| Author | |
MarieC
Forum All-Star
Joined: Oct 19 2005
Location: Ohio
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1011
|
| Posted: Aug 29 2006 at 10:09am | IP Logged
|
 |
|
We're beginning our study of American History this year and Columbus is one of the first explorers we'll study. What are your favorite books about Christopher Columbus? The child I'm studying this with is 8/3rd grade but a really good reader. We're also looking for read alouds.
Thanks!
__________________
Marie
mom to 6
dds-98, 00, 02 and 09 & dss-03 and 06
Out in the Orchard
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Bookswithtea
Forum All-Star
Joined: July 07 2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2621
|
| Posted: Aug 29 2006 at 7:24pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Depends on what "side" of Columbus you want to present. The D'Aulaire book is colorful and presents the traditional view of Columbus as a hero.
We usually read that book and also a book called "Pedro's Journal." This book shows a more mixed side to Columbus' character...not all evil, but not all good, either. And then we talk about him, and about how times were different and we can't put our standards of conduct on peoples who lived under different standards of conduct, etc...
__________________
Blessings,
~Books
mothering ds'93 dd'97 dd'99 dd'02 ds'05 ds'07 and  due 9/10
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
MarieC
Forum All-Star
Joined: Oct 19 2005
Location: Ohio
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1011
|
| Posted: Aug 30 2006 at 6:06am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Books,
Thanks for those suggestions and for the reasons behind them. This child is my oldest so I'm just getting the hang of looking for the other side of the story as I'm a product of schools that just gave you the traditional views. It's frustrating to know what else to look for.
Thanks for your input!
__________________
Marie
mom to 6
dds-98, 00, 02 and 09 & dss-03 and 06
Out in the Orchard
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Bookswithtea
Forum All-Star
Joined: July 07 2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2621
|
| Posted: Aug 30 2006 at 7:29am | IP Logged
|
|
|
When we were in school, the "all good" view of Columbus prevailed. Now I fear that the "all bad" view of Columbus is prevailing.  I always tell my kids that the truth is somewhere in the middle in most cases, and remind them of David in the Old Testament...a man after God's own heart who still committed adultery and murder.
What I would recommend is to go to the library without your munchkins for an hour and look at the picture books about Columbus and just see what tone they have, first.
If you decide to show both sides, its also important to show the side that the Native Americans were not all gentle, peaceful and good, and the Spaniards were not all greedy violent gold digging enslavers. Talk about an oversimplification! 
I'd like to recommend a book or two that are published and only available from Sonlight Curriculum. In their core 3 Intro. to American History, there is a book called Incans Aztecs and Mayans. WARNING! This book is gorey. But John Holzmann has made a point of telling the full truth about the Aztecs. If you live anywhere on the West Coast, you know its become popular to mythologize the Aztec Culture as fully advanced (the truth is that it was advanced technologically but positively savage in terms of respect for life). You don't need to read this entire book to your children (actually, I wouldn't recommend it), but a few pertinent sections (first preread by you) and they will never forget that the cultures Columbus (and then Cortez) encountered in some ways were more violent than the Spaniards who eventually won the war. The other book Sonlight sells is The American Indian Prayer Guide. The prayers are hokey and I edit on the fly as I'm reading aloud. But the information on 36 different tribes across the Americas is excellent, imho.
Finally, its important to also tell the stories of the brave Franciscans who also came from Spain but with God in their hearts. They fought for the Indian's rights. John Holzmann, in the SL books recommended above, even makes the point that the Franciscan way of doing missionary work was, for the time, way more Christian than the Puritan/Pilgrim model (and he's a protestant!). I can't recommend a specific book because I can't remember the title of the last one I used, but a good book on Fr. Serra is crucial. I also like the Vision books on St. Isaac Jogues and Fr. Marquette (you can get these from Emmanuel books).
I wanted to add that I do edit the language of Pedro's Journal occasionally, on the fly. This is not a book to give an elementary child on their own. Its not a bad book at all...it just needs discussion, imho.
Hope this helps!
