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Kristin
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As I've mentioned before, I am not really familiar with Charlotte Mason's philosophy but have started looking into it, in particular the daily routine involving short lessons. For those of you who use this as a guideline, how do you plan on working in your time for use of Montessori materials?
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Bunch 'o Honey to my Honey Bunch and Mama to five - Noah 10y  , Rose 8y  , Dominic 2.5 y  , Oliver 16m 
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Meredith
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Kristin, we very much follow the concept of "short lessons" as it allows us time to do our morning work without being burdened by taking too long to finish something. Now that being said, things are a little different for Montessori, especially when introducing a new item/material into the learnig room, there is apt to be a longer period for working with the materials, in fact encouraged. It is very child-led and for the 3-6 age group the desired effect of completing a work until ready to move on is the main goal, as long as it is being used correctly 
I have an example of lessons/rotations I have used in the past with my two older children, but I am having trouble uploading it here, it's an excel document and I can email it to you to look at if you'd like. I believe they were 1st and 3rd grade at the time. Let me know if this is helpful or if you need more specifics, we're still working out the particulars here as well 
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Meredith
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Jordan
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This is a big question for me too, Kristin. You and I just seem to be right on the same page.
I haven't started yet, but I am thinking I will start by presenting one or two things a day. Then, I'm just going to see what the dynamic will be like. Is my 4 yo interested and asking for more? How is my 2 yo fitting into it? I'm sure I'll need to make adjustments.
I am also planning to do FIAR next year so I'll be putting this together with our Montessori materials. I would like to find a way for these to compliment each other. I would like to use Montessori geography materials, with our FIAR book. Maybe I'll print up nomenclature cards that are relevant to our book.
I would like for the things we do to blend well together so that it feels natural and like part of life, rather than something awkward or artificial. I think if I made a big sudden switch to being Mama Montessori, my kids would be confused and all of the new materials and ways of handling them would be strange and uncomfortable. Okay, I'm rambling. I know others can answer much better than I can.
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Jordan
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Meredith
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Jordan wrote:
| I would like for the things we do to blend well together so that it feels natural and like part of life, rather than something awkward or artificial. I think if I made a big sudden switch to being Mama Montessori, my kids would be confused and all of the new materials and ways of handling them would be strange and uncomfortable. |
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This sounds just right Jordan, and I am sure that if you approach it gradually in your own style, your dc will just think it is a natural progression into *school*! They are so young, you have lots of time to make adjustments as they come up. I think you're doing a great job 
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Meredith
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AndreaG
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Well I am still hammering out my schedule, but I have used the 15 minute CM lessons for required subjects that my son didn't necesarily want or choose to be doing, but I felt were important. I think I will inject this into a 3 hour montessori work period, by giving him the choice of when during that time he wants to do his 15 minutes of math, and 15 minutes of spelling etc. This particular child really really likes/needs routines so I imagine he will end up "choosing" about the same time everyday, which will make it easy for me to plan what I will be presenting during the rest of the time. We'll see though - it might be too chaotic now that I will be adding a second child that I will require to do math and language everyday, I might just have to have a CM schedule followed by a montessori "choice time".
I'd love to hear how others do this or what your plans are!
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Andrea
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Eleanor
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For the preschool and kindergarten years, we don't plan on doing any structured "lessons," other than our Montessori time. We're aiming for the full 3 hour work period, a few days a week (or maybe even every day, if it works out for our family). Within this time, the children can choose to spend as much time as they want on an activity, whether it's just a few minutes, or the whole 3 hours. They can also have as many presentations as I think they can benefit from; there's no set limit. This is all in keeping with the Montessori philosophy.
Outside of "school hours," we'll continue to enjoy read-alouds, music time, nature appreciation, and indoor and outdoor play, just as part of our everyday family life. As I understand it, these sorts of informal activities are pretty much all that Charlotte Mason recommends for this age group. We'd be doing them anyway, but it's a happy coincidence. 
