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Bookswithtea
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| Posted: Nov 20 2007 at 11:55am | IP Logged
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How do you know how much to expect from a 9th grader in Alg. 1? Now that we are halfway into the year, its getting really hard, and we've had some not-so-good test scores. I don't think its the program (Teaching Textbooks). I think its a combination of two things...
1--still getting the hang of which rules to use when, which probably comes with time and practice.
2--teenage boy behavior...things like not thoroughly checking a test for mistakes, combining two steps on one line, sometimes even copying the problem down wrong! 
We've slowed down, and gone back two chapters to make sure that comprehension is at least adequate if not mastered. He's not *terrible* at math (I was...I know the signs), but he's not a math whiz, either.
In every other subject, we require an 83 (lowest B average without being a B-) because we believe that less than that in his other subjects reflects laziness rather than lack of comprehension. But I don't know if I'm expecting too much out of him for math to get 83's, too? I'm frustrated...he's frustrated...
Advice on this or anything else related to teaching Alg. 1 would be much appreciated...
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mothering ds'93 dd'97 dd'99 dd'02 ds'05 ds'07 and  due 9/10
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guitarnan
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| Posted: Nov 20 2007 at 4:35pm | IP Logged
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I think you could still expect an 83. Your son will have to focus on checking his work and copying things correctly, that's all.
We did Alg. I last year. My son had some of the same issues but managed to score in the low to high 80's most of the time.
Do you grade his tests, or does someone else? It's perfectly OK to give partial credit in Algebra I (they do it in ps, and I know first-hand because I was a math sub for 2 years).
Another thing to focus on is problem-solving methodology. Your son needs to be able to recognize what kind of problem he is looking at (rate times time equals distance, for ex.) and have memorized the formula to use (rt=d) in each instance. That will go a long way toward improving his grades.
With graphing, he needs to practice drawing neat, legible graphs.
It's OK to do some of the exercises using the answers (in back of book?) to help solve them. What you're looking for is mastery of methodology, remember, so sometimes a student learns a lot by puzzling backward from an answer to the beginning of the problem.
I'm not familiar with TT's format, so perhaps there's aspects of the curriculum I'm not understanding fully; please excuse my lack of knowledge.
HTH.
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Nancy in MD. Mom of ds (24) & dd (18); 31-year Navy wife, move coordinator and keeper of home fires. Writer and dance mom.
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Bookswithtea
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| Posted: Nov 20 2007 at 4:39pm | IP Logged
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guitarnan wrote:
Do you grade his tests, or does someone else? It's perfectly OK to give partial credit in Algebra I (they do it in ps, and I know first-hand because I was a math sub for 2 years). |
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Well, we are doing everything else you mentioned, but not THIS. This could make a huge difference in his scores...Dh marks it *wrong* if there is one tiny mistake, like a reversed sign or lack of reducing. There are only ever about 22 problems on a test so the grade drops quickly.
Can you give me some pointers on how many points to have per problem so that I am doing it fairly?
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mothering ds'93 dd'97 dd'99 dd'02 ds'05 ds'07 and due 9/10
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guitarnan
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| Posted: Nov 20 2007 at 4:56pm | IP Logged
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Aha. Glad to be of help.
Normally what I do is look at how many points each problem is worth. If I get to decide, I make each problem worth 1 point (so, on a 22 problem test, the grade will be some number divided by 22, converted to a percentage).
Then, I take off 1/4 point for something like a reversed sign or minor arithmetic mistake, provided the rest of the problem is done correctly from that point on.
I take off 1/2 point for more serious things (only graphing part of the equation, using the wrong formula, not completing the problem).
I take off the whole thing for serious mistakes (a combo of the above, or just clearn incomprehension). Occasionally my son just skips a problem my accident - automatic zero points - just thought I'd let you know it happens to me, too!
Does this help?
Even when I took the AP calculus exam, way back when, they HAD to have given partial credit because I managed to pass the darn thing.
Now, your son will have to learn to SHOW his work. ALL the steps. Otherwise, he can't get partial credit for a problem. If he does it in his head and gets it wrong, and doesn't show you how he got from A to B (or x to y, silly math joke!), then he loses all the points for that problem.
We use Jacobs and the algebra tests always had extra credit problems; some were hard and my son avoided them, but he did up his grade here and there with those extra credit attempts. (Geometry, they don't have extra credit.)
It's also important to review the test afterward. Reason: SAT problems are all or nothing, right or wrong. Those darn ovals you have to fill in say nothing about how you did the problem.
Also, consider giving a semester exam in January (maybe your program allows for this) to "encourage" your son to review the first semester's work. Math is cumulative, so a good review never hurts. Everything builds on what's come before.
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Nancy in MD. Mom of ds (24) & dd (18); 31-year Navy wife, move coordinator and keeper of home fires. Writer and dance mom.
