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Bella
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| Posted: March 10 2008 at 3:47pm | IP Logged
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After reading_The Temperament God Gave You_, everything about my DD is making sense to me...well, as much as an 11 yo dd can I suppose. 
There has been much conflict between Dh,me and our DD. She is highly spirited, with some special needs. But! This figuring out of her temperament has been so revealing. 
Now, I just need a little guidance from someone-or whomever wants to jump in! 
I must say, that I have always been on the fence about HSing DD(that's my Melancholy temperament  ), and the reason is because I simply don't feel suited to prepare her for heaven,or life. She simply resists so many things I try to involve her in, or teach her -or even the materials I provide for her to teach herself. Her classic response to most everything, is,"That isn't fun, I want to have fun!" or "That/this is so boring!" And, this could be a new idea that she or someone else brings up-including me or DH. And it involves everything from math to religion to outside the house activities. When she does agree to something, she rushes through it-always. I have never ,ever seen her pouring her heart into anything. Even things like running-she enters races, but will only "train" a few days before. Or when she was in dance, she was supposed to practice everyday-and after threatening to pull her out if she didn't take it seriously-we finally did. And this was after she begged the dance teacher to let her into the class-even though she was a little younger than the other girls-only in age-definitely not in ability.
The most disturbing aspect, is the constant complaints I hear from her about our faith and going to Church. She says things all the time about how much she wished we still went to our old church-this was when she was 5yo-yet she remembers it! Now, some of her neighbor friends attend a similar church-coffe shop,rock band, gym during church for kids younger than highschool,etc.
Sometimes I blame the conflicts on my illnesses, my DH not being Catholic, or just her spiritedness.
I should add that I let her have almost all control over how /what she studies(for ex: she hated MUS, and wanted to switch back to Singapore-which we had used before-so I switched her. She makes up her own schedule/routine of when /what she will study each day. It's not like I am dictating exactly what/how she learns-I have tried so hard to accomadate her.
Any advice on getting/keeping her motivated in academics,faith, and activiies? I am sure I have left a lot out here- sorry it takes me a book to just pour out my heart/concerns.
Due to trauma experienced during a very short career *at* school -our parish school, she will not even allow me to suggest her going to even a different catholic school. And if she would allow such a discussion, DH would never agree to it due to the expenses.
Any sage Moms BTDT?
Many thanks,
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Peace and Blessings,
Bella
Wife and Mom to my sweeties!
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CrunchyMom
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| Posted: March 10 2008 at 4:29pm | IP Logged
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I haven't btdt as a parent, but I am sanguine. Really, I'm a sanguine-choleric, but the sanguine definitely dominates.
Speaking from my own weaknesses, I'm not sure that letting her dictate so much of how she spends her time or what she studies is ideal. My biggest temptation in life is sloth. I don't necessarily choose bad things, but I always tend to choose what I enjoy doing over what I should be doing, and justify it by telling myself it isn't so bad. (which its usually not bad at all except that I'm NOT doing other things that I should).
So, I tend to procrastinate. While I would never do well on a strict schedule run by the clock, I wish I had learned self discipline more and had my parents emphasize structure a bit more. For instance, if I had always been told to help my mother do x at x time, and I were expecting it, I would have done better habitually helping her around the home. Instead, I balked at being "interrupted" and she didn't always insist I be diligent (like, if I halfway cleaned the kitchen, she finished it instead of making me do it well. I didn't always half-clean on purpose, but I feel that I never learned well how to be thorough about things I didn't like).
Anyway, I wasn't home schooled. I was a good student, but I think I was just lucky that I enjoyed school, could read fast, and was able to successfully cram for tests, etc... I wasn't particularly disciplined in that either. 
I think that perhaps helping her build rewards for herself might be good. Like, she has to spend x amount of time doing something she doesn't like, but that means she gets to do the "fun" thing.
I'm not sure what to say about taking her out of activities she excels at. I suppose you spoke with her instructors, etc... before doing it? I studied music, and while I REALLY regret not practicing as much as I should have (for what I could have accomplished), I did graduate from college with honors in Music magna cum laude, and I wouldn't trade my experiences and education.
