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aussieannie
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| Posted: June 14 2008 at 10:05am | IP Logged
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I was just reading a great blog entry, The Art of Forgiveness and it is such a universally important issue, it is even emphasised in the Our Father. Mother Angelica always spoke on it, often her guest speakers dedicated their hour to it.
Can we get to heaven without practising it "7x70"? Why is it the hardest thing in the world, but something that makes us feel so good when we finally decide to do it?
Unforgiveness has the ability to physically harm and oppress you according to some, I wonder why and how many just can't acknowledge that?
How many times has unforgiveness destroyed relationships and really, for no good reason? Why is it we have to keep reevaluating whether we have unforgiveness issues - didn't I conquer that last time?
Then there these side issues... to forgive but how do I behave toward that person afterwards? When is enough, enough and not an issue of forgiveness but of prudence etc? It all feels like a delicate balancing act...
My understanding of forgiveness is the ability to pray for that person and I can't think of how many times I'll say to someone, "I can pray for that person, I've forgiven them." but even though I've said I COULD, I HAVEN'T as yet...  Then when I finally 'bite the bullet' and seriously do it, I find that I don't have those embarrassing flare-ups over them when I really thought I had forgiven..you know, those: "Where on earth did that come from?"   
In fact, when I do it (pray for them), anything humanly possible to resolve and heal in the day to day dealings with the person/people, does and will happen. Actually I shouldn't say 'humanly possible' because it always quite miraculous and it is precisely because it has come from the Divine that you marvel over it.
I haven't any serious forgiveness issues at present to prompt me to talk like this, (but hey, but how many times do I think I don't but something not acknowledged is lurking there anyway, I just can't see it?)
Look how I can say so much on this subject just by 'musing over it' - actually I haven't really said that much, just asked alot of whys...
It is the cornerstone of what God expects from us, because I'm sure it blocks grace from entering our lives on so many levels.
I'd love to have a good discussion with all of you great women. Can you share your thoughts and stories, do you have any books to recommend or articles to link? What are practical ways to approach this issue? What has made a difference in your life?
I know it is spring over where most of you are and just thinking and talking about this issue creates an image in my mind of spring cleaning and throwing open the windows, letting the fresh air in.....ahhhhhh!
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Maryan
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| Posted: June 14 2008 at 10:11am | IP Logged
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Annie... I can't believe you posted this!! The other day on PBS I watched a special where someone was talking about forgiveness and then being a doormat.
And I wondered - hmm... does turning the other cheek mean WILLFULLY (not passively) mean being a doormat? Does forgiveness involve being dying to self THAT much?
And what happens when the person doesn't even say sorry? It's easy to forgive when there's an apology? But what if it doesn't come?
And I know exactly what you mean about hidden flare ups. I haven't a clue that I'm "holding" something... when all of a sudden something comes up and I realize, "Wow... I didn't know that I carried that."
Would love to hear thoughts too...
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Erin
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| Posted: June 16 2008 at 2:56am | IP Logged
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Anne
One of the first things we have to realise relating to forgiveness is that it may not happen quickly in fact it can take years, particularly when you have been seriously hurt, and therefore need to forgive the transgressor. And this is okay. You need to acknowledge your hurt before you can start the forgiving process.
I struggled for years with a deep hurt and I used to wonder, "Should I be going to Communion? I have so much anger and hurt, I haven't yet forgiven" Yes I should have gone, I seriously needed those graces. I was constantly praying over the situation, taking it to Confession regularly and asking for forgiveness and the graces to help forgive more truly. The best advice I received in it all was to offer my Communions specifically for the person, that was when true forgiveness and healing happened, not instantly but it did happen. And Maryan, I never received an apology and it truly does make it harder.
I received counselling over this time period and it helped, but truly I believe that it was only through the sacraments that I achieved healing and forgiveness. What a privilege it is to be able to receive the Sacraments.
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aussieannie
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| Posted: June 16 2008 at 4:44am | IP Logged
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Maryan wrote:
| And what happens when the person doesn't even say sorry? It's easy to forgive when there's an apology? But what if it doesn't come? |
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Yes, this is where grace truly is needed, it is much easier to forgive those who are sorry but when you do not receive that sorrow it is a wound that continues to exist and continue on...unless you step in and turn it over to God.
Erin wrote:
| One of the first things we have to realise relating to forgiveness is that it may not happen quickly in fact it can take years, particularly when you have been seriously hurt, and therefore need to forgive the transgressor. |
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Well I suppose like virtue, we can only say we truly possess it unless we have been tested and often strongly, I think we can forget that. In the case of forgiveness, struggling in that testing/trial, knowing what it really feels like to want to reject forgiveness but still bringing it to God sooner or later, and saying, "Lord, I will pray for this person, please help my feelings of unforgiveness, heal my own heart." then we know what it means to forgive.
