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Anneof 5
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| Posted: July 06 2007 at 8:59pm | IP Logged
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Where would one begin with trying some Montessori ideas with children who have some learning delays or other problems? I have looked at Montessori for a long time (was always overwhelmed) and have now found out that 2 of my dc have sensory processing disorder and possible other delays. They are 6yo and 8yo. I don't know for sure if they would be able to handle a more advanced level corresponding to their real ages as they may be behind with their developmental levels. Is there anywhere you could direct me to get more info on this? Do older kids at a lower developmental level start at the 3-6 yo level? I am not looking to try a purist form of Montessori education, just try to present some ideas to them that might be easier to grasp for those with writing difficulties, visual and auditory memory and other problems. I do not want to invest a lot of money, etc., as these are my last two little ones but I do want to do my best for them. I know a lot of you are trying to focus on getting ready for your upcoming school year and I don't want to divert from your discussions but just thought I would try asking in case someone might have an idea for me. Thank you.
Anne
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Mackfam
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| Posted: July 06 2007 at 9:58pm | IP Logged
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Oh dear Anne, I hesitate to post because I just don't know much at all about the learning disabilities you're describing.
I would suggest posting a few questions in the Special Blessings forum. There are probably some ladies there that have direct experience with the challenges you are describing, and can offer much more valuable advice than I ever could.
I haven't read this book, but thought of it for you. It might shed some light on your situation as far as expectations, where to start, etc. Montessori: Prescription for children with learning disabilities
I think I might start in those two places. I suspect that some Montessori based work would be an ideal fit. I wonder what would happen if you just purchased say a Pink Tower or a set of Brown Stairs. You can get the presentation easily online. Then, try the presentation with your dc and observe what happens. You wouldn't be out a lot of $$, and if it wasn't a fit, the Montessori materials are quite easy to resell, here and elsewhere.
I'd be really curious to hear your thoughts (from someone in the trenches) on that Montessori book. If you read it, will you please let us know what you thought?
I'm also wondering...what is sensory processing disorder?
I truly hope I haven't steered you in a wrong direction. I know the special blessings threads will be helpful!! God Bless you.
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Jen Mackintosh
Wife to Rob, mom to dd 19 , ds 16, ds 11, dd 8, and dd 3
Wildflowers and Marbles
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montessori_lori
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| Posted: July 06 2007 at 11:01pm | IP Logged
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Anne, you have asked some great questions. I do believe that the Montessori method can be used with learning disabilities, but it "looks" different in practice than a traditional Montessori environment.
One of the main differences is that in traditional Montessori, after receiving a presentation, a child works mostly independently or with one other child. In 'special needs' Montessori, the child works one-on-one with a teacher or parent almost exclusively.
I'm working on interviewing Michelle Lane about her Montessori/autism work, and one question I'm asking her is if her methods can be used with other learning disabilities. Michelle is getting married tomorrow (congrats!) so it's going to be a few weeks until I get her interview up. In the meantime, take a look at her websites and book, just to see what you think (her book is basically a Montessori album of lessons, but with the appropriate vocabulary/tracking for a special needs child):
Lane Montessori School for Autism
Autism - A Montessori Approach
There is a lot of interest on these boards on the topic of Montessori and special needs, so I'll post a link here to my interview with Michelle once it's up.
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AndreaG
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| Posted: July 07 2007 at 8:43am | IP Logged
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I don't know too much about learning disabilities, but I have a child with sensory integration issues and I think montessori, particularly the 3-6 practical life and sensorial activities have been very beneficial and he has been very drawn to them. He is actually advanced academically however so I'm not sure if my experience applies to you. My stepmom works with kids with special needs and I see alot of overlap with the things she does and montessori.
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Andrea
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Meredith
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| Posted: July 07 2007 at 10:51am | IP Logged
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Thank you Lori and Jennifer for posting these links, as this is not really an area where I have ANY expertise.
Anne, I hope you will be able to find some information there and please do visit our Special Blessings forum, it's wonderful!
So glad you stopped in here to ask as well!
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Meredith
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Anneof 5
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| Posted: July 07 2007 at 12:20pm | IP Logged
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Thank you all so much for your help!
