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hobbitmom
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| Posted: July 19 2007 at 8:41am | IP Logged
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Eleanor, not to hijack your thread (maybe you could start a new one?), but your comments here and in other places have piqued my curiosity about the differences between AMI and AMS... Which is Montessori R&D, by the way?
Amy
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CatholicMommy
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| Posted: July 19 2007 at 10:56am | IP Logged
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Here's a quick description:
AMI is the original organization established by Maria and Mario Montessori (her son) in 1929. He continued until his death, and I believe the family is still running it (I could be wrong on this point). AMI = Association Montessori Internationale and is headquartered in Amsterdam, The Netherlands. Their training is recognized all around the world.
AMI website
AMS = American Montessori Society. It was established here in the US in 1960 to get the word out more; not quite so elitest-feeling as AMI, but not necessarily as 'pure' (this is not necessarily a bad thing - I'm just pointing it out). AMS is the one publishing or encouraging the publication of books that can be understood by the homeschooling parent: Hainstock's books for example. AMS website
The other differences between the two could open a whole can of worms (and it does in some circles!)...
Does this help?
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CatholicMommy
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| Posted: July 19 2007 at 11:05am | IP Logged
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Just found this as well: From this website
QUOTE: What is AMI?
What is the difference between AMS and AMI (Association Montessori Internationale) schools? AMI was established by Maria Montessori and her son, Mario in 1929 and has international headquarters in Amsterdam, The Netherlands. In AMI schools, Montessori philosophy and curriculum are implemented in a way that is consistent with the original approach of Maria Montessori. The Montessori materials are used precisely in the manner used by Dr. Montessori without deviation or extensions; preserving the purity of the method is of the utmost importance. In AMS schools, teachers bring in outside resources, materials, and ideas to extend or supplement the Montessori curriculum. AMS teachers bring the world into the classroom. Examples include the use of technology and current events. Additional information about AMI can be obtained through their website www.montessori-ami.org. END QUOTE
I sort of disagree with the above post (ie AMI does bring the world in, just in a different way), but the basic idea is there.
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montessori_lori
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| Posted: July 19 2007 at 12:12pm | IP Logged
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Just to add a little...AMS was founded because early adopters of Montessori in the US thought that there were changes that needed to be made to the Montessori method for it to be applicable in America. Some tried to get AMI to change, and when they refused, AMS was founded.
There is unfortunately a rivalry between the two, with many AMI people (especially the older generation) looking down on AMS as being not a good or not really Montessori.
As I mentioned in a recent Grace & Courtesy post at my blog, I attended an AMI conference in Chicago about 10 years ago. The conference ended with a dinner, and at the dinner I told the other people at my table that I was AMS trained. Several of them looked at me as if I were a bug that had just crawled out from under their plate...but others were nice and some had worked at AMS schools before so they deigned to talk to me =)
My training, while AMS, gave me the best of both worlds. My trainer, Sister Mary Motz, did her training back when there was only AMI in the United States, no AMS yet. So she brought a lot of that into her training: the precision and perfectionism in presentations, the extremely high level of expectation set for the children, the purity of the classroom and materials.
There are strengths to both methods, and I think the younger generations of both organizations are much more likely to emphasize the commonalities rather than the differences. There were hard feelings on both sides after the split back in the 60's, but that generation has gone on now. Many of my customers are AMI, and several Montessori companies are run by AMI-trained people, but you'd not see many differences between their materials and mine (Montessori Print Shop, Maitri Learning).
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Eleanor
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| Posted: July 19 2007 at 1:04pm | IP Logged
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CatholicMommy wrote:
| AMS = American Montessori Society. It was established here in the US in 1960 to get the word out more |
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Well, not exactly... as Lori suggests, it was more complicated than that. Here's the history, as I've found it.
Maria Montessori tried to establish her method in the US in the 1920's, but wasn't successful. Dewey's philosophy had a stronghold over the hearts and minds of educators.