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lapazfarm
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| Posted: Nov 20 2007 at 5:09pm | IP Logged
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Another option you may consider is when grading the test, only mark the problems right or wrong. Then let ds make up half of the missed credit by finding and correcting the mistakes himself.
For instance, if a problem is worth 6 points, he can make back three points by fixing it himself.
That is one option I used to use occasionally with my struggling math students.
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guitarnan
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| Posted: Nov 20 2007 at 5:18pm | IP Logged
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I love this idea, Theresa, and plan on adopting it immediately.
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Nancy in MD. Mom of ds (24) & dd (18); 31-year Navy wife, move coordinator and keeper of home fires. Writer and dance mom.
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Bookswithtea
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| Posted: Nov 20 2007 at 5:35pm | IP Logged
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Theresa, that is a *great* idea! I will talk with dh about that.
Nancy, I think I can handle that. I am relieved...maybe he isn't doing as poorly as I thought he was?
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mothering ds'93 dd'97 dd'99 dd'02 ds'05 ds'07 and due 9/10
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Barb.b
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Ladies, I love this thread! Theresa, What an awesome idea. I will adopt this for tests and for problems in the book! Books - I love your comment about teenage boy behavior! My son will try to write down as little as possible! Skipping steps . . . it is agrevating. Giving partial credit does help - but sometimes I think it makes it worse because he thinks he doesn't have to change because he will at least get some credit. Now Theresa's idea just might work. I do see my ds having mistakes due to not checking the problem or doing it too quickly!
Barb
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Carole N.
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| Posted: Nov 20 2007 at 6:29pm | IP Logged
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Coming in late on this discussion, but I just wanted to let you know that I have some of the same problems. Like you wrote Nancy, I take off a point or two on math problems that have a partial error (like sign errors, etc.). And as Theresa suggested, I let him go back and work the problem when he misses it. I think that is very important in teaching them to look for their mistakes! I must be weak, however, I let them work the problems they just "missed." I guess I need to establish some accountablility.
Dh always compares math to being an engineer and building bridges or skyscrapers or towers in a refinery. A tiny mistake could mean that the bridge falls or the tower leaks. Good analogy and I try to use it as well. And since the biggest problem that I have with ds is showing his work, it makes sense. You cannot fix the problem if you have nothing to show for it (even if the information is locked in your head, everyone else needs to be able to see what you have done).
We have been through three different Algebra programs and finally settled on TT. I really do like the program. Ds will take his final test tomorrow and then, when we are settled in Wales, he will begin Jacobs Geometry. I think that he needs the break! And so do I. Math is not my forte. 
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guitarnan
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Carole, you'll find Jacobs Geometry good, I think, except that they only have 1 version of each test. Algebra I had 4 versions, so we could use 1 version as a practice test/review. In Geometry, the Review section at the end of each chapter isn't exactly like the chapter tests...so you may need to do some one-on-one reviewing.
We still like the program, though...and it starts with fun stuff (constructions and polygons), not proofs, so teens aren't immediately turned off as I was in high school.
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Nancy in MD. Mom of ds (24) & dd (18); 31-year Navy wife, move coordinator and keeper of home fires. Writer and dance mom.
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Moni
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| Posted: March 27 2008 at 11:30pm | IP Logged
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I require 100%
On daily assignments and on any tests he takes.
I marked the incorrect problems with a checkmark.
If they are just needing reducing I mark it with a Triangle.
I hand him back his paper and he makes his corrections.
And then I check those corrections.
And the process repeats until all problems are correct
Then he gets 100%
We've always done math this way though.
So whenever he's finished a math book, he knows he has done every single problem in that book correctly at least once. 
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5athome
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| Posted: March 28 2008 at 4:40pm | IP Logged
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Two other things you might try -
Give the test, let him do the fixes. The next day give him the same test again. My dh leans toward 100% after fixes or redo the next day. I tend to be more lenient:)
Another idea I read if you think it is just sloppiness is to hand back the test and say for example, 3 are wrong. However, you do not say which 3 - this forces the student to go through and double check answers.
I really think by making the required score high, you are doing your child a favor as a firm grasp of Alg 1 will be needed and appreciated as they go to the higher maths.
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Lauri B
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My daughter is doing Teaching Textbooks Algebra with the solutions cdrom. She is supposed to watch the solution to every problem she misses, however she was getting a bit cocky and often thought she knew what she did wrong, so would skip the solutions cdrom or watch part of it and then quit. However, without watching the FULL solution, she couldn't really know what she did or didn't know and this began taking a toll on later lessons! She is holding herself to a higher standard now and is much more precise in each problem, more careful in checking, and watches each and every solution (all the way through) to the problems she misses. She found that her understanding greatly increased by requiring more diligence to the program.
Perhaps this is the case with your son. It's easy to get a bit sloppy as the year goes on. We often think we "get it" when we don't and the misunderstandings multiply.
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Topic: Alg. 1 help regarding expectations?
