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KauaiCatholic
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| Posted: April 30 2009 at 3:45pm | IP Logged
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my ds has dyslexic tendencies but I've been trying to work through them on our own, due in part to the fact that I have no idea where to go for help (live on a small, rural, resource-scarce island) and also that I had been in denial  . after reading the replies to the "it's official" post, I realize I am being ridiculous. I hope I haven't hurt his progress by not seeking help sooner. 
but I am overwhelmed by all the online info, and am wondering what you wise women would suggest in regards to being tested. is it worth it, assuming I can find it? is this something that CAN be handled "in house," or do I need a professional? BTW, I did get his vision tested and that's fine.
FWIW, he's 7 1/2 but we just finished the Bob Books and are starting Level 1 readers. about the time he finally stopped letter reversing, he began "sound" reversing. he is continually stumped by sight words (which I learned in these postings is common with dyslexia) and often is stymied by words he worked through 2 pages earlier. on the other hand, he has made great progress (used to break into tears; now he is very proud of finally being able to read), and often surprises me with the harder words he can handle just fine. so I'm wondering: should I just continue to be patient and keep trying to muscle through this on our own? or am I making things unnecessarily hard on us both?
hmmm ... I may have just answered my own question.  but I am curious what other people's experience has been. do you test or not?
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Kathryn
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Hello,
I'm new too but wanted to respond because my DS almost age 9 sounds similar to your son. We completed a big ole long questionnaire format that required input from us as well as his school teacher (he's currently schooled at our Catholic school but we're HS next year). This questionnaire was sent to a place that does dyslexia testing as well as help for those w/ dyslexia. He had the tendencies you describe (letter reversal, simple sight word problems etc.) I read sooo much I was convinced he must be dyslexic. Apparently there are specific traits to dyslexia and if the children don't have those specific "things" it's probably something else. So, after all the questionnaire, they decided he is prob. not dyslexic and we have seen improvement over the past year. So, at this time, we haven't done any further testing. He tends to have more ADD type issues but we haven't moved into that realm either. I'm hoping once we're HSing that I can get a better feel for what's happening when he's not in a class with 25 other little personalities and homework to boot at the end of a 7 hour day!!
Anyway, sorry so long and I hope this helps but I completely understand about feeling like you might be hurting his progress by NOT testing but then I think many kids (esp. boys) tend to mature later and it's not unusual at 7 1/2 for him to still be having some of the issues you're describing. BUT, I would love to hear from the other experienced moms w/ older kiddos too.
Hope that helps,
:-)
Kathryn
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KauaiCatholic
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| Posted: April 30 2009 at 5:04pm | IP Logged
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thank you for the encouragement! after I posted this I was chastising myself even more; sounds so much worse when it's all written out. now it occurs to me that my growing anxiety is being heightened by his little sister (3 and reading on her own) so thanks for the reminder about boys' maturity ... 
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melanie
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Hi there,
My daughter is dyslexic. I could write a ton on it, lol, but here's the gist...
--You haven't damaged anything. My daughter wasn't diagnosed until the end of 4th grade. They can't do anything to fix it, you know? When my daughter was diagnosed, it wasn't a big surprise, but we really didn't change anything we had already been doing school-wise because of the diagnosis. I even called the person in charge of special education for our school district and asked what kind of services she would get if she were in public school...individual tutoring. You know, like she already gets all day at home?  That was it.
--I did get vision therapy for her. That helped tremendously. It didn't fix the dyslexia by any means, but it did help reading become easier for her. She reads quite easily now, and above grade level. Now spelling, on the other hand...yikes. I'm not sure if vision therapy is an option for you. I hear some school districts provide it, and it he school district provides it then, in the USA anyway, homeschoolers are also entitled to it. But ours didn't. We had to pay for it privately, and it wasn't cheap, and we are not wealthy. It hurt, and I was afraid it wouldn't be worth it, but it was. Just my experience.
--Other than that? Use a good phonetic spelling and reading program, and progress at their own pace. It's an art form, to learn the balance of pulling them along in areas that they don't like without stressing them out too much. We use Phonetic Zoo for spelling. We used Phonics Pathways to teach reading when she was younger. I let her use lots and lots of audiobooks and she loves them, but she still will rarely read voluntarily. I do require some reading each day though.
Ok, I have a 4yo climbing me again. I'm glad to answer any more questions about our experience though. Mostly I just wanted to say not to worry about having caused any harm. You are doing just what he needs, whatever the official diagnosis, by providing individualized teaching.