I guess that my thoughts are just because I didn't always apply myself as much as I wish I had, I don't regret the experience or what I was able to achieve with my haphazard study habits, yk? I didn't always practice when younger, and I kind of hate to think of my parents having made me quit.
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Lindsay
Five Boys(6/04) (6/06) (9/08)(3/11),(7/13), and 1 girl (5/16)
My Symphony
[URL=http://mysymphonygarden.blogspot.com/]Lost in the Cosmos[/UR
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Bella
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| Posted: March 11 2008 at 7:12am | IP Logged
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Thanks Lindsay! 
On the topic of structure, I see where you are coming from. and I think it is my sanquine side of *my* Melancholy/Sanquine Temperament that gets in my way of meeting her needs and providing the optimum learning environment for her. Structure doesn't come naturally for me-I like it-as long as I 'm not the one creating it, or even truly being held accountable to it.  Wow! Now that's a bad combo eh? And you see, this is where I constantly self-doubt about whether or not she would be better off in a school environment. She would have structure and easy access to friends(which I would have to monitor a geat deal...but I alredy do that-perhaps to a fault).
Or maybe I need to suck it up and, and enroll her in a program like Kolbe. Giving us both a good kick in the bum yk? Ack! So confusing.
On the chore side of things, I have to watch it as I tend to be mushy-one day *over* controlling, with too high expectations, the next I won't be feeling well, and I let too many things slide. So hard to be even and consistent! I do try to have her do thorough chores, and she will alwasy take the quickest/easiest way to the end line. But! I can get so involved in a power struggle, and that is something I am trying to avoid at present as she and I have some attachment issues that I am trying to address.
On the activity side, it was she who agreed(to the dance teacher), that she would put in so many hours of dance practice a week-mainly stretching-as she dances well in all regards except she does not have flexibility. Again, it became a power struggle that I was getting sucked into trying to get her to do her daily practices. IN comes DH. He is a retired professional endurance athlete. Self- discipline comes easy to him, and he has no tolerance for anything but that from DD when it comes to most everything. SIGH. Thus the conflicts.
I am reallky hoping a Mom of a sanquine pops in here, as I am really needing some guidancein the area of her faith .
Anyway, I really appreciate your input.
Many, thanks!
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Peace and Blessings,
Bella
Wife and Mom to my sweeties!
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donnalynn
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| Posted: March 11 2008 at 4:13pm | IP Logged
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Hi Christy -
I have a very sanguine daughter. I very much agree with Lindsay - with a sanguine temperament you do have to help with structure and follow through.
My daughter plays violin - her teacher uses a practice chart and they agree on how much time/how many days. This piece of paper helps a lot - I just have to say "How does your practice chart look this week"? This seems to feel more like I am reminding her about her commitment than constantly reminding her to practice. Charts and lists seem to help a lot, in general.
She also has to complete her day's violin practice before she gets her computer time. This goes back to structure - sometimes the sanguine lacks the internal incentive to follow through on things - so sometimes it helps to provide an external one.
In regards to faith - I think anything that has some social quality to it is very appealing. Dd enjoys going to our Lenten soup suppers and helping with clean up etc..
Does your church have a coffee hour or any pot luck suppers? Maybe she would bake something or help with clean up? Dd also really enjoyed helping at our Soup Kitchen. Service oriented activities also seem to help focus and give her something to do.
This dd is 13 and I was a little worried that "Tea and Cakes With the Saints" would be too young for her - but she was delighted to receive this book for Christmas. Anything you can do to deepen a connection to the liturgical year might be helpful - again - things to do - I think forming a sense of family traditions helps give the sangiune a kind of anchor.
I always think of butterflies when I think sanguine - they do tend to flutter from here to there - I think they are very likely to get swept up by someone else's ideas - I think you have to show joy and interest in your faith. My daughter is pretty good about going to church (again service - we are in the choir) but I also try to be very positive about going.
Hope this helps - if I think of anything else I'll let you know.
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donnalynn
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Angie Mc
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| Posted: March 11 2008 at 5:46pm | IP Logged
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Hi Christy! Our 12yo ds is a bundle of fun sanguine:). I'll just share a few principles that have helped him and our family to appreciate and *feed* him.
