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Angel
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Our family is in a difficult situation right now. We live in one of the most liberal dioceses in the country. Recently there have been a lot of church closings in the diocese, many old priests have been made to retire, and the wonderful old-school priests at our parish were replaced with a priest whom we thought was also very good. We felt incredibly lucky. But now it turns out that our priest, on two separate occasions, has invited a Lutheran minister to say Mass along with him and distribute Communion. (By that I mean that the minister stood at the altar wearing vestments and then distributed Communion.)
Many of our friends (this parish has long been where the Catholic homeschoolers in our farflung area attend Mass) have been wondering what to do. They are investigating other parishes. The problem is, the parish we attended was almost a church "of last resort". There just aren't many orthodox Catholic priests in the area.
So, this leads to my question: what would you do? Andy and I have been talking about attending the Latin Mass, which would mean nearly a 1.5 hour drive (one way). A luncheon is offered after Mass, because many people do travel long distances, and I know one area homeschooler who attends regularly.
And on the other hand, two of the other families with whom our children are closest have chosen to attend a different NO church in the same area as our last parish. It's closer for us, but we would have to leave earlier in the morning. These are really the kids' only friends. We are very isolated here and don't know many people.
So... that's my longwinded way of asking, in this situation, would you:
Choose to attend the faraway Latin Mass every Sunday
Choose to attend the closer NO church so the kids can see friends
or Attend the Latin Mass 1 or 2 Sundays a month and the NO Mass the other Sundays
Really, I am just worn out and a little sick at heart. Explaining to the kids why we are yet again searching for a new parish is hard, and my dh and I are not really sure what to do.
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Angela
Mom to 9, 7 boys and 2 girls
Three Plus Two
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LucyP
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Personally, I would go to the church that was closest as long as it was an orthodox (as opposed to "Traditional") Catholic church - it would be nice for the children to have friends at church I suppose, but my kids don't get to socialise at church, anyway, so that wouldn't bother me personally. I think for my own family it s good to feel involved in a local parish community(localish, as we actually attend at the next parish - we live on the border between 2, but went with the one we do not live in as the other priest was less than orthodox as well as less than welcoming when we were seeking to convert).
Maybe, if in your situation and my husband and I had the energy we would seek to clarify why the priest acted as he did, and then raise the issue with the relevant authorities - because I suspect we would rather be committed to a parish unless there was persistent and deliberate error that was harming the faith of our children or others.
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folklaur
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well, for us, it is unlikely we would drive 1.5 hours each way weekly to go to Mass.
how about a Eastern Rite parish? Are there any of those around?
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JodieLyn
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Is there any reason not to attend the other NO Mass?
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Martha
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How about option number 3?
Write a formal complaint with specific abuses to the bishop and copy it to the archbishop and higher if neccessary.
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Martha
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Erin
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Angela
We are in a similar situation, our priest would be one of the most liberal priests in the diocese (by his own admission) Currently we have chosen to stay, but I can't say we are happy but then our options are few. I worry about the effect long term on the children. Will they grow up strong in their faith and with an strong love of the Blessed Sacrament when everyone else is so casual. Dh has said perhaps we should consider something similar to your option 3. Its all so unsettling and disheartening to travel though too, we've tried that which is why we currently are where we are at.
What is the local NO situation like? Your option 2.
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Erin
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Christine
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We chose your option 1 a year ago and are so happy that we did. Our parish is only about 45 minutes away (when traffic is good). Our pastor is very orthodox and faithful to our holy father, Pope Benedict XVI, and to our Archbishop. He gives excellent homilies, visits his parishioners, is a very good confessor, and teaches the confirmation class. From what I have heard, this is true not only of our pastor, but of all the Fraternity of St. Peter priests (I have heard good things about Institute of Christ the King priests, too). As a friend of mine, who goes to a Novus Ordo Mass, recently said, "The formation of the priests who are celebrating the Latin Mass is excellent."
Our parish has potlucks after Mass twice a month and the children have made some wonderful friends. The older ones (ages 7 and up) really like going to Mass. Learning a little bit of Latin is a side benefit. 
I will keep you in my prayers as you and your husband try to discern what is best for your family.
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Christine
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Gloria JMJ
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Angela,
I came across this also and have chosen to attend the traditional Latin Mass that is 1 hour and 15 min away. We cannot get there every Sunday, so we say the Full Rosary and read the readings on the Sundays that we have to stay at home. Going to the Latin Mass has improved the children's reverence and understanding for the Blessed Sacrament.
