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Bookswithtea
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| Posted: April 25 2006 at 3:34pm | IP Logged
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I'm confused and I can't decide what to do.
My ds's birthday is 8-14-93. He barely made the cut off for Kindergarten (end of Aug/early Sept). It seems like throughout his elem. years, he always did better if I viewed him as as one grade lower (iow, a 6yr old K student).
Now he is 12 almost 13. It seems like he is starting to catch up, academically. He could probably handle either 7th or 8th grade level work this Fall.
In addition, ds *definitely* looks more like a beginning 8th grader than a 7th grader.
I've decided to sign up with NARS for high school in order to get an accredited transcript. Its the only affordable program I can find that will let me continue to choose curriculum and determine my own methods of accountability for learning the material.
I need to decide what grade level to call him in order to target a "graduation date" and to figure out which year to sign up with NARS.
He will be at an academic advantage if I consider him a 7th grader. Its one more year to mature and he will likely do better with his schoolwork. He won't move out of our homeschool at 17 and be a barely 18 yr old starting either college or trade school.
The downside to calling him a 7th grader this year is that he will be 15 when he starts high school, which is not really the standard, and he will most likely tower over his peers (he is likely going to be over 6 ft before he stops growing). One hs mom who graduated a few sons also told me, "18 yr old boys do NOT like to sit at the kitchen table and be taught by their mommies." I can kind of see her point.
I haven't raised another boy before. Do they make huge academic strides and catch up to girls quickly in the teen years? If so, then maybe the academic advantage to keeping him a 7th grader won't matter. Do boys feel uncomfortable if they are older and taller than all their peers? And what about not being 18 yet when he graduates? Will one more year in home school be best for him before he starts career training (he would still be 18 at graduation, but 19 by the time he started college or trade school).
Help? 
~Books
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Patty
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You know your son best, but in general I would say it's better to give a student more time if there is a question. All our kids are tall, even though none are behind the grade they would be in ps. Our youngest was six in October so he's a pretty tall kindergartener. He's bright, and when he was almost five dh and I talked about whether to start him in kindergarten. Dh said, "Why push him? They grow up fast enough anyway."
As for an 18yo boy being taught by mom at the kitchen table, well... Our oldest son is 20 and a college sophomore. When he was 18 I was lucky if I SAW him. He was enrolled in three community college classes, active in the homeschool teen group, and finishing his Eagle Scout work. Yes, he was home sometimes and did some work here, but he was extremely active and on the go.
God bless you in your decision making,
Patty
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Lavenderfields
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The kids and I have been talking about graduations and ages today. I have some who have and will graduate at 17, and some who have and will graduate at 18. I really don't think age matters so much as how you son will do if you put him in 8th grade. For a boy, one more year to mature, advantage, one more year to keep him home, advantage.
As for sitting at the kitchen table, usually around 8th or 9th grade, most kids start taking responsiblity for their own work and do it without Mom. And, as Patty said, by the time they are 16 or 17, they are so busy you hardly ever see them. My 15 almost 16 dd takes dance classes at the college, helps out with three dance classes at the dance studio, helps in a CCD class and takes many dance classes at the studio. She fits her school work in where it is convient for her.
Hope this helps.
God Bless
Robynn in Lancaster, CA
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Bookswithtea
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| Posted: April 25 2006 at 8:33pm | IP Logged
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Lavenderfields wrote:
| one more year to keep him home, advantage. |
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See, this is one thing I was wondering about. My sheltering mommy soul thinks its best to keep him home one more year, but I don't know if that's truly what's best for him or not because I just don't know what its like to have a child this age. I still sometimes can't believe he's 12, kwim???
I asked him today what he thought about it all. He *hated* the idea of having to start a heavier workload earlier. I think he wants to kind of "cruise along" academically as long as possible. He didn't even seem to care about the idea of graduating a year earlier.
Lavenderfields wrote:
| And, as Patty said, by the time they are 16 or 17, they are so busy you hardly ever see them. My 15 almost 16 dd takes dance classes at the college, helps out with three dance classes at the dance studio, helps in a CCD class and takes many dance classes at the studio. She fits her school work in where it is convient for her. |
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I can't even imagine...
We are really encouraging our children to get involved in the vocational program that our local district offers for 11th and 12th grades. Its an excellent program. When they graduate, they have a certification in a trade as well as a diploma, and my school district is amenable to allowing ds to homeschool all his core subjects and just show up for the vocational classes. I'm thinking I'd feel more comfortable with him doing this at 17 and 18 than at 16 and 17. By then he will have been driving for a year, hopefully, and I can just let him get himself there each afternoon! lol
So you don't think its a big deal to turn 18 a few weeks before one starts their senior year, then? He will still be 18 when he graduates, so it shouldn't look like he repeated a grade. I just don't know if it makes any difference. I was a July birthday and was *barely* 18 when I started college. That's the only frame of reference I have.
