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Mary G
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Molly -- in your opinion, which is the best of Mary Hood's books? Which one gave you the "most comfort" for unschooling?
Thanks!
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chicken lady
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Good question Mary, when I feel like I'm losing my vision I pull out The Joyful Homeschooler, and remember to get my act together spiritually first. The relaxed Homeschooler I have found grounds me in what my dc need to know I am doing, and that I can trust the process. But mostly I have a couple of her tapes where she has given interviews, and her gentle reassaurance and knowledge of the educational field has truly blessed me with much needed peace and understanding, She has given me permission to believe that I know my dc best and educating them in a family centered environment is a good and healthy thing.
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Genevieve
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WJFR wrote:
I was thinking more about it and I think the reason I especially liked the first GWSs was that the premise seemed to be, "If you take children seriously and respect them and their abilities, they will surprise you with what they are capable of". This is similar to what Charlotte Mason said (and Montessori) and it is an attractive theory to me.
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Interestingly even though I have read up on a few educational philosophies, I find that I am attracted to similar core teachings in each of them as you had pointed out. Inter-connection. As I am in the early stages of homeschooling I feel like I had to pass through a few rites of passages. The realization that no boxed curriculum would be perfect. The realization that no boxed philosophy would be perfect. The realization that education is never perfect and that all I am doing is helping my children along the earlier stages of life-long learning and loving God.
P/S What is IMHO?
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Elizabeth
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Isn't it interesting how different books inspire us? I found McKee's book interesting (and very comforting in the math department) but her life was so different from mine I didn't relate much. Part of it was that she only had two children. But that wasn't the biggest difference. The book gave me no spiritual underpinnings for the lifestyle. Mary Hood's books give me some spiritual foundations, but they're not Catholic. Suzy Andres gives me spiritual underpinnings that are wholly Catholic and rooted in the spirituality of a saint with whom I really connect. She only has two children but she lives in the midst of large Catholic families and truly does have a heart for them. At times, I find myself wondering at her courage: she lives in the shadow of the biggest Catholic boxed curriculum provider and can still live a lifestyle very different from the one they promote. She also has the benefit of coming alongside her husband as he mentors college-aged students who have been educated at home, giving her an experience and a dimension into the long-term picture.She's seen the fruits of different philosophies and she knows that children who are unschooled are certainly not at an academic disadvantage...
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Elizabeth Foss is no longer a member of this forum. Discussions now reflect the current management & are not necessarily expressions of her book, *Real Learning*, her current work, or her philosophy. (posted by E. Foss, Jan 2011)
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momwise
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I totally forgot to mention my very favorite: Raymond and Dorothy Moore. I really got my introduction to unschooling through them (though I didn't know it by that name). I read Better Late than Early first and then a few years ago I read The Successful Homeschool Family Handbook. While we really aren't "unschoolers," these books helped me relax enough to enjoy my children and allow them to learn in more natural ways.
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Willa
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Genevieve wrote:
..... I feel like I had to pass through a few rites of passages. The realization that no boxed curriculum would be perfect. The realization that no boxed philosophy would be perfect. The realization that education is never perfect and that all I am doing is helping my children along the earlier stages of life-long learning and loving God.
P/S What is IMHO? |
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Genevieve,
Ditto! Even after 12 years I continue to re-examine. It's not that anything we've done has been a total disaster -- I think it's a balance thing... I go too far one way, then another. At different times in my life I need input from different sources. You said it better than that  ... "boxed philosophies" -- liked "boxed curriculums" -- can be a springboard, but don't seem to be a whole thing in themselves. They leave things out.
IMHO -- in my humble opinion 
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Willa
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Willa
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Elizabeth wrote:
Suzy Andres gives me spiritual underpinnings that are wholly Catholic and rooted in the spirituality of a saint with whom I really connect. ....
...She also has the benefit of coming alongside her husband as he mentors college-aged students who have been educated at home, giving her an experience and a dimension into the long-term picture.She's seen the fruits of different philosophies and she knows that children who are unschooled are certainly not at an academic disadvantage... |
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Elizabeth,
Me too. Though I like "stories" about real lives and real unschooling, in some ways I don't need specifics as much as a philosophy and a way to live. HWG gave me a start in thinking that way.
