| Author | |
Angie Mc
Board Moderator
Joined: Jan 31 2005
Location: Arizona
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 11400
|
| Posted: July 02 2011 at 9:47pm | IP Logged
|
 |
|
For 9th grade we read short stories as part of my ds's English. For 10th grade, we plan to read poetry. I just ordered poetry books to cover my ds's favorite topics - America, baseball, comedy, and war history.
I'm reticent. I know nothing about poetry beyond the elementary years. My first child taught herself  . So we're going to dive in with a goal of appreciation, some memorization, and making connections to favorite content in other subjects.
What are you favorite poems for this age? Favorite poems for young men? Tips on ways to enjoy poetry? Thanks!
Love,
__________________
Angie Mc
Maimeo to Henry! Dave's wife, mom to Mrs. Devin+Michael Pope, Aiden 20,Ian 17,John Paul 11,Catherine (heaven 6/07)
About Me
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
kristinannie
Forum All-Star
Joined: Jan 27 2011
Location: West Virginia
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1363
|
| Posted: July 02 2011 at 9:49pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Are you planning on doing poetry for the entire year? I love poetry. I especially love the romantic poets, especially Wordsworth. Those are great for any nature lover. You can always do some Milton as well (excerpts). His poetry has great religious stuff in it.
__________________
John Paul 8.5
Meredith Rose 7
Dominic Michael 4.5
Katherine Elizabeth 8 months
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
juliana147
Forum All-Star
Joined: July 07 2010
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 520
|
| Posted: July 06 2011 at 9:52am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Hi Angie, I have used Joseph Pearce's anthology, Flowers of Heaven: One Thousand Years of Christian Verse. It is a very good anthology. You might want to use some supplements, though, since he has a definite focus, and cannot include everything. However, I really appreciated not having to double check everything for appropriate content, and the book contains some beautiful Catholic works I had not seen before.
I still pull out my old Norton Anthology of Poetry from college for read alouds. I don't like all of their choices, though, and wouldn't use it as a primary text for this age level.
My dh really loves Beowulf, the Iliad, and the Odyssey. I really don't, LOL. When I had to read them in high school, I was convinced that these works were "boy poetry." My ds will be reading them this year and discussing them with Dad, who can make these stories actually sound exciting. 
Have you thought about teaching him to write poetry, too? I have also used Poetry a la Carte by Prufrock Press. It is intended for grades 5-8 or so, but can be tweaked for older and younger grades. You will need to look over much of this before you use it, since it is intended for classroom teaching. What my kids liked was the introduction to poetic forms. This is helpful if you want to teach the writing of poetry along with poetry appreciation.
juliana
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
guitarnan
Forum Moderator
Joined: Feb 07 2005
Location: Maryland
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 10883
|
| Posted: July 06 2011 at 10:43am | IP Logged
|
|
|
My son really enjoyed "Lepanto," and we purchased a great study guide to go with it. (CHC, maybe?)
__________________
Nancy in MD. Mom of ds (24) & dd (18); 31-year Navy wife, move coordinator and keeper of home fires. Writer and dance mom.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
juliana147
Forum All-Star
Joined: July 07 2010
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 520
|
| Posted: July 06 2011 at 10:49am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Another Chesterton fan!!!
We loved "Sonnet to a Stilton Cheese." Hilarious read-aloud!
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
MichelleW
Forum All-Star
Joined: April 01 2005
Location: Oregon
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 947
|
| Posted: July 07 2011 at 1:30am | IP Logged
|
|
|
These are my favorite books for teaching poetry to high schoolers:
This X. J. Kennedy manual is a really good book that could last you throughout high school (though I wouldn't pay full price for it, it looks like they have a used one for $13). It teaches both appreciation and writing and the poems are varied and truly excellent!
In addition I would recommend this OOP book book for writing poetry. It is appropriate for 8th-9th grade. It is OOP but it looks like there are many used ones available. It is more basic than the one above, but it makes poetry writing FUN and accessible.