~Books
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Lavenderfields
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| Posted: April 25 2006 at 9:36pm | IP Logged
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[QUOTE=Bookswithtea]
So you don't think its a big deal to turn 18 a few weeks before one starts their senior year, then? He will still be 18 when he graduates, so it shouldn't look like he repeated a grade. I just don't know if it makes any difference. I was a July birthday and was *barely* 18 when I started college. That's the only frame of reference I have.
My ds 20, has a birthday in November, we decided to keep him home one extra year. This was a blessing for this child, even though, he entered puberty earlier than most, at age 11, he was taller than the other kids for quite a while, but by the time we let him enter high school, almost all the boys had caught up to him. So, he turned 18 in November and didn't graduate until June. Half the kids were 18 when he graduated.
I have another ds 13, just turned 13 in February, he will be 18 when he graduates from High School, you ds and mine were born the same year, just 6 months apart. He has been talking about High School lately. He says, "he can't believe he will be going into high school because you get really smart in High school" 
The age is no big deal to the boys, but the girls in my family have a different opinion.
My dd 9 has a birthday in December, we kept her back and she has complained that she will be 18 when she graduates.  Go figure!
God Bless
Robynn in Lancaster, CA
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Patty
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Bookswithtea wrote:
So you don't think its a big deal to turn 18 a few weeks before one starts their senior year, then? He will still be 18 when he graduates, so it shouldn't look like he repeated a grade. I just don't know if it makes any difference. I was a July birthday and was *barely* 18 when I started college. That's the only frame of reference I have.
~Books |
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No, I don't think his age should be a big deal. I have a nephew who will turn 18 in July before his senior year. He's in public school. His parents didn't think he was ready to start kindergarten when he had just turned five. LOTS of kids are 18 their entire senior year, or most of it. Really, that would be my least concern. I would be praying about this, asking for wisdom to know if he is intellectually and emotionally mature enough for a certain grade.
God bless,
Patty
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Bookswithtea
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| Posted: April 26 2006 at 12:39pm | IP Logged
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I feel much better now. It sounds like his age is not going to be as much of a concern as I was thinking it might be.
In all honesty, I think I feel better about giving him one more year to grow up.
Blessings,
~Books
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Willa
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Books, you can always change your mind later, too.
My first 2 sons had June birthdays and I chose to "keep them back a year". My oldest graduated at just short of 19 and is doing well as a college freshman this year (he's going to be turning 20).
I have been calling my second son a "junior" this year -- he will turn 18 in late June. But while I was tabulating his transcript I realized he had enough credits to graduate. So, I'm graduating him "early". I don't want to send him away yet, and he doesn't particularly want to leave home, but this will give him an extra year to start steering the boat on his own while he's still living in our family.
One thing you can start doing is keeping a transcript now because some middle school credits can parlay into high school credits. Eg, my oldest took biology and Algebra in 8th grade.
There are always so many options! I am definitely not in a hurry for my kids to leave home either, and my husband would like to have them stay here forever I think 
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Willa
hsing boys ages 11, 14, almost 18 (+ 4 homeschool grads ages 20 to 27)
Take Up and Read
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Willa
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Bookswithtea wrote:
| So you don't think its a big deal to turn 18 a few weeks before one starts their senior year, then? He will still be 18 when he graduates, so it shouldn't look like he repeated a grade. I just don't know if it makes any difference. I was a July birthday and was *barely* 18 when I started college. That's the only frame of reference I have.~Books |
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I was an October birthday and graduated at 17. I was just too young to want to leave home! Especially as we had just moved from Switzerland back to Alaska, a big transition in itself. I took a few community college classes while I sent out applications to universities in the "lower 48". I also worked a bit part time.
So I went to university at age almost 19 and it really made no difference to anything I can think of. (Not in a bad way, that is. It probably made all the difference in the world in good ways since I met DH in college my freshman year)
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AMDG
Willa
hsing boys ages 11, 14, almost 18 (+ 4 homeschool grads ages 20 to 27)
Take Up and Read
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teachingmom
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Bookswithtea wrote:
| So you don't think its a big deal to turn 18 a few weeks before one starts their senior year, then? He will still be 18 when he graduates, so it shouldn't look like he repeated a grade. I just don't know if it makes any difference. I was a July birthday and was *barely* 18 when I started college. That's the only frame of reference I have. |
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From what I hear from my mom (a retired public school 1st grade teacher who often advised parents to wait the extra year with boys, in particular) and a good friend (whose children are in public school), it is quite different from when I was in school, and many parents are opting to wait a year and have children begin kindergarten when they are 6. Many of those kids will be 19 when they graduate from high school.
