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anitamarie
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| Posted: July 07 2009 at 2:44pm | IP Logged
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while they are away at camp?
Background: ds (11) is very disorganized. Actually, it's more a laziness thing. I never trained him properly when he was younger to put his things away as he used them. I have been more successful with the other children with this.
His room is always a mess. He shares it with his younger brother who is more organized and willing to put his stuff away when he knows where it goes, etc.
His "surfaces" (desk, dresser, bookcase) are always stacked with stuff.
This child is a packrat. I have found packaging from toys, bits of meaningless paper from various things, etc. in his room repeatedly. He also holds onto everything he has ever owned. (McDonalds toys, VBS projects, etc.) He has gotten better in the last 2 years as I have tried to work with him on this problem. But he will tell me about every item "That has a memory attached to it." (I think we should take a picture and move on, but it is so hard to get him to agree.)
I have tried on various occasions to help him organize his room with his help and input and find storage solutions so that he can keep a reasonable amount of "stuff". He never maintains it.
I am really tempted to go in there this week while he is at Scout Camp and empty it of needless junk.
On the other hand, I want to respect him. He is growing up and needs that from us more than ever.
I could go in and just take out everything questionable and put it aside for us to go through when he gets home, but I just know the battle that will be.
I want to help him now and do the training and follow-up I should have done before. I would like to have a manageable starting point.
Sorry this went so long.
Any thoughts? What would you do?
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JodieLyn
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Well I might, but I would do it when they were here too..
I have a friend who is cleaning out her son's room while he's away... about that age.. but he was told if the room wasn't clean to standards that it would be cleaned when he was gone.
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jdostalik
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Tough one...perhaps I would try and organize his stuff into different stacks and clean enough so that you would feel like you and he could tackle the room together when he arrives home without having to sift through trash...Good luck! 
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Angie Mc
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Have you asked him if he would like this...if it would be helpful to him? He might surprise you and say, "Yes." (I have one child who really appreciates this type of help because being tidy is *very* difficult for this child.) This way, it could be a win-win...he sees it as a gift of service for him AND you get to raise the standard of order in his room.
Praying all goes well!
Love,
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SuzanneG
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Anita~
I have a question.......Would he notice if you went in and cleared out the "garbage", the "needless junk" as you called it?
Depending on that answer I would have 2 separate "strategies".
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Suzanne in ID
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momtokea
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I do this every once in a while. I think my kids really appreciate it. They just end up with too much stuff and don't know where to begin cleaning. It's much easier for them to keep their space clean if there is less clutter. I do get annoyed when I find stuff that is obviously garbage and am trying to teach them to throw out the garbage (packages, paper, etc.). As far as things that have a memory attached, I would get a rubbermaid container and toss it all in "for safe keeping" and put it on a shelf in the storage room. Then several months later it is easier to toss out (out of sight out of mind) Often they never even remember it.
Overall, I think they have too much clutter that is overwhelming for them and they do appreciate the help in keeping the clutter down.
Maria
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RamFam
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I guess I'm mean, but I often do this. Of course my kids are younger and probably don't mind as much as an 11 yo. I take a big trash bag in and fill it with all the junk that seems to collect. Then straighten the rest. I of course advise them that if they would clean it that I wouldn't have to.
My mom would ask us to clean our rooms once; then she would do it. I guess she didn't want to fight with us on it or something. But I never minded. Actually I think I liked never having to clean my room. I don't think I ever missed anything?
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hylabrook1
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Maybe I'm projecting my own reaction on to your son, but I feel extremely violated if someone makes decisions about my *stuff*. I know it's really hard to get the piles reduced when he sees so many things as too precious to get rid of. My suggestion is to work together with your son, but things that he is attached to that make too much clutter in his room should go to a box. Hang on to the box for a couple of months, then go through it with him; maybe he'll be more willing to get rid of the stuff then -- he might *get it* that he doesn't really need all of it since he'll have done fine without it for a while. When you go through his room with him, you might find that *place for everything*, and then get him into the habit of a weekly clean out. He might respond well to an attitude that takes the tone of "I want to help you get a handle on this" as opposed to "Every time I look at your room I want to scream". It is hard to say without knowing your son's temperament.