After age 6, we plan to keep using the Montessori manipulatives and work period for some subjects, but we'll also set aside a separate time to study other topics (e.g. Latin and religion) in a more lesson-based way. Not sure how much these lessons will be influenced by Charlotte Mason's ideas, but it's certainly something we're considering.
This "back and forth" style is a bit different from the way most other families on this board seem to be doing things (except Andrea, maybe?), but it's what we're comfortable with. If I attempted to blend the methods, and do "Montessori in a Charlotte Mason-ish way," or "Charlotte Mason in a Montessori-ish way," I'm pretty sure I'd end up thoroughly confused! My husband feels the same way. We'd prefer to choose the best method (as we see it) to teach the material in question, and then stick fairly closely to the original philosophy when we're implementing it.
I guess this could be seen as "artificial" for some families, but my husband and I are quite nerdy to begin with  ... so our version of "Real Learning" is going to be pretty intense, no matter what. We're actually drawn to Montessori because the interaction with concrete materials provides a much-needed balance to our book-, Internet- and conversation-saturated home life. I shudder to think what would happen if we tried unschooling, or a very heavy and wide-ranging classical curriculum. Our children would be buried in books, become nearsighted by age 5, and gradually lose the use of their limbs (except for typing and page-turning).
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Meredith
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Eleanor wrote:
| For the preschool and kindergarten years, we don't plan on doing any structured "lessons," other than our Montessori time....Within this time, the children can choose to spend as much time as they want on an activity, whether it's just a few minutes, or the whole 3 hours. They can also have as many presentations as I think they can benefit from; there's no set limit. This is all in keeping with the Montessori philosophy. |
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This is much how it will be in our home too Eleanor. Afterall, once the presentations are made, the dc are free to explore and work with the materials available for a nice long time, it just may vary with each child
Eleanor wrote:
| Outside of "school hours," we'll continue to enjoy read-alouds, music time, nature appreciation, and indoor and outdoor play, just as part of our everyday family life. As I understand it, these sorts of informal activities are pretty much all that Charlotte Mason recommends for this age group. We'd be doing them anyway, but it's a happy coincidence. |
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I agree with you on that!! Charlotte and Maria had much of the same ideals for small children along with a great respect for the child as a whole person.
Eleanor wrote:
This "back and forth" style is a bit different from the way most other families on this board seem to be doing things (except Andrea, maybe?), but it's what we're comfortable with. If I attempted to blend the methods, and do "Montessori in a Charlotte Mason-ish way," or "Charlotte Mason in a Montessori-ish way," I'm pretty sure I'd end up thoroughly confused! |
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No, not really. I don't think any of us here are trying to re-establish the methods or principles, we're just realistic about how it really looks in a home educating environment. Keep in mind that many of us (yourself included) are dealing with multiple children with varying ages and needs, that's what makes it Real Learning for us, IMHO Anyone else?
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Mackfam
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I do plan on having lessons in some subjects in the morning. I don't consciously think of how much time I spend on each lesson, but I do keep them very short. After morning lessons, I plan on offering some choice time. That time will be limited at first, but increase to 2-3 hours as the year progresses. Any other learning time for the older children takes place after lunch. My 10yo will complete her history reading from living books at this time, there will be independent reading time for my 6yo. After reading time is science/nature study, and Catechesis of the Good Shepherd presentations. I don't mind if the children use the materials at later times during the day. In fact, last year, it was not uncommon to find my 6yo taking things out after dinner.
CM and Montessori complement each other beautifully to me, at all ages. But their fit is not so much in trying to merge one philosophy on top of the other. It is rather in that they both propose beautiful and living, whole things for the child to stimulate and offer "real" experiences through Montessori or "real" ideas through living books. Montessori materials bring in the concrete, CM's ideas bring in the abstract with the living books. Both are very "real" ways of learning and for the older child in particular, seem to merge in a way that helps bring about so many meaningful connections.
