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Tina P.
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| Posted: Oct 24 2005 at 3:11am | IP Logged
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WJFR wrote:
the kids seem to learn a lot during the down-times as well as the structured times. I think of it as taking a water break in a marathon; you're not quitting the marathon, just pacing and refreshing yourself to go better in the long run.
I always found it frustrating that my kids would seem to be fine with an academic checklist and then suddenly shut down and lose steam, but recently I've been wondering if this is just the way they are and that possibly the down-times (which I usually feel a bit guilty about) are actually helping them consolidate and move forward.
My 12yo is having a down time right now too -- he is doing daily math (key to...) and reading books I give him, and football, and that's about it. The weird thing is he is reading several full-length books a week --- solid books, from the Ambleside list and Mater Amabilis -- and that is WAY more than I would have required him to read. He also wrote a long sports story last week, and last year it was SO hard to get him to write at all. I want to get him back on more structure soon, but in the meantime, I think the pause helped him grow a bit academically and in his internal motivation.
Just a theory -- thought I'd mention it. |
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Tina, wife to one and mom to 9 + 3 in heaven
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Tina P.
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| Posted: Oct 24 2005 at 3:23am | IP Logged
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WJFR wrote:
generally, the kids seem to learn a lot during the down-times as well as the structured times. I think of it as taking a water break in a marathon; you're not quitting the marathon, just pacing and refreshing yourself to go better in the long run.
I always found it frustrating that my kids would seem to be fine with an academic checklist and then suddenly shut down and lose steam, but recently I've been wondering if this is just the way they are and that possibly the down-times (which I usually feel a bit guilty about) are actually helping them consolidate and move forward.
My 12yo is having a down time right now too -- he is doing daily math (key to...) and reading books I give him, and football, and that's about it. The weird thing is he is reading several full-length books a week --- solid books, from the Ambleside list and Mater Amabilis -- and that is WAY more than I would have required him to read. He also wrote a long sports story last week, and last year it was SO hard to get him to write at all. I want to get him back on more structure soon, but in the meantime, I think the pause helped him grow a bit academically and in his internal motivation.
Just a theory -- thought I'd mention it. |
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I couldn't agree with you more, Willa. You take a week off or do something really wild like unschool when you've been keeping a particular schedule doing certain subjects at certain times each day and what happens? The kids start figuring math problems on napkins while you're eating dinner. They sprawl all over the living room reading books that maybe you wanted to save for later because they occur later in the history that you're studying or maybe you think the books might be over their heads. And art totally flourishes when we're in easy mode. Science, outside of natural discoveries outside, suffers. I think that's one of my downfalls.  I'm not thrilled about anything but natural science and boy, does it show!
My 11 yos admitted that he doesn't like to read anything I assign. I encouraged him to read outside his little series that he likes (Beverly Cleary, Boxcar Children, and Bobbsey Twins) by asking him to read The Moffats. I had to absolutely CRAM it down his throat. "You *must* read one chapter a day," I finally told him. Once he made it past the first few chapters, he wanted to read every Moffat book we had. So frustrating! But though I was a huge reader at that age, I have only myself to blame for his stubbornness.  My next project is to get him reading Marguerite Henry books (my favorites between 9 and 14). Where do you find these book lists? Do they correspond to history? I know there's a reading your way through history site out there somewhere as well...
And he chose to write this sports story by himself? So there *is* hope for my kids regarding writing? 
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Willa
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| Posted: Oct 24 2005 at 10:27am | IP Logged
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Reading Your Way through History
Sonlight arranged by Chronological Cycles
Well, about the story, he had to read a lot of football books and sports pages too -- which don't seem that DIRECTLY educational to me, but I think that phase had its benefits
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Willa
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Willa
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| Posted: Oct 24 2005 at 1:16pm | IP Logged
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Tina, I see I didn't answer your questions
Mater Amabilis-- Catholic CM curriculum designed by our own Michele Q and Kathryn F.