__________________
Melanie
homeschooling Maria (13yo), Kain (10yo), Jack (5yo), Tess (2yo), and our newest blessing, Henry Robert, born 4/23!
slightlycrunchycatholic.blogspot.com
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Tami
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I don't have time at the moment to completely read the other posts, bu to echo the others, no , you haven't done him a disservice. At all. Usually, around age 8 or 3rd grade is typically the earliest for testing for a LD like this, because before that a child's struggles can just be immaturity, iyknwim. Esp. with a boy.
It does sound like you're onto something with him, though.
Have you inquired at your local ps for what services they offer? They should be able to provide testing for you, (if I understand the law correctly) and you truly want it. Lots of moms hs dyslexic children, so it can be done.
Ok, have to run. I'm sure you'll get wealth of resources from these women here.
__________________
God bless,
Tami
When we are crushed like grapes, we cannot think of the wine we will become. (Nouwen)
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ElizLeone
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We had my son tested as a six-year-old because his deficits were so severe in so many areas. We were just trying to sort out what was going on. (He was oxygen-deprived during a serious illness as an infant which may have caused or exacerbated some of the learning disabilities which he seems to have.)
I would not necessarily discourage testing. It was a good thing for us to know what we were dealing with. But I would not do it again through a private educational psychologist (hugely pricey out-of-pocket). And depending on your state, I'd use caution with ps testing... In my state, dyslexia is not officially recognized by the public school system, and all the kids just get lumped as learning disabled. Not very helpful. It might be different though in your state.
My recommendation, if you decide to pursue testing, is to have it done informally (sometimes for free) by a private tutor who specializes in dyslexia tutoring using Orton-Gillingham or another multi-sensory phonics method. This type of a tutor will be able to easily spot dyslexia and give you advice. In our case, we found our tutor after we had our son tested by the private psychologist. I regret we didn't just have the tutor help us figure it out from the beginning. It would have saved us a lot of money, and we would have avoided some of the psychologist's tests that I didn't like -- an IQ test, for example.
Do stick with phonics. A multi-sensory method such as Orton-Gillingham has been proven to work with even the most severe dyslexics. Two years ago, I was told my son would never read. Now he's reading at an average first grade level. (He's second-grade age.) He's made real progress with the intensive phonics approach and tons of one-on-one time (with me and with the tutor).
Our "severely dyslexic" son, now eight, goes to his reading tutor two afternoons a week. This gives him the uninterrupted, quiet time that is so essential for him to be able to concentrate and which is in such short supply in our busy house.
Between tutoring and some good phonics-intensive programs at home, we're seeing real progress. And the intensive phonics is great for all my quick-to-read kids too! :)
Hope this helps!
__________________
Elizabeth in Wisconsin
7 kids, 1 little saint
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Our Adoption
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melanie
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Also, take heart...this is your oldest? My next one taught himself to read around his fourth birthday! I'm still all giddy about it, lol. It was a real shot in the arm after being so worried that we weren't doing something right around here. THey are all SO different. And even though he taught himself to read, he couldn't hardly scribble with a crayon at all or use scissors or any of the things his dyslexic sister did easily at that age. Homeschooling has been very humbling, because it's taught me how little control I really have over this whole thing, hehe.
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Melanie
homeschooling Maria (13yo), Kain (10yo), Jack (5yo), Tess (2yo), and our newest blessing, Henry Robert, born 4/23!
slightlycrunchycatholic.blogspot.com
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amyable
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Echoing the others in saying that you haven't done him a disservice at his age. 
I *am* glad we had testing though. I did it for my own peace of mind, really, and to make me a better teacher of my dd. So it was all for me. We did the whole battery with an educational tester and a psychologist (again, for my own information...) I was a speech-language pathologist in a former life with some experience working with lots of different LDs - the more I knew (including things like IQ) the better I would be able to teach/tutor her on my own w/o having to pay a tutor. I think that would be true even if I hadn't been an SLP in the past.
Ugh, my computer is overheating, I hope I can come back and finish my thoughts!
ETA: OK, hopefully I have a few more minutes after letting the computer cool down. 