Erin wrote:
| I struggled for years with a deep hurt and I used to wonder, "Should I be going to Communion? I have so much anger and hurt, I haven't get forgiven" Yes I should have gone, I seriously needed those graces. |
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Temptations can be so strong sometimes, the fact you even FEEL such strong emotion, can make you feel awfully guilty, so I know what you mean about, "should I go to Communion?" and I can tend towards scruples which doesn't help.
Erin wrote:
| I received counselling over this time period and it helped, but truly I believe that it was only through the sacraments that I achieved healing and forgiveness. |
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I think this is a beautiful point, it is GRACE that enables to move beyond the situation, counselling can play it's part in the rationizing of a situation, but sactifying grace allows us to take it to our heart and soul and forgive.
Erin wrote:
| What a privilege it is to be able to receive the Sacraments. |
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Oh, Amen! I think of times when I have gone to confession and then placed those who I have a hard time forgiving on the paten and in the chalice at the offertory and prayed for God to bless them abundantly and to heal my heart, I KNOW my ability to forgive is God working in me. I am just not capable of doing this by myself.
I have seen people I have known well, destroy their lives and often the lives of their loved ones when there is a stony unforgiveness towards God. Unforgiveness spawns such bitter, twisted fruit.
I've also seen someone start to seriously destroy their life over unforgiveness until finally they saw the light and prayed for that person and forgave, this too, took many years to get to that point. This person is now a real beacon of light when sharing her story with others struggling in a similar way.
I had something else I really wanted to say but breastfeeding fog set in....I'll be back when it clears away.
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Erin
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| Posted: June 16 2008 at 4:57am | IP Logged
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aussieannie wrote:
| I have seen people I have known well, destroy their lives and often the lives of their loved ones when there is a stony unforgiveness towards God. Unforgiveness spawns such bitter, twisted fruit. |
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Isn't this a different thing? Unforgiveness towards God vs unforgiveness towards another. I haven't really thought about this. What do you think?
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aussieannie
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| Posted: June 16 2008 at 5:38am | IP Logged
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One of the cases was unforgiveness towards God the other towards a person...they are both damaging, but I tend to think unforgivness towards God, you have driven a very big wedge between you and the sacraments/faith...
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Servant2theKing
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| Posted: June 16 2008 at 5:40am | IP Logged
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It seems as though forgiveness toward others, toward ourselves or toward God is ultimately a reflection of the state of our heart and soul. The more we allow our hearts to be united with the Sacred Heart of our Lord the less our thoughts and deeds are dictated by our own heart and will.
There have been numerous incidents in the past that have caused me to struggle with forgiveness...the more I pray and stay close to the Heart of Jesus, the less of a struggle I have in forgiving...very often I find myself forgiving as soon as the wound occurs because the Lord helps me see the other person's own woundedness rather than the pain they have just inflicted.
The times I still struggle with forgiving always seem to be rooted in pride...a "how dare they treat me that way" mentality. If I can turn my thoughts toward the immense agony our Lord suffered for our sakes, when "he uttered not a word" in His own defense, I am more able to see the wrong in my own indignation and pray for the soul that has caused only minor pain in comparison to Christ's Passion.
With all that said, forgiveness does not mean we are called to allow others to continue to wound, especially if our children or others are being harmed. Setting healthy, holy boundaries, a hedge of protection, around our families is a crucial part of our duty as parents. Otherwise, do we not act as accomplices if we stand idly by and allow someone to harm innocent victims? I have found that the best solution with ungodly, hurtful behavior is simply removing ourselves from the company of those who continually lash out and wound us, while still keeping them in continual prayer. To forgive is truly Divine. May our Divine Lord and Saviour give us the grace to forgive the trespasses of others AS He forgives us our trespasses.
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Nina
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| Posted: June 16 2008 at 5:33pm | IP Logged
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Servant,I totally agree.I think that sometimes we feel guilt eventhough we have forgiven but refuse to allow others to hurt us with their abusive behavior.This is even more true when it(sadly)involves relatives.
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Angie Mc
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| Posted: June 16 2008 at 6:09pm | IP Logged
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Interesting topic! I'll think on it...I have more questions than answers. Here is how we make amends within our family.
When someone outside of the family doesn't ask for forgiveness, we imagine or role play that the person is asking for forgiveness. This can really help to soften our hearts.
Forgiveness for deep wounds is more of a process than a one time event, for sure. This is especially true when the wrong doing continues and continues...even if at a distance. This is where it gets confusing. The objective outcome of ongoing wrong doing and unkindness is strained relationships. I don't see the problem as a lack of forgiveness on my part (if I have done my best to forgive,) but rather a challenge to continue to forgive because I cannot cooperate with sin. Perhaps this is where the 7X70 comes in...that ongoing desire to forgive and pray for the other person.
Love,
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Angie Mc
Maimeo to Henry! Dave's wife, mom to Mrs. Devin+Michael Pope, Aiden 20,Ian 17,John Paul 11,Catherine (heaven 6/07)
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4Real Forums : Tea and Conversation
Topic: To forgive is Divine.....
