pusing hogwash. A parent can help a student navigate towards solid courses, with solid instrucion in areas of their interest. Freshman year, particularly is most vulnerable because many, many of the "honors" courses were very odd but phrased to sound okay unless you knew a few buzz words or had some inside info - but with hard work and planning you can find great courses to fulfill requirements. It doesn't mean you don't stretch your exposure, but there is a difference to being exposed to some modern art/music that is still art/music and another to be subject to downright pornography. The courses that liberal agenda advisor might think are great and the ones "you just really must take because it is such a great professor" are not likely to be the ones my child or I want. Of course there is always that drop/add option if done early so you rearrange your whole schedule later with mom and dad. All of the above work, just would have been tons easier to have all parties participating to start with. Just if mom and dad and said child have a bit of tension coming in, this can be a little wedge to hasten the process towards "independence." The University is doing a dance of its own - see they want mom and dad's money so they cannot totally offend and have to seem like they are just an extension of home, trying to help. And there may be the overcontrolling, occassional folks who do need to let the child gain wings and it doesn't sound totally unreasonable to want the child to begin to take on more and more on their own. It isn't clearly battleground but can serve to try and make it where the University becomes more and more formational and where the parents less. (None of this works, of course, when mom and dad have a great relationship with said child). Now, I'm still trying to figure out if the University really believes the students are doing all this course scheduling 100% without mom and dad or not. Is it a case of wishful thinking or do they really believe they are furthering said child's independence. What was clearly obvious to me was hysterically funny unless you were in the midst at which point it was darn frustrating - mom and dad blocked from entrance into the room with the computers for registration - said children making sure mom and dad are nearby and have their cell phones, a hall of parents outside the registration process answering calls and with cell phones in continual use asking questions like "Now, what time is that class? What building is it in? Do you really think you'll be able to get from the other end of campus to that class with your recent knee surgery? Better try a different time Didn't you tell me something about taking xyz? Is that different or still important to you. Oh, okay, so you'd rather get more core courses out of the way, that sounds like a good idea. Is there something that fits, that is interesting. Looks like you might have a spot at xyz time." This all sounded like good guidance, not overprotection or interference; it was all solicited by the students and as far as privacy - there was tons more the old way. Not a single student did their schedule without input from mom and dad - many poked their head out the door to ask mom and dad if they couldn't hear even when it meant losing their place at the computer. Basically, I could have had the schedule of every single student signing up for classes at the same time as my dd. Unfortunately for us, our cell phone died so we had to wait till dd came out. She told us her schedule was hopelessly messed up and since this was at least two hours after most had finished, they asked me to just come in and help. I assume dd just asked if she could get mom to come in. We resolved the problem in less than 30 minutes - probably could have registered and been done in 10 minutes if we'd been there in the first place. Registration for your first year of college during orientation is universally a mess - do it ahead of time if you are able!!!!
The college gives parent presentations, and on the surface, at face value they really don't sound terrible just leave you a tad uneasy - about how the child is in a growing process and we have to learn to let go graciously while still staying involved in their life (ie don't have an opinion about right and wrong, just be there to accept your child and give them their space if they don't want to talk is the translation as best I could determine it after more time to process all the talks, and actions together). They often told the students one thing and then told the parents what they thought the parents wanted to hear. Take what the university says with a grain of salt and use your own good judgement as parents. And basically, the parents I know did just what they always would have done, blithely ignoring most of the blather, and maintaining their same old good relationship. I know my dd gave me her password (I did not ask for it) online to her college stuff. I have never used it (except the one time she asked me to look something up for her or see if she had an e-mail from so and so since her computer had crashed) and wouldn't as I consider that her private information. She'd never keep grades from us and is generally checking daily for a while to see things posted. No, the university wouldn't tell us anything at all about her - and once I had a time figuring out a random charge on our bill and had to wait until I could catch dd outside of regular business hours so she could tell me whether it was a legit charge or not and whether she had already paid it herself or wanted us to. (The bill was related to adding a class after a certain time but since it related to her schedule they couldn't tell me anything - aah).
When a child goes to the doc, dentist, etc. medical facilities will not tell you anything unless your child has signed a release . Some docs will try to send you out at least for some time (even before the child turns 16)so they can talk to your children about all kinds of bc things without you present - be alert, be prepared, refuse! Granted different docs do things different ways - some automatically give you the form expecting parents to be informed (this is my pediatrician)and would never push something like this, some you have to ask or have your child ask (these be cautious), sometimes you have to be persistant (those are the docs I avoid). Be sure that your child has signed information at college so that if there is an illness or something, they can talk to you. Do this with whomever they see while in college. It comes across better to them, if the child is requesting it without mom and dad right there, but be sure that it is done. Anything from requesting a different dorm to whatever, just gets quicker and more friendly and serious response if it is the child doing the requesting. (DD would tell me and discuss things through, tell me what she wanted, brainstorm with me how to approach the Univeristy - but she did the approaching). Otherwise you do often get a reaction like it is mom and dad interfering or pressuring (even if it was initially dc request).