Jennifer, sensory processing disorder is when children have difficulty processing everyday sensations and sometimes show behaviors of seeking out sensations or avoiding them. It can involve touch, sounds, sight, and movement. It can vary widely from child to child and can be mistaken for ADHD in some kids (like my son) or go along with it. It is very common with Autistic children. My kids do not outwardly appear to have a disorder but just may appear on the rather active or intense side. Ds avoids light touch, especially in his arms and hands. He has a lot of trouble paying attention, isn't always in touch with how he is feeling on the inside (hunger, full bladder). He reads about at a first grade level, finished Math at that level and has a terrible time with handwriting due to avoiding having his hand touch the paper. He has trouble with auditory and visual memory. Dd is a sensory seeker, often crashing into couches, kicking things, bouncing up and down, cannot sit for long. She knows her letters and most sounds and can do some simple addition up to about 5.
I have posted on the special needs board and got a couple of responses so far. I was just trying to figure out a way to reach them in a more hands on way instead of doing a lot with pencil and paper. It just doesn't work for them. They cannot sit for long and reading aloud to them has always been difficult. I don't know if it is possible to just "jump in" at their ages with Montessori or if one has to start at the beginning for it to work for them. Or do I just adapt that style of learning to what I was using previously? I will check out those links. I am just getting nervous about being ready for another school year and want to be better prepared than in the past.
Thanks so much again!
Anne
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Meredith
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| Posted: July 07 2007 at 12:37pm | IP Logged
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Anne, another thought would be to try out some of the Base Ten Materials, or the Bead Material for math and see if they like it/can deal with it (?) This way there is alot of hands on and no paper necessary unless you want to introduce it initially. They can do all their counting, rounding/exchanging up to 9999. The 100and 1000 chains are wonderful too and you can make your own markers for the 10's an 100's for thm to place next to each increment as it is reached (counted).
Just a few random thoughts, don't know if this is what you were thinking of or not.
Blessings!
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Meredith
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Mackfam
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| Posted: July 07 2007 at 12:47pm | IP Logged
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Anne,
Thank you for the explanation of the sensory issues your dc are facing. Honestly, that sounds a lot like my 6yo ds  .
My initial reaction is that Montessori would be ideal in your situation. Most of us use Montessori in varying ways to enhance a learning weakness a child might have. Janet (ALMom) comes to mind almost immediately. The reason I really started moving this direction is because of the son I mentioned above. His socks have to be perfect, no fuzzies, tags are out, things must be ordered for him or he is completely distracted. Pencil and paper were not enough to hold his attention. Writing frustrated him because it wasn't "perfect." Yet, his intellectual capacity was amazing. He has a very mechanical mind. Moving to a more Montessori approach has really helped him learn through his hands in an orderly and logical way that appeals to him.
I'll be praying that through Lori and her resources you might be able to find some solutions that work for your family.
I like Meredith's ideas about the bead materials. My ds is captivated by beads - he just "gets it!"
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Jen Mackintosh
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ALmom
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| Posted: July 08 2007 at 3:31am | IP Logged
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Anne: I don't want to seem like I'm ignoring your question. Basically, I am not sure what or how to answer as I have no experience with sensory integration, although my nephew who has just joined us for school, does deal with this and I'm hoping some of the materials will help him and I'll surely be learning plenty about this issue. I've asked before about Montessori and special challenges and really haven't gotten much (autism is not what we are dealing with so I hate to invest in that book, though I'd love to take a peek at how someone else has adjusted). One of mine who struggles actually prefers to work totally independently - just hates to do anything that requires a pencil in hand but will read and read and read. I was thinking Montessori might help him be less frustrated in learning. He is bright and learns quickly but it would be hard to tell from his "output". I'm in experimental mode here and hoping to learn from someone else who has blazed this trail before. If you learn anything, please share it. Right now I'm going with sheer mother's instinct/intuition.
I suspect that the reason Jennifer thought of me is because we have been dealing with a lot of vision and eye-hand issues for a long time. I'm thinking of integrating my olders into my 4 yo Montessori to try and remediate some of this - but I'm new to Montessori. I dabbled and tried when my 15 yo was struggling (she also had the vision problems) but without the books/support available now, I really bungled this and it has taken me this long to come back to it - though we've always had Montessirish materials around. We do have a lot of visual memory problems here so some of the difficulties/lags we may be trying to overcome are similiar. I will be working with 4yo, 6yo, 10yo, and 2 13yos who have varying challenges. My 4yo is the only one in the group who has not struggled with some sort of eye-hand delay and vision therapy situation. Mine are all reading at least at grade level (the 4yo is not reading, the 6 yo is just starting) but my nephew struggles in this area as well as sensory and eye-hand. I'm learning from this child's evaluators,etc, and from my own experiences observations and from my sis's. My instinct says that Montessori will provide a lot of benefits to all of these children - I'm just still trying to work out exactly what and how to present it to them.
