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juliecinci
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Since we are discussing unschooling, it became apparent to me that the issue is not so much what kind of education but how we see our children.
How do you see yours?
I know that a lot of times on Christian lists, the question of a child's sin nature comes up as a way to suggest that kids will opt for the easy way out or will not put their best interests first or that they will not work hard to get what they say they want.
But before we discuss how the sin nature fits in, what qualities do you believe to be present in children in general?
I'll post my ideas later.
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Julie
Homeschooling five for fourteen years
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Lissa
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eagerness
curiosity
hunger for knowledge
hunger for meaning (both in the sense of wanting to know why why why about everything, and in the sense of badly wanting to be needed/involved/important, to help mom & dad with household stuff, to play with older kids, to take care of younger ones)
stubbornness
sense of awe & wonder
desire for affection
desire to have one's own way (self will)
persistence (not all kids are persistent about the same things or in the same way, but they all seem to be persistent about SOMETHING--astoundingly so in many cases)
Oops, my time's up, I have to run, list unfinished but I'm more eager to see what others come up with anyway!
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Cay Gibson
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Great topic, Julie.
I was just thinking that we needed to discuss how our dc feel about *unschooling* or whatever!
What are their thoughts?
What are their feelings?
Afterall, it's all about them, right?
We do table-time every morning (except this week as the house is a mess so we're focusing completely on *unschooling* which, btw---while I'm on topic---means that I do as CM and MM instructed: make sure there's a rich learning environment being offered, present the materials to them, then get out of the way.
But this time is blocked into a relatively short span of the day. It's a part of the day we do a math sheet, sit down and write, do a part of our CHC work. The rest of the day I have made it a habit to make sure my dc are all doing "something"...whatever that "something" is.
It's not about me, afterall; though the end result is often seen as a reflection of the parent. That's another topic...
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Cay Gibson
"There are 49 states, then there is Louisiana." ~ Chef Emeril
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Genevieve
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I really liked Lissa's list. And if I had to add to that it would be intense concentration. They are so cute when they are focused on an activity.  and in my kids, curiousity could be mistaken for recklessness. 
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MacBeth
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When you say "qualities", Julie, do you mean only the good things  ?
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Lissa
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Nah, let's hear it all! Though when I think about "bad" qualities, they always seem to me to be some good quality carried to an extreme. Like the premise of RAISING YOUR SPIRITED CHILD, I guess, which singles out certain character traits that might seem difficult to deal with and explores how they are actually too much of a good thing--"stubborness" being an excess of "persistence," etc.
Which in turn reminds me of C.S. Lewis's writing on human instincts or impulses, such as the "herd instinct" or "survival instinct," and how there is an appropriate time for each of them, and a time when indulging a particular instinct might be a sin. He gives the example of the man who sees another man drowning. His survival instinct (ordinarily a good thing) must in this case be suppressed for the sake of doing what is good and right--attempting to save the drowning man. I love his analogy of each quality or instinct being like a piano key--all are good when played at the right time, and "bad" when played at the wrong time; and natural law is the sheet music that tells us which key should be played at which time. Only of course he says it a million times better... 
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juliecinci
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Macbeth, I had all kinds of qualities in mind because if we are thinking about how to parent and educate these little ones and big ones, it helps if we realize what our assumptions about about how they operate.
I did ask to leave "sin nature" out because that is such a big topic and it includes the parents as well as the kids so I thought maybe we could do that after we had identified other qualities first.
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Julie
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Willa
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Lissa, that's a good list. What you say fits in with Catholic and traditional thinking..... vices are the deficit or excess of a virtue. Evil is not a positive, but a matter of choosing the lesser good over the greater. Taking laziness -- rest and comfort are good things, but they are lesser than some other goods in some circumstances.
A few other qualities that I notice in my kids:
--A strong desire to know and do the right thing; embarrassment and sometimes resentment when they are caught short by inexperience, ignorance or just lack of desire to actually carry out the good thing.
--Caution about new things (which is a good quality in itself, and leads to a pattern of observing and trying things out on a small scale before jumping right in).
--They enjoy a mixture of sameness and variety. WHich seems to me to be a very human quality, recognized by the Church in its liturgical cycles. So maybe that is two things:
-- Love for consistency
--Love for "good" novelty.
Come to think of it, I think Julie once used the term "tension". I find most of my childrens' qualities to be a tension or balance between two things that if taken in isolation would be extreme. It has always seemed to be part of my parenting job to help them find the balance between the two qualities....ie balance out eagerness with caution, love of variety with love of sameness, etc.
I suppose that's starting to go beyond the scope of your question, Julie. I'd love to hear your thoughts.
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Willa
hsing boys ages 11, 14, almost 18 (+ 4 homeschool grads ages 20 to 27)
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juliecinci
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Such a great start and better than I might have written had I just posted my own ideas.
I loved Lissa's list.
For me, children have the following qualities that deserve to be recognized and acknowledged (and affirmed!):
curiosity
a desire for competence
(they want to be capable at what they do)
fresh perspectives
(they speak honestly especially when they are young... this honesty can embarass adults, but it can be key to understanding something in a new way if attended to... Examples: "Why do we always look at pictures of flowers instead of just growing some ourselves?" or "How come Grandma never smiles at Grandpa?")
eager
want their work to be important and real
(real means that other people bigger than them do it too... I remember when Noah had to learn fractions, I didn't remember anything about them. I took the book, went to another room, figured it all out and came back to teach him. He said, "Oh I get it. Fractions are for when you are in fourth grade and have a book but you will never use them again." Needless to say, I had to think about whether or not I ever used fractions... happy to say I discovered I did and we moved quickly into real life and out of the book.)
can multi-task - even with noise!
(can listen to music and do math, want to play complicated games that require managing lots of data, will clean their bedrooms and listen to books on tape)
are happier to do things with parents than by themselves
can take on difficult tasks if there is a reward
(either intrinsic - beat the level, or extrinsic - soda after mowing!)
like to narrate their lives to someone somewhere
are often compassionate toward underdogs
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Stuff that is harder to affirm but is still true
less able to think of alternatives to one way of doing something
low tolerance for intrusions on their plans
hard time waiting for what they want
unaware of a bigger picture (at times)
interpret life through a limited perspective
trust and believe their parents are right
(this one is good and well for most of life but cna be tricky in the teen years when alternate perspectives challenge the one they have always accepted)
universalizing their experiences to others
(thinking that if they don't like something, no one else will either; conversely if they think it is good, then who could dislike it?)
Well, that's as many as I can think of for now. 
We might want to add: what do we think children want? What do they need?
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Julie
Homeschooling five for fourteen years
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4Real Forums : Living Learning
Topic: The Nature of Children