In the 1950's, several American Catholic parents -- dissatisfied with the rote methods used in parochial schools -- learned about Montessori, and began studying and promoting it. You'll see references to this early Montessori movement in the writings of Dorothy Day, Mary Reed Newland, Integrity magazine, and other pre-Vatican II "progressives". (I have a special interest in learning about this era, which, in hindsight, was a very mixed bag. It brought us everything from the Catholic Worker movement, to Pre-Cana, to La Leche League, to false ecumenism and churches-in-the-round.  )
One woman, Nancy Rambusch, made Montessori her personal crusade. She studied the method in England with the AMI (of course, Montessori was all AMI back then). After she came back to the US, she ran a small school in her apartment, then got together with some other parents and started a bigger school in Connecticut. I think this was the first official Montessori school in the US, at least in recent times. Although all the parents were Catholic, the school was non-sectarian, and was simply called "The Whitby School" (no reference to Catholicism -- or even to Montessori, for that matter).
In the 1950's, Nancy Rambusch was on good terms with Mario Montessori, and her organization was considered to be the American branch of the AMI. But Mrs. Rambusch always seemed to have a desire to adapt the method to make it "more suited to American children" -- even though it was already thriving in many cultures throughout the world (and, based on her own accounts, it seemed to be working fine with her American students!). There's a definite streak of iconoclasm in her writings, as well as a sense of "well, we're Americans; of course we can't do things the way the old world does."
Around 1960, this all came to a head when she published her book Learning How to Learn, which was critical of some aspects of the original method, and indeed of MM herself. (I have this book, and was just re-reading it last night... I'll try to find some relevant quotations.) Mario Montessori took exception to this, and a rather heated correspondence followed. This was what eventually led to the split.
When Mrs. Rambusch declared her intention to start a new society to promote her "new and improved" method, Mario Montessori claimed that the AMI, as the recognized international association founded by Dr. M. herself, had a copyright over the name and method. Mrs. Rambusch responded by suing the AMI in a US court, and she won. Because of this, since the mid-60's, anyone has been allowed to use the name "Montessori."
Not too long after that, Nancy Rambusch left the Whitby School over some other controversy involving the board of directors. The school still exists, but, as far as I can tell, it has no Catholic connection whatsoever. Nor does it have any connection to the AMS; in fact, its mission statement cites Montessori as an "inspiration" rather than a model.
These days, the vast majority of American Montessori schools are either AMS, or unaffiliated schools with their own spin on the method (some of which make "true AMS" seem positively rigorous by comparison!). This seems to be particularly true of Catholic Montessori, since many religious congregations started AMS-affiliated schools in the 1960's. (Some of the more recently-established schools, such as Holy Rosary in Cleveland, are AMI-affiliated.)
Here are some of the external, practical differences between the "average" AMS and AMI school:
- AMS has "circle time;" AMI does not.
- AMS usually has a 2-hour work period, rather than 3.
- AMS is open to adding new types of materials, while AMI sticks to those that are "strictly Montessori."
- AMS teachers will present extensions (alternative uses of materials) to the child, either directly or through photos; this isn't generally done by AMI teachers.
Of course, this is general -- a lot of it depends on the individual teacher, as Lori says.
(Regarding Montessori R&D: I'm not sure if they're officially connected to the AMS, but I'm pretty sure they're not AMI-affiliated.)
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montessori_lori
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Thanks for that info, Eleanor. A lot of that is new to me. And it's interesting that one of Sister Mary's trainers was Nancy Rambusch - before the split. (When Sister Mary told me that, I was like, "You trained with Nancy McCormick Rambusch! No way!!")
Here's an article I found from Time magazine in 1964 about Nancy Rambusch:
Montessori in the Slums
I should say that from my perspective, I think there were necessary differences for Americans wanting to be involved in Montessori. For starters, AMI required that people come to Bergamo to be trained, and that their trainers be people who had themselves trained with Maria. That wasn't possible for most Americans, but much easier for Europeans.
Also, there were things like introducing the Pink, Blue, and Green Series materials for reading, and the more casual American way of life. So I can see how the Montessori method needed to expand and change once it came over here.
Today, there are AMI training centers around the world and so their own requirements have changed. But it took a long time for that to happen.
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Eleanor
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| Posted: July 19 2007 at 1:28pm | IP Logged
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You're welcome, Lori. I'd love to be able to fill in more of the blanks (especially regarding the correspondence between Mario M. and Nancy R.), but I don't have access to the documents. If anyone lives in Connecticut, and is willing and able to visit the UConn library, maybe you can enlighten us!