__________________
Blessings,
~Books
mothering ds'93 dd'97 dd'99 dd'02 ds'05 ds'07 and due 9/10
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
JennGM
Forum Moderator
Joined: Feb 07 2005
Location: Virginia
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 17702
|
| Posted: Aug 30 2006 at 8:32am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Bookswithtea wrote:
When we were in school, the "all good" view of Columbus prevailed. Now I fear that the "all bad" view of Columbus is prevailing. I always tell my kids that the truth is somewhere in the middle in most cases, and remind them of David in the Old Testament...a man after God's own heart who still committed adultery and murder.
What I would recommend is to go to the library without your munchkins for an hour and look at the picture books about Columbus and just see what tone they have, first.
If you decide to show both sides, its also important to show the side that the Native Americans were not all gentle, peaceful and good, and the Spaniards were not all greedy violent gold digging enslavers. Talk about an oversimplification! |
|
|
I hope you don't mind me chiming in. I guess in Catholic schools there was the praise of Christopher Columbus, but generally anything to do with the Spanish in the New World has what has been termed The Black Legend. Think about it: Spain was Catholic, most historians were English and Protestant. There has been quite a bit of Spain bashing over the years. You have to be aware of that when sifting through literature.
I'm going out on a limb to say that Christopher Columbus was a very good man. He strived to be holy. Was he perfect? Absolutely not...but neither am I. If you read his journals, he was very devout. He really wanted to bring Christianity to the Indians. But he wasn't a good leader, so some of the abuses and greediness that happened under his watch is unfortunate, and he mourned the loss of life and cruelty. Things got out of hand and he couldn't rein in the abuses. And some of his decisions weren't good.
Father Serra's name and other Franciscans are quite maligned, too. You have to sift through that bias in your history books, too.
One part of learning history is to develop your historical consciousness -- an awareness of the influence of our culture and history, and seeing the different historical events and figures also influenced by their own culture and history.
Also as Christians, we should view all events pivotal upon Christ's paschal mysteries. Everything before and after point to this central event in history. And so, while learning about the Indians is interesting, there are questions as to where it fits in history. Were they really part of history until they entered the Western influence and Christianity? I know this is part of a large debate...so don't attack me. I'm just following Christopher Dawson's approach. I wish I could find a quote to back me up right now.
We see things with what we think is 20/20 hindsight. We have a completely different culture. It just isn't right to rise up in subsequent generations and completely condemn historical figures because we are now enlightened and see their mistakes. We don't know and understand all the circumstances. Was there evil? Yes, on both sides. The Aztecs were blood thirsty pagans, very scary. And many Spaniards came with just greedy intentions. Slavery was a fact in that time -- is it wrong? Yes. But it has taken a long time to sift through and make a public awareness of that fact.
I'm still a bit fuzzy-brained this morning, so this isn't quite "technical" in terms, but maybe you can see some of my points.
__________________
Jennifer G. Miller
Wife to  & ds1  '03 & ds2  '07
Family in Feast and Feria
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
JennGM
Forum Moderator
Joined: Feb 07 2005
Location: Virginia
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 17702
|
| Posted: Aug 30 2006 at 8:54am | IP Logged
|
|
|
JennGM wrote:
| Also as Christians, we should view all events pivotal upon Christ's paschal mysteries. Everything before and after point to this central event in history. And so, while learning about the Indians is interesting, there are questions as to where it fits in history. Were they really part of history until they entered the Western influence and Christianity? I know this is part of a large debate...so don't attack me. I'm just following Christopher Dawson's approach. I wish I could find a quote to back me up right now. |
|
|
I just wanted to add to this a bit before rotten tomatoes are thrown at me. I'm just furthering the question of "what is history?" If you define it as events and understanding the how and why people came to that decision in that time, then studying different civilizations is more of a social studies. We don't have people or events to study, just a culture and artifacts...if you can see the difference.
__________________
Jennifer G. Miller
Wife to & ds1 '03 & ds2 '07
Family in Feast and Feria
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Bookswithtea
Forum All-Star
Joined: July 07 2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2621
|
| Posted: Aug 30 2006 at 10:50am | IP Logged
|
|
|
JennGM wrote:
| I hope you don't mind me chiming in.. |
|
|
Not at all!