Listen: Just last night I listened to ds for over 30 minutes while he talked...and talked...and talked:). I literally didn't say a word. I smiled and nodded, but that was it (and I'm a talker!) He is a budding comedian and was absolutely hilarious as he talked about his altar serving adventures:). He *needs* to verbally process and loves an *audience.*
Talk: We also talk and talk and talk together. I have become a near baseball expert just because I know he loves it and I want to talk with him about what is important to him. (And his enthusiasm is SO contagious - one of the gifts of the sanguine!)
Layering: I use this word to describe his tendency to, well, *layer* fun. For example...
Mom, can Joseph come over?
Sure son.
Great! Can we watch a movie while he's here?
Sure, just double check the movie with his mom first.
Great! Do we have popcorn - I can make it.
We do.
Great! What about ice cream?
What about it?
Can we go to the store and buy some?
No, I'm not going to make a trip for ice cream today!
OK, how about swimming? Is the pool ready?
No, sorry buddy.
Hmmm...well what about a sleep over?
Do you see where this is going? Yep...no end in sight! Why should we just have a little fun when we can have *layers and layers* of fun?  So my job is to find ways to say yes to his need for fun while also helping him to be satisfied with what he gets and to understand that not everyone is as *rigged* for fun as he is! We really aren't trying to rain on his sunshiny parade by helping him to set limits.
Work First: My ds prefers that I set expectations and limits for *non-fun* things. We have a checklist of chores and independent work for ds to do before he gets to his fun. He is a hard worker but he is easily distracted. He admits *having fun things* waiting as a reward for him is helpful.
Not Everything is Fun: Some things just need to be done to be a part of a family and to function in society. I say plain things like "I know this isn't fun for you or for me but it does need to get done." Or, "Do we really need to discuss this now or are you just trying to get out of doing what you have been asked?" Or, "I think you are confused. This is work time (or church time or...) and I expect you to (fill in the blank.) Or, "If you want me to help you with your (fun activity) then you need to help me with my work." Or, "Are you sure you can watch the movie and clean the kitchen at the same time? How about you clean the kitchen first then watch the movie?"
Move: This guy needs to move! He is a good athlete and loves baseball. So we make sure that he plays and practices as much as possible.
Do: When thinking about faith, what helps him most is *doing* the faith. He reads for our family daily from the bible. He is an altar server. He calls the family to the rosary and often hands out the rosaries - he sometimes leads the rosary when his dad isn't home.
Do Some More: I need to *do* stuff with him...watch movies...read books...watch his practice...do-do-do!
Well, I need to run and hope others jump into this conversation. The key for me is to really value the energy and fun that ds brings to the family while also setting healthy limits for myself (and the others in the family - none of whom are sanguine.) I'm so fortunate...my brother (and dear friend) is sanguine. I know that my childhood was enriched because of his joy (I'm choleric - is it obvious? ) and I adore him as an adult. Yet, I know that so many of his *sanguine* traits were misunderstood. My ds is so much like him! Like I said, I'm very fortunate!
Off to a batting lesson, then batting cages, then Little League  .
Love,
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Angie Mc
Maimeo to Henry! Dave's wife, mom to Mrs. Devin+Michael Pope, Aiden 20,Ian 17,John Paul 11,Catherine (heaven 6/07)
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amyable
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| Posted: March 11 2008 at 9:08pm | IP Logged
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I just wanted to say I am finding this thread SO helpful! My oldest is Sanguine, and the rest of us, well, are not! Here is our family in age order using Maryan's wonderful emoticon system (Sanguine , Choleric , Melancholic  , Phlegmatic  )
One of these things is not like the other... We're all on the introverted side I think (my 2yo is the Choleric, which may be just because she's 2!) and none of us really *get* her. Reading these ideas has motivated me to try harder to understand and help her, in a way that is good for HER and not just protective of the rest of us (although I could use some advice on the balance of that too! I feel run over after a day with her sometimes as do her sisters  )
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Amy
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The Highly Sensitive Homeschooler
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SuzanneG
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| Posted: March 11 2008 at 9:17pm | IP Logged
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amyable wrote:
| I just wanted to say I am finding this thread SO helpful! My oldest is Sanguine, and the rest of us, well, are not! |
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Me too!!!! My oldest is Sanguine....(she's only 7, so I have not "BTDT"), and I'm loving everyone's examples and experience. Thank you all! I'm choleric , so I don't understand her constant desire for FUN!