Also, I just wanted to add that some AMI Montessorians are very homeschool-friendly -- e.g., Susan and Jim Stephenson, who run the Michael Olaf company. But they don't recommend trying to set up a copy of a Montessori school in your home (unless you have AMI training, and enough children, space, and resources to set up a full classroom environment).
Instead, they advise homeschooling parents to follow more of an "unschooling" approach, using "Montessori-style" materials.
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CatholicMommy
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| Posted: July 19 2007 at 2:26pm | IP Logged
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Thank you Eleanor for adding the details - I didn't think I'd have time today to add them, so I tried to summarize what I could - my own summaries don't always come across clearly though :)
Funny you mention Holy Rosary - that is where I took my CGS Level II training. The trainer there explained how the school got started (because of CGS actually!). I never had a chance to visit the classrooms, but I would have loved to do so.
And I just spent the last 2 hours on the phone with the the (AMI) training center in St. Paul. They are waiting for 1 more reference form and 1 more transcript but it looks I'm pretty much in! Finally, something settled!
I will definitely be the AMI person who homeschools, shares information, etc!
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Eleanor
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| Posted: July 19 2007 at 2:46pm | IP Logged
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Wow, that is a wonderful opportunity! 
You want to hear something funny... When I was engaged to be married, I was out of work for several months, and was rooming with a friend who lived within walking distance of an AMI training center. (Given that there are only a handful in the country, this is no small thing.) It would have been so easy for me to do the training and the internship. Of course, even though I already had an interest in homeschooling, and in Montessori specifically, I wasn't thinking about such practical matters at the time. Talk about hindsight!
Oh, well. I'm sure I'll get another chance later, if it's meant to be. Meanwhile, I can ramble on about anything I like, with no risk of losing my non-existent accreditation.  
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Meredith
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| Posted: July 19 2007 at 5:34pm | IP Logged
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Wow, so much good information here ladies, thank to everyone who put the time in on this one  Congrats Catholicmommy on your possible Training!! Sounds awesome!!
Blessings!
__________________
Meredith
Mom of 4 Sweeties
Sweetness and Light
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Eleanor
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| Posted: July 20 2007 at 4:29pm | IP Logged
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Also wanted to add something else...
The belief that "parents shouldn't attempt to use the Montessori materials at home" isn't just an AMI thing. Nancy Rambusch actually devotes several pages to this issue in her 1960 book. She brings up concerns related to lack of training, lack of dedicated classroom space, and the constant distractions of running a household full of children of various ages.
"Who can build the pink tower with the baby cruising nearby? Who can work with the maps when Tanganyika is in imminent danger of disappearing? ... The principal error of Montessori enthusiasts is the failure to recognize that the materials do not teach automatically, under any circumstances. The child must be in an environment designed to dispose him to work and have at hand a directress who will protect his right to learn." -- p. 109
I get the sense that she's saying this from a "been there, done that" perspective, rather than from some sort of elitism. She seemed to believe that it was a much better idea to help parents get together and set up schools.
While I'm not convinced that it's impossible to do "full Montessori" at home -- otherwise, I wouldn't be trying to do it myself -- I do think it's a pretty huge undertaking (and possibly a slightly crazy one ), and very different from just incorporating a few aspects of the philosophy into an eclectic homeschooling program. The major Montessori organizations, such as AMS, AMI, and NAMTA (which is AMI-affiliated), all seem to discourage the former, while encouraging the latter. (For instance, see NAMTA's advice to homeschoolers.)
Of course, even with an eclectic style, it's possible to use some of the authentic Montessori materials. But one could argue that, outside the context of the full "prepared environment," these highly specialized materials wouldn't necessarily be of any particularly great benefit. If this is true, then parents might just as well use other types of materials -- whether purchased or homemade -- that teach similar concepts, and that are likely to be much less expensive and more versatile.
This is getting way OT, so I'll stop now.  Just wanted to point out that the above attitude to homeschooling is likely to be the "official" standpoint of most Montessori organizations, not just the AMI. And that it might not be primarily motivated by a sense of elitism, or a desire to "defend one's turf." (Though, human nature being what it is, I'm sure there are some teachers out there, of various stripes, who are inclined to that sort of thinking.  )
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hobbitmom
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| Posted: July 20 2007 at 8:29pm | IP Logged
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Eleanor wrote:
While I'm not convinced that it's impossible to do "full Montessori" at home -- otherwise, I wouldn't be trying to do it myself -- I do think it's a pretty huge undertaking (and possibly a slightly crazy one ), and very different from just incorporating a few aspects of the philosophy into an eclectic homeschooling program. The major Montessori organizations, such as AMS, AMI, and NAMTA (which is AMI-affiliated), all seem to discourage the former, while encouraging the latter. (For instance, see NAMTA's advice to homeschoolers.)