I will be doing a lot of what Jordan is doing, just feeling things out. So much of starting a new year is really about just playing around with the schedule and anticipating the needs of the children. It is so important to be flexible with the routine at first. One child may move very differently than another.
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Jen Mackintosh
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Eleanor
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Meredith wrote:
| No, not really. I don't think any of us here are trying to re-establish the methods or principles, we're just realistic about how it really looks in a home educating environment. |
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In past threads, several people have mentioned that they liked the Natural Structure book. This approach sets out to blend Montessori and classical education, rather than Montessori and CM, but IMO the idea is the same: Try to get the best of both worlds, by combining what seem to be the essential principles from each philosophy.
This is a noble aim, and one to which I was attracted in the beginning, but I'm no longer personally interested in pursuing it. For me, it's a big enough challenge to adapt *either* Montessori or classical (or CM, or some other style) to a given learning situation in our home environment, while keeping the integrity and "track record" that drew me to it in the first place. If I were trying to combine the methods, and apply them simultaneously... my brain would be chaos central.
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lapazfarm
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Chaos central, checking in!LOL!
There is no one method or set of materials which completely satisfies me. Perhaps I am a madwoman, but I think I have a good grip on how I want our school days to go, and I will use the parts of whatever established methods that suit me. Experts are great, but I am the "leading expert" on my kids. And I think that is one of the main points of "Real Learning".
I plan to start our day with read-aloud and then move into our work cycle. I'll present a couple of things a day, leaning heavily on language until dd's reading takes off. There will be times when dd and ds work together (geography in particular), and times they work separately. I think the flow of the day will be like that, sort of back and forth between time alone, together, and with me.
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AndreaG
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I think that homeschooling is so individual, what works for one would be chaos for another! I love hearing all the different approaches and discussing both the philosophies and practical applications of them! That said, I am trying to simplify this year by following a pretty "purist" montessori approach for my 3-6 ers, and following a montessori spine for my oldest. I don't think I know enough about elementary montessori to do a purist approach and I also have gathered an eclectic array of elemements from other approaches (4 year history cycles, nature study, poetry memorization etc) that I will also incorporate.
I do appreciate Eleanor's perspective on chaos- I have in the past made myself crazy trying to concoct the "perfect" homeschool curriculum with the best of every approach from classical to charlotte mason to thomas jefferson to Mother of Divine Grace etc etc. I strongly believe in the importance of praying to the Holy Spirit for guidance in this area. This year I am feeling a call to more simplicity and focus and sticking to one approach and really getting the most out of it so I am going montessori for the most part- though I am sure I will just have to do a FIAR unit or two!
I am trying to use montessori as the measure and only bring in things from other philosophies in as much as they are compatible with it- for example I won't be following a CM schedule of 15 minute lessons, because I want to have 3 hour montessori work cycle, but I might have my son do a 15 minute math lesson as part of his daily workplan.
All this to say that there are so many ways to combine things- I'm glad we can discuss all the variations here!
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Meredith
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Eleanor wrote:
| In past threads, several people have mentioned that they liked the Natural Structure book. This approach sets out to blend Montessori and classical education, rather than Montessori and CM, but IMO the idea is the same: Try to get the best of both worlds, by combining what seem to be the essential principles from each philosophy. |
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I agree with you on the Natural Structure as it is much more difficult to incorporate a Classical approach with Montessori. And I am in total agreement with you on creating chaos when *an* approach is the best fit for your family. With experience you will find what your niche is, and I'm so glad that we have found ours with Montessori and are able to use it to suit our needs. Like Theresa, as parents, we are the experts of our children and that's why I love the freedom of home education!!
I wish you many chaos free days in your journey, it'll be so fun for all of you
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Meredith
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Jordan
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Eleanor wrote:
| I guess this could be seen as "artificial" for some families... |
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I'm sorry, Eleanor, for making a statement that could be interpreted as a generalization for using the Montessori Method at home. To clarify, I was actually just talking about my own inexperience and thinking that it will take practice and experience for me to gain confidence. This will be very new for me and I don't want to sound to my kids as if I'm reading from a script or bringing in too many changes at once. This is what I meant by "artificial." I am sure that someone with more experience and background with Montessori could make a smoother transition in less time than I could.