__________________
Michelle
Mom to 3 (dd 14, ds 15, and ds 16)
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Mackfam
Board Moderator
Non Nobis
Joined: April 24 2006
Location: Alabama
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 14656
|
| Posted: July 07 2011 at 6:26am | IP Logged
|
|
|
The Charge of the Light Brigade and Other Story Poems - This is the teacher edition and does contain some helpful material in the center of the book. We use the center section for jumping off points mostly, but there are some thought provoking questions there. The poetry is very good, and to me, is ideally suited for a young man though definitely not limited to young men. The poetry in this book is divided into sections and I'll list them for you since I think that gives you a good feel for the poetry overall:
** Group 1 - Patriotism and Adventure
** Group 2 - Fun and Fantasy
** Group 3 - The Famous and the Infamous
** Group 4 - Ballads of Yesterday and Today
** Group 5 - Poems of the Heart
** Group 6 - The World of Today
***************************************************
Great general poetry anthology - The Oxford Book of English Verse edited and selected by Sir Arthur Quiller-Couch. This is an excellent general anthology. Shakespeare's sonnets are contained here and these would be an excellent part of high school poetry.
***************************************************
As others have suggested -- the poetry of G.K. Chesterton, especially The Ballad of the White Horse and Lepanto, both of which Catholic Heritage Curricula offers study guides for. The Works of G.K. Chesterton offers an excellent sampling of his poetry.
****************************************************
For the faith: I really enjoy Joseph Pearce as well. I also recommend Garlands of Grace: An Anthology of Great Christian Poetry by Regis Martin (Ignatius), and a book that JennGM recommended not too long ago is now a favorite of ours, A String of Sapphires by Helen Parry Eden (check your library because this one is long oop and hard to find, but so worth it!!) It contains absolutely beautiful Catholic poetry that follow the mysteries of the Life and Death of Our Lord. We enjoy reading this book aloud to all ages, and I don't necessarily think this book is really only for a high schooler, but my high schooler is especially enjoying the poetry so I wanted to mention it.
__________________
Jen Mackintosh
Wife to Rob, mom to dd 19 , ds 16, ds 11, dd 8, and dd 3
Wildflowers and Marbles
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
4 lads mom
Forum All-Star
Joined: Sept 26 2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1944
|
| Posted: July 07 2011 at 7:11am | IP Logged
|
|
|
This is a totally secular suggestion.....but one of my favorite “still alive and with us” poets. Ted Kooser was the poet laureate a few years back, and has such vivid, “for real” poetry......I think it would appeal to both teen boys as well as girls. I can’t think of any that are racy, but I haven’t read every single one of his poems....but enough to know he is my poetry hero for right now.  He wants his poetry to be “approachable” and believes poets shouldn’t just write for “themselves” in a selfish sort of way, but always with an eye and ear directed towards the audience..and be respectful of that audience. I also have a few of his “how-to” books. I love this guy, I am trying to work up enough courage to send him a few of my poems.
Here is his website:
http://tedkooser.net/
I encourage all of you to check him out....he is a treasure.
__________________
Mom of four brave lads and one sweet lassie
Scenes From This and That
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Angie Mc
Board Moderator
Joined: Jan 31 2005
Location: Arizona
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 11400
|
| Posted: July 07 2011 at 12:09pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
You all are the best! Dh was called out of town on the 4th for an emergency with his work and returned last night. I'm a bit behind with my planning and it was a treat to see you all helping me out in my time of need . I'll get back to this topic soon, may have some questions, but wanted to thank you all.
4 lads, how cool that you HAVE poetry to conisder submitting. Do it!
Love,
__________________
Angie Mc
Maimeo to Henry! Dave's wife, mom to Mrs. Devin+Michael Pope, Aiden 20,Ian 17,John Paul 11,Catherine (heaven 6/07)
About Me
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
4 lads mom
Forum All-Star
Joined: Sept 26 2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1944
|
| Posted: July 11 2011 at 10:24pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
By the way, Mater et Magistra Magazine
has a terrific unit study on poetry that I keep picking up and mulling over. I think it would be well worth the cost of purchase. The unit study is written for different age levels. There are lots of suggestions for reading poetry and resources about poetry. Margot Davidson and Sally Thomas wrote this, I am impressed!
Also, if I could put in, once more, an unsolicited advertisement about Mater et Magistra.....I LOVE this little gem of a periodical. LOVE it. 
And.....I am printing up my poetry and letter to Mr. Kooser
__________________
Mom of four brave lads and one sweet lassie
Scenes From This and That
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
SallyT
Forum All-Star
Joined: Aug 08 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2489
|
| Posted: July 12 2011 at 8:51am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Oh, yes, I was going to suggest my personal fave for poetry instruction, Laurence Perrine's Sound and Sense. That's the book I built my part of the poetry study around, and I've always loved it, ever since I encountered it as a high-school student myself.