Of course, even with an eclectic style, it's possible to use some of the authentic Montessori materials. But one could argue that, outside the context of the full "prepared environment," these highly specialized materials wouldn't necessarily be of any particularly great benefit.
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Actually, Eleanor, you’re not off topic at all. This addresses my real concern behind the original question. I’ve been starting to wonder whether it’s even possible for me to implement Montessori at home (as opposed to "something Montessori-ish"), and if not, what benefit dc would get out of the attempt.
On the one hand I’m convinced that Montessori is the kind of education I want for them; on the other is my need to be realistic as to what I can and can’t do; and on the other (if only I DID have three hands!) is my conviction that home is where dc belong, rather than sending them away to school. I’ve been struggling against the growing concern that one of those has to give—either I keep them home OR they get the real Montessori experience.
Eleanor wrote:
If this is true, then parents might just as well use other types of materials -- whether purchased or homemade -- that teach similar concepts, and that are likely to be much less expensive and more versatile.
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And this is where I’m at, hovering on the edge of parting with what seems a shocking amount of money and wondering if in fact it’s the right thing for me to do.
Keep talking. It helps to get other perspectives and not simply go round in circles in my head.
Amy
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CatholicMommy
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| Posted: July 20 2007 at 9:43pm | IP Logged
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My own opinion:
There is something special about having Montessori in a classroom - the community, etc.
But there is something special about using the philosophy at home, the ability to focus on one aspect of a learning at a time, the family sense of community, mutual respect, etc.
Montessori at home without the specialized training, with few of the specialized materials can truly reap many many benefits. My son and I have 'done' Montessori since prior to his birth - and I know that we have been blessed through it - I also know that the public school students I have tutored in the last 2 years have sometimes ONLY learned something with Montessori materials, NO other way worked. No we don't do it the 'same' as a Montessori school, but I do see benefit to having those specialized materials - the focus on essentials, but I'm also ok with having cardboard versions, as long as the essential teaching is there with no distractions.
Little babies crying? Toddlers running around? Every child at a completely different stage? I think that's what I like about Montessori - I can work around those things easier with Montessori than with anything else. I personally find it 'easier' but perhaps it's 'just my style' too???
Ask me a year from now if my opinion is different, but I doubt it will have changed.
I think there are benefits to both sides (home and school), yet if I had my own way, I would be at home with my son and more children, homeschooling, with Montessori - with or without the training.
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ALmom
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| Posted: July 21 2007 at 12:14am | IP Logged
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Well I'm totally unqualified to be in this discussion, as I have no real Montessori experience and only one week of on-line training and some messing around with trying this out. With that said please do take what I say with a grain of salt.
Is it possible that all this discussion is really about semantics and not about whether or not these teachers think we can do a good, even great job with our children?
I do know that Dr. Montessori spent a long time working out her method through trial and error - but in the end it does seem as if every little thing is important in what she developed. Teachers in school have spent a long time studying all these little things and why they are so important. Someone who has spent years and years studying this, see these little connections and are aware of some things that are lost when it all isn't followed and so understandably resent someone calling something Montessori when it really does not include some of these things that they appreciate. It takes time to really appreciate all these and some things simply do not lend themselves to in the home - like the totally uninterrupted time to focus. I know at our house, a day will not go by that either the dog doesn't run and bark at the jogger going around the block just as little 4 yo is beginning to concentrate and it breaks concentration - or the baby gets fussy or falls down and observer/directress mom has to run to tend to the emergency and something is missed or it takes too long and in the meantime someone gets bored and ... You all know the realities of family life. Now, I don't happen to think that this is going to make or break our school, but I do know it does mean we will never completely imitate/be a Montessori school. It doesn't mean I don't imitate many things quite closely, that I learn to show the materials well, understand them quite well and achieve great things with my children. But, in truth, I am not a Montessori school or Montessori homeschool. I am eclectic with a Montessori style.