Is there some other way that your children could get together with their friends? Maybe if you and your children have good things to say about the Latin Mass that you attend the other children's parents will decide that they want to try it too. I think that Our Lord would bless the sacrafice that you would go through to see Him and protect your children from the common irregularities of the NO. And if you explain to your children that God never changes, so we are going to the mass that never changed or ever will change, they may be able to understand.
God bless you in this difficult dicision.
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MaryM
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That is a really tough decision, Angela. I'll be praying for your family's discernment.
Seems like from what you have described as the different options you are considering there are pros and cons to each. I might be inclined to go for #3 as it would be an opportunity for your family to continue discerning the right course of action for your family by trying both for awhile. Maybe that would be how you would continue indefinitely, but maybe it would help provide the answer for deciding on one or the other option. Just a thought.
I think the important thing to remember is to fulfill our Sunday obligation to participate in the Mass, so that might be different places different weeks. I do think we can help our children to understand how seriously we take this obligation and their formation in the Faith by our discernment and searching even if that does find us at times making a change (again).
Since it has come up and there may be questions, according to the 1983 Code of Canon a Latin Rite Catholic can fulfill the Sunday or Holy Day obligations by attending the Divine Liturgy in an Eastern Catholic Church that is in communion with Rome. Remember that these will have their own customs and Eastern-rite Catholic churches have their own liturgical laws regarding holy days and are not affected by the decisions of the Latin rite, so there are differences. This Faith Facts tract from Catholic United for the Faith has additional information about the different Eastern Catholic Churches in communion with Rome. If you have trouble discerning whether a particular Eastern church in your community is an Eastern Catholic or an Eastern Orthodox church, call your local diocese and ask.
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Angel
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Martha wrote:
How about option number 3?
Write a formal complaint with specific abuses to the bishop and copy it to the archbishop and higher if neccessary.
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Actually... that's already been done. The bishop did send a letter ordering him to stop, but by this point, all of the other families we knew who attended Mass there had already chosen to leave. (We kind of found out about the situation a little later than most.) I guess I understand... although I like this priest as an individual, there is a certain strain that creeps into his homilies from time to time... NOT blatantly heretical as are some of the area's priests... but enough that you kind of wonder where he's coming from. And then again, other of his homilies are excellent. I suppose it doesn't help that in a recent consolidation of parishes Mass has been moved an hour earlier, and we are still driving 45 minutes to get there. [:s]
As for other problems with the other NO location... these friends of ours, whose opinions we value, seem to like it, but I guess there is some question about homeschoolers and the sacraments... Making a 45 minute drive to religious education classes every week would be very difficult. Not impossible, but... difficult.
I guess we are thinking about this decision not just in light of our convenience, though, or simply as a means of discharging our Sunday obligation in a way that remains loyal to the Faith (although finding a priest loyal to the Faith is our highest priority)... but also in the light of community. I know (have experienced) that Catholic churches are in general not big on community, but... it would be nice to change that... to have a church that was more like a home, you know?
In any case, thank you all very much for your replies. [:)] It does help to know what others would or have done in these situations.
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Angela
Mom to 9, 7 boys and 2 girls
Three Plus Two
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KC in TX
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What a tough decision, Angela. I'd try option 3. However, the religious ed thing would throw a wrench in things. Our parish has just decided to require CCD for the homeschoolers. However, as the priest has always said, "I cannot deny a sacrament."
Praying for you and your husband for discernment.
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KC,
wife to Ben (10/94),
Mama to LB ('98)
Michaela ('01)
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Jordan ('05)
And, my 2 angels, Rose ('08) and Mark ('09)
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SusanJ
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Angela,
I understand what you mean about wanting a good church community and its feeling like home. Our family has had great experiences of community at more than one Catholic parish--so it is possible!
It sounds like you know you would have some community at the closer NO parish but you aren't sure at TLM parish. I, too, would probably try both for a little while. You may find wonderful community at the TLM parish as well--especially if there is a regular luncheon afterward. That sounds like fostering community to me. And you may meet families who live near you and are traveling in a similar way.
And you may inspire the other families you already know to go with you to that parish. At the least, it would be a nice consolation to know you'd be able to see them on the Sundays when you had to "fall back" on the NO parish.
One other thing to consider. If priests are frequently transferred in your diocese and most of them are not faithful, the NO parish may change for the worse at some point anyway. It may be a better investment of your energy to pick a good long-term option.
Prayers for you--we have always been able to attend our parish or something very close by. My heart really goes out to all the moms here who have a hard time traveling long distances for Mass.
