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Leonie
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I really think, Julie, that the whole university system here in Australia must be very different to that in the US.
The first year of university for my older three sons meant that they did not have to pick a major but could experiment and try classes that interested them. Sure, they have to pay for these classes but the picking what you love approach has meant that the transition was easier than expected.
Now, in the second years, majors were often chosen ( or changed! lol!) and more pre-requisite subjects were required before they could get into certain classes. Some of this is where they have learned to "suck it up" and do the not-so-liked course in order to reach their goals. But the first year of being introduced to someone else's time schedule meant that study habits learned then, in courses of passion, have helped with the application to other courses.
I used to say that college/university wasn't necessary - and it still isn't. However, I will be completely honest and also say that both dh and I enjoyed our study and dh has gone onto more post grad stuff ( study I hope to get to over the next few years). I think that we, perhaps unconsciously, sent the message that university was important.That we value it. Therefore, my ds have always talked about "when they study at university."
Jonathon (16) did two classes last semester. He is younger than the majority of students. He chose two courses as part of a liberal arts degreeee - Film Art ; Creative and Professional Writing. He received Distinctions and High Distinctions.
But this was the first time he has ever experienced studying a set course, with deadlines and assignments. Yes, I suggested he give it a go and that he might want to try university. If he had said no, there was no pressure - he is only sixteen.
He chose the courses that suit his passions. And,yes, at the start of the semester we talked together and I showed him how I would organize my study schedule if I was him.He also read "No Regrets" by Alexandra Swann and she wrote about her early university study experiences and schedule. He read "The Day I Became An Auotdidact" by Hilary Kendall and that gave him inspiration. He gradually developed his own ideas and method.
He is choosing not to study this semester. He wants to concentrate on his art and he saw how he had less time for this with the university study.
He *is only 16. You can defer a semster or a year or two here in Australia. He can enrol again next year. However, I guess what is more to the point, is that he developed his study skills through need and mentoring and motivation - actually studying courses that he wanted to study.
Does this make any sense? 
Leonie in Sydney
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juliecinci
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Your system sure does sound different, Leonie. Can I send my kids to Australia?
In the states, you have to go through admissions as a freshman and the requirements for the application process are rigourous (if you want to go to a competitive school, forget about it!).
The Christian liberal arts schools seem the most flexible for admissions (ironically since they are pretty rigid in how they run their schools). State schools and Catholic institutions are much more "this is how it's done" and expect that they will be able to recognize the transcript and the coursework.
Boston College told me that my daughter would need all the SAT IIs for every subject to prove that she had really studied the course work... and this is a kid who is part time enrolled in high school!
So I've had to think about whether or not these kids want college and where they want to go.
Not easy.
I sent you a p.m. I don't mean to hog this space with my concerns.
Julie
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Julie
Homeschooling five for fourteen years
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Willa
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Karen E. wrote:
| I hope to instill in my children the belief that some things, no matter how distasteful, are worth doing out of love. Love -- for God and others -- is the answer to "Why?" and "What for?" When I lose sight of that, I lose sight of how to approach my children's education. |
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Karen, you should never hesitate to hit "post"
That's great and I'm going to add it to my little collection of things to think about.
It's true that if I could get ONE thing I could ask for in my kids' education, that would be it. The rest would come by itself. It encompasses an illiterate Maria Goretti and a Thomas Aquinas, and everyone else on the continuum.
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Willa
hsing boys ages 11, 14, almost 18 (+ 4 homeschool grads ages 20 to 27)
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Genevieve
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Julie,
Please do share your concerns for college. I'm interested in knowing. I grew up in Singapore and took the British "A" level exams and the SATs I and II. College is a long way off but at the same time I don't want to limit my children's choices. I honestly haven't explored how homeschooler apply for college but you have perked my interests.
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Genevieve
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Cindy
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Leonie wrote:
Talking of a full course of study - I look back at our years of homeschooling and unschooling and see that we did study full courses, but not in the traditional sense. It may be some time this season on history, then watching a related film next year, then writing an essay on a history topic for an essay competition. All in all, over time, we saw a full course of study. The "completion" or closure has come when studying for university entrance and university examinations.
Leonie in Sydney |
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I had this described to me as "organic" learning, as opposed to linear. You can get into an area for a bit, leave it alone, come back to it months or years later and the brain will remember and experience will grow on top of experience.
I have found this type of learning to be more real, less artificial and fuller than linear planned coursework.
