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Eleanor
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| Posted: March 12 2010 at 12:40am | IP Logged
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Has anyone used any of the resources that are available for getting younger elementary-level children involved in philosophical inquiry?
We've recently bought some of Matthew Lipman's "Philosophy for Children" materials. They're recommended by Dr. Peter Redpath, a professor of philosophy who's also the director of Angelicum Academy. (The specific books that Angelicum uses are Elfie, Kio and Gus, and Harry Stottlemeier's Discovery.) I like them a lot so far, and I'm very keen to learn more about this or similar programs. Doing philosophy together with the little folks seems to be a natural fit for our family, and it's given me a lot more optimism about the possibility of combining a Montessori-influenced approach with the content of classical education.
Here are some interesting links. Keep in mind that the "Philosophy for Children" materials are not Catholic, so they sometimes raise questions for which our faith already provides the answers -- but this shouldn't be an issue with the books I've seen, as long as the teacher or parent who leads the discussion is reasonably well-informed and can fill in the missing parts. It's not much different from dealing with all those other tough questions they come up with every day!
Philosophy for Children (the creators' site)
Philosophy for Children (from the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy)
Does Philosophy for Children Belong in Schools at All? (a pro-homeschooling, John Taylor Gatto-ish perspective)
There are some other programs available besides Matthew Lipman's, including one that's based on children's literature (sort of like "Five in a Row" meets Aristotle?). I haven't looked into these much, but would be happy to discuss them as well... even though I'm inclined to cringe at the thought of dissecting poor old Frog and Toad in the way that site recommends. 
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Willa
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| Posted: March 25 2010 at 5:24pm | IP Logged
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Eleanor wrote:
| Keep in mind that the "Philosophy for Children" materials are not Catholic, so they sometimes raise questions for which our faith already provides the answers -- but this shouldn't be an issue with the books I've seen, as long as the teacher or parent who leads the discussion is reasonably well-informed and can fill in the missing parts. |
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Thanks for the links... I like the idea of doing philosophy with children. I've never used any of the books but will be looking them up -- I'm in planning mode : )
I know that sometimes philosophical books discuss questions as if there was no available answer.... and that's what you mean by the "missing parts". It's true though that philosophy is legitimately different from theology -- it tries to start from what we can know "from below", by human reason -- religion illuminates our path but doesn't really give shortcuts for philosophy. So a doctrine believed by faith can still be reasoned about philosophically -- and indeed, as a convert I love that about our Church.
I just thought I'd mention that since it's something that became slightly more clear to me when I read Leisure: The Basis of Culture this winter. It resonated with me and made me understand better how philosophy and theology are complementary even though their territories are somewhat different.
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Willa
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Willa
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| Posted: March 25 2010 at 5:27pm | IP Logged
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While we're on the subject, I often wonder why philosophy was traditionally not taught much until students were almost adults. I can see that rigorous philosophy needs to follow logic and grammar -- but small children are often amateur philosophers. It would seem worthwhile to be able to discuss some questions on some level with them even if they weren't yet ready to read Aristotle 
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Willa
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CrunchyMom
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| Posted: April 28 2010 at 9:13am | IP Logged
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This seems to be a Charlottemasonesque resource for teaching children philosophy:
Here is a recent NYT article about a charter school that teaches philosophy to children using picture books.
Quote:
| Professor Wartenberg and students use eight picture books to introduce children to the major fields of philosophy, including aesthetics, ethics, metaphysics, social and political philosophy and philosophy of the mind. |
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Here is his book Big Ideas for Little Kids: Teaching Philosophy Through Children's Literature
The book seems pricey, but I can see it being a good resource, much like Five in a Row is for some people, in looking at the sorts of books he chooses and the way he introduces the topics so that one can gain the tools for choosing your own books and asking the relevant questions.
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Lindsay
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[URL=http://mysymphonygarden.blogspot.com/]Lost in the Cosmos[/UR
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JennGM
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| Posted: April 28 2010 at 12:36pm | IP Logged
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Lindsay, you come up with some fascinating reads!
Some parts of the the newspaper article sounded more like a discussion of feelings, almost like Values Clarification...not much of what I thought philosophy was.
It does look good, though. Do you think he limits to only 8 books, or gives suggestions for other ones, too?
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JennGM
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| Posted: April 28 2010 at 12:39pm | IP Logged
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Adding Teaching Children Philosophy website
ETA: looking it over, he has 84 books he mentions, the philosophical questions and ideas, and it answers most of my questions above. 
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Jennifer G. Miller
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Eleanor
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| Posted: May 03 2010 at 10:54pm | IP Logged
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It seems as if Philosophy for Children (P4C) has quite a different approach from "Teaching Children Philosophy." P4C uses purpose-written short novels, each of which is designed to spark discussion about a particular branch of philosophy. Although the novels might not win any literary awards, they're captivating in their own way.