__________________
Mom to Joseph-8, Margaret-6, William-4, Gregory-2, and new little one due 11/1
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[URL=http://thejohnstonkids.blogspot.com]The Kids' Blog[/UR
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Nina Murphy
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Christine wrote:
We chose your option 1 a year ago and are so happy that we did. Our parish is only about 45 minutes away (when traffic is good). Our pastor is very orthodox and faithful to our holy father, Pope Benedict XVI, and to our Archbishop. He gives excellent homilies, visits his parishioners, is a very good confessor, and teaches the confirmation class. From what I have heard, this is true not only of our pastor, but of all the Fraternity of St. Peter priests (I have heard good things about Institute of Christ the King priests, too). As a friend of mine, who goes to a Novus Ordo Mass, recently said, "The formation of the priests who are celebrating the Latin Mass is excellent."
Our parish has potlucks after Mass twice a month and the children have made some wonderful friends. The older ones (ages 7 and up) really like going to Mass. Learning a little bit of Latin is a side benefit.
I will keep you in my prayers as you and your husband try to discern what is best for your family. |
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YES to everything Christine said.
Christine,
Are you in Seattle with Father Saguto? You can't do much better than Father Saguto! We  him.
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SORRY FOR JUMPING BACK IN SO RANDOMLY!!! 
(I guess I should change my avatar if I'm going to actually *post* after so long away!!!!
HELLO again dear people. )
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God bless,
~~Nina
mother of 9 on earth,
and 2 yet-to-be-met
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DominaCaeli
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Nina Murphy wrote:
Christine wrote:
We chose your option 1 a year ago and are so happy that we did. Our parish is only about 45 minutes away (when traffic is good). Our pastor is very orthodox and faithful to our holy father, Pope Benedict XVI, and to our Archbishop. He gives excellent homilies, visits his parishioners, is a very good confessor, and teaches the confirmation class. From what I have heard, this is true not only of our pastor, but of all the Fraternity of St. Peter priests (I have heard good things about Institute of Christ the King priests, too). As a friend of mine, who goes to a Novus Ordo Mass, recently said, "The formation of the priests who are celebrating the Latin Mass is excellent."
Our parish has potlucks after Mass twice a month and the children have made some wonderful friends. The older ones (ages 7 and up) really like going to Mass. Learning a little bit of Latin is a side benefit.
I will keep you in my prayers as you and your husband try to discern what is best for your family. |
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YES to everything Christine said. |
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Yes here too. (And welcome back, Nina!!)
We only travel about 30 minutes to Mass right now. We have driven farther at other points in our marriage, but we are very blessed that a Mass has recently become offered at a parish closer by.
You mentioned, Angela, that you're a little concerned about going to a parish so far away since there might not be that sense of community you could get at a local parish where everyone lives in the same neighborhood. I think you're right in one way--it is more difficult for us to attend "extras" at the parish because the drive is a bit far for us (though as the children get older and more involved, that sacrifice will be worth it to us, I imagine). Ironically, though, in my experience with TLMs, since everyone does travel a distance to be there, there is a shared sense of purpose among the parishioners that leads to friendships and community that you might not get elsewhere. The lunches after Mass sound like an example of that. I also think Susan's point about a long-term choice is a really good one.
Blessings to your family as you decide.
__________________
Blessings,
Celeste
Joyous Lessons
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Nina
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I also agree with Christine. 
Oh, and yes, the ICK priests are excellent. But that is only an option if you live in the midwest. We attend the Fraternity masses and are very happy with our parish. I certainly know how frustrating it is to deal with a liberal NO parish. I'll be praying for your family.
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DominaCaeli
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Nina wrote:
| Oh, and yes, the ICK priests are excellent. But that is only an option if you live in the midwest. |
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The Institute is also out west as well (Bay Area, CA). We have attended FSSP parishes in the past but we are now at an ICK Oratory. Praise God for both orders!
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Blessings,
Celeste
Joyous Lessons
Mommy to six: three boys (8, 4, newborn) and four girls (7, 5, 2, and 1)
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Christine
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Nina Murphy wrote:
Christine,
Are you in Seattle with Father Saguto? You can't do much better than Father Saguto! We him.
--------------------
SORRY FOR JUMPING BACK IN SO RANDOMLY!!!
(I guess I should change my avatar if I'm going to actually *post* after so long away!!!!
HELLO again dear people. ) |
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Nina, yes, we are. We feel truly blessed to have Fr. Saguto as our pastor. I have an extra copy of a booklet, containing some of his marriage sermons. If you would like it, please pm me your address and I will be happy to mail it to you.