Great point about seeing the "fruits" of different types of schooling. I hadn't thought of that, but of course she lives in academia and would see it from that perspective. Very helpful to me to ponder
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Genevieve
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I've stumbled across these few books while exploring some unschooling websites. Has anyone read them? I'm still planning to get my hands on the McKee and Wallace books. :)
Valerie Fitzenreiter - The Unprocessed Child: Living Without School
Agnes Leistico - I Learn Better By Teaching Myself & Still Teaching Ourselves
Grace Llewellyn - Guerrilla Learning: How to Give Your Kids a Real Education With or Without School
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Leonie
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Genevieve,
I really didn't like the book "The Unprocessed Child." I found it very didactic and almost smug, when compared to the personal sharing of Nancy Wallace and Alison McKee.
Leistico's book is intersting but, like The Unschooling Handbook, kind of lightweight.
"Guerilla Learning" is good for those with children in school, imo - I used to have that in the parent library at an education centre and put some excerpts in the parent newsletter. Homeschoolers would probbaly know all the ideas, though.
That said, I am a homeschooling book junkie so I am glad that I have read all three books. Even though none of them stand out as must reads, for me. 
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Genevieve
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Oh Leonie, I am grateful that you have read so many books. It saves my time to read them. I read at a snail's pace especially with only little ones runninng around.
If you don't mind, I'll like to ask what you think of
Christian Unschooling by Teri Brown
Parenting a Free Child
One to One by Gareth Lewis
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Leonie
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This is my take ( ymmv!) -
Christian Unschooling - a gentle book with a very loose definition of unschooling and so it has been criticised for this. A nice read, but not great and not very Catholic but I do pass it onto people curious about unschooling from a Christian POV. Like Homeschooling With Gentleness, but stories from many different families.
Haven't read Parenting a Free Child.  Gasp!
One to One by Gareth Lewis - I love this book. I don't like the high school sequel much - sold my copy - but One to One is a book I dip into for ideas for Math games, crafts, art, a reminder on the story or drawing approach to history.....
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chicken lady
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I just finished reading (again)!! Homeschooling our children, and Unschooling Ourselves, it seems this thread has resparked an interest in me to get out the books and take another look around. That being said, WOW, I really feel excited! Like Elizabeth, I would agree that the book lacks a spiritual dimension, and she has 2 children, plus worked outside the home some of time, none of these things can I re-late to, I can re-late however to "listening" to my children, allowing them to teach me how they need to be educated. I have been having a heck of a time with my 9 yr dd. She seems so unmotivated, and really out of sorts. After finishing this book agin, I asked her to tell me what she wanted to study,(intersting none of which I thought would be great fun), her list is amazing, and wonderful, very diverse,from animal care to piano, and the history of the Papacy!! Oh yes she included snakes as a most have study!! YIKES like that is going to happen!! She wants to go back to acting classes and put on an American girl play!! For a 9 yr old I was quite delighted, I just need to get out of the way, let her lead. I think I have been stifling her wanting to make sure that we were doing the basics, I never really saw this before. Most folks around me, in this highly academic area, consider me very relaxed, yet I too found that I was holding on to some old tapes about ewhat makes up a worth while education!
Off to re-read the Moores better late than early, and perhaps some of these books Leonie is suggesting.
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Willa
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Leonie,
While we're picking your brain , any reads you'd recommend for a high schooler? I think you mentioned that your son had read The Day I Became an Auto-Didact, and one of Grace Llewellyn's books? Anything objectionable in either of those?
Have you read Llewellyn's "Real Lives?"
I just reread:
--Homeschooling for Excellence
--The Successful Homeschool Family Handbook by Raymond and Dorothy Moore (not an unschooling book per se, but does recommend a relaxed, interest-directed and tutorial/work/service type of homeschooling.
and read A Different Kind of Teacher by John Taylor Gatto -- more about the failings of schools rather than about unschooling, and sort of incendiary, but very thought-provoking! He believes in educating through a combination of the following:
--Independent Study (where the child picks a topic and pursues it, adults helping if asked)
--Apprenticeships (learning skills and trades by hands-on experience)
--Community Service (giving something back to the community)
--Family Studies (helping parents, or grandparents, or siblings, basically acknowledging that one's family is essential and important)
--Dialectics (working through authoritative statements for oneself to determine if they are right or wrong)
He says this is the kind of education that produced Abraham Lincoln, Benjamin Franklin, Thomas Edison etc)
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Willa
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Genevieve
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That was my next questions even though my oldest is only about to turn three! 