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Suzanne in ID
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Bella
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| Posted: March 12 2008 at 9:40am | IP Logged
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Oh Ladies! Thankyou for the replies!
I will have to wait a little while to respond, as both my DC are sick, and this mommy has been up most of the night due to coughs,etc..
I so much appreciate you all taking the time to respond, I am taking this all in, and you have given me much to consider and reevaluate.
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Peace and Blessings,
Bella
Wife and Mom to my sweeties!
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JodieLyn
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| Posted: March 12 2008 at 7:59pm | IP Logged
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Quote:
| I do try to have her do thorough chores, and she will alwasy take the quickest/easiest way to the end line. |
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This is not a bad thing necessarily Ask anyone who has a child that doddles
What you might find helpful is to look for information on "speed cleaning" I have a friend that has mentioned learning from a book the fastest most efficient way to clean things. That might help you both.. her with learning how to do things so they're over and done with as fast as possible.. and you because they'll be done right while doing it as fast as possible.
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Jodie, wife to Dave
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All men who have turned out worth anything have had the chief hand in their own education.
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Syncletica
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| Posted: March 12 2008 at 9:57pm | IP Logged
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I just wanted to mention these conferences on audio cassette by Mother Mary Bosco. They are so informative and good. Very helpful and humorous, too. (She is sanguine, too.) I highly recommend them, if any one would like to get them...
Temperament conferences
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Angie Mc
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| Posted: March 12 2008 at 11:02pm | IP Logged
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JodieLyn wrote:
| What you might find helpful is to look for information on "speed cleaning" . |
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Interesting! My ds IS awesome at Speed Cleaning.
Love,
__________________
Angie Mc
Maimeo to Henry! Dave's wife, mom to Mrs. Devin+Michael Pope, Aiden 20,Ian 17,John Paul 11,Catherine (heaven 6/07)
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SuzanneG
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| Posted: March 12 2008 at 11:51pm | IP Logged
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Yep....my daughter is a VERY FAST bathroom cleaner, (just skip to the picture at the bottom )once I showed her EXACTLY what she should do. She hums, wears a visor and an apron. Why??? Because apparently, it's more FUN that way!
And, I about the "layering", Angie. I get this ALL THE TIME. And, I love your conversation examples. That's very helpful.
I enlist my dd to execute much of the liturgical year stuff. To her, it's all a great excuse for a party. So, I give her ideas and then she decorates or plans a skit or leads a prayer, etc.
She also keeps a calendar where she writes down anything fun that is happening. I swear she lives and dies by birthday parties, someone coming into town, going somewhere....it helps her to "see" that excitement is on the horizon and makes her more monotonous things more bearable.
Maybe this would translate into an older child.....ie: in March, talking about and planning a couple things to do as a family or things for her to look forward to in April????
Also, is "fun" built in to your family routine/schedule? Such as a game night? Ice cream with dad? Little stuff like that. Just brainstorming here and thinking out loud.
And, I liked what Donna had to say about discussing UP-FRONT about practicing for something (violin in her case) and also having it come from a third party. BEFORE you make a commitment to something, discuss what is involved in it and make the expectations and consequences very clear. If the child still decides to do xyz, knowing what they are getting into, then it minimizes the chance for a power struggle later on. It's simply natural consequences. Of course, this is the case with ANY child, but even more important, i would imagine, with a sanguine.
Christy....just reading through your original post. If there aren't friends at church or any activities that you can be involved in like Donna mentioned, (you mentioned your illness)....maybe getting involved isn't an option??? What about, at least, doing something special after Mass on Sundays that becomes a tradition?
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Suzanne in ID
Wife to Pete
Mom of 7 (Girls - 14, 12, 11, 9, 7 and Boys - 4, 1)
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Bella
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| Posted: March 14 2008 at 9:14pm | IP Logged
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Ladies,
I just wrote a super long(of course!!) reply...and my puter shut down.
My back is begging me to go to bed...I will try again tomorrow.