Fr. McNeely and a few other FSSP priests visited in September to help Fr. Saguto celebrate this Solemn High Mass.
Finally, don't feel badly about jumping back in. It is good to hear from you. I am only able to visit sporadically, as life has gotten extremely busy and I am trying to stay off of the computer between 8 and 3 each day. Suzanne and Shelly (I don't know what name she uses online) occasionally let me know about posts.
__________________
Christine
Mommy to 4 girls, 5 boys, & 2 in God's care
Memories of a Catholic Wife and Mother
Pretty Lilla Rose
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Nina Murphy
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Christine wrote:
Nina Murphy wrote:
Christine,
Are you in Seattle with Father Saguto? You can't do much better than Father Saguto! We him.
--------------------
SORRY FOR JUMPING BACK IN SO RANDOMLY!!!
(I guess I should change my avatar if I'm going to actually *post* after so long away!!!!
HELLO again dear people. ) |
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Nina, yes, we are. We feel truly blessed to have Fr. Saguto as our pastor. I have an extra copy of a booklet, containing some of his marriage sermons. If you would like it, please pm me your address and I will be happy to mail it to you.
Fr. McNeely and a few other FSSP priests visited in September to help Fr. Saguto celebrate this Solemn High Mass.
Finally, don't feel badly about jumping back in. It is good to hear from you. I am only able to visit sporadically, as life has gotten extremely busy and I am trying to stay off of the computer between 8 and 3 each day. Suzanne and Shelly (I don't know what name she uses online) occasionally let me know about posts. |
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Christine,
Thank you so much; yes, that is exactly what I need! I told him many times he wrote the best sermons on marriage and family life and asked: would he please write them down. You hear them so rarely (although our sermons are always excellent). We are so blessed, all around. There are so many faithful priests defining themselves and standing strong in these current times, and proudly taking their mission to shepherd seriously (throughOUT the Church---I think of all the priests who've brought balm to my soul through Catholic radio!).
But....yes! I think strong, nourishing sermons should be published and made available to us hungry moms and dads/spouses. So, thank you---I'll PM you my address.
Thanks for welcoming me back----I definitely will come and go with the tide...in spurts. Although I would *rather* stick to a schedule and check/post consistently and be able to maintain my relationships---I truly value them. There is NOTHING like the community of faithful Catholic moms/homeschoolers----it is indipensable. My life has just gotten "in the way" of my resolutions (or something like that).  
Say hi to Father from the Murphys!
__________________
God bless,
~~Nina
mother of 9 on earth,
and 2 yet-to-be-met
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LLMom
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I understand what you are going through. For the last 9 1/2 years, we have been traveling 1 hour each way to attend a good Mass. (TLM) But we still don't have all of the sacraments and have to go out of diocese for them. That will hopefully be changing soon for confirmation. It is has been hard on our family traveling so much, but we have received many graces as well. The other drawback for us is that there aren't many families for us to get to know so we don't do anything with the parish. It is a lonely place to be at times.
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Lisa
For veteran & former homeschool moms
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Nina Murphy
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Angela, I didn't think of asking: a radical option to consider....at least for the future, if possible: moving?
I do know people who have moved to be near large and thriving Catholic communities. Ultimately, as you said: it can be everything in raising a family to have that community----especially if you don't have supportive extended family. We have just gravitated toward the parish with all of the large families and homeschoolers in whatever area we've been in----haven't known ahead of time, I've had like a special scent, or something.
It is everything to do with the children having those friends and families to be examples (well.....and the priests). The example thing has been huge----how they identify themselves.
Right now, it is the FSSP apostolate. But not in the past. It was a Novus Ordo parish revitalized by a retired priest who had had a conversion experience at an apparition site and came back and John Vianneyed the place with perpetual adoration, rosaries, confessions, and holy retired priests; then, a parish in the center of a bustling orthodox Catholic college town. Go where you need to, where Catholicism is loved and lived, would be my advice.
Or if you have strong, confident personalities and established, well-formed Faith lives, go be the leaven for another withering community. Some of us are called to sprinkle ourselves like salt in other parishes....yes. But being with like-minded families can be instrumental in keeping your kids motivated and cheerful (not to mention mom and dad focused and not demoralized), too.
Just another thought/2 cents.
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God bless,
~~Nina
mother of 9 on earth,
and 2 yet-to-be-met
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4Real Forums : Domestic Church
Topic: What would you do?
