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Psshh03
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| Posted: May 08 2012 at 10:19am | IP Logged
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I recently picked up a copy of the 3-5 manual by Moira Farrell for next year and I'm really excited to try it!
My question is for those who have used it for a couple years, after purchasing the mass kit and preparing whatever other materials we need for this, is it worth it in the end? Do you find it nourishing for the children? In other words, would you still use it knowing what you now know?
I know there was a lot of hype a couple years ago but haven't really seen any recent threads (or maybe I haven't been able to find them).
This is my first post! YAY!
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JennGM
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| Posted: May 08 2012 at 11:01am | IP Logged
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Welcome!
I have loads of opinions on this subject, but a little short on time to expound. Short answer, I do find these albums a bit lacking compared to the Catechesis of the Good Shepherd. It just doesn't give the complete picture of what the CGS tries to do.
I'll try to come back and elaborate.
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Psshh03
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| Posted: May 08 2012 at 11:35am | IP Logged
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Your post reminds me, has anyone used the albums written by Elizabeth Papandrea that used to be available at montessori candy?
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JennGM
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I have not seen Papandrea's albums. I got the impression that they were albums she created after taking training for the CGS. As I am trained as a catechist for Levels I and II, I didn't want to spend money to look them over!
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Jennifer G. Miller
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JennGM
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| Posted: May 08 2012 at 12:57pm | IP Logged
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I have a minute now. These thoughts are a bit jumbled, so pardon me.
My son has been in an atrium since he was 3, and went through the Catechesis for his First Confession and Communion, also, so I'm coming from another vantage point. I am a trained catechist, but have only incorporated some elements in my home, as my son is already in the atrium.
I do constantly seek ways to bring home some of the CGS elements in my home. The home is a natural place for most of the approach, except that there is a lack of dedicated, special, quiet place that would lead to prayer. That's just the way with the family.
I find the 32 points for the Catechesis of the Good Shepherd are key to seeing the point of the CGS and the atrium.
The aim is to learn to love Christ and His Church through the Bible and Liturgy. The atrium is a place of prayer, with Christ as the Teacher. At the first level 3-5, the emphasis is relationship with Christ -- knowing and understanding His love for us, with the image of Christ the Good Shepherd.
The main material over everything is the Bible. If you had nothing else but a prayer table and the Bible you could do catechesis. Christ is Teaching through His Word. In fact, the Missionaries of Charity start with this, and then gradually and slowly, only through handmade work through thrifted materials do they add other presentations.
I tend to compare the CGS to the Home Catechesis albums. Moira's approach is quite different, but still quite good. She took from various sources and was not trained in CGS when she wrote them. Maria Montessori herself started some of this and some has been recorded in Child in the Church. Moira doesn't give references, but I see some elements from various places, including "Godly Play".
I don't like all the paper materials, just because it's not beautiful or lasting. I was preferring to do less and make it lasting rather than cut out things.
But what I think is most lacking in the manuals is formation of the parents in taking this approach. These are manuals, with step-by-step directions and a script to cover with each presentation. That is comforting and helpful to the homeschooling mother.
The missing instructions to see and take cues from the child. Time for wonder and contemplation isn't factored in. There is no room for the Holy Spirit.
And a huge element of practical life is not even included. This is based on Montessori, and practical life is a huge part of atrium: polishing, dusting, flower arranging, pouring water, sewing, washing, ironing...The young child especially experiences through the physical, and contemplates in his/her "work". (Actually we all should be doing this!). but even simple things to help the child be comfortable, like walking the line, pouring, sorting...
If you look at that list of basic practical life in an atrium, it harkens to a sacristan's or religious' work in preparation for Mass. There is a method to the madness.
All these elements can be done in the home, and should be, but it is wonderful to incorporate it together so with presentations of God's Word there is time to contemplate. Like a child learns to wash hands or tables, and chooses to do it after a deep rich presentation on the Good Shepherd. I just think that while the idea is good, because there isn't parent formation, it can can become like a lesson and a checklist. It isn't like a RightStart Math lesson, although it is presented that way.
The Mass materials are fabulous, and very similar to the CGS. This presentation is mainly a nomenclature lesson, although there should be room at the end for contemplation (the child with the lighted candles after the altar is set). While it's wonderful that the child learns the names of the sacred vessels for Mass, the point of the lesson is to make them familiar at his size so he can more fully participate with the community at Mass. Everything is so far away, usually not even seen because tall people are in the way. When he goes to Mass he'll be able to recognize in real life what he has been working with at his size at home.