Peace,
Nancy
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teachingmyown
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I would also give a conditional yes. I would clear out the trash, and organize things enough that he could tackle it when he got home. I wouldn't do the whole thing or really throw away things that he may want even if I think he doesn't need it, appreciate it, etc. I would wait and discuss it together. I think it is a valuable skill to learn. I wish I had a better grasp of it myself.
A year or two younger, then yes I would do the whole thing and purge it. I do this when my kids go to VBS at my mom's each year. Especially the girls, 4 in a room, manage to collect a million useless things.
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Cay Gibson
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anitamarie wrote:
Background: ds (11) is very disorganized. Actually, it's more a laziness thing.
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I have...and do...clean out the younger girls' room. They share it and it gets very disorganized. I'm afraid that, since they were the youngest, and I was caring for their ailing grandfather when we moved here, I let a lot of "pick-up" strategies go by the wayside w/ them. I also relied a lot on my oldest dd to help out and didn't "show" the younger ones how.
Today my 11 year old (who resembles your 11 yr old) could not play on the computer or go to see her friend until her room was cleaned, dishes put away, and math lesson done.
It worked like a charm. I'm not beyond bribery...and I'm not up to discussion on the pros and cons either.  Today it worked. I'm happy and she's been taught that you are rewarded when you are diligent. 
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Angie Mc
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| Posted: July 07 2009 at 5:38pm | IP Logged
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A related post - Serving teens.
Love,
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Angie Mc
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Mary G
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At 11, yes I probably would clean it out. But I tend to be a pretty tough mom ... my now 18yod got her room purged whenever she left for a week or more because that was the only way to get her to notice that she actually had a floor!
Here's what I'd do (and did do with her):
I'd put trash -- obvious trash like old wrappers, crumpled up paper, etc -- in the trash. The rest of the "needless" stuff I'd put in a box with his name and date and tape it. If he doesn't need to go in there after 6 mo., I'd toss it all; if he goes in and takes out one or two things, I'd allow that but he'd need to keep it neat.
The way I look at it is that while they're living in our house, they have to maintain a certain level of neatness and respect for property. If they learn this early (and my boys are actually better than my girls) they end up with way more lee-way when it comes to purging ....
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Babs
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My oldest son, 26, has been struggling with this his whole life (or more precisely I have been struggling with him over this). He also states that so many things have a memory attached to them. We finally got plastic bins and we packed up the things he wanted to keep and we put them away in the basement so his room would be neat. Each summer we had him go through and try to purge some stuff and pack up the new year's "treasures". There was nothing else that worked. He is now in medical school and a few times over the years he has had friends or the girl he is now dating help him to toss. He has a fair amount of stuff but not too much, imo, considering he is a packrat.
I think you could start sorting things out to go over with him when he returns but I would be very careful not to clean his room yourself. If he is anything like my son that would cause him an awful lot of stress and would probably make him feel more strongly about saving everything.
I would do this with him and then I would start a box to put under his bed or in the closet where he could put new things he may want to save over the next year. Then next summer, take the new things to the storage area and try to get him to toss some from both.
My son has always been afraid of losing those memories. This might be a boy who would really appreciate an area in his room where you could make a collage of pictures of family, friends, events, even projects and artwork. After all of these years I don't understand it but it is very real to him. This has worked very well for us and eliminated any disagreements about his room and he was able to keep it reasonably clean. I hope this helps.
Barb
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Babs
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| Posted: July 07 2009 at 6:18pm | IP Logged
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I just wanted to add that I could go through any of the other boys rooms and throw almost everything away while they were gone and they would be very happy their room was clean. None of the other boys have saved much except what I have saved for them. Allowing him to save what he wants within reason will give you all some peace.
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anitamarie
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| Posted: July 07 2009 at 7:01pm | IP Logged
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SuzanneG wrote:
Anita~
I have a question.......Would he notice if you went in and cleared out the "garbage", the "needless junk" as you called it?
Depending on that answer I would have 2 separate "strategies". |
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Suzanne:
He definitely would simply because of the sheer quantity that would be gone. There is also a lot just out of place. When he doesn't feel like taking something where it goes, he puts it on the dresser, desk or bookcase. So those would be empty of most of their current contents.
So, what are your 2 strategies?
ETA: A lot of what he has in there is the needless junk, half-done comics, cartoons and drawings, packaging of various sorts, library hold-slips, etc.
He does have some stuff of value, too.