Ambleside Online -- Protestant CM curriculum
Also, Suggestions towards a Curriculum -- Elizabeth Foss's "read through the year" booklist arranged thematically. (look on sidebar for the link)
The last one might be useful with your son since it sounds like he's a binge reader -- likes to settle into a genre or theme or author -- that's how that booklist is arranged 
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Willa
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Karen T
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Just thought I should post an update about ds, since I began this thread about 2 weeks ago. (i haven't had time to read the boards since then, but have received the responses by email so I've kept up with you)
He ended up taking about 10 days off and was very bored. I used that time to concentrate more heavily on my younger son, who really thrived with the extra attention! I hadn't realized how much I'd been putting him off to work with the 12 yo.
I picked up some books at the library for 12 yo, nothing terribly challenging but just some things i saw that he might enjoy. we relaxed our rules on computer/tv time for awhile and gave him more freedom with that (no internet, though, just his own games) He actually didn't go overboard with it much, but spent a lot of time outside and with friends. I did insist he do his chores each day before play but after that he was free. Finally one night on our way home from dog training class (he's taking one of our dogs while I train the other) I asked him what he thought about school and he said he knew he'd really been slacking off and he wanted to do better, promised he'd try, etc. I asked what we could change to make things work better and at first he said "nothing, it's all my fault I haven't been doing it" but when I pushed him a little he did complain about the number of problems in math (Saxon 8/7). I'd been having him do all the mixed practice b/c although he gets the new concepts right away and generally does very well, he really does have trouble doing problems from previous lessons. I had told him if he was getting them all right we'd start doing only half, but so far that hadn't happened; usually there were 5-6 out of 30. Many seem to be careless errors but i wanted him to realize that's just as bad as not knowing how to do it.
But anyway, since that seemed to be a de-motivator for him, I decided to try something else. Since then, I look over the mixed practice and circle the ones he's to do. This way, I can choose the ones I know he needs more practice on and still limit it to about 15 problems. He is so much happier and does them without complaint, usually getting most of them right.
I'm still having to push him a bit on some other things, but I've also started having us all take a walk first thing with the dogs. I think that gets him woken up better and helps him focus.
Brenda had asked if dh could take over some of the teaching, since he is home with the kids 2 days/week while I work. Unfortunately no. He could actually be quite good at it but even though he fully supports me homeschooling and thinks it's best for the kids now (complete turnaround from 2 yrs ago when I first began discussing it!) he leaves it entirely up to me. He is also not much of a disciplinarian (hates confrontations) so I don't know how much he even pushes Shane when I'm gone. I know he reminds him, etc. but he is very willing to accept whatever Shane tells him like 'it's all done, Dad" without checking. He's busy studying himself (college student) and watching the 4 and 5 yos.
Almost without fail each time I'm gone, Shane will have done only half of an assignment but told dh he was done. Tonight I was checking some Latin done on Friday (I had to work an extra day last week) and I had clearly written on his schedule " p. 23 exercise D -copy the sentences and label each part with case and number, then translate; exercise E - follow the directions" (which are in the book)
He had done D, but not copied the sentences, only written on notebook paper the case and translated. E wasn't done at all, and the paper was finally found wedged into his science book, instead of in his Latin notebook, or even his daily assignments book. When I asked him why the rest wasn't done, he said he didn't understand it so couldn't even attempt it. Exercise E was simply the reverse of D, ie translating from Eng to Latin.
I like the way some of you have discussion time and lay out what is to be done for the next day. What I have been doing is to teach him directly on MWF when I'm usually home, going over the math concept and presenting the Latin, doing science experiments with him, etc then just asking him if he has any questions about his schedule for the next day, and I've been feeling very guilty b/c I'm not here 5 days/week to actually teach him one-on-one. However, now I'm realizing that he's wanting this b/c he's been taught that way at ps (not one-on-one, but basically having info poured into him, vs. learning to find it on his own). He does do the math lessons on his own (usually I"ve looked over it to be sure it's nothing completely new - most of what we've covered has been somewhat review but he definitely needed it, and was not ready to go into Alg 1/2 yet).
He does have the whole week's schedule that I do on the weekend, and could even work ahead if he wanted (never!)