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Mackfam
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Jordan, you clarified beautifully. Like you, I enjoy preparing and reading, but in the end, I just gotta get in there and get some practice. I think you are right in wanting your presentations to be as "organic" as possible.
Eleanor, I think I understand where you're coming from. I too appreciate the simplicity and ease of only focusing on one teaching manner/philosophy at one time, and truth be told, I wish I could do it - it would sure simplify a lot for me. With young children, Montessori is such a natural fit and extension of their already existing learning environments. You are able to do that with your young children. Montessori makes sense to continue with.
My perspective is a bit different, and I think that is where the difference lies, not in your choice to follow Montessori exclusively, but in my need to provide more for the emerging needs my older children have.
For my toddler I will be able to stick with an exclusive Montessori method. That will not be possible with my 6 and 10yo though. The 6yo will benefit from a mostly Montessori learning environment, with many extensions using those wonderful materials, but he will need more as a child that is now reading and beginning to ask more abstract questions. I must address those needs too. As a Mommy of multiple ages, I want to bring the Montessori in as well as those CM philosophies that allow my older children to experience nature and their other lessons in a living and "real" way. My 10 yo is well into a more abstract line of thought, but because we did not start out strong like you are in Montessori, there are some areas that need a little remediation (like her handwriting and some parts-of-speech practice) that I think Montessori addresses in a very ideal way. She's also thrilled to have the opportunity to work with the geography materials, and I see it as a wonderful way to reinforce her history and literature experiences. It ties so much together. I don't want to water down Montessori for her. I think it offers her opportunities she missed along the way and I want to expose her to that.
Could this be where we're splitting in our philosophies? I think if I understand you correctly, your children are both younger and able to enjoy the benefits you can offer them in a pure Montessori environment. As a mother of children in every Montessori age group I must assess my children and their learning needs and provide accordingly while keeping in mind my own natural teaching style. It is a lot to juggle, and overwhelming unless I include the Holy Spirit in the equation. My older children have not had the benefits your dc will have in starting out in a Montessori environment. Your dc may not need the reinforcement in certain areas that my children need because of the wonderful foundation you are providing for them now. I believe that Montessori and Charlotte Mason are both paths with the same goal in mind - Real Learning. Each of our homeschool environments will, and should look different because as loving mothers and experts in our own children, we tailor our homes to best meet the needs they have - this may include some, none, or only Montessori, but we all have that same goal of providing an atmosphere of "Real Learning." It is so wonderful that on these boards we can all benefit from each other's real experiences. I appreciate hearing the differing perspectives because it helps keep me well rounded. I'm grateful for your experience here, and look forward to hearing how Montessori works in your home.
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montessori_lori
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I'm going to add my $0.02 (always seems more like a dollar's worth!)
I observed the 3-hour work cycle many times in my classroom, and here's what I noticed. Interspersed with the work are things like line time, presentations, snack, reading groups, talking with other kids, etc. Also sometimes a child would take 5-10 minutes to walk around the room and choose a work. Or they would watch another child work for a little while.
It also helped enormously with work choices that they were able to see the work their friends were doing - often, if they finished their own work and didn't know what else to do, they'd wait until someone else had finished their work and take it right from them (no one stopped at the shelf to drop it off and pick it up).
At home, most of these dynamics are not there. Even if you are homeschooling more than one child, chances are they are not all using the same level of work (or doing it in the same way). You may not be doing line time or reading groups every day. There may not be kids the same age who can work together (and spur each other on to new work or more complicated work).
In other words, I didn't find that the 3-hour work cycle worked at home. Two hours would have been our maximum, and often it was less than that. For awhile I kept fighting for it to be longer, and it just didn't gel.
