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LLMom
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How does one go about doing this for less obvious things? Things such as job changes, moving, using certain curriculum, methods of discipline/parenting style, adding a new baby, etc. How do you know what God wants of you? Is it just a type of intuition or feeling? I know that we shouldn't base decisions of feelings alone because many times they can sway us negatively. I have been reading Thomas a Kempis' The Imitation of Christ and he says that we ought not to trust our feelings because they will quickly change and at times we ought to do that which we don't want to do. So I am wondering about how to discern things.
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dollylima
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Lisa,
What a thought-provoking thread. Thank you.
Although I think I understand what the author of this book is trying to say, I actually disagree about not trusting my feelings. Maybe it depends on what this person is meaning when he writes of feelings, but I choose to see my five senses and my sense of intuition -- which often gives rise to the experience of emotion, as Gifts from God, to be used for this exact purpose.
If a person walks through his or her daily life in a state of uncontrolled reactionism...just a big ball of feelings flitting and flying from this crisis to that, this problem to that, this experience to that, then I think there is some call for pulling back the feeling part of the self and cultivating the rational self. But in the case of a person who is
1. Regularly quieting herself before God in prayer and meditation.
2. Actively listening for God's voice.
3. Committing to seeing the earth and others through the eyes of Christ.
4. Looking at herself honestly on a regular basis and remaining unafraid of making mistakes, appearing foolish or admitting an area of weakness
and
5. Aware that our emotions and intuition are a gift, to be cared for, cultivated and respectfully utilized just as any other gift from God...
Is in a much better place to discern when and where and how to place her foot down and take the next step in faith than a person who orients herself toward her feelings (senses, emotions and intuition as I see "feelings") with such as constricting, confining and potentially unhealthy perspective as to say "These things can not be trusted." I believe that they can be trusted if you are walking in a daily devotion that includes the things I mentioned above.
I have not read the book you speak of, and this is only my opinion. I would be more than happy to discuss it further with you. I hope it helps in some way.
Heather
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SusanJ
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Thanks, Heather, for saving me the trouble of writing! I agree with everything you said.
Take it to prayer, talk to dh and another trusted advisor, do your best to discern the objectives of the situation, do everything Heather said and act. You'll make mistakes but the Lord won't abandon you in your mistakes. If you are seeking His will, you will find it.
God Bless,
Susan
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CrunchyMom
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I think that when Thomas a Kempis refers to our feelings, it is more along the lines of our passions. We shouldn't let our passions govern us.
I think that if you are in the position the Heather describes, your conscience is going to be better formed such that you can more readily rely on intuition.
I also find that while I can better rely on intuition and feelings in some areas, in others, they have not led appropriately unless guided by study as well, if that makes sense. I feel that my senses are dulled by the world, and there are areas where I don't trust my feelings to always know best (for instance, judging what clothing is modest or what entertainment is appropriate and not harmful to my soul).
If we have prayerfully considered and thought about something and ultimately have to make a decision based on "our gut" that is not the same thing as allowing our "passions" to govern us willy-nilly. Certain temperaments are always going to find peace in making a decision based on "feelings," but that doesn't have to be in the 1960s pop-psychology sense of the word, lol.
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domchurch3
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I really like what the above posters said and I would like to add a few things that have helped me.
1)A personal and family mission statement. You can read about this in Steven Covey's The Seven Habits of Highly Effective Families. Making decisions is so much easier when you have a goal in mind.
2)Weekly couple's meeting to discuss issues we have been praying about.
3)The Greg and Lisa Popcak talk about discerning God's will on their radio program, Heart, Mind and Strength. You can listen online at avemariaradio.com or net. In a nutshell they say that when you need to make a decision, you can discern God's will by choosing the decision that will lead to greater intimacy, meaningfulness and virtue.
I have used this so many times and it truly has been a blessing to put it into practice.
Blessings,
Elizabeth
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Leonie
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I find that talking to a priest, and/or to a spiritual advisor can help. And just giving it a bit of time - things seem to become clearer, sometimes, with the passing of time.
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julia s.
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Trusting your feelings can be tricky. Especially if you are truely undecided and you are looking at making a purchase which is costly or a a decision which is not easily reversible. Sometimes I know when I'm praying I'm looking to justify a choice I want to make -- and I'm not really listening to God's will, but take an absence of lightening bolts as a nod to go ahead, iykwim.
I think making a petition to God and then follow your normal daily tasks. Be as close to doing God's will in your everyday life and then through your normal routines God will give you His answer.
Not to sound contradictory, but the only real feeling I would trust is joy. I remember Elizabeth wrote in her book about how we should look closely at what makes our children happy because God placed that joy in their hearts. That rang very true and every time I follow joy I've known God walked with me.
I hope I've helped a little.
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Lisbet
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julia s. wrote:
I think making a petition to God and then follow your normal daily tasks. Be as close to doing God's will in your everyday life and then through your normal routines God will give you His answer.
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Julia, Thank you for this, it makes a whole lot of sense.
Lisa, this very question has been rolling around in my head lately too. We are dealing with the question of pregnancy (again, yes, I'm uber-fertile what can I say!) We've always just 'rolled with it', but we have sooooo much outside pressure from the outside telling us 'enough' or whatever, even though the thought of another baby brings us great joy. We just want to do Gods will in everything, and it can be so hard discerning the intentions of our actions sometimes. I am such a simple person when it comes to these things, so what Julia said really resonates with me!