Here are the things I think I'm gaining or hope to gain by having had DD tested. She was 11yo during testing:
-a better understanding of the details of her strengths and weaknesses (i.e. I new she had memory weaknesses but the testing helped give more info on just what KIND of memory and processing, etc)
-a diagnosis will help her get accomodations for state and college testing, will allow her to get audios from Recordings for the Blind and Dyslexic
-knowing her verbal and non-verbal IQ helped me to see that she does have true non-verbal LDs and she isn't just being obnoxious or lazy with me
-knowing processing speed through testing again helps me realize she is just processing slow, again, not being rude or lazy. Yes, I could SEE this to some extent without testing, but with a strong willed, argumentative girl, it's hard for me to step back and give her the benefit of the doubt without the *proof*
-It helped me to see it wasn't just my lousy teaching or the clash of our personalities, but she really DOES have trouble learning and reading. Knowing it's NOT MY FAULT goes far in helping me be a better teacher and parent to her.
Well, there goes my computer trying to catch on fire again I'd better run.
Good luck whatever you decide.
__________________
Amy
mom of 5, ages 6-16, and happy wife of 
The Highly Sensitive Homeschooler
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KauaiCatholic
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THANK YOU ALL, SO VERY MUCH!!!
I am so grateful for all this advice and comfort ... even though I now have more to ponder it doesn't feel overwhelming anymore.
blessings on all of you! 
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BrendaPeter
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Our son is 10 years old and we suspect he's dyslexic but haven't had him formally tested. He's great with phonics but I learned, by reading various dyslexic books from the library, that he struggles mostly with fluency. We're using a program called Great Leaps and that has been a Godsend. I also use All About Spelling with him as spelling is a struggle and it really helps him quite a bit with reading those "non-phonetic" words.
He's really improving but it's VERY slow. It does take ALOT of patience.
Keep praying as I know it is super-overwhelming initially!
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Blessings,
Brenda (mom to 6)
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JuliaT
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I believe that all 3 of my children are dyslexic (at varying levels with difficulty in different areas.) I have not had them tested and I don't think I ever will. But my kids had red flags waving gaily in the breeze which has helped me in discovering what the problem was. The biggest red flag is that their father is dyslexic and it is genetic.
The other thing that put us in the dyslexic camp was when I was reading a list for characteristics of dyslexia, I began to cry. The things that I used to think were my children's ideosyncrasies were actually part of the dyslexia. This is what finally made me take my head out of the sand.
Due to the fact that all of my children have it, I did a radical thing and bought Barton's Reading and Spelling prgram. It is hugely expensive but I am so tired of dancing around with other programs and not have them work. I tried to use WRTR, which is supposed to be an Orton-Gillingham program, and that made me wallow in the pool of frustration. I had heard alot of good things about Bartons so I decided to bite the bullet. I am only on level 2 with my 8 yr. old and level 3 with my 9 yr. old, but I can see some improvement already. My 8 yr. old is actually reading books now.  This is a huge step for him.
Blessings,
Julia
mom of 3 (9,8,6)
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rose gardens
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Thanks to all of you who shared your stories about dyslexia! I'm so glad to read that I'm not the only homeschoolers here dealing with this! Many people homeschool very bright children. With my other children, homeschooling seemed more joy than work. Encountering a learning disorder threw a wrench in all my plans. Things that worked for my other children don't work for one of my children. I questioned (and still question) everything I do with him.
For a long time, I thought it was me, then I thought it was his personality, and one day while doing sight words it finally clicked that there was a real problem and neither of us were to blame. He shows strong tendencies towards dyslexia.
That was when he was 6 1/2. I spoke with someone on the telephone who specializes in working with dyslexia. He said he could test my son but recommneded waiting. Since we homeschool, there was no rush to diagnose. For that matter, there was no need to rush reading.
I also took my son for a vission test, hearing test, and speech therapy evaluation. The speech therapist noted he had poor phonotic awareness. We took it much slower last school year, focussing on letter sounds and phonograms.
I have read much about dyslexia and learning disabilities. Neurologists say some children simply do not have the neurological brain developement to learn reading until later. EEG's show that people with dyslexia use different pathways in the brain when they read. My hope is that by taking it very slow and by using methods approved for people with dyslexia (while also working with various ways to help brain neurons connect), my child will make the proper brain connections and not develop full-blown dyslexia.
That's my hope. He recently turned eight. If his reading has not made more progress by the time he's nine, I will have him tested for dyslexia.