Now we (the parents) have a great relationship with our children, so it has never become an issue. The kids and I simply ask, before even talking to a doc, okay what forms do we need to sign to make sure parents are informed - and we also try to only go to docs that think along our lines (harder and harder to find, but when you find one, they are worth any other inconvenience or cost). Now, I heard of one mom who was told she wasn't allowed back with her child who simply said, either I go back or I don't pay the bill (ie no filling out all this responsible party for the bill stuff). Situation was resolved and at that point mom was congratulated by the physician (it wasn't his rule or preference, simply our interfering federal government! Staff can either be pushing to seperate you or they can offer the alternatives and a lot depends on the individual staff member involved.)
We had the same sort of experience with college registration - only the problem was that they sent all the kids into this room and forbid parents to enter. Ya know what happened - it took twice as long, cause every kid I know used their cell phone to talk to mom and dad as they tried to schedule - especially since advising services are really next to none (it is in the college's interest to mess up the schedule so you take extra time). Honestly, my dd's best advising has come from other students in her field who already had their schedules shot by bad advising from their given advisor. This is especially true if you are doing something out of the ordinary - double majoring, combining honors track with something like art/music instead of engineering.
One of the approaches we took was for mom and dad to be in the background while child requested all this stuff. You get less flak that way - since the request is coming from the child.
As far as billing, the college did inform us that they could not send us grades (and the way things were said, it honestly sounded like the University had no choice - which may be true or it may simply be the strange routine of orientation where the college says one thing to parents to reassure them and an entirely different thing to the kids. I know cause our dd and I had totally different impressions of some of the same people who spoke to us and she gave us the low down of what they told the students).
Anyways, the University did want to get paid so they allow the students to set up entirely different account where the parents can get in and access the financial section only and pretty much assume mom and dad are footing all/most of the bill. I will say that at least one faculty presenter made the comment that if mom and dad are footing the bill, then you would certainly be within your rights to refuse to pay the bill until you'd seen the grades (and personally that's what he'd do) - but you'd have to get it from the student because the University, by law, cannot release that info to anyone but the student and whomever the student requests that they send a transcript to.
The campus security (not an official part of orientation but a good place to visit regardless), gave us a lot more information and were appalled at the number of times kids could simply get more money from mom and dad for "expenses" when they were really in trouble with the police for drinking violations. They were a lot more forthright about issues - lighting or lack therof on campus, safety, etc. We took our dd to hear from the police directly - not just mom and dad being overprotective.
Funniest thing here related to Jr college because lots of college students take a course or two over the summer for transfer - but the University system and the Jr. College are on different schedules so summer registration for the Jr college takes place during a lot of other folks finals. It is mostly parents signing absent students up for classes. Dd was taking finals while needing to register for the JR. college course, so she sent me and asked if I'd get her schedule while there. I was not the only mom, by a long shot. Most of the parents had kids taking finals somewhere. We all ended up with a schedule by taking a form to our child to sign. (How many actually had the actual child sign is questionable - the registrar did a lot of winking and leaving the room that day - and really it would be rather ridiculous to make these kids miss their first day of class because they couldn't get their schedule until the first day of class when arriving home the weekend before summer classes started). Whether they would have been as accomodating in other situations, I don't know.
Well, I sure got longwinded. This whole college thing sometimes gets under me - but it is the same battle we face living Christian lives in a pagan world.
Janet
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sunnyviewmom
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| Posted: June 18 2009 at 2:46pm | IP Logged
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I guess it's kind of an extension of the attitude of the secular culture that even if you do not send little ones to pre school (or even babies or toddlers to daycare) you are overly protective, the attitude that its so wonderful and healthy for little ones to separate from Mom and family. I think that's one of the biggest ways that the evil one has a grip on the culture.
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stefoodie
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| Posted: June 18 2009 at 5:07pm | IP Logged
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My dd attended a "college night" hosted by a couple of Notre Dame grads here. One of the kids asked, "what about homesickness", expressing his anxiety over the eventual separation from his parents, which dd thought was admirable and rare these days. The ND's grads' answer? "Well, you'll be sure to experience that, but you kinda have to learn to live your own life, you know." Needless to say, not what my dd was expecting them to say. I find it sad when kids themselves express their attachment to their parents and then are often mocked or dismissed and made to feel that it's not normal, or worse, that such an attachment is part of immaturity, like "you'll soon grow out of it".
Sometimes I think that's one reason why some adult children are less welcoming of their parents in their old age -- I've met parents who "can't wait to get rid" of their kids so they can get their life back. No wonder some folks would rather put their aging parents in a nursing home than take care of them in their own homes (not generalizing here, I know for a lot of people it's not so much a choice as a necessity, but I've also seen the negative attitudes that I talk about here).
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stef
mom to five
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cvbmom
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| Posted: June 18 2009 at 8:37pm | IP Logged
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stefoodie wrote:
Sometimes I think that's one reason why some adult children are less welcoming of their parents in their old age -- I've met parents who "can't wait to get rid" of their kids so they can get their life back. No wonder some folks would rather put their aging parents in a nursing home than take care of them in their own homes (not generalizing here, I know for a lot of people it's not so much a choice as a necessity, but I've also seen the negative attitudes that I talk about here). |
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I TOTALLY agree with you on this one. Sad!
God bless,
Christine
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Mom to dd (16), ds (15), dd, (12), dd (11), ds (9), dd (8), dd (7), ds (5), dd (3), ds (2), and ds (1)
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4Real Forums : High School Years and Beyond
Topic: Community College - good news and sad....