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~Irene (Mom to 6 girls, ages 7-19)
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Elizabeth
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When I was pregnant with my first and teaching first grade, I watched my September 21st due date come and go. It was hot (my school was not air conditioned) and I was eager and impatient to have my baby. My principal came down to my classroom after school that week and made me promise that if the baby came before the October 1st school deadline, I would start him or her late and not "on time." After getting over the shock of hearing that I could have an October baby when I was so focused on September, I readily saw her wisdom and agreed, baby unseen. He ws born September 29th (exactly a year after Cay's ds, who also claimed that year for himself.) Turns out, that baby was very bright, though slow to grow physically. He's developmentally beyond most adults I know and he wil turn 18 just as his senior year begins. My husband and I comment almost daily about what a great plan this was. He is leaps and bounds beyond where he was this time last year and his junior and senior year will be much more meaningful and much less of a struggle for all of us because we added that year. The baby I'm carrying is due the same time. We absolutely have the same plan. And my little girl is a Septmember 30th baby. Six hours later and it wouldn't even be a question. So, here's the question: do I get an entire year less with her at home, learning all I want her to know as a late teenager, than I get with ds # 3, who was born just 36 hours on the other side of the deadline, in October? Absolutely not! Having nearly finished navigating this once, I recognize those last two years as priceless. And I saw two friends with college bound children defer that admission a year this year and reap the benefits of what you can do to educate a child who really is mature enough to go, but who could benefit from spending that year of relative maturity at home.
I think Irene is right; he won't be odd at all if he's nineteen.
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Elizabeth Foss is no longer a member of this forum. Discussions now reflect the current management & are not necessarily expressions of her book, *Real Learning*, her current work, or her philosophy. (posted by E. Foss, Jan 2011)
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mary
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i have a sept 21st boy and have wondered how to handle this. at what point do you hold them back? my son finshed his K work this year and is working on 1st grade math. next year i will have to have him assessed (as required in our state). do i have him assessed for K although he will have completed 1st grade? i'm confused as to how and at what point you all hold your late babies back a year.
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ALmom
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Have them assessed at the grade you intend to call the child. As homeschoolers you can teach any level and call it any grade you want. So I can teach using "3rd grade" curriculum and still call my dc a second grader if I want to.
Janet
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Kelly
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I just saw this thread and am so thankful for the discussion. I have a December birthday ds, my eldest (16), who I refrained from enrolling in school until the next year (the ONLY year he attended school). It was a good move, most definitely, but because he is a "late bloomer", I"m pondering---well, not holding him back so much as streeeeeeetching out his studies and graduating him at 19. I, too, have wondered if that's a mistake, and feel NO rush to push him out of the nest-I like having them at home! Although I hate the thought of ds being 19 when he graduates from hs, turning 20 his freshman year, OTOH I *KNOW* how all my many brothers, and I, wasted our first year of college growing up, instead of studying! Plus, I'd like ds to have a few more holes plugged in his academic basket, and be really secure, scholastically, when he goes to college. All that being said, he's taking a dual enrollment chemistry class this summer at a local college, so he'll actually graduate from hs with college credits, anyway---Ah, decisions, decisions...
I go back and forth on this topic, but in the end, it seems to me, we're homeschoolers, can't our kids be in whatever grade we want them to be in??? We travel a lot, and I'm wondering if ds's stretched out schooling couldn't be presented (on a transcript) as an opportunity (getting to travel extensively and so on) as opposed to a "failure" of any kind. That's how *I* see it, anyway.  Besides,with dual enrollment possibilities, on top of it all, ds won't even be a bonafide highschool senior, anyway, but will have some college frosh credits under his belt already! So, does it matter? Reading all your posts reminds me that the grade distinctions in hsing are typically blurred, which is a great thing. Isn't that one of the advantages of hsing, having the chance to learn horizontally as well as vertically, getting to explore many interests as well as in-depth interests, not having to follow a specific checklist? I always say there's more than one way to skin a cat! Thank you for reminding me of that, and sharing your insights and experiences---this definitely helps quell some of my angst on this topic!
Kelly, letting it all hang out in FL!
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cybertreks
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Another POV:
I have two sons with August birthdays. My 14yo just finished 9th, and my 13yo just finished 7th...his birthday is almost the same as your ds's. So they both went to school on the younger side. These two boys are as different as night and day, in maturity, in size, in personality. But I'm glad that they both went in when they did. However I had a dd that I sent in on the early side, and I had to make a mid-course correction for her in 5th grade. So maybe it just depends on your son's personality.