I'm starting to see some ways to re-organize things that may work better.
And, I am going to try and start tea time this week, with a specific time each day that will be the "end" of our school day, so he has a finite end in mind but also will be required to continue working (including chores and reading) until that time, not off to visit friends. I'll read aloud at tea time so hopefully it's something to look forward to.
Thanks for all the suggestions and commiserations. I'll keep you posted.
Karen T
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Tina P.
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| Posted: Oct 31 2005 at 2:45am | IP Logged
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BrendaPeter wrote:
Hi Tina,
I'm not Janet(whose post is great btw!) but I wanted to mention that we stick to a schedule & have now for several years. After they exercise (8-8:30), they know it's time to come in for prayers & Bible reading at 8:30. I find we all do very well with the same routine most days.
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I wish I *could* stick to a schedule. But right now (and practically every 18 months), I have a new baby who likes to alarm me with irregular breathing in the middle of the night.  I'm getting exhausted and need to sleep in and to sleep at some point during the day. The during-the-day sleeping occurs when my littlies read to me. Isn't that awful!?!?
When I have a baby, my whole world turns upside-down for a little while. OK, maybe for the first year. I *had* a routine between my last (who is two now) and this new baby.
What do you ladies do for the kids' exercise in inclement weather?
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amiefriedl
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Tina P. wrote:
What do you ladies do for the kids' exercise in inclement weather? |
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We do kid's exercise videos. We currently use Yogakids III, it is fun, but I'd love to find something completely w/o the slightest hint of new age thought. This video is quite tame, and has great exercise routines for the children. Still it would be nice not to have to be a tree all of the time... Check your library for videos.
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Blessed with an awesome hubby and Mom of ds10, dd7, dd3 and dd 10months.
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Willa
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My boys wrestle with each other and run up and down our rather long loft. Noisy but lets off some steam. And they like going out in rain, too. I'm afraid I'm a bit casual about noise and action in the house because we get LOTS of snow here and it gets icy and hard to play in very fast.
My daughter has a pedometer and walks laps in the house while reading. I do that too, or climb up and down the stairs for a few minutes a day.
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Willa
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ALmom
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We have a chin up bar in one of the doorways and the boys see how many they can each do. It can get a bit competitive among the close in age boys but overall builds arm strength and gets some pent up frustration out without tons of noise. Also some of the boys like to keep a running count of how many sit-ups or push-ups they can do and are encouraged when they see improvements in the number they can do in a row. I have been trying to encourage jumping rope - but unsuccessfully. We also have a table tennis table in the garage for bad weather days.
We also do Willas routine of running through the house and wrestling - much noisier.
We do have a lot less inclement weather days as we don't worry about running in the rain and we are in the south, etc. so it's really only T-storm days (which are mostly summer). Not sure how I'd cope with months on end of bad weather.
Janet
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Rachel May
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One year the kids grouped their toys'r'us gift certificates from Christmas and bought a bounce house ($120 on sale). It's 5'5" by 5'5" and fits in our living room since all our money goes towards feeding/clothing/educating kids and not furniture.  When the boys get very wild, jumping is a great activity.
I like the yoga video idea too. The kids do my pregnancy yoga DVD with me.
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Sarah
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ALmom wrote:
We have a chin up bar in one of the doorways and the boys see how many they can each do.
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Could you tell me more about chin-ups and pull-ups. My son can do neither and he's very athletic. We tried to do them on top of the swingset but I think the bar is too thick. I don't really know how to go about teaching him this. He feels bad he can't do it. I think I'm going about it wrong. Do they stand on a chair? (Okay ladies, so I hid in the showers during PE class in school and missed it!!)  I'm lacking some basic athletic skills.
What else do people do for exercise in the winter? Especially when you have three very little ones in tow. Laps around the backyard?
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ALmom
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My husband taught the boys to climb up the door jamb with their feet (or use a chair for less damage to the door jamb) and then starting on top of the bar, they let themselves down as slowly as possible - holding the position of the chin above the bar as long as possible. When that is very controlled, they can begin pull ups. The ones with the palms facing you are easier and palms away are harder. It takes a while to be able to do even 1, but then when you get it, it's great(or so I'm told - I haven't progressed to that point yet but my stomach muscles are completely stretched out after an 11 pound baby).