Perrine is . . . well, not everyone's cup of tea, especially if you don't want to categorize poetry as "good" and "bad," or "good" and "great" (though you can also skip those chapters if you don't want to get bogged down in those kinds of arguments). But for my money, especially as preparation for college reading and analysis -- not just of poetry, either -- Perrine is the goods, in terms of introducing standard literary terms and devices and demonstrating how they actually function in a work of literature. This kind of discussion takes appreciation of poetry beyond the level of inspiration, or emotional appeal, or being able to relate, to the level of being amazed at all the ways any poem can mean, because of the way it's made.
This is the level of literary conversation which college professors expect, though they too often don't get it, because too many students are mired in "what I think this poem is saying to me." (or if not a lit class, then you get my husband's experience of reading theology papers which are all about "what I think Saint Augustine is saying to me today, which funnily enough sounds just like what I already say to myself all the time.").
It's really not just about poetry, although reading poetry is important enough on its own merits -- it's about reading, understanding, digging beneath the surface, and persevering with a text which doesn't readily give up its goods. Again, I can't stress enough that too few college students are willing, or even able (which is the really sad part) to do this kind of active close reading. It's becoming virtually a lost art, and that deficit is creating a black hole which is pulling all of higher education down into itself. But I think I'm digressing.
Anyway, that's my plug for Perrine. My recent graduate worked her way through it virtually on her own this spring, more or less following the M&M study guide. I'm hoping eventually to flesh that out more, to make a semester-long "seminar" plan for my humanities curriculum site , but we're not there yet.
Other fun stuff for aspects of poetry:
John Hollander's Rhyme's Reason (on poetic forms)
Richard Hugo's The Triggering Town (you probably don't want your child to read this, but it's a quick, easy mom-read for understanding how at least one poet writes, and he has interesting ideas for poetry-writing prompts).
If you have back issues of M&M, I also wrote a piece (several years ago now) on reading and writing the sonnet. It can be fun to take one form and do an intensive study, just to see what poets from the Renaissance to the present have done within the confines of a fairly strict and non-negotiable set of rules.
OK, the poetry nerd is DONE. (but I could talk about this stuff all day . . . )
Sally
__________________
Castle in the Sea
Abandon Hopefully
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Angie Mc
Board Moderator
Joined: Jan 31 2005
Location: Arizona
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 11400
|
| Posted: July 12 2011 at 1:44pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Wow, ladies...I'm inspired! Our family is on a staycation. As soon as its over, I'm all over this!
4lads - AWESOME...can I have your autograph? Will you remember us when you're rich and famous?
Sally Poetry Nerd...do go on!
Thanks, all!
Love,
__________________
Angie Mc
Maimeo to Henry! Dave's wife, mom to Mrs. Devin+Michael Pope, Aiden 20,Ian 17,John Paul 11,Catherine (heaven 6/07)
About Me
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
SallyT
Forum All-Star
Joined: Aug 08 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2489
|
| Posted: July 12 2011 at 3:46pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
I'll browse my shelves for more good resources, Angie. I did two stints in M.F.A. programs in poetry and have no end of books of and about poetry. Much of it is not the kind of thing you necessarily want to hand your child -- virtually none of the poets I read or studied with as a graduate student were/are coming from any kind of faith perspective, for example -- but there's a lot that's interesting, and it could be fun to do a course in "How to Read a Poem," along the lines of Adler's How to Read a Book.
And 4LadsMom -- go for it! Some of the best, most interesting, and most helpful correspondences I've had have been with poets I've admired. And though I haven't met him in person, I think Ted Kooser is a very nice guy. He wrote me once, long ago, out of the blue, having seen a poem of mine in print . . . which I think says more about the kind of guy he is than anything else! Just very encouraging and kind, and the sort of person who would take the time for a struggling student.
Another good resource, by the way, is the Poetry Friday carnival -- the current roundup schedule is here. A lot of the entries are children's poetry, but not all, by any means, and many people write really good and interesting reflections on the art of poetry itself. I haven't participated in a long time, but I do have a whole poetry label at my regular blog. Often I just post poems, mine or other people's, without a lot of comment, but occasionally I try to say something more.
Must make dinner now, but more later!