I'm excited about this new year - my kids haven't been doing Montessori work this summer as we did in years past - so everything will be exciting and new. And they'll be a year older. Maybe our work time will get longer, but if not, I'm okay with that. We just can't replicate the classroom dynamic with 2 kids who are 3 1/2 years apart.
Again, just my $1.00!
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Meredith
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montessori_lori wrote:
At home, most of these dynamics are not there. Even if you are homeschooling more than one child, chances are they are not all using the same level of work (or doing it in the same way). You may not be doing line time or reading groups every day. There may not be kids the same age who can work together (and spur each other on to new work or more complicated work).
In other words, I didn't find that the 3-hour work cycle worked at home. Two hours would have been our maximum, and often it was less than that. For awhile I kept fighting for it to be longer, and it just didn't gel.
I'm excited about this new year - my kids haven't been doing Montessori work this summer as we did in years past - so everything will be exciting and new. And they'll be a year older. Maybe our work time will get longer, but if not, I'm okay with that. We just can't replicate the classroom dynamic with 2 kids who are 3 1/2 years apart.
Again, just my $1.00! |
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Totally a $1.00's worth! Thanks for stopping in here again to share your wisdom! We are definatley in this boat here with an 11yog, and three boys 8.5, 5, and 2. So my dynamic is going to be, hmm, let's just say interesting  I am going to aim for the 5yo and the 2yo to have their work periods or choice times in the morning for obvious reasons, as we really like to school in the am hours and have our afternoons free. That is all part and parcel as to *How* the 2yo allows the 5yo to actually DO his work! I may have to do presentations with the 5yo during said 2yo's nap if it fails miserably  ! But I am realistic too in knowing there will be a *break in* period to the new school year as there always is with all the dc.
I really appreciate your insight here Lori and thanks so much for sharing here!! I hope your new year is fantastic!!
Blessings!
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Meredith
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SeaStar
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That is a great observation, Lori- thanks for passing it on. I have wondered how at home, where everyone is a different age, that group dynamic would work. I need to adjust my expectations.
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CatholicMommy
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I have up to 5 daycare children ranging from infancy to age 5) plus my son most schoolyear mornings and we have rarely worked to the 3 hour mark.
We do have short lessons though - then they have independent work - perhaps they need another presentation later in the morning - whatever.
In the winter months we return to it all in the afternoon, and sometimes in the evening, for maybe another 1-2 hours.
Everyone above is right in that with smaller groups, the entire 3 hours are not usually necessary, but to have that time "slotted" allows you to be more relaxed about when to actually end. ie rather than scheduling an hour and the kids really could have gone longer...
So yes, it's give and take, based on what your family needs.
This coming year for us will be something entirely different (and I don't even know what yet!), but I will certainly miss these 3 past wonderful years of Montessori daycare in my home... 
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I really appreciate your take on things Lori! So helpful to hear how it works in your home! I want to be flexible here, but I'm glad to hear that affirmation once again that Montessori in a home setting is just different - there are different dynamics at work! Love your .02!
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Jen Mackintosh
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Kristin
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Thanks for giving us a snapshot of the 3-hour work period in a Montessori classroom, Lori. It is very helpful! Your comments have helped me understand why we never came close to the 3 hour mark; all those little extra things taking place would easily add another hour or more!
What you said confirms my own experience here in our home. When ds was 2.5 yrs old (actually just under), his work period was probably about 45min - 1hr. By year's end, he worked slightly longer. The following year it jumped up to about 1.5 hours. I'll be interested to see if it increases again this year.
This seems like a pertinent time to share an idea given me by a Montessori friend of mine. She said that if I want to spark an interest in a new work, I could sit down and begin practicing the work myself in the vicinity of the child, as other children do in a traditional Montessori setting. She also indicated to me that this approach can be used to motivate a child in a certain area where interest is lacking. Child may say, "Oh, I want to do that work!" And you say, "Great! If you want to do this work, you need to do this other work first."
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4Real Forums : Nurturing the Years of Wonder
Topic: Montessori Routine / CM