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Genevieve
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Leonie wrote:
Haven't read Parenting a Free Child. Gasp!
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When you get around to it, post your review here. I think till then all the other books would keep me occupied.
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Leonie
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Molly,
I love being re-inspired by my books. Your dd's interests are amazing.
Willa,
Jonathon read the Day I Became An Autodidact and two books by Grace Llewellyn - Real Lives and African American Homeshooling. A couple of the stories in African American Homeschooling are written by teens. All the stories in Real Lives are written by teens - many of whom are religious.
Oh, and I love Gatto's books, too.
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Willa
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I just finished reading Homeschooling our Children, Unschooling Ourselves. I enjoyed it, but Homeschooling with Gentleness is still my favorite unschooling book, I think.
Upon reflection, I notice that almost all the homeschooling books are written by people who seem to have choleric temperaments -- outgoing, activity-oriented, at ease in the larger community and craving new experiences. What the McKee children are doing at any one time is SO much more than my kids would ask for or be happy about, and indeed I couldn't tolerate it myself, especially multiplied by seven instead of just two! She writes about Christian asking for this class and that meeting with friends and that volunteer opportunity -- that is simply NOT my family  It may be that I am not bringing them up correctly and I'm sure that's part of it, but also, I don't think my kids are naturally like that. My job throughout their childhood has been to gradually get them exposed to new things -- their immediate reaction is consistently fairly negative or at least decidedly cautious and reticent.
So besides the Catholic philosophy, I think that Suzy Andres' book appeals to me because she and her son strike me as more introverted, quietly intellectual temperaments. Legos, half-reluctant piano lessons, lots of reading aloud and discussion, a couple of close friends to interact with, a bit of math in short lessons....that's closer to what our speed is in this house, when we are in unschooling mode.
But I do worry a bit about unschooling introverted kids because they are NOT going to ask for new experiences, new ways to move into the community. They are going to hang back and want to watch and get assimilated. They are going to need strong talents that make up for their lack of ease with external situations. They are going to want to delve inwards instead of pushing outwards, and since introverts have a different way of processing experiences, my introverts and myself are on a rather different track than the McKees and the results they had won't be the results I would have.
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Willa
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Willa
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My county library has "Real Lives" and "The Day I became an Autodidact" so I'm requesting them hoping to read them with my second son. ... thanks so much for the mini-reviews, Leonie!
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Willa
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tovlo4801
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WJFR wrote:
So besides the Catholic philosophy, I think that Suzy Andres' book appeals to me because she and her son strike me as more introverted, quietly intellectual temperaments. Legos, half-reluctant piano lessons, lots of reading aloud and discussion, a couple of close friends to interact with, a bit of math in short lessons....that's closer to what our speed is in this house, when we are in unschooling mode. |
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Willa,
I love this. I think our family temperment is a bit like yours and I've been battling doubts the last week or so about our new path. I've been worrying that I'm not "doing" enough. I'm comforted by your comments and I realized reading your post that I've been comforting myself with mental images of what I imagine homeschooling is like in the Andres house. This was a nice reinforcement.
Thanks!
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Cay Gibson
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WJFR wrote:
| She writes about Christian asking for this class and that meeting with friends and that volunteer opportunity -- that is simply NOT my family It may be that I am not bringing them up correctly and I'm sure that's part of it, but also, I don't think my kids are naturally like that. |
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I think it's naturally born into a child. You're doing a super job at bringing them up correctly. I can tell. 
WJFR wrote:
| My job throughout their childhood has been to gradually get them exposed to new things -- their immediate reaction is consistently fairly negative or at least decidedly cautious and reticent. |
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I've always heard that human beings are creatures of habit. None of us like change that much. When taken out of our comfort zone, most of us are initially leary and cautious.