Sally
__________________
Castle in the Sea
Abandon Hopefully
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
4 lads mom
Forum All-Star
Joined: Sept 26 2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1944
|
| Posted: July 12 2011 at 4:31pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
My head is spinning....He wrote to you???!!??? WOW!!! That’s it, I am getting it in the mail today.
Angie, you don’t know how life changing this post has been.....seriously. I have been in a pm conversation with a fellow mom on here after talking about Ted Kooser, and now I get to meet Sally T, the author of the unit study I have been all over the last few months???? AND...Ted Kooser to wrote her as well?????
It doesn’t get much better, folks....God is handing me a few gems here!!!
I am off to look up everything you have spoken about, Sally.....you are so right on about the study of poetry and literature....I need to read your blog!!!
Thanks, again, Ladies...I am reminded so many times of why I love it here.  You all have carried my girl in prayer, and lifted my mama spirits with engaging conversations like this!
__________________
Mom of four brave lads and one sweet lassie
Scenes From This and That
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Mackfam
Board Moderator
Non Nobis
Joined: April 24 2006
Location: Alabama
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 14656
|
| Posted: July 12 2011 at 4:33pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
4lads....
Thank you so much for mentioning the Winter 2010 m et m magazine with the poetry pullout unit study written by Sally and Margot!!!! It's wonderful and I was so grateful for the reminder!!! I pulled it out and have been enjoying it immensely as well as some of Sally's thoughts on this thread! So, I have Sally's unit study on poetry from the Winter 2010 m et m, and now I'm hunting through my back issues for this.....
SallyT wrote:
| If you have back issues of M&M, I also wrote a piece (several years ago now) on reading and writing the sonnet. It can be fun to take one form and do an intensive study, just to see what poets from the Renaissance to the present have done within the confines of a fairly strict and non-negotiable set of rules. |
|
|
I found it!!! It's in the Spring 2009 issue - Lead, Kindly Poem: Reading and Writing the Sonnet. A pdf version of the Spring 2009 issue is available through mater et magistra - and it is one of my favorites; the Shakespeare issue!!!!
Wonderful! I'm so glad you shared, Sally and I'm eager to dig in (again) to your articles! I've got my little pile of poetry resources sitting on my desk and I hope to pay more attention to it next week sometime. Glad I can ride on your coat-tails, Angie! Thanks for starting this thread!
__________________
Jen Mackintosh
Wife to Rob, mom to dd 19, ds 16, ds 11, dd 8, and dd 3
Wildflowers and Marbles
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Angie Mc
Board Moderator
Joined: Jan 31 2005
Location: Arizona
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 11400
|
| Posted: July 15 2011 at 6:37pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Thank you again, Ladies! I have checked out each and every source shared here. I'm SO excited!...which I have never said before in connection to poetry .
SallyT wrote:
Perrine is . . . well, not everyone's cup of tea, especially if you don't want to categorize poetry as "good" and "bad," or "good" and "great" ...But for my money, especially as preparation for college reading and analysis -- not just of poetry, either -- Perrine is the goods, in terms of introducing standard literary terms and devices and demonstrating how they actually function in a work of literature. This kind of discussion takes appreciation of poetry beyond the level of inspiration, or emotional appeal, or being able to relate, to the level of being amazed at all the ways any poem can mean, because of the way it's made.
|
|
|
Sally, this is a lightbulb moment for me! I absolutely NEED objective measures for good, bad, ugly. I love structure as it relates to writing - the discipline and container that allows ideas (more than emotions) to shine via clarity.
My dd was attracted to poetry from many angles, with an emphasis on emotions. I didn't relate. But with my ds, I can see us working toegether from a similar perspective.
4 lads mom wrote:
Angie, you don’t know how life changing this post has been.....seriously.
...Thanks, again, Ladies...I am reminded so many times of why I love it here. You all have carried my girl in prayer, and lifted my mama spirits with engaging conversations like this! |
|
|
God is Good! I'm with you, 4lads, I've been blessed so often in such a tangible way through this gathering . Do keep us posted!