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Cindy in Texas
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Cindy
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Leonie wrote:
I really think, Julie, that the whole university system here in Australia must be very different to that in the US.
The first year of university for my older three sons meant that they did not have to pick a major but could experiment and try classes that interested them. Sure, they have to pay for these classes but the picking what you love approach has meant that the transition was easier than expected.
Leonie in Sydney |
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Hum... this sounds like how it was in the US when I went to college. From what I have heard it is pretty similar today.... (from the admissions people I have talked to and online requirements I have looked at... and the kids I know who have gone into college- state schools at least)
I must be missing something! Are US universities requiring students to decide on a major in the first year? For example, my neighbor's dd is going to Purdue and in the Business school but taking first year courses and is not locked into the major.. my niece is doing similar first year work at U Texas...
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Cindy in Texas
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juliecinci
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They don't require you to pick a major during the first year, but they do limit you to general education. You can't do cool upper division courses until you are a declared major.
If you do switch majors, it can cost you more money to make up the time lost and the courses that don't apply...
The biggest difference with European schools, for instance, is admissions. (I don't know much about Australia but know Europe through my aunt in Italy and my time in France in university.) The game here is so much more complex. One state school we're looking at requires that we show evidence that the superintendent excused our daughter from compulsory enrollment as a homeschooler. Xavier admissions told us that we needed to bring the text books with us to the interview and show that our son had actually done all the work in the textbooks. I can't really believe it would come to that, but that is what I was told in person while at an admissions meeting for parents.
Frustrating.
Julie
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Julie
Homeschooling five for fourteen years
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juliecinci
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Oh and Cindy, let me clarify something.
One of the difficulties I've run into in several colleges is that they don't allow students to be in special student status. They see that as trying to get around the admissions process. So, for instance, they want your child to be fully enrolled as a degree-seeking freshman.
We were able to get around that at Xavier (after many, many phone calls and a little begging  ) with our oldest mostly because my husband teaches there. But they made a HUGE deal out of the fact that his participation as a special student will not make it easier for him to enter as a freshman - he'd still need to go through the freshman admissions process for next fall, for example.
I've found that to be true about the local colleges here (haven't checked with others since they would be too far to commute to).
So it wouldn't work, then, to apply to the school as a degree-seeking student and then only take a course or two for the first semester. You'd have to take the minimum full-time student load and keep going to retain your full-time student status. (Unlike Australia where her son can take a course or two, stop for a semester and then start up again).
Junior colleges may be more lenient but in Ohio, they are not cheaper and require a GED.
Julie
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Julie
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Karen E.
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WJFR wrote:
Karen E. wrote:
| I hope to instill in my children the belief that some things, no matter how distasteful, are worth doing out of love. Love -- for God and others -- is the answer to "Why?" and "What for?" When I lose sight of that, I lose sight of how to approach my children's education. |
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Karen, you should never hesitate to hit "post"
That's great and I'm going to add it to my little collection of things to think about. |
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Actually, Willa, I felt that I was just echoing and restating your thoughts when you wrote:
WJFR wrote:
If I tried to absolutely codify what has worked in the past, it would be ideological. The problem is that a system or ideology is in some ways more efficient than a method or transformation. Once we put aside questions of WHY? and WHAT FOR? we can accomplish more superficially-- like Martha as opposed to Mary. But then we may be accomplishing the wrong things, working against our true purposes. |
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So, you had already hatched the thought worth thinking about. 
WJFR wrote:
| It's true that if I could get ONE thing I could ask for in my kids' education, that would be it. The rest would come by itself. It encompasses an illiterate Maria Goretti and a Thomas Aquinas, and everyone else on the continuum. |
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Oh, yes, I think so, too. Beautifully stated.
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God bless,
Karen E.
mom to three on earth, and several souls in God's care
Visit my blog, with its shockingly clever title, "Karen Edmisten."
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Leonie
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Julie,
I found that there were ways around the usual admissions for many universities - and private universities , like Notre Dame in Perth,Australia, were especially open. Keep on trying was my motto!
There are also ways to do Open University here and use those credits to apply to the university you want to attend. A homeschooled girl, a friend, did that here and got accepted into medicine - very competitive. Can you find something similar in the US? What about the Swanns book - any helpful ideas?
In Australia, there is also a special admissions examination for "mature age entrants" - age 20 plus! Are there special pathways like this inn the US - a kid can travel and work before doing the university thing.