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Karen T
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Here is my take: if you strongly suspect your child is dyslexic, go ahead and use a strong Orton-Gillingham phonics program such as Wilson reading, or Barton. If he is dyslexic he needs the multisensory input and slow, steady teaching a program like this gives. If he's not dyslexic, it will be overkill but won't hurt him a bit. I use Barton for my dyslexic ds9 and also for my non-dyslexic dd8, simply b/c I already have it and know how to teach it. Barton does seem expensive upfront but re-sells really well, and you only pay for one level at a time. By the time i buy and then re-sell one level I am usually only out $50-75 total per level, and the higher the level, the longer it takes to get through it (we're in level 4 and expect to need 4-6 mos) A private tutor is going to cost WAY more than that. Barton is time and teacher-intensive but the DVDs tell you exactly how to teach it and the lessons are completely scripted. I've heard good things about Wilson also but don't have any experience; I think it's cheaper but less scripted.)
Many, many public/private schools don't believe dyslexia exists or lump all reading difficulties into the same boat - and they rarely have any programs to teach dyslexics - they generally use one remedial reading program for ALL kids, no matter why they can't read.
It's true that some kids, esp boys, just may not be ready to read until an older age but if your child does fit several of the criterion
here waiting is only going to make it more frustrating for him. Many dyslexics learn to memorize a lot of words simply by the shape or the beginning letters and are not really decoding them phonetically. This will catch up to them around grade 3-4, when the difficulty gets worse and there are fewer context clues to guess at. My ds had memorized thousands of words and I thought he was reading, but he could not decode simple 3-5 letter nonsense words.
Vision therapy will not fix dyslexia but some kids who might appear to be dyslexic (esp to a school tester) do need vision therapy, and some kids may have both problems.
Bottom line, you don't need a formal diagnosis of dyslexia to start teaching that way. If you think there might be *other* learning disabilities instead of or in combination with, then testing is probably prudent but be sure the tester will actually be testing for it!
There is a yahoo group called "heart of reading" which is primarily about teaching dyslexics but also touches on other LD's and issues. I have learned a world of info there. Someone today posted what I think is a very good definition of dyslexia:
I'm actually thinking of telling her my daughter has "a language disorder that makes it difficult for her to hear and process the sounds of language correctly, and which means she needs an intensive multi-sensory approach" rather than using the word dyslexia, which she's likely to think she knows all about.
karen T in Md
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rose gardens
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Karen, that was a really helpful post. I was unfamiliar Barton and it's nice to learn of a way to teach the Orton-Gillingham method without attending a training seminar.
I looked over my "saved favorites" on dyslexia recently. I had saved a website that addresses several questions about testing for dyslexia. The website notes that there is no single test for dyslexia, but rather dyslexia specialists use a series of tests. It also pointed out that local school districts won't likely test for dyslexia but rather to see if the child qualifies for special education services--and only the more severe cases of dyslexia will likely qualify for that. It had lots of other helpful information about what testers look for when trying to diagnosis dyslexia. http://www.dys-add.com/testing.html
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ALmom
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Does anyone know if that last link is good? I tried to connect to the link and couldn't get through. Is there something wrong or was the site just down when I checked.
Thanks to whoever started this thread. I am currently in the midst of debating about this. I've looked at various sites and ways - the tutoring help is over the top expensive, testing is expensive if you want accomodations (which we don't) but there isn't any hints about what to do if you test the free route through the Shriners.
One of my concerns is that I'm dealing with an older child who reads just fine with no comprehension problems that I can tell. The spelling is atrocious - but it is almost always either leaving out a single letter like o in forward or it is reversing letters like rowng for wrong. But he will spell a complicated word just fine in the same paper. Placement of things in space will even occassionally get him in math like x squared written as 2x and sometimes it is hard to tell if it is a math error or a flipping error. Other times it is obviously a flipping error because the answer is just being copied and copied wrong.
Nothing stands out like a red flag for Dyslexia except the reversals and if we do a lot of testing that then gets on his record, I may be slamming the door for him and his goal to be a pilot. We may already be excluded because of the vision therapy we did. Most of my children had vision problems and had the same horrible reversals. With them, though, this all disappeared within 6 months of finishing therapy. It is still lingering with this one child.
Where do you go if you are just looking for help in teaching as opposed to getting a diagnosis. I am more than willing to do overkill to overcome the reversals whether it is Dyslexia or not. We are long past learning how to read - but I still use WRR materials for spelling.