Love,
__________________
Angie Mc
Maimeo to Henry! Dave's wife, mom to Mrs. Devin+Michael Pope, Aiden 20,Ian 17,John Paul 11,Catherine (heaven 6/07)
About Me
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
SallyT
Forum All-Star
Joined: Aug 08 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2489
|
| Posted: July 16 2011 at 9:59pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Angie, I really think that this "made thing" thing demystifies poetry -- in a good way. When I taught high-school English, I had colleagues who never taught poetry, because they were scared of it, as though it were some kind of mystical prophecy from above that they couldn't begin to understand or touch. And I can remember getting into an argument with a student once, who had produced some kind of from-Mars explanation of an Emily Dickinson poem, which he defended by saying, "You're supposed to read between the lines." To which I responded, "Yeah, but you're supposed to read the lines first."
Anyway, I think especially for boys, the idea that poetry is all about expressing your emotions is a serious turn-off -- and for anyone, the idea that it's an expression of emotion leaves you with very little to talk about, other than feelings, which get kind of boring (unless you're a teenaged girl, but even then!
Oops, I think this forum is about to lock for Sunday, but more later!
Sally
__________________
Castle in the Sea
Abandon Hopefully
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
juliana147
Forum All-Star
Joined: July 07 2010
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 520
|
| Posted: July 18 2011 at 1:22pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
quoting SallyT: "which he defended by saying, 'You're supposed to read between the lines.' To which I responded, 'Yeah, but you're supposed to read the lines first.'"
Sally, this made me laugh!
I agree completely that thinking of poetry as simply a way to express emotions is a huge turn-off for many boys (and some girls, too). I think that's why the guys in my house prefer epic poetry! I am going to challenge myself to read "Sir Gawain and the Green Knight" this month. If Tolkien liked it, maybe it will have something in it I can appreciate, too.
I agree with 4lads that this thread has been wonderful... it has challenged me to step beyond my comfort zone in so many ways and explore different poetic forms. In the process, I've found new favorites, and gained wisdom from all of you! Thank you, everyone!!!
-juliana
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
SallyT
Forum All-Star
Joined: Aug 08 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2489
|
| Posted: July 18 2011 at 2:21pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Yeah, Sir Gawain! Tolkien loved it so much he translated it (or translated it so much he loved it -- I think things may have worked in that direction for him).
What I was going to say the other night, but ran out of time, was that a little quotation by William Carlos Williams opened mental doors for me in a huge way. A grad-school professor of mine used to quote Williams as saying, "A poem is a thing made of words," though I've also seen him quoted as having said, "A poem is a large or small machine made of words."
Either way, the idea that it's a *thing,* not a sort of amorphous mist of feeling, was liberating to me both as a writer and as a reader -- if it was a large or small machine, and its parts were words, then I could look at it and see how it worked, or even play around with it.
Once, for example, when we were studying "voice" (ie point of view), that same professor had us take a poem like "Stopping By Woods on a Snowy Evening," which of course "speaks" in the first person, rewrite it in the second and third persons, and talk about how that one seemingly tiny change changed the whole poem. Or we'd try well-known poems in longer or shorter lines than the original (break up "Stopping By Woods" into tiny little haiku-like lines; write "The Red Wheelbarrow" in two or three long lines; how does this change the entire effect of the poem? speeds things up? slows things down?).
Playing around with poems this way really helps, I think, to see how even these tiny decisions, which we don't normally think about as readers, contribute to the experience of the poem -- I think "experience" is maybe even a better word than "meaning," because to read a poem is to be appealed to in terms of not only your emotions and intellect, but also your senses and your ways of making associations . . . Anyway, these games are great for seeing how the poem is made and why it's made the way it is.
I'm in the middle of reorganizing all our books -- really, taking over the study that my husband initially didn't want to call a "school room," for reasons that are kind of opaque to me now, for a homeschool library (and yes, we may actually do lessons in there, but we're not calling it a school room, no sir!). Anyway, in this process I've found another book which I really need to revisit -- A Poetry Handbook, by Mary Oliver. I haven't used it for homeschool, and I can't remember how appropriate or not it might be, but I'll give it a look-over and let you all know.
Sally
__________________
Castle in the Sea
Abandon Hopefully
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
guitarnan
Forum Moderator
Joined: Feb 07 2005
Location: Maryland
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 10883
|
| Posted: July 18 2011 at 2:53pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
This thread rocks. I am thinking of proposing a poetry study for our co-op this fall, thanks to all of these wonderful suggestions!
__________________
Nancy in MD. Mom of ds (24) & dd (18); 31-year Navy wife, move coordinator and keeper of home fires. Writer and dance mom.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
|
|
4Real Forums : High School Years and Beyond
Topic: High School Poetry