Yes, changing majors ( as my son Nicholas has done) or taking a circuitous route ( deferring as J is doing right now or doing the STAT - mature entry) takes longer and costs more - but in the long term, it can be well worth the monetary cost for that individual.
Two of my older sons are doing law, as their second degree. Law is competitive, but because they already had a Bachelor of Arts, the university did not ask about high school study.
I am just throwing out ideas that I know are relevant to Australia but may offer some help for research for college study in the US.
BTW Cindy, I think you are enrolled with Clonlara? Can you share how they help with college admissions?
Leonie in Sydney
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Cindy
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juliecinci wrote:
They don't require you to pick a major during the first year, but they do limit you to general education. You can't do cool upper division courses until you are a declared major.
If you do switch majors, it can cost you more money to make up the time lost and the courses that don't apply...
The biggest difference with European schools, for instance, is admissions. (I don't know much about Australia but know Europe through my aunt in Italy and my time in France in university.) The game here is so much more complex. One state school we're looking at requires that we show evidence that the superintendent excused our daughter from compulsory enrollment as a homeschooler. Xavier admissions told us that we needed to bring the text books with us to the interview and show that our son had actually done all the work in the textbooks. I can't really believe it would come to that, but that is what I was told in person while at an admissions meeting for parents.
Frustrating.
Julie |
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The undergrad courses don't sound that different from when I went to school... you take general courses the first year and narrow it down as you progress. I was not able to take the cool courses either, until later years, except that I in Archeteture( my first of sevearal majors) , but most of my classes were general enough I could apply to other majors.
As I progressed and found what I liked I ended up with a major different than I started.
Those students who have an idea of what they want to do can get through early, those who don't will take longer and waste some time and money. I wonder if things have appreciatively changed since decades ago when I went to college?
I also wonder if there are colleges that are more "homeschool friendly". That is what I keep hearing, esp for a student who has not had the typical college prep background. I wonder if you are running into non-friendly colleges or if this is really a misnomer?
I can see why they may not like students to have special status... but be an enrolled freshman. My thought would be to do the onesie twosie courses through distance or community college and hopefully be able to apply them to future 4 year degrees. I know the state schools in Texas will give you a list of what community college courses they will accept as credit.
Julie, is taking one or two classes important for you? Or were you just making that comparsion to Austrailia. I had never thought of that with the 4 year schools.. neat idea. Maybe we should lobby!
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Cindy in Texas
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Leonie, thanks for the good ideas to consider. I'm too busy for a good reply!
Cindy, you are right that some of the ones I mentioned are less homeschool friendly - like the Jesuit schools! They are friendly on the phone for sure and welcoming of homeschoolers. But they want what looks like a curricula to verify that the education took place which is harder with unschooling. Boston College wouldn't even accept the literature/writing work we'd done with him without a text to verify it (and we're writing instructors and dh is a uni prof!).
I think we may just have to go one of two routes for my oldest:
Parttime enrollment through X this fall and then if he wants more, he can go to a community college. Or, wait until he's 22 and then he can do the adult degree programs that are one course at a time, on the weekends or at night. He likes that idea but they won't let him in at 18. (Much cheaper too.)
Leonie, thanks for the reminder to get him into something non-traditional in the meantime. I do keep forgetting about that option. Yes, good idea.
Sigh.
Off to write a syllabus for a course I'm teaching at co-op starting tomorrow.
Julie
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Cindy
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Leonie wrote:
Julie,
BTW Cindy, I think you are enrolled with Clonlara? Can you share how they help with college admissions?
Leonie in Sydney
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Hi Leonie-
The general thrust of what Clonlara says is to help your child focus on their interests and create a transcript as much as possible from the real learning that takes place naturally. But, also keep an eye out for the future 'tickets' that the world will need to see for him/her to follow their goals.
(this is my assessment of Clonlara so far...still learning...)
Pat Farenga said this at an unschool conference I recently attended...
"Don't sacrifice your relationship with your children on the alter of academics."
I think Clonlara would agree with that.
Part of that relationship is to give your child all the info on college, work and future options that you can, let them know the choices as early as possible for each child, so they can take their education into their own hands. Then, if they see they will need a 'ticket' (such as the SAT for college, or foreign language, etc) they might have the internal motiviation to achieve those when they are ready.
This avoids the situation Julie mentioned where we require something such as Math that the child is not ready for or doesn't see a need for yet. We all know how much better kids learn if they are doing it for their own internal, not external reasons.