Sorry if I am hijacking this thread - and if someone needs to move my particular question from here and make it its own thread, that is fine. I figured there were lots of moms experienced with dyslexia that will maybe be able to help me sort this out. I am open to a PM if that is a better mode to communicate. Thanks.
Janet
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Anneof 5
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Here is the link to that site that the article comes from:
http://www.dys-add.com/
Hope this works for you. I couldn't get the other one either.
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rose gardens
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ALmom wrote:
Does anyone know if that last link is good? I tried to connect to the link and couldn't get through. Is there something wrong or was the site just down when I checked.
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Thanks for noting that. I can get to the site from my favorites list, but I can't get there from the link above either. It's likely my computer skills to blame as I'm not adept at providing links to other websites on this forum. Here's the web adress that you can try to copy and paste. http://www.dys-add.com/testing.html
------------
It's a little funny. I had that site saved to my favorites for a long time, but I didn't explore the site enough to discover the Barton System--or in any case it didn't stand out.
After reading more about the Barton System on this thread and exploring it further, I recently purchased the first section. Glad I did.  Before getting started, they require some screening. My son struggled with part. I called the company to discuss his results and they suggest I re-test him as it wasn't clear if the problem was his auditory processing or distraction & misunderstanding directions. (We worked with a speech therapist regarding his auditory processing last year.) I spoke with Susan Barton and she said that most people with dyslexia have some type of auditory processing problems. Her system helps develop auditory skills/phonemic awareness skill, but if the problems are too severe they need some additional correction before beginning the Barton program. I'll be a little sad if his auditory processing skills needs more work before we can begin the system, but then again, if that's the problem I'm happy to know so we can continue trying to correct underlying problems.
Some of you might want to check out the student screening for the Barton System too. It can help identify some more severe auditory processing problems. If the child doesn't pass the screening, the site offers some other program suggestions. I won't try providing a direct link but you can find it under the student section at bartonreading.com
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rose gardens
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I found a book at the library that included some testing that parents can give at home to help narrow down the cause of the reading problems. "Why Our Children Can't Read and What We Can Do About It" by Diane McGuinness, Ph.D. (She has a different take on dyslexia from many.) There are about ten pages of "Do It Yourself Diagnostics" starting on page 299, along with guidelines for how to assess the results. Those tests can help spot the specific deficiency of knowledge and/or ability that may be the underlying factor in reading problems.
Both this book and the Barton Reading Test noted above, showed my son's underlying audio-processing is the likely cause of his reading problems. I'm a little frustrated because he saw both a speech theapist and audiologist a year and a half ago when I realized that there was something not right about his reading. Speech therapist noted phonological awareness problems and we did do a program which was theoretically suppose to help with that. Audiologist didn't catch the problem. Reviewing the audiologist's test results I see she worked with words rather than sounds--My son can identify differences between familiar words, but not the sounds of some letters. Even though he can say those letter sounds, he doesn't hear them accurately all the time. There may be more to it still, but my son will soon start the LiPS program by Lindamood to help correct for audio-processing problems. As I had difficulty finding a speech therapist familiar with that program and the program we tried previously didn't ultimately fix the problem, I'm going to try learning the LiPS program and working through it with my son at home.
The original poster asked about testing--based on my recent experience I would suggest YES! Some simply testing may very well may be something you can handle "in house" rather than paying an expert. Not every "expert" will identify or treat the underlying problem correctly.
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Gratiae ut Deus
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I'm so happy this topic came up and that I stumbled upon it! I am going through a similar situation with my 8 yr. old boy. He already has an IEP set up with the school district from when he started kindergarten. He has been in speech therapy, but has since "graduated" from it. Some things have come out now that we did not see at his initial testing at age 5. He has always been a "slow" learner, but with these new developments I have decided to have him tested with an Occupational Therapist for possible vision issues. He will also be tested by another therapist for dyslexia and/or other problems.
We have always homeschooled and are blessed to be in a school district that is very accommodating and cooperative with homeschoolers. Otherwise, I don't know how we would afford the testing and services/therapy. I do know that in the state of Colorado though, it is a legal right that the district provides these services and testing. I feel very sorry for those that do not have that where they live.
What a great thread! Thank you all so much for the info., encouragement and stories you've all shared.
God bless!
__________________
Kelly
wife to Mark
momma to ds 12, dd 11, ds 9, ds 8, dd 6, ds 5, dd 3, ds 8 months and one saint in heaven
The Careless Catholic
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4Real Forums : Special Blessings
Topic: to test or not for dyslexia?