My 14 year old is 6'3" tall and has the social maturity of the 16 and 17 year olds I know. He regrets that he's not even one grade further along, as most of his friends tend to be older. My rising 8th grader is not as socially sophisticated as some of his peers, but he seems to fit in well with his social group. Both boys are fine with the academic aspect of the grades they are in.
I would think long and hard about 'holding them back' (not to say I wouldn't do it, but I'd think a long time about it first!), because your friend's words are wise about an 18 year old not wanting to be taught at the table by mommy. My 18 year old is going to Australia by himself in a few months; I can't see him still being all keen on homeschooling at the place he's in in life right now. JMHO
--Beth
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Elizabeth
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cybertreks wrote:
I would think long and hard about 'holding them back' (not to say I wouldn't do it, but I'd think a long time about it first!), because your friend's words are wise about an 18 year old not wanting to be taught at the table by mommy. My 18 year old is going to Australia by himself in a few months; I can't see him still being all keen on homeschooling at the place he's in in life right now. JMHO
--Beth
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If you opted to give him another year before starting college and he spent that year sitting at the table with the little kids, being taught by mommy, there would indeed be a problem. But that's not likely to be case. The teenagers I know who are still not enrolled in school during their "high school" years are very busy.
They are involved in passions (violin, dance, soccer). They are interning (with senators, sports agents, and pastors). They are taking classes at community colleges for dual enrollment credit (thereby beginning official college with a semester or more of college credits under their belts). They are going on eight week seminar/pilgrimages to Rome; to summer intensives with the New York City ballet;to exclusive violin camps all the way across the country; to Spain to play in soccer in an international tournament.
The only times they're sitting at the table with Mom are the rare times they're home to join the family for dinner .
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Elizabeth Foss is no longer a member of this forum. Discussions now reflect the current management & are not necessarily expressions of her book, *Real Learning*, her current work, or her philosophy. (posted by E. Foss, Jan 2011)
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Cay Gibson
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I don't know how I missed this thread.
I'm a big advocate of allowing them ( especially boys) that extra year.
Boys tend to be more immature than girls...statistically  . They can use the extra year. I fretted over that same decision the year my oldest was in preschool. He has a very late Sept. b-day, I spoke to his preschool teacher who had three boys and had held her older two back and never regretted it.
She told me that if I sent him on I might regret it. If I held him back, I never would. It's true! I've never regretted it though, I must admit, that I do think his last academic year was his 11th grade yr. His senior year was unschooling to the helt and lots of on-job training with some technical schooling added to the mix.
Hold your son back and allow that senior year for on-job learning and lots of unschooling in the real world. After all, most high school seniors only take one or two classes in the morning then go to jobs in the afternoon (unless they're taking college prep classes).
He'll still be under your roof and on your dh's health insurance (there you go for a good reason to hold off graduation ) but he'll have some freedom to discern his life and work and plans.
My second son was born in March but he's slower and more immature. He didn't read until he was nine so he was held back in first grade. I never considered holding him back (before the inevitable reality) because he was a March b-day.
My last two girls both have b-days that fall after Oct. 1 cut-off. One is in Oct., the other in Dec. I have no worries about where to place them...though the Oct. dd is reading at a 6-7th grade level and seems to be following the path of her May-born sister.
I much prefer those later b-days where there is no debate about holding back, etc. It's a given. It allows the children time to discern, time to mature, time to plan, time to wise up.  If you have to (becasue with boys they do seem to want to leave the nest in those teen years), let him have that senior year to focus on a job out of school (like Willa mentioned) and let the planning begin!
They're all so different, aren't they?!
I'll be praying for your discernment. 
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Cay Gibson
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Bookswithtea
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I just wanted to say thanks for sharing, everyone. I really appreciate it. We did decide finally to hold ds back another year, mostly because its what he wanted and he doesn't seem to care what his friends are taking, classwise...As an aside, I am beginning to think its a homeschool thing...they don't care because they don't school together, I guess. He also just seems to do much better academically when I consider him a 7th grader than when he is trying to keep up with 8th grade level work. I can tell he always feels like its just barely out of his reach to understand.
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Blessings,
~Books
mothering ds'93 dd'97 dd'99 dd'02 ds'05 ds'07 and  due 9/10
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Cay Gibson
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I forgot to mention , that most the time my 13 yr old is taking two grade levels. In fact, he always has. This year he'll be 8th grade but still using some 7th grade materials from Seton.
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Cay Gibson
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Elizabeth
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I moved a follow up Seton question to the Real Learning forum.
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Elizabeth Foss is no longer a member of this forum. Discussions now reflect the current management & are not necessarily expressions of her book, *Real Learning*, her current work, or her philosophy. (posted by E. Foss, Jan 2011)
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4Real Forums : High School Years and Beyond
Topic: 7th grade or 8th grade????