JennGM wrote:
| I guess in Catholic schools there was the praise of Christopher Columbus, but generally anything to do with the Spanish in the New World has what has been termed The Black Legend. Think about it: Spain was Catholic, most historians were English and Protestant. There has been quite a bit of Spain bashing over the years. You have to be aware of that when sifting through literature. |
|
|
I completely agree.
JennGM wrote:
| I'm going out on a limb to say that Christopher Columbus was a very good man. He strived to be holy. Was he perfect? Absolutely not...but neither am I. If you read his journals, he was very devout. He really wanted to bring Christianity to the Indians. But he wasn't a good leader, so some of the abuses and greediness that happened under his watch is unfortunate, and he mourned the loss of life and cruelty. Things got out of hand and he couldn't rein in the abuses. And some of his decisions weren't good. |
|
|
Is this so very different from David? Also devout, also made some huge errors. I didn't mean to suggest that Columbus is a bad guy. I do think that only showing his good sides and not his errors can make things difficult for our children down the road. That's all I meant to communicate.
JennGM wrote:
One part of learning history is to develop your historical consciousness -- an awareness of the influence of our culture and history, and seeing the different historical events and figures also influenced by their own culture and history.
Also as Christians, we should view all events pivotal upon Christ's paschal mysteries. Everything before and after point to this central event in history. And so, while learning about the Indians is interesting, there are questions as to where it fits in history. Were they really part of history until they entered the Western influence and Christianity? I know this is part of a large debate...so don't attack me. I'm just following Christopher Dawson's approach. I wish I could find a quote to back me up right now... |
|
|
I completely agree. I think one purpose in studying the Native Americans, honestly, is to combat the image that Catholic missionaries and the Spanish conquistadors were so "black." Being familiar with the different cultural aspects of the Native Americans is interesting and might be helpful if conversing/evangelizing a Native American, but it certainly doesn't carry the same weight as Greece or Rome. The Sonlight books I recommend are useful, I think, precisely because they combat the Black Legend so effectively, even though they aren't specifically Catholic.
JennGM wrote:
| We see things with what we think is 20/20 hindsight. We have a completely different culture. It just isn't right to rise up in subsequent generations and completely condemn historical figures because we are now enlightened and see their mistakes. We don't know and understand all the circumstances. Was there evil? Yes, on both sides. The Aztecs were blood thirsty pagans, very scary. And many Spaniards came with just greedy intentions. Slavery was a fact in that time -- is it wrong? Yes. But it has taken a long time to sift through and make a public awareness of that fact. |
|
|
I completely agree. This is one of the biggest problems with modern history textbooks, imho. Its not fair for us to rise up in judgment against previous cultures who did not hold our same moral sensibilities.
No tomatoes from me, Jenn.
__________________
Blessings,
~Books
mothering ds'93 dd'97 dd'99 dd'02 ds'05 ds'07 and due 9/10
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Kelly
Forum All-Star
Joined: Feb 21 2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1211
|
| Posted: Aug 30 2006 at 6:05pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Here I go again on my recommendation of the first History Links notebook on how to study history. I think it's great (tho not for everyone, a lot of people don't like it). Still, I think the process they recommend is an excellent one, ie, looking at history thru a lens comprising: 1)primary documentation; 2)history books; 3)archaeology & geography; and 4)the Church's teachings. I always tell my kids it's like navigation: you gotta have more than one reading to give you an accurate location!
Thanks, Jenn, for the link on the Black Legend, too. Always nice to see someone else explain it better than I can! 
Re: Columbus. If you can get your hands on a copy of James Leek's "Evangelization of the Americas" (or is it "Evangelization and the Americas"???) I thought his discussion of Columbus was excellent, straight forward and thought provoking. I think it's geared for grades 6 to 8, but I've used it for all ages, interpreting it for the younger ones, adding more discussion and reading for the older ones.