You can get a description from somewhere on all the activities from the Presidential Physical Fitness program (Instructions for the President's Challenge Test Items). I'm not sure where as our copy was given to us by a dad that organized a program so our children could try to place. (Our family is decidedly unathletic so we never actually reached our goals - but we're still striving). It helped the boys that mom tried as they can easily do it better than me - I still haven't got the controlled down thing. They also list 2 different sets of standards for boys and girls from age 6 - 17 (ie how many curl-ups, time on a mile and a shuttle run, how many pull-ups and how far they should be able to reach in a v-sit. Descriptions on how to do all these are included in the instructions.
My dh got the bars at a local store (Wal-Mart?, Home Depot or Lowes or somewhere like that) I don't think we saw it at an athletic store - but it is worth a try. It was under $10 at the time, has a bracket to screw into each side of the door jamb and a fairly thin bar that fits in these brackets (you can then take it out when you don't want to have to duck going in and out of a room). It's a little bit thinner than a shower curtain rod. Our children always try gymnastics and flips around it along with a home made balance beam, so we did have to set some rules like 1 person at a time. When not in use for chin ups, I use it to hang up my ironing/laundry. It was strong enough to hold my dh so it lasts forever - just if they get real wild we sometimes have to repair the jamb and move the bracket up or down (hasn't happened but once when we had 4 dc on it at the same time doing running starts). It's expandable so should fit any house door that has the framing around it - other than sliding glass doors. We've had a few falls and mom/sibling has to help toddlers (spotter) so they don't land on their head.
Hope this helps some.
Janet
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ALmom
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Forgot to mention, tell your son not to feel badly. This is one area that even the really athletic boys (unless they are into gymnastics) have to really work at to get. Most sports don't really develop this upper arm strength naturally.
Also I had to laugh at your description of yourself - that could have been me - only I was the one that frightened the teacher to death because I always had my nose in a book and had figured out how to walk up and down the stairs of our PE bus (we were bused from the school to the sports fields on Kwajalein) without even looking up from my book and kept my nose in that book until the last moment when I could no longer avoid the inevitable PE moment (I always struck out, missed the fly ball, etc. - the only thing I could do reasonably well was soccer dribbling and stealing, I was never intimidated by the other kids because I never saw them - so they decided to make me goalie which lasted about 1 game. I missed every single ball that came at me - wasn't even close, I never saw it.) I can laugh now but boy was PE miserable, and I couldn't even play an instrument to get out of PE in high school. 
First date with dh was to play tennis (I really liked him so I couldn't turn it down, but warned him I was no good)I spent the entire time chasing his balls - even the easy, right to me ones. Second date was bowling (I am notorious for dropping bowling balls backwards which I did manage to do). I told him the same thing this time. He figured out then that I wasn't just trying to be nice - when I said I was no good at something, I really was. The rest of our dates were me watching him run, or nature walks or dinner out.
After we were married, he figured he could teach me table tennis (his big sport). He did get me where I could return smashes (by standing way, way back) but never could figure out why I couldn't return spins even with his expert coaching and kept telling me to watch the line or something on the ball. Finally, I blurted - I don't know what line you are talking about, when I hit the ball, I don't even see the ball, I just anticipate. Anyways, for his sake I did do one tournament with him (came in 2nd out of 3 women because the first person I played kept hitting smashes and getting frustrated, the next person I played had figured it out and gave me all curves so I never returned a ball in that one. It was a quick loss. Kind of funny - sorry to diverge way off subject. Glad to know that I'm not the only one out there.
Janet
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Sarah
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| Posted: Nov 06 2005 at 8:08pm | IP Logged
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Thanks for the info, Janet, I'm going to get one of those bars and check the President's fitness thing. That was very helpful to know. I needed some direction here. Also, I loved your story about your husband and you. That was great. Thanks for sharing.
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4Real Forums : Living Learning
Topic: No self motivation