Clonlara says, like many others, to begin to research early. Know what colleges might fit your child and which are homeschool-friendly. I also have heard it said that we need to realize that we are paying *them*, the colleges, money- in essense we are interviewing them, and we are their customers. Sometimes it seems that we are so eager to get into colleges the relationsihp is ill-balanced.
Know prospective colleges' requirements and share the info with your kids and get them involved as much as possible.
A quandry for me is how much we need to help the child that has no vision for college... do we wait until they are ready to face the requirments additional to their pasions and they play catch up? Or do we require external subjects early on so they won't have such a hill to climb at the end?
Along this line,I met a very articulate and intelligent 16yo girl at the conference. We chatted for a while and she had 'radically' unschooled her whole life. Now her family is moving to MA and she wants to attend Smith College. She has a lot of catch up work to do, but is really fired up! I have no doubt she will do it all- because she has her personal sights set!
Her mom trusted her to follow her passion and take her education upon herself. I think that might be contributing to her self assurance that she can do it now.
But, all children are different. I guess that is where relationship comes in and knowing your child. Some kids might prefer to hedge their bets and study now. Others might prefer to catch up later. I think it takes a lot of trust in our children and prayer, too, and believing that they themselves and God have as strong or stronger role than we do. But, we have a vital role and mentor and faciliator, too.
I am still working on this in our house...so this conversation is very interesting.
From hearing about what others have dealt with with colleges and from the beginning research I have done here in Texas, I think requirements for college admission is a very variable situation. I read articles all the time like this one
http://www.homeschool.com/articles/CollegesWantYou
that tell us that if you pick the right college they will be thrilled to have a homeschooler with a non-traditional transcript and probably won't care about the SATs or at least not the SATIIs.
But then we haven't actually tried to get into a college yet.
The above is pretty much Clonlara's opionion, I think. They are expert at crafting a transcript and have an impressive list of colleges their 'graduates' have been admitted to.
Hope this answers the question....
Oh, - re-reading your question...
They will put together the transcript and be heavily involved with the actual admissions process. I have not talked with them much about that phase, but will post when I do.
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Cindy in Texas
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Willa
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Leonie wrote:
| WRT, character issues, I feel that unschooling addresses these *more often* for my dc. I am more able to talk to a son about an issue and work with him when I am not pushing lesson plans. |
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That's what I was thinking last week. Suddenly I have more space to really address things like study skills, self-discipline etc without worrying so much about pushing through X amount of work. That is, if I don't get lazy and lose my focus : )
Leonie wrote:
| Talking of a full course of study - I look back at our years of homeschooling and unschooling and see that we did study full courses, but not in the traditional sense. It may be some time this season on history, then watching a related film next year, then writing an essay on a history topic for an essay competition. All in all, over time, we saw a full course of study. The "completion" or closure has come when studying for university entrance and university examinations. |
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This is similar to what I read in an unschooling article about how learning is like a jigsaw puzzle, and though we may tend to learn in clusters or connections, we don't always learn best in straight sequential fashion.
I too see that my children acquire a full course of study over time. There are some subjects we revisit again and again, each time deepening our understanding. Since you mentioned LW&W, I've revisited that one so many times during the years -- first my mom reading them to me, then me reading them myself, then me reading to various children, and now the older children listen in on the latest read-through and pick up the book again for themselves. Over time, that's a lot of foundation for religion, philosophy, psychology, creativity, lit appreciation, you name it. ANd that's just one example.
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Willa
hsing boys ages 11, 14, almost 18 (+ 4 homeschool grads ages 20 to 27)
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Laura
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I noticed that this thread started heading in the direction of "getting into college". I had posted on home schooling on your own through high school in another thread and I thought I would cut and copy one question regarding record keeping in high school that I asked.
I KNOW that I could do it on my own, but I haven't yet!
When I think of all the money that we could save and also the post above about all the missed opportunities in character development because of "pushing lesson plans" it makes me really want to spend time pondering this now before my son enters high school next year.
Anyway I am babbling as usual. Here is my question:
Mary G. wrote:
Laura:
Cafi Cohen's book, And What About College is a big help too. As is her earlier book, Homeschooling the High School Years (or some similar title)....
Blessings -- and keep praying (esp thru the high school years
What about A Home-Designed Form-U-La by Barb Shelton?
Does anyone have a review of this book?
I would like to know which would be a better purchase for my buck!
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JMJ,
Laura
wife to Ken and mom to 8 blessings with #9 due July 26,2009
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Leonie
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Laura,
I am not much help with the college thing, because of my location . 