Last but not least, once you get past Columbus to Cortes, your children would probably really enjoy the cd by Anne Carrol (available thru Seton High School in Manassas, VA) on Cortes. It's a very Catholic POV, but given that 99% of the info out there is stacked against Cortes, I think it's balanced to provide..."The Rest of the Story" (in the words of Paul Harvey) 
Kelly in FL
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
MarieC
Forum All-Star
Joined: Oct 19 2005
Location: Ohio
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1011
|
| Posted: Aug 30 2006 at 10:38pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
WOW! You've all blown me away with your knowledge. My poor kids don't have a very informed teacher here!
Thanks for all of your insight....I've got a lot of research to get going on!
__________________
Marie
mom to 6
dds-98, 00, 02 and 09 & dss-03 and 06
Out in the Orchard
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Erin
Forum Moderator
Joined: Feb 23 2005
Location: Australia
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5814
|
| Posted: Aug 31 2006 at 5:35am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Marie
A fantastic book for your son to read is Christopher Columbus by Mervyn Kaufman this is part of a series the 'World Explorer book' This is a brilliant series and a good reader of eight would have no problem reading it. Although to be honest it makes a great read aloud. 
Another title is 'Son of Columbus' by Hans Baumann. When CC embarked on his fourth voyage to the West Indies he took his 14yr old with him. Looks really great, haven't read it yet 
A thought provoking pictue book is Encounter by Jane Yolenit is the story of the first meeting between a Taino boy and Columbus seen through the eyes of the Taino .
__________________
Erin
Faith Filled Days
Seven Little Australians
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
MarieC
Forum All-Star
Joined: Oct 19 2005
Location: Ohio
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1011
|
| Posted: Aug 31 2006 at 2:35pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Erin,
Thanks for the book suggestions...I'd seen your  for the World explorer books on another post but couldn't find it at my local library. This post got me thinking about other area libraries and I found another one that has it...Yea! Guess I'll be heading that direction soon.
The other 2 look good as well...Encounter is at the branch I frequent!
How does an Aussie know so much American history?! You're sure showing us up!!
Thanks again!
__________________
Marie
mom to 6
dds-98, 00, 02 and 09 & dss-03 and 06
Out in the Orchard
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Erin
Forum Moderator
Joined: Feb 23 2005
Location: Australia
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5814
|
| Posted: Aug 31 2006 at 6:49pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
MarieC wrote:
| How does an Aussie know so much American history?! You're sure showing us up!! |
|
|
Well, I was blessed to grow up in a home with a mother who was as book mad as I My mother collected for years and when she gave up homeschooling I have inherited the family library well at least in trust till my siblings marry.
I have continued to add to the collection  In truth it is easier to find American books more than any other country as you have such big publishers. My other biggest collections would be English and of course Australian. I have a wonderful collection there  The majority of books on my website are from my own shelves.
There is so much written on American history, don't forget to check out poetry on Christopher Columbus.
__________________
Erin
Faith Filled Days
Seven Little Australians
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
SylviaB
Forum Pro
Joined: June 19 2008
Location: Ohio
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 288
|
| Posted: Sept 12 2008 at 7:25pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Anyone have any picture book recommendations on Christopher Columbus?
__________________
Wife to Alex
Mama to Zachary (5/04) and Erin (1/06)
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
MaryM
Board Moderator
Joined: Feb 11 2005
Location: Colorado
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 13104
|
| Posted: Dec 14 2012 at 12:55am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Just finished Demi's Columbus book which was published earlier this fall. I'm including it here and not in the picture book thread because I think it is for an older student. It is a picture book but has extensive text and there are issues/topics that wouldn't be for younger students. It is visually very engaging as her books usually are. It does include lots of naked natives - though done kind of amorphously. Includes pictures of violence - Europeans against natives and vice versa. Presents both the good and bad about Columbus though I thought her bias against showed. I usually find her books to be pretty balanced even if she isn't a believer. So I have a mixed reaction to it, but do think it is worthwhile to include with an older student.
SylviaB wrote:
| Anyone have any picture book recommendations on Christopher Columbus? |
|
|
And just for the record since it doesn't look to ever have been linked here, there is a thread with picture book recommendations - The time of Columbus picture books.
__________________
Mary M. in Denver
Our Domestic Church
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
|
|
4Real Forums : Across Time and Place
Topic: Christopher Columbus