Actually I'd say the same thing about classical education - and we have some aspects of this as well. I do not do a classical approach (this requires enthusiasm, passion, deep knowledge on the part of the teacher in the subject taught). Now I can be knowledgeable and passionate about some subjects, not all and I'm not sure I have a really deep knowledge in any subject though I come closer in some than in others - but I can still adapt things I like such as dialogue, leading students to discover, the socratic method and we can achieve great things and learn some things together - but I don't kid myself in having phenomenal expertise in these areas and I'm sure my children would progress much more quickly under the tutelage of St. Augustine or St. Thomas Aquinas or the Jesuit schools of the 1500s- and we certainly call on the aid of St Thomas Aquinas using a students prayer we have - but for whatever reason, God didn't give us those specific opportunities, so we take what is available to us and make it work for our family to the best of our abilities.
I really don't think it is elitist and I don't mind saying that I am not doing Montessori. I'm doing the best I can to imitate those aspects of her program that I understand and which resonate as true or are particularly helpful with our children. Some of us may imitate quite a bit more than others and have quite a bit more understanding of the method than others. Some may imitate everything but the fact that aspect that is impossible because it is in a home and not a school. (My house will never be the ideal place for deep/silent concentration no matter how well behaved and great my kids are or even how well they learn to be quiet in their activities. I have real babies and real dogs who take off barking after real joggers and real distractions that come with my double duty as teacher and mom).
Sometimes the seeming pickiness about semantics has to do with the way others use the examples from various poor imitations to badger the schools about its ineffectiveness or failures. I suspect the same people who caution homeschoolers would have the same trouble with copycat schools. We are simply being asked to be honest if we don't have the formal training and school set up to not say we are Montessori. Then when we modify things to fit our needs - even if the only modification we make is that we deal with the messiness and beauty of daily family life everyday 24/7 without the seperate school setting - then no one gets confused.
I also suspect that they may be cautioning us not to get so paranoid that we throw out the good in frustration because we cannot ever achieve that same level of quiet (the dog will run through our room and knock over someones carefully done work with the pink tower, I'm sure - and I may be distracted and frazzled if I think I must be present every single time, every single child uses the materials -it would be physically impossible for me and I cannot leave out every material all the time or even for set "school hours" as even in our large house we don't have that much space) or that we simply cannot afford every one of the beautifully made materials. Now, I know that my environment or my homemade items or my inexperience probably mean I may lose some things - but life is what it is and I'm sure we'll gain other things that Dr. Montessori never thought of because she was working with children in a school setting. I may not have the same heaviness that requires the same degree of hand strength or the same beauty if my materials are homemade - but maybe we learn a bit more about the materials by enlisting our children in the process of the creations. We may have interruptions to concentration because a baby cries - but what treasure of spiritual lessons are being taught as you love the baby and tend to its needs and learn to accept interruptions with grace and courtesy. I know we are coming up with our own eclectic twist on things - so I have no problem calling it eclectic homeschooling in a Montessori style - or that we are Montessorish. I am not offended that a Montessori trained teacher would ask me to do this - or recommend this.
Janet
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AndreaG
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For me, "montessori homeschooling" is more about following the philosophy of Maria Montessori than trying to duplicate a montessori school. Of course to follow the philosophy it is very helpful to know what goes on in a montessori school and duplicate it to an extent. A really important element for me is Montessori's scientific approach, observing the child and seeing what works.
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CatholicMommy
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I've been mulling this over - what the key elements are.
Many have already said these, but here they are again:
Observation of the child; materials suited to what the child needs at that time that have some type of essentiality/control of error/etc (basically, get to the point without distraction); a teacher who cares so much about the child as to allow the child to make mistakes and learn from them, while providing an environment where mistakes are acceptable; allowing the child to discover what he can on his own, but guiding him in the right direction (with suggestions, materials, experiences, etc); respect for others and for self; orderliness/consistency of the environment (this is defined different in a family setting where things are always changing as the family grows).
We all know that all of these things can be done at home. Suggestions for specific materials are great, but if you have to substitute, that's fine too.
So it sounds like we're all in agreement - we can all do Montessori at home to one extent or another, without needing training - and no it's not going to be the same as school, but that's the wonderful thing about it. :)
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4Real Forums : Nurturing the Years of Wonder
Topic: Differences Between AMI & AMS??