WJFR wrote:
| But I do worry a bit about unschooling introverted kids because they are NOT going to ask for new experiences, new ways to move into the community. They are going to hang back and want to watch and get assimilated. They are going to need strong talents that make up for their lack of ease with external situations. |
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My oldest ds was a sunny baby with a sunny disposition. Every single morning he'd greet me with the most joyous smile. HE was so friendly and joyful when meeting new people. But he's also sensitive (which he tries to hide now that he's older) and he is an anxious person. My pet philosophy is *it's all in the exposure*. I try to expose them to the world...from the central point of home. But I heard an actor from the television show *ER* say last night that adversity is a good thing. It builds us up and makes us stronger. And I wondered if I have kept my dc from too much aversity. 
Last week I brought the kids to the local high school football game. Dh is still working weekends and long hours and the football games have started back but are held in the daytime instead of night due to damage from the hurricane...no lighting system. I figured it would be a welcome treat and we love to root for our home team (dh and I both graduated from this high school). <Go Tors!>
One of Kayleigh's friends asked Corey to go and he said no, he wanted to stay home and clean the yard. It surprised me because he played on this football team in 9th grade and on the soccer team too. And he loves sports...always been a team player...opposite of his younger brother who likes individual sports such as golf, bowling, and NAScar racing.
But, as we drove away, I saw him driving the tractor to the next fallen tree and I knew he was joyful about being out there...just him and nature. His uncle told me after the storm, Corey was always the first one up and the last one to bed. He'd fix a pot of coffee and go off to hustle work around the place. He was in his glory.
I should have unschooled this child on a farm in Montana!  But, one can't have too many regrets...though us mothers can hold onto many. 
Do you think it's possible for people to change from extroverted to introverted and the other way around? I think my ds has as he's gotten older.
Now...back to unschooling...I was already into the *unschooling* mood before Rita so the storm was a pleasurable excuse to learn in that mind-frame. Unschooling became more appealing and tangible. In fact, it became the ONLY way.
I'm eagerly reading, re-reading, and researching any and all *unschooling* threads, books, articles, and eloops I can find. I've reread Andres' book and it does sound very familiar to our path. Matter of fact, that K-Mart curriculum she mentions is exactly what we used part of the time we were away. All our books were left home (no room in the camper ---thankfully they're all safe and sound  ) and one day I picked up some School Zone/ Super Deluxe workbooks for each grade level and let them work in those at night. Lessons complete! In the meantime, we learned by standing in FEMA lines, lots of library time, grilling outside in the woods, traveling to historic real-life museums, etc.
But what attracts me even more to unschooling is the knowledge that what my dc know, I never taught them!
My oldest graduates from hs this year but has already followed his heart's path and has found a full-time job doing what he loves to do. THe store where he was working hated to loose him so he agreed to work there when he could. So he's basically doing apprenticeship work his final year. I can't see him working two jobs and doing school work, plus he still attends a nightly training school for an electrical course.  But I mean to see that he graduates and has a diploma.
Mark and I have always drilled into our dc that they must get their education and I still hope and pray that Corey goes next year to the community college. But, even with a touch of introvertism, he is already paving his own way in life. He's independent, a real-hard worker, and a great kid.
Yet there's a regret on my part. I know he doesn't score high on tests. YOu have a ds who did well on testing and is attending a wonderful college. I would love to be able to say my ds is going to TAC. But that isn't going to happen. 
I tried classical education on my ds. Just didn't work for him. Though we've had wonderful discussions on Shakespeare, he doesn't care to read what I'd like him to read. He's reading the Foxfire books now. But I'm glad he's reading.
So what is education? For Corey it's unschooling and apprenticeship learning. For Kayleigh it's structured, classical, classroom. For Garrett it's individual, one-on-one assisted, unschooling also. For Chelsea...well, she's a sponge...I think anything would work.
I don't know if this post makes any sense but I'm grateful for the outlet. I'm realizing that my idea of education isn't the same ideal as my ds's. Will he make his own in life? Oh, definitely. Introverted or not, I know he won't fail and, God forbid a health issue, he will succeed just fine. He can already get by in the *real world* better than I can. And I think being a hard worker might even go further than having a college degree.
Still, we're always saddled with regrets. I know my ds won't ever be given awards and ceremony and prestige. But, then I watch him and he's happy...very happy...and that makes me happy.
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4Real Forums : Living Learning
Topic: this one will convince you to unschool