At age 3-5 there is not definite catechesis that is required, but starting early gives the respect of the child that they are full members of the Church and can participate. So my bottom line is that your child will be enriched and have a wonderful experience and learn much just from this album. I do think the next levels won't be as complete as you would want, but I would give it a try at this young level.
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Family in Feast and Feria
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CatholicMommy
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Welcome to 4real :)
I second Jenn's post :) I tend to recommend Moira's albums as a supplement, but NOT as CGS - and she herself will say that only level 1 is relatively similar to CGS, from there she took her own path.
Elizabeth's album is straight from CGS training, only modified for presentations on the Traditional Latin Mass. I am under the impression she has no plans to modify levels 2 and 3, though it would be great if she did! CGS frowns upon publishing albums, but then there is another reality. I would publish my own if it weren't for becoming a formation leader.
Start with Jenn's input, try out Moira's album, and feel free to adapt for your own home.
Oh - and one thing that I didn't see in Jenn's post (I may have missed it?) -- Moira's album implies that each presentation is given every year. This simply isn't POSSIBLE - nor is it appropriate.
For example, with the infancy narratives: a 3 year old should receive the Annunciation (with one line of the Hail Mary and short version of the Magnificat) and the Nativity with the Adoration of the Shepherds. The 4 year old REVIEWS those presentations, while also receiving the visit to Elizabeth, with the rest of the Hail Mary prayer and a short version of the Canticle of Elizabeth. The 5 year old, reviews those again and also has the Adoration of the Magi and the Presentation in the Temple (both of which presentations introduce evil and hatred in a very light way; the children hear about the angelic dreams and the Canticle of Simeon, though we don't dwell on it yet).
(in level 1, we leave out the hired hand and wolf from the Good Shepherd)
In level 2 then, they spend time with those notions of evil - Herod's hatred which caused the Flight into Egypt; the words of Simeon about the sword piercing Mary's heart; the wolf and the hireling in the Good Shepherd.
The infancy narratives seem a bit out of order, especially as a catechist with lots of children around. But really it is looking at each individual child and giving greater depth each year, with plenty of time to meditate. It works perfectly for the child.
Look for the book "Joyful Journey" - it has a sample 3 year cycle that get you organized into what is appropriate at each age, so you don't have to give every presentation every year.
And for children of multiple ages - the older children can take a little bit more each year (especially at home where you do have more time), but it is ok to extend out the presentations a bit anyway, so they still have time for contemplation.
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JennGM
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I'm glad you elaborated on the presentations, Jessica. I don't have my book anymore and couldn't give specifics.
http://www.cgsusa.org/products/the-good-shepherd-and-the-chi ld/ is an excellent suggestion. They are in the process of rewriting and restructuring the whole book, but it probably won't be done for a few more years. The other really basic book that will help you see the Montessori side integrated with the Catechesis is Listening To God with Children. Such a wonderful, wonderful book.
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Aagot
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| Posted: May 08 2012 at 5:34pm | IP Logged
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I have used 3-6, 6-9 and am using 9-12 this year. I have found them very beneficial for me and the kids. There are actually very few paper activities involved with the presentations. Most of them involve felt, clay, wood, etc. They can become very involved and beautiful. I was able to get by preparing just the weekend before for 3-6 but not so with 9-12. I would recommend preparing over the summer if possible.
This is really a worthwhile program and I appreciated the effect on my children.
HTH
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Psshh03
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| Posted: May 08 2012 at 9:47pm | IP Logged
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WOW! Thanks for the thoughtful replies, I really appreciate it!
Now I'm waffling even more, wondering if we should take the plunge and have my husband (handyman and woodworker) make me (or the children I should say  ) a mini altar and purchase a mass kit.
ETA I do have Religious potential of the Child and The Good Shepherd and the Child coming in the mail!
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CatholicMommy
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| Posted: May 08 2012 at 9:51pm | IP Logged
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In my own opinion, regardless of what "program" you use, the miniature Mass set is SO worth it! There are many atriums I know of that use the one sold at Our Father's House, because it is the most complete set available, perfect size and it is beautiful (and it is made so it needs routine polishing - the perfect built-in practical life activity!).