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LisaR
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a dear Priest friend once told me "stop looking for "signs" - God gave you an intellect- use it!"
Many times with discerning, along with what has already been mentioned, we go forward with what seems the most logical, and prudent choice. Asking God to help us to see if we need to stop, as opposed as waiting for a sign to go ahead with a decision to begin with. Does this make sense?
it is comforting knowing too, that God allows us our freedom and that good/fruit can even come from the "wrong" decision.
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humanaevitae
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If there is no clear cut answer, we normally move toward the one that "seems" to make the most sense to us at the time, all the while prayfully "checking" with God to see if he is trying to close a door or lead us somewhere else.
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LLMom
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julia s. wrote:
Trusting your feelings can be tricky. Especially if you are truely undecided and you are looking at making a purchase which is costly or a a decision which is not easily reversible. Sometimes I know when I'm praying I'm looking to justify a choice I want to make -- and I'm not really listening to God's will, but take an absence of lightening bolts as a nod to go ahead, iykwim.
Not to sound contradictory, but the only real feeling I would trust is joy. I remember Elizabeth wrote in her book about how we should look closely at what makes our children happy because God placed that joy in their hearts. That rang very true and every time I follow joy I've known God walked with me.
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Julia,
Do you remember where in Elizabeth's book she talks about joy?
I worry about following my feelings because frankly, they do change frequently. Many mornings, I don't feel like getting up and doing school, but I make myself. There are many more examples, but I rise above those feelings and do what should be done. Also, some things seem impossible at certain times, but that feeling blows over later on in the month. That's why I am wondering about that quote from E's book. Many times my children aren't happy if I say they must do x, but they still have to do it.
Thanks for everyones imput.
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CrunchyMom
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LLMom wrote:
| I worry about following my feelings because frankly, they do change frequently. Many mornings, I don't feel like getting up and doing school, but I make myself. There are many more examples, but I rise above those feelings and do what should be done. |
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According to the definitions in my mind, that would fall under "passions." Sometimes I don't feel like doing something, but my "gut" tells me I should do it anyway, even though there may not be a logical reason that comes to mind immediately.
Again, temperament is a factor--some people effectively rely more on their feelings or rather, instincts or intuition--but optimally, those feelings are rooted in good formation of the mind through prayer and study.
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julia s.
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Lisa,
I knew I was paraphrasing it so the quote doesn't actually mention joy, but Elizabeth talks about joy often in her book.
The quote is from the section "Education is a Life" p.47
"What delights him? What does he ask about? God put those delights on his heart. Now help him pursue them."
She wasn't talking about not wanting to do chores and things... she was talking about ideas and inspirations. These are the things removed from passions that come from the Holy Spirit.
I wanted to thank you... I got to reread parts of her book again and that is always fun.
And I agree about forcing yourself to do your vocation and the children doing theirs. That is what I meant by following God's will very closely. I am beginning to see that faith is active. It is as much part of our physical body as it is part of our spirit. I've wasted many a day "waiting" for God to answer me. The answer came when I did what he set before me to do with a resigned and sometimes even a glad heart.
And joy or delight isn't this frantic/manic feeling it is peaceful and feels Godly when we live with it. At least that is how I've come to view it -- but faith is always presenting new aspects for us to ponder which is why it is so exciting and, sometimes conversely, frustrating.
LLMom wrote:
julia s. wrote:
Trusting your feelings can be tricky. Especially if you are truely undecided and you are looking at making a purchase which is costly or a a decision which is not easily reversible. Sometimes I know when I'm praying I'm looking to justify a choice I want to make -- and I'm not really listening to God's will, but take an absence of lightening bolts as a nod to go ahead, iykwim.
Not to sound contradictory, but the only real feeling I would trust is joy. I remember Elizabeth wrote in her book about how we should look closely at what makes our children happy because God placed that joy in their hearts. That rang very true and every time I follow joy I've known God walked with me.
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Julia,
Do you remember where in Elizabeth's book she talks about joy?
I worry about following my feelings because frankly, they do change frequently. Many mornings, I don't feel like getting up and doing school, but I make myself. There are many more examples, but I rise above those feelings and do what should be done. Also, some things seem impossible at certain times, but that feeling blows over later on in the month. That's why I am wondering about that quote from E's book. Many times my children aren't happy if I say they must do x, but they still have to do it.
Thanks for everyones imput. |
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Thank all of you ladies for this thoughtful discussion. I have much to take from this and to contemplate. 
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dizzylaurel
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I wanted to add one more thought...I just got back from traveling for the holidays, so I'm a few days behind!
The ideas above are wonderful, and I will add many to my prayer journal as reminders...however, the one other element that I always have trusted in making a truly discerned decision is PEACE. Whenever faced with a decision, I use many of the tactics listed above, but in the end, what really tells me that I've chosen well is a true sense of peace after the fact. If I've made a decision, and then still fret or feel "unsure", it's often a message to go back and look again at whether it was God talking or my own inner wants. If I feel that peace, I have RARELY regretted any decision made.
Just my humble two cents!
God Bless,
Laurel in PA
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4Real Forums : Domestic Church
Topic: discerning God's will
