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Kathryn
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| Posted: Sept 10 2013 at 4:47pm | IP Logged
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We did a very informal kinder math with DD 6 last year and so this year I purchased the Horizons Math 1 book for her but it's not "clicking". We did some worksheets last year so it's not like worksheets are new. And she's very familiar with 100 chart and can skip count and do simple add/subtract but I'm not sure if she needs more time in this level or if I really need to go down to the kinder program maybe book 2 for now. Here are a few examples (sorry it's so long):
1. she can easily count by 5s to 100 but on the worksheet it says to count by 5s and fill in the blank and gives example 5 (blank) 15 so answer would be 10 which she got
we work next one together 20 (blank) 30 and she looks at me like  so we start counting from 5 until we get there and she says 25 and writes it down But on alll the other 4 she did them wrong... 45 (blank) 55 she wrote 46 etc.
2. place value showing 89 = blank + blank and she's supposed to fill in the tens place and ones place; she got the tens place but missed the ones place so I helped get her back on track; then I said see how 89 on this side EQUALS 80 + 9 on this side (and I showed her with the abacus)... more  like she's not making that connection or understanding and unless I sit and work every problem with her, they're wrong
3. the number line showing from 0-9 and if it shows going over 1 and then ADDING 3 more you get to 4 she is sooo lost on this concept and yet she can add 1 + 3 and get to 4 but the number line is clearly a new concept she's not understanding
Sooo...if you made it through that, thank you so help me discern from this (if you're able  ) whether I need to just sit with her one on one thru the whole lesson (my goal is no more than 20 min to work), whether I need to scale back to a lower level or ????
Thanks!!
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Kathryn in TX
(dd 16, ds 15, dd 8, dd 5)
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SallyT
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| Posted: Sept 10 2013 at 9:01pm | IP Logged
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My kids had a hard time with those sequence type things for a long time -- either they wouldn't get the "rule" for the sequence or wouldn't know how to apply the rule if they did know it . . . It's a kind of abstract thinking that's just difficult for some children at early stages.
Place value, too. Just did not compute for any of my children early on (6-ish). As I recall, we played a lot of computer math games that involved place value -- Starfall has some nice ones, for example. And we used cuisenaire rods. And we counted out black-eyed peas . . . One thing I've done for various mathematical concepts is to use an empty egg carton and count things into the "cups." So to form a number like 89, you'd count ten blackeyed peas, or beads, or whatever, into eight "cups," then only nine into the ninth one. It would be kind of tedious, but actually doing that counting -- "1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10" -- however many times might make the concept concrete. At least, I'm not mathy, and it makes sense to me!
With most of these things, I think just going over and over the difficult concept, whether it's working with a number line or understanding place value, might be the way to go -- not dropping back, necessarily, but slowing down so that maybe you'd spent your whole 20-minute lesson doing that one thing, until it makes sense. OR skipping it for a time, if you possibly can, and coming back to it later. I think that if the number line were causing confusion and frustration for a child who could already add simple numbers, I'd let it go for the time being and try introducing it again later on.
I don't know the Horizons program, so I don't know if you can pick and choose and skip things very easily, but I think that's what I might try.
Sally
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Aagot
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| Posted: Sept 10 2013 at 11:05pm | IP Logged
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Does your abacus have the ten beads all the same color in one row and another color the next row? Or is it like the AL Abacus - the first five blue the next five yellow? The reason I ask is it just sounds like she isn't visualizing in groups of fives and tens yet.
If your abacus is like the first description , I would either repaint it or use some other manipulative that you can control its colors. Maybe plastic cubes or squares.
If you are using an AL abacus ( the kind RightStart Math uses), then I would let her use it until she doesn't need it any more. She will stop when it has been internalized.
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JodieLyn
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| Posted: Sept 10 2013 at 11:38pm | IP Logged
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My oldest (quite a bit different aqe) in Algebra and dealing with negative numbers.. rather than a "number line" I tell her to picture a thermometer (like for outside).. since it's familiar (and here we get negative numbers on it) it seems to really work better. So if you've done work with a thermometer and you child is used to that.. you might use that for a picture image.
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All men who have turned out worth anything have had the chief hand in their own education.
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Kathryn
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| Posted: Sept 11 2013 at 4:15pm | IP Logged
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Aagot wrote:
| Does your abacus have the ten beads all the same color in one row and another color the next row? |
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Yes it's like this.
I think maybe I do just need to spend more time on the new material. The reason I've liked Horizons for older DS is b/c it teaches the new concept and then the rest of the worksheet is all review. He really needs that constant review and it seems to have worked really well for him. So that's why I went with this program for her. I'll stick with this level then. Today I made sure we spent only 20 min and I worked on the dry erase board with the new concepts and it went much better. I'll try some of the other ideas about number order too.
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Kathryn in TX
(dd 16, ds 15, dd 8, dd 5)
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anitamarie
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| Posted: Sept 11 2013 at 4:21pm | IP Logged
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With my first grader (using Horizons), I stay with her thru the whole lesson, just to make sure that she's got the concepts. This may seem like a silly question, but are you using the Teacher's Manual? I know a few who have tried to go without it, and it was hard. I make sure the first few times she sees a concept that I go over it exactly as laid out in the TM. (Not that you aren't.)And I'm sure to do the counting and flash cards. Sometimes we set up the number chart with transparent colored disks over the numbers we are skip counting. When we first do the skip counting activity with the blanks, I leave it set up to refer back to.
I made a place value manipulative type thingy for my dd last year, and she used it a few times at the beginning of the year as a reminder. If you use excel, I can send it to you. Just pm me.
Also, 80% correct is considered proficient enough to move forward in many cases. She may just need more practice.
All that to say, I don't think you need to scale back to a lower level, just maybe go over concepts a little more thoroughly.
God Bless,
Anita
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Kathryn
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| Posted: Sept 11 2013 at 5:15pm | IP Logged
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Hi Anita,
Actually yes I did purchase the TM and do use it...mostly. It's def. not the easiest TM, imho I guess b/c there are no visuals or ready-made, handy manipulative charts like you mention about the place value.
My son did a BJU math curriculum at a co-op one yr and I *LOVED* their TM. It was so thorough and had the exact visual concept of how I would present it to the child and it had a disk with all those paper manipulatives I would need so it was just a click away to print and be done. So while I like the Horizons book better for DS I plod thru the TM for him and now her grade 1.
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Kathryn in TX
(dd 16, ds 15, dd 8, dd 5)
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anitamarie
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I totally agree about the TM.  Especially now that I have one doing 4th!
Good luck.
Anita
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4Real Forums : Living and Loving Numbers
Topic: Do I need to adjust math level?!