But I wanted to clarify my thought above. Like Willa, I find more time, via unschool-ishness, to be with my dc and to work on issues, like character, that sometimes seem extraneous when I am focusing on "school".
However, I do not mean to imply that homeschoolers using more formal methods of education don't work on these issues! It is *my experience in *my situation that allows me to say " *I can work more on character issues when not following lesson plans."
I hope I didn't offend anybody!
Leonie in Sydney
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Laura
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Leonie,
I am sure that you did not offend anyone, most especially not me! 
I agree with what you and Willa wrote.
I get very caught up in staying on track. It is both a blessing and a burden. The blessing being that we always "finish" our school year on schedule, the burden being that we never ever go on those lovely "rabbit trails" that you all speak of because, "hey, how would we stay on schedule that way?"
Hum, it does not take a rocket scientist to see that I am missing out on many many wonderful moments with my children, but hey we are on schedule???!!!
I really missed all of you ladies while I was off-line and staying on schedule.... 
I am always inspired by you all.
Now, if only I can learn a little more self control and set the timer for how long I spend reading these posts because they are messing up my schedule! 
See how I go round and round?
How do I get off this crazy carousel?!
__________________
JMJ,
Laura
wife to Ken and mom to 8 blessings with #9 due July 26,2009
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tovlo4801
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Wow! Thanks for all these insightful posts.
I've been struggling to define who we are as homeschoolers ever since we started. Lately I've felt that schizophrenia Karen described. I've noticed people's expressions getting more and more confused at my answers while I've moved from classical, to classical unit-study, to CM, to relaxed CM, to unschooling, to "oh, I don't even know anymore!" over the course of our two years of school.
I've decided after reading these posts, that I'm just homeschooling. I'm resolved to stop trying to find a perfect label for what we do. As soon as I say we're doing CM, or classical, or unschooling, I find myself feeling tied to every aspect of that particular method, even those that don't meet the WHY and WHAT FOR test in our family.
I've rejected some things I've tried and moved to other things that seem to fit our families needs better. Each move, I've abandoned things that really did work because the category as a whole didn't fit. I've been looking for a schooling category "home". This discussion clarified for me that this is a mistaken journey.
I love what Leonie said about guiding and God and free choice. I've struggled to put that into words for over a year. God does not force. He presents truth in various ways, but it is always a free choice on our part to accept it or reject it. He is a gentle guide. I tend toward an authoritative kind of parenting. Unschooling helps me step back and be more Christlike with my kids. It helps me be a guide and not a dictator forcing things that can only be free accepted and rejected.
Classical education as I've experienced it plays way too much into my negative tendencies. It tempts me to plan out much too much to be acomplished for questionable reasons and burn out any love of education for my kids. Yet the truth is there is so much value to classical education. I can't let it go. I've seen in the hands of parents with different temperments than mine it can be a wonderful path. I just need to temper it with a more relaxed perspective. It won't be true classical education. It also won't be true unschooling because I'll be directing some things. Charlotte Mason seems to blend well the things in classical that I love with a more relaxed presentation and freedom for the children to accept or reject what they have been given, but even this is not exactly perfect for our needs.
I say this all the time, but I really mean it. I am so glad that the home of "Real Learning" exists. It seems to be the one place I've found that is comfortable taking us where we are and helping us to grow into whatever we are meant to become without asking us to conform to a set of rules that perhaps don't make sense for our particular family. Here I can receive support for all the various pieces that make up our homeschool. Here I can explore that constant transformation without feeling that I have to abandon everything as our perspective changes. I'd love to see a category here to discuss classical education. Just as I love the way people here approach unschooling, I suspect the approach found here toward classical education would be very supportive. I would definitely benefit from that discussion.
God Bless you all! Thank you so much for working out your own struggles here and reaching out a helping hand to others as you make your way. I learn so much from all of you.
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Cindy
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| Posted: Sept 13 2005 at 8:41am | IP Logged
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Hi all-
To add a little more about Clonlara.. I was reading the high schcool packet of articles last night and one of them stressed to Clonlara students not to present yourself as a homeschooler but instead as a student of Clonlara Private School. In the article (written when?) she stressed that even if you are very proud of your homeschool journey, to use the Clonlara name instead, as it will get you around a lot of the hurdles with colleges. That tells me they must have encountered difficulties, or maybe it is just a selling point of the school. I know of lots of homeschoolers who have gotton into college with out problems.
I am still a neophyte in this college thing, so may re-think my phone calls I'm about to make to local colleges and how I present myself.