And I want to emphasize - I LIKE Moira's guides - I just know that even she says they are not CGS; nor do many of the presentations from levels 2 and 3 even match CGS topics in many cases. ie the presentation on the Jesse Tree - fantastic devotion - perfect for the home - not done in CGS. But CGS was never meant to be the be-all-end-all of children's formation either - it was always meant to supplement what happens at home.
:)
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Rosesinsummer
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| Posted: May 25 2012 at 6:51pm | IP Logged
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I would just like to preface this with saying I'm currently in training to be a catechist for Catechesis of the Good Shepherd USA. I have completed 1 year and still have 1 year of training left to complete. My formation leader was trained by Sofia Cavaletti over 30 years ago.
That stated, personal "home" atriums are to be discouraged. The goal has always been to catechize within a worshipping community, as the entire community takes part and supports the work of the atrium.
I'm probably not saying this perfectly, and I'm short on time to elaborate, but it is always preferable that if you are really drawn to CGS and want this beautiful formation for your child, perhaps it is an inspiration of the Holy Spirit calling you should pray about becoming a catechist and sharing your gifts with your entire parish. There are so many children who desperately need Catechesis of the Good Shepherd.
God bless you all in the formation of your children.
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CatholicMommy
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The balance needs to be struck between all of the following:
--the ideal parish-based atrium - that historically is not the prevalent model.
--"home atrium" that is intended for only the children in that family
--home atrium intended for large groups - this is historically the most prevalent model until the last decade and a half. I have been in homes that have a separate room set up as an atrium and many children visit each week, just like a parish atrium; and I've had several ladies in each of my formation courses that had atrium in their homes (for a group of children) until their parish embraced it, if they ever did.
--home-based faith formation that follows Montessori principles that is frankly going to look a LOT like Catechesis of the Good Shepherd; which is based on Montessori principles
--parish atriums that may have LONG waiting lists, but no time or space to even utilize additional catechists (yes this situation exists - at least the year I was living in a particular town in Minnesota)
I have all levels of formation, have experience in parish and home atriums at all levels, including a bit of time in a "pre-atrium". I have an 8 year old son who was "home catechized" only for a year at age 6 (year 1 of level 2) - yes, with atrium. By himself. *I *had *no *other *options - and I HAD training.
"There are so many children who desperately need Catechesis of the Good Shepherd" - and there was no way I was going to refuse my son that formation just because he was "alone".
There is a noble goal, but there is also reality of a LOT of situations. And while it would be great if everyone could go to formation, we have to be considerate of those who cannot.
Yes, there is always the suggestion that if enough adults in an area want it, they can ask a formation leader to come to their area - but honestly, in many areas, there just aren't enough individuals to justify the cost of even that option.
And not every mom is ABLE to provide services to her parish atrium - whether that is as a catechist at an already-established one, or getting one going. It's just not as rosy as we would like it to be.
Perhaps I am feeling a bit defeatist today - I have finally been offered to run a level 3 atrium at our local parish this coming year - I am ELATED. But I also am realistic about the work it took to get there (I was hired 4 years ago to set up level 1 and get level 2 foundation laid; then we weren't able to be involved AT ALL for a year; then my son participated the last two years and now I can be back within the program) - it was a huge process and not one I would have undertaken had I had 7 other children and an underemployed husband as so many ladies on this board are in similar situations, perhaps even with lots of moving around and an unpleasant pregnancy going on. I am a single mom to one boy - I have a LOT more flexibility.
The moving brings up the point too - you can't provide services to a parish if you're planning to move soon.
So each mom here does the best she can.
So. Can CGS be done at home with just one family and have it LOOK like a parish atrium? Nope, not a chance.
Can Montessori be done at home with just one family and have it LOOK like a classroom? Nope, not a chance.
And that is OKAY. And WONDERFUL.
Can either of those be offered to outside families and have it look closer? Yep.
And that is OKAY. And WONDERFUL.
What is going to work for YOUR family? This year? This month?
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Rosesinsummer
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| Posted: May 25 2012 at 9:38pm | IP Logged
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I'm not judging anyone who is trying to do this kind of catechesis in the home. I just wanted to relay what was stated in our training, because it seems that some people have a misunderstanding of what CGS is about and some people think it's something anyone can order out of a catalog and DIY within your home.