I appreciate P4C because it introduces philosophical concepts in an orderly and systematic way, so that each topic can be explored in depth, rather than jumping around. For instance, ethics isn't emphasized until middle school (and Angelicum doesn't use those books). The earlier levels are more fundamental. Elfie is about language and thought; Kio & Gus is about the use of our senses to observe nature; and Harry Stottlemeier's Discovery (the title of which, I just learned, is a pun on "Aristotle"... guess I should have figured that out on my own!  ) is about logical reasoning.
We now have the materials for Elfie (they were back-ordered, so it took a while), and I'm hoping to get a small group of 5-7 year olds together once a week for discussions. Exciting stuff! 
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pmeilaen
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Here is an originally Norwegian book covering the history of philosophy chronologically: Sophie's World. I've read in in German and liked it.
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CrunchyMom
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| Posted: May 04 2010 at 8:22am | IP Logged
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Eleanor wrote:
It seems as if Philosophy for Children (P4C) has quite a different approach from "Teaching Children Philosophy." P4C uses purpose-written short novels, each of which is designed to spark discussion about a particular branch of philosophy. Although the novels might not win any literary awards, they're captivating in their own way.
I appreciate P4C because it introduces philosophical concepts in an orderly and systematic way, so that each topic can be explored in depth, rather than jumping around. For instance, ethics isn't emphasized until middle school (and Angelicum doesn't use those books). The earlier levels are more fundamental. Elfie is about language and thought; Kio & Gus is about the use of our senses to observe nature; and Harry Stottlemeier's Discovery (the title of which, I just learned, is a pun on "Aristotle"... guess I should have figured that out on my own! ) is about logical reasoning.
We now have the materials for Elfie (they were back-ordered, so it took a while), and I'm hoping to get a small group of 5-7 year olds together once a week for discussions. Exciting stuff! |
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Thanks, Eleanor!
It looks as if the "Teaching Children Philosophy" could possibly be a good supplement for P4C. If you look at the website JennGM linked, there is an index that organizes by concept and then gives the books related to that topic. So, I suppose that one could still introduce the concepts systematically.
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Lindsay
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[URL=http://mysymphonygarden.blogspot.com/]Lost in the Cosmos[/UR
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hmbress
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| Posted: May 11 2010 at 9:04am | IP Logged
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I found this YouTube BBC documentary on Dr. Lipman's philosophy for children program. Very interesting.
Eleanor - I was able to get the Elfie novel from the university library, but they don't have the teaching guide that goes along with it. Do you have that? I confess that after reading the novel, I'm not really clear on how to use it with my first grader. I assume the manual goes into all of that?
Thanks,
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Eleanor
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| Posted: May 12 2010 at 5:28pm | IP Logged
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Yes, I think you'd really need the instructional manual. It's about 400 pages long, and has a LOT of ideas for each section of the book. If you like, I can post a few examples.
The manual is pricey, but we plan to use it with our whole gang and some of our friends' children, so I think it will be worth it in the long run. It looks like the publisher, IAPC at Montclair State University, has the lowest price ($50), but their online shop isn't working yet, so you have to mail in the order form. We'll probably go that route if we decide to get any of the other books. We paid $73 for the manual at the Angelicum online store, which is quite a hefty mark-up, especially given how long it took to arrive. 
The IAPC site says the instructional manual has a spiral binding. I think maybe we got an an older edition, b/c ours just came as a huge stack of 3-hole punched pages. In any case, the information is all there.
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CrunchyMom
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I was looking at introducing The Fallacy Detective for logic in the next year or two, and I came across this book, Philosophy for Kids. It gets really good reviews, and it is considerably more affordable than the Dr. Lipman's program.
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Lindsay
Five Boys(6/04) (6/06) (9/08)(3/11),(7/13), and 1 girl (5/16)
My Symphony
[URL=http://mysymphonygarden.blogspot.com/]Lost in the Cosmos[/UR
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SeaStar
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Looks really good. This would be a fun thing to do during our morning basket time
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CrunchyMom
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SeaStar wrote:
| Looks really good. This would be a fun thing to do during our morning basket time |
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I agree, Melinda. That was what I was thinking.
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Lindsay
Five Boys(6/04) (6/06) (9/08)(3/11),(7/13), and 1 girl (5/16)
My Symphony
[URL=http://mysymphonygarden.blogspot.com/]Lost in the Cosmos[/UR
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SallyT
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Fallacy Detective is fun! We have two copies, and I can't find either of them at present, but keep inserting, then deleting them, from our reading for next year. Can't decide whether that's one book too many or not . . . but it is a great read for middle school (or maybe younger?).
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4Real Forums : Philosophy of Education
Topic: Philosophy for children