Perhaps that is a big draw of Clonlara? I am new there so don't know, but will ask next time I call.
I did a little more digging into local colleges last night, something I have on my list to do.
We are in Texas and at this point I don't see my kids wanting to go far away for college. So I looked into Collegeboard and did some searches on likely candidates.
I found some interesting things... such as agreements between our local community college system and some selected four year universities in the region where you can have a dual enrollemnt. You can take courses at the community college and they will automatcally go toward the 4 year when you decide to go there.
Just something I had not seen before.. may be in other areas, too, if that is of interest.
I can see why they say to research early. You are right, Julie, the system is complex and seems very regional. I am looking for options for kids who do not test well and for which the SAT will be a hurdle, esp in math. The community college to 4 year university looks like a viable option to get around the test scores if necessary.
I am thinking that doing some research now might open up door for the boys when college looms closer. I typed out some ideas below. Is this a good game plan for those who have done this college thing?
-Start researching early (like Freshman year)
-Find some possible colleges based on regions, potiential interests, philosophy, etc to make a short list
-Look at their websites and begin a dialog with the guidance counsellors
-Determine what areas they are hard and fast on and which they are more flexible
-Find out what their transfer credit policy is
-See if they have any summer programs for teens, or summer only study plans with transferable credits
I am thinking if we begin researching we will have some possible paths marked out and know what it would generally take to get to each one.
Then, keep the dialog open with your child. I liked hearing about Leonie's journey with J--- suggesting he try a course, no pressure, letting his study what he liked and pick up the college experience gradually. And letting the kids see the various options available to them.
To have the college experience be a natural continuation of the homeschool learning experience would be so nice! Online courses might be nice introduction to arranging scheudules and meeting others' demands. We have had an intro with Bravewriter courses- our only outside courses so far. Even though the demands are light, it is a nice way for kids to get introduced to an outside schedule.
(Should I post this under a new topic.. like Unschooling to college?)
Any thoughts?
__________________
Cindy in Texas
It Is About The Journey
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Willa
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Joined: Jan 28 2005
Location: California
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3881
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| Posted: Sept 13 2005 at 11:29am | IP Logged
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tovlo4801 wrote:
Yet the truth is there is so much value to classical education. I can't let it go. I've seen in the hands of parents with different temperments than mine it can be a wonderful path. I just need to temper it with a more relaxed perspective. It won't be true classical education.
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Richelle,
No matter what my family does this year in our homeschool, I am not giving up my classical ed ideals in the least. In fact, one of the benefits of these ongoing unschooling discussions, for me, has been to clarify that issue for me. Ugh, let me try to explain.
Y'all know I started homeschooling because I read John Holt, Raymond Moore etc.... I had a perfectly horrible time in school all through 13 years (college was substantially better...) so the last thing I wanted to do was suffer through many more years of school through my children. Unschooling was to me what I had done OUTSIDE of the school walls all my life. I wanted to give my kids that freedom.
However, classical education gave both dh and I an ideal -- it was what we wanted for our kids. Never the drill & kill or the "rigor" (always reminds me of rigor mortis ) but just the idea of teaching the "tools" of learning and the great books and Ideas.
When our family periodically "fell" into periods of unschooling it was usually because of life events -- several very difficult pregnancies, medical incidents etc. I called it 'default unschool' and it saved me from the kind of intense burnout that I see some others going through, but it made me feel a bit guilty.
Homeschooling with Gentleness was like a lightbulb to me -- you mean you can unschool even though you want your kids to be able to go to a college like TAC if they desire to? You mean you can unschool and follow the Little Way? So all this has helped me better integrate two philosophies that seemed superficially contradictory.
If you say that what you do won't be "true classical education" then you have to think about "what IS true classical education?" No, YOU don't have to Richelle -- I'm not giving you an assignment. But what I've seen in reading the educational writings of the ancients and the historical Catholics (which IS the real classical tradition) is that they have AT LEAST as much in common with unschooling as they do with what is now called Classical Education.
But of course, there are permutations -- which are fun to endlessly discuss. I've been rereading the Kolbe manual Ignatian Education and it's making a lot of sense to me in light of what we've been discussing on here...
I'd love to see a classical education board on here
__________________
AMDG
Willa
hsing boys ages 11, 14, almost 18 (+ 4 homeschool grads ages 20 to 27)
Take Up and Read
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4Real Forums : Living Learning
Topic: Unschooling and Self-Direction