There is a reason that CGS formation of catechists requires 90 hours plus additional hours outside class time to observe both atriums and Montessori classrooms. There is a lot of reading during formation. There is so much to learn! I'm simply an assistant in a level 1 atrium going through the CGS training. But ultimately, my formation will not be finished in another year, as I am always supposed to remember my role as servant to the children, listening to God with the children, because the only teacher is the Good Shepherd.
Our parish does not have a level II atrium. I would love that for my oldest who completed level I two years ago. I've even contemplated driving 1 hour to join in another parish's level II atrium, so I do understand the desire. But ultimately I feel hesitant since it is not my parish. I realize that some day I may be trained as a level II catechist (one step at a time) but the fruits of that training may not be with my own children experiencing this program first hand. I'm trusting the Holy Spirit on that one...
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Rosesinsummer
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| Posted: May 25 2012 at 10:08pm | IP Logged
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Forgot to add:
Another part of formation of the catechist is the making of materials for your atrium. This is really an important part of formation that later-comers sometimes miss out on in established atriums. It is not always possible to do everything yourself-- that's were volunteers from the parish with specific skills like carpentry, sewing, calligraphy, etc. come in handy for the community aspect for establishing an atrium.
Last summer I helped to repaint and repair our map of Israel and some of our sheepfold. It was really neat. The catechist that I'm working under spent 2 years just making and gathering materials-- some on her own, some with help from her husband, and some help from parish volunteers. It was truly a labor of love.
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JennGM
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Very interesting discussion. Lots of food for thought. I've pondered (and continue to ponder) on this for a long, long time.
Instead of the discouraging and somewhat negative "You shouldn't establish home atriums" I think it's more of a "DON'T WANT to duplicate an atrium at home."
Family life is different. I don't want to duplicate a school environment at home, nor a Montessori classroom. The relationship a parent has with her child is unique. We are the primary educators, especially in religion. So setting up any aspects of a "home atrium" will not look like a a regular atrium. You don't want to duplicate an atrium.
I have lots more thoughts, but must come back later.
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CatholicMommy
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I think Jenn hits on the main point in fewer words that my long-winded response ;)
An atrium canNOT be replicated in the home; but neither was CGS intended to be the be-all-end-all of faith formation experiences. It has always been intended to be a supplement to what happens at home.
But those same topics get taught at home (at least I would hope that most Catholic homeschooling families are not avoiding teaching their children the names for the articles of the Mass just because it's part of CGS and doing it a Montessori way might look like CGS).
Most families DO make most of their own materials, regardless of program used, if it is a Montessori-inspired home.
Making the materials is the adult's way of entering into the same moment as the child will when he uses the material. But this can be done with or without a CGS brand label.
CGS is very rich, very deep - and catechists with years of experience are still only on the surface of that depth.
In the end, it is about passing on our faith to our children in the best way for our families. If that includes something that looks like CGS, or something entirely different, that's fine for each family to choose.
CGS will never be available in a published-in-a-box curriculum - which is WONDERFUL. That doesn't mean aspects of it won't filter into family's homes, regardless of their CGS experience.
Interestingly enough, level 3 is closer to 120 hours of formation, but having 1, 2, and 3 does not mean I'm a better homeschooling mom than anyone else on this board. In fact, there are many women here who are sure to pass on the faith better to their children than I have been doing with my own son. As much as I've grown through CGS, I'm still not the best example all of the time - I wish it was like a magic wand sometimes - just make me what God wants me and quickly so that I can best be an example for my son. But that's not the Plan of God, I guess ;)
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Rosesinsummer
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Thank you ladies, for engaging in this discussion with me. Yes, I agree, lots to think about. CGS is definitely rich, I feel overwhelmed sometimes by all I have yet to learn. I will be an assistant for one more year-- nice and comfortable. I am nervous to be the lead catechist all on my own. I believe you are right that it is a continual growing process.
We are involved in Family Faith Formation this year, and I did see activities that appeared to be CGS inspired. It made me smile because I thought, "I wonder if the authors of this formation have been through CGS." No, it's not CGS, but they tried to incorporate some of the wonderful aspects of it into the formation, which I appreciated.
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4Real Forums : Domestic Church
Topic: Home catechesis using CGS