A HUGE ((((THANKYOU))) to you!! I sooo much appreciate the time and effort you put into your responses.
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Peace and Blessings,
Bella
Wife and Mom to my sweeties!
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Bella
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| Posted: April 05 2008 at 6:02pm | IP Logged
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Hi Ladies,
I am popping in here to let ya'll know that I have really gleaned a lot of information and insight from your replies.
Donna-Thanks so much for sharing what is working for your DD! I have always resisted charts, but I think this is something I need to overcome,see the good in, and implement. We are considering piano or horsebacking riding lessons for DD, and we will take your advice,utilizing a chart. I am trying to figure out a way to get DD more involved *service* wise, but she does have some special needs that I have to consider. She does love to help clean the church before Easter and Christmas..maybe I can look for other ways in which she can help at the church. I love the idea of _Tea and Cakes With The Saints_, and am glad to hear that it is also appropriate for even a 13 yo! That would also give her another way to include social interaction with our faith. We are working on family traditions...there are so many awesome ideas, so I have been trying to keep it simple so far. Anyway, I have been thinking of joining the Protestant HS group here, as our local Catholic HS group isn't very active,and a bit exclusive. But! My main hesitation is that DD would probably end up wanting to be best friends with a very fundy type of Christian, and DD would get swept away with her new friend's faith. I thought I was being a little paranoid, then when you stated that Sanguines tend to get swept up in others ideas...well...that sorta confirmed my paranoid suspicions!
Angie- Your description of a conversation with your DS was hilarious! And so familiar.Oh my, was it ever! I am now looking for ways to say yes in meeting DD's need for fun, while still setting limits. ( In the past, I have lacked so much mercy, and ended up criticising DD for being so programmed to have more,more,more FUN!) Now, I understand! She *is* rigged for this...I just need to accept her where she's at, and yet set limits so she isn't running the show, and wearing me out. I have shyed away from chore charts and lists in the past-too many reasons why-but my way IS NOT WORKING! So, again, I will be meeting DD-and gently guiding her-to more of a work then play way of life. Which makes since! I'm just a slow learner. We are just learning the Divine Mercy Chaplet these days, so I think I will have DD lead the prayer for us-great idea! You made me see that I need to really value my DD as.she.is. THANKYOU!!
Jodie-my Mom recently moved to town, and she just remarked how fast! DD cleans. Actually, her words were along the line of how fast my DC can mess up the house, but boy can DD whip it back into shape!
I've also really realized these past few weeks, that DD is extremely sensitive to any criticism, so I am totally backing off of expecting just too much from her.
Suzanne-I when I read about your DD wearing a visor to clean the bathroom! Now,*that* is having fun! I am now going back to our old way(why do we Moms try to fix what isn't broken??) of cleaning and dancing to music. Both of my DC really enjoy listening to music while cleaning, and with my smooth moves , I think I will burn off some extra calories!! Anyway, DD is now in charge of planning our Liturgical year! She loves the idea-as you said, any excuse for a party! Again, I have been so merciless towards our DD....she is always looking to the future for excitement on the horizon as you say. I haven't warmed to this..too strict in some ways-and just not seeing her for who she is. She *lives* for get togethers, family coming to town,etc. oh goodness, my Mom just moved her, and just today got a new Yorkie...DD couldn't sleep last night as she was so excited to see the puppy today! But, in sticking with the others suggestions, she did her chores first, then we took her over to see the puppy. We do not have fun built into our family plans. Dh works long,late hours, so I've just never been able to say a particular day is going to be game night,etc. But we will work on that. And finally, we are making a new tradition of desert on Saturdays and Sundays, with donuts following Mass. Great idea! We sometimes do the donut/coffee after church at the school gym, but it feels so lonely, as I think people view us as the wierd HSing family(we live *right* around the corner from our church-have never drove there!)...but that is probably my own insecurities.
Okay Ladies, I have some great ideas, and I'm off to write up a general schedule(routine,really) and a chore chart!
Hugs and thanks to all of you!
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Peace and Blessings,
Bella
Wife and Mom to my sweeties!
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4Real Forums : Mothering and Family Life
Topic: Help me help my sanquine DD...