I have a lot of questions in the class I am taking about where to start with some of these as the practical life and sensorial seem to have the most for eye-hand, body coordination/control issues that we deal with that I suspect are underneath the writing difficulties. I want to entice them to repeat and repeat the pre-writing stuff that develops fine motor skills. I have children that do not integrate both sides of the body so these are areas that I think they do need to start at the beginning. All of ours (and myself included) have difficulties with right - left which is a part of all the early Montessori trays that I've looked over so far. However, I cannot imagine these olders being enticed very long by color tablets with a 3 part lesson on primary colors or ttansferring pom poms by tongs from tray to ice cube tray - though the right left practice would be good for them and even using the tongs. I suspect we may be feeling our way with them a bit. I know eye droppers, walking the line, training for "chores" and perhaps getting them to practice to present to my 4yo may all be in my arsenal of tricks/things to do to entice repetition. I certainly think there are a few prewriting activities that would entice some as part of "art" like the insets or the colored water with eye droppers and mixing colors - boys and water play seem to go together or at least with mine and I certainly see my 10 yo finding this to be a fun experimental thing to do to see how many different colors he can come up with depending on the number of drops of each color.
However, some of mine do not consistently even hold the pencil properly so I really do want to go to the beginning even if we have to move quickly so as not to have boredom set in. One of the 13 yo is being asked by his therapist to change hands so there will be a lot to practice using the other hand and obviously that will need at the beginning work.
Right now my older dc are delighting in teasing me about Montessori as I have been very excieted with some discoveries about my own lack of coordination (not surprising since I do not have binocular vision on a consistent basis and do not cross the midline easily). I'm dancing around the room excited because I just learned how to pour properly. Now anytime we get ready to do something, my olders are going - oh is there an approved Montessori way to do that. We walked by the garden center at Lowes with the display of tractors and my 15 yo piped in with, "Oh, mom, what is there a Montessori way to drive a tractor." So I may end up using humor or getting them to humor me a bit in a game of "now how would Montessori have us do this?" I know this is far from pure Montessori in one sense but I know I'm just going to have to observe what does and does not work and I guess that really is Montessori in a nutshell. You take clues from the child and how they learn and observe carefully. Well, I have the observation part down to a fine art - you really have to be so observant when you are dealing with special challenges. I'm taking a class to try and understand her materials and all she built into them so I can get the greatest possible benefit from every little thing we manage to entice this biggers to do.
But the bottom line is that I still have no idea how or what I'll do with these. I may do some of the sound presentations (rhythm, pitch identification, etc. and call it music - or maybe I'd better not call it music or my 13 yo whom I think has some auditory issues in addition to the vision problems will simply refuse it - but I definitely want us all to do this. My struggle will be how to do rhythm presentations when I don't have a clue myself - I have to watch when other people clap in order to know when to clap when we are supposed to be clapping to a beat. I think that as I work with my 4 yo, I'll be looking for opportunities and ideas to develop lags in my other children and even myself. I will say the insets remind me a lot of a therapy the dc had to do with tracing shapes on a blackboard -then after drawing or tracing for a while, they had to try and match the size and shape, etc. We made a lot of these out of cardboard and to be honest, doing the chalkboard thing was a drag (most of our therapy was tough to do) The insets look so much more fun and you won't have the frustration of the ragged cardboard edges. We also had to trace in the air - well seems like it would be logical that you could trace sandpaper letters as well. So I see lots of possibilities, I'm just going longwinded in saying I still haven't figured out the logicial how to in a practical sort of way and really think it'll just be a see what will entice, keep them involved, etc. while I have a pretty clear idea of what I want to accomplish with the Montessori for these olders. I don't know what to expect so our first day of school will be a surprise and we'll probably spend the whole year adjusting and observing and changing what/how we do Montessori with these older children. They are definitely not ready for elementary Montessori on the body control/ hand control but I'm thinking that conceptually the beads may be fun math - with a fine motor skill thrown in if we always pick up the beads a certain way. I'd better stop before I drive you nuts. I'm really no help - just confused too with endless possibilities floating in my mind but no real clear picture of HOW we'll do this.  
Janet
Janet
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4Real Forums : Nurturing the Years of Wonder
Topic: Montessori for those with learning probl