Anita
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anitamarie
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hylabrook1 wrote:
Maybe I'm projecting my own reaction on to your son, but I feel extremely violated if someone makes decisions about my *stuff*. I know it's really hard to get the piles reduced when he sees so many things as too precious to get rid of. My suggestion is to work together with your son, but things that he is attached to that make too much clutter in his room should go to a box. Hang on to the box for a couple of months, then go through it with him; maybe he'll be more willing to get rid of the stuff then -- he might *get it* that he doesn't really need all of it since he'll have done fine without it for a while. When you go through his room with him, you might find that *place for everything*, and then get him into the habit of a weekly clean out. He might respond well to an attitude that takes the tone of "I want to help you get a handle on this" as opposed to "Every time I look at your room I want to scream". It is hard to say without knowing your son's temperament.
Peace,
Nancy |
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Nancy:
See, that's what I'm afraid of. I, too, don't like when people try to tell me that my stuff is junk. I have, however, become a ruthless purger because visual noise depresses me beyond comprehension.
I'm leaning toward taking everything out that doesn't need to be there, sorting it into piles and having him sort through with me when he gets back. He is currently gone. But I am afraid he won't get rid of much, though. As far as the box, I have a box for each child of "Treasures and Memories" it includes artwork and treasures both created by them and given to them. However, there is a limit to how much I am willing to store. I like your idea of revisiting the box. I didn't think of it.
Anita
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anitamarie
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Angie Mc wrote:
Have you asked him if he would like this...if it would be helpful to him? He might surprise you and say, "Yes." (I have one child who really appreciates this type of help because being tidy is *very* difficult for this child.) This way, it could be a win-win...he sees it as a gift of service for him AND you get to raise the standard of order in his room.
Praying all goes well! |
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Angie:
Well, he's gone this week, so I can't ask him. But I think his reaction would be 2-fold, he'd love to have it cleaned, but not have any of his stuff gone. 
I think we really are going to try to raise the standard of order in his room. I've realized that I am not the Mom that can close the door and walk away. I need the house (all of it) "in a vacuumable state" at the end of every day. (Not that I'm going to vacuum every day. ) I also feel like I am doing him a disservice if I don't at least try to give him some of these skills. KWIM?
Thanks,
Anita
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anitamarie
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Babs:
I know what you mean about the memories. This child is the only one like that, so far. Unfortunately, he comes by it honestly . I had to overcome this and be ruthless with myself. It was really freeing. I guess I'd just like him to be free sooner than I was. It can be such a weight dragging you down.
Thanks for understanding the issue here. It's nice to know your son is a happy, functioning adult.  Thanks again.
Anita
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anitamarie
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| Posted: July 07 2009 at 7:25pm | IP Logged
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Mary G and Cay both of you hit the nail on the head.
Cay: I didn't know enough to teach him when he was young, he's the oldest, and then the others came along, so I just did it, now I can't and he doesn't know how or want to. We do often base privileges on cleanliness, but I don't think we are consistent enough .
Mary G.: I have come to the same conclusion about it being our house and we decide the standard. I tried to be the type to let them keep their room to their own standard, but I just can't do it. And it's not fair to his little brother who has to live there, too.
Thanks to everyone for your replies, lots to think about. I appreciate the input, this has been on my heart for a while.
God Bless,
Anita
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LeeAnn
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Have you ever seen an episode of "Clean Sweep"? I don't think it's on the air any longer, but lots of good inspiration there. Basically, empty the room entirely, including the furniture, things on the walls, etc. Take all out to the lawn (on tarps or blankets) and sort there. Bring things back in gradually, taking the opportunity to paint or just generally clean and make the room look so nice "clean" that it becomes obvious that bringing in the rest of the junk would be unbearable.
If you don't have the energy for that then yes, I say clear out the trash while he is gone, and get some big rubbermaid tubs to store all the "treasures" that aren't needed right now. His stuff is all there, nothing's been thrown away that is "valuable" but in half a year or so, maybe he'll realize this level of accumulation can't continue forever.
In part, I blame our culture on problems like this--before the modern era there just wasn't enough STUFF in the world for the average person to accumulate so much junk. Your mention of VBS crafts makes me sigh--usually I am so against plastic, disposable junk, but alas, I am organizing VBS too and it comes with the territory it seems. We give this stuff to the kids and then are surprised when they want to keep it forever. I can't tell you how many pounds of happy meal toys I've thrown out over the years.
Good luck!
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Topic: Would you clean out your child's room...
