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ambermelody
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| Posted: July 18 2007 at 4:49am | IP Logged
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Hello,
I was going to write this post is response to “Advice to a Newbie” but thought that it might be better to start a new thread.
My eldest ds3 enrolled in a Montessori preschool program (as I have mentioned in some previous posts :) I hope I’m not boring you all to tears here!!) at the beginning of the year. And this is where my Montessori adventure began – leading to voracious reading, websurfing ;) & our plan to homeschool (there is no Montessori elementary school in our area - & we’ve always been drawn to the idea).  Yippee!
I had just read the “Advice to a Newbie” thread the other day when I went to pick my ds up at the end of his day (he is enrolled 2 days a week & I am working towards providing him a Montessori preschool program at home for the rest of the week) & was excited about talking to his assistant directress about my plans...
Well, basically she said “No, no. Don’t buy any of the Montessori materials. That would just be repeating what we do here. He can do the Montessori work here & you can provide him with lots of practical examples of the work in his own home environment”
Hmmmm... well, I like this teacher but I must say that I was quite frustrated by her response. She was very forthright about it too – I felt like she was telling me what to do rather than just offering her opinion.
I want to do this! Everything I read (& all of this groups wonderful wisdom & enthusiasm) gets me more & more excited about our learning future. I am hoping to make a lot of materials but I am also hoping to buy some of the classic M materials when we receive some money we’re waiting on: The pink tower, the brown stairs, moveable alphabet, sandpaper letters & numbers (unless I get brave & make them, which I should really try first!) & globes & maps & insets.
She also expressed her opinion that the presentations need to be so precisely shown to the child – the movements, the words, the pauses, the way the pieces are held – that it wouldn’t be possible for someone to present them without extensive training, including multiple in-person teaching examples. I know that the precision of the presentations is very important – but I will only learn with practice. practice. practice.
Now that I’ve thought about it a bit I’ve started to wonder whether I should take her advice & just let him experience the real materials there & just provide extension work. What would you do if your dc did have some outside access? 
I do want to keep him in the preschool for the time being because I’ve really seen him blossom with his Montessori experience & until I feel really organised & confident I don’t want to lose that.
I’d love your thoughts. re. “What would you do if your dc did have some outside access to the Montessori materials?” I’m sorry this is so long. I’ve got to learn to be more succinct! 
Amber.
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SeaStar
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| Posted: July 18 2007 at 6:45am | IP Logged
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I'm not a Montessori expert, but I do want to say this: the more I read about Maria Montessori, the more I'm convinced that she would be shocked and even discouraged that her methods have taken on an "elitist" nature.
I mean- my goodness! It certainly doesn't take years of extensive training to teach a child how to sweep.
Also, Maria Montessori was a trail blazer- she was the first female doctor in Italy. She landed a job of caring for children who were seen as mentally "inferior", and she used her own ingenuity to help them learn. She made up all this stuff as she went along- it was all about trial and error and what worked.
Were she still alive today, I"m sure she'd still be tweaking her system. I think she would rather see us use her methods at home the best we can rather than send our children off to schools that we find lacking for whatever reason. And I'm sure she would frown heavily on anyone who said, "No, YOU can't do this. It would be impossible." How many times did people say that to her during her lifetime? Probably often.
You know what is best for your ds. Give yourself permission to have some fun and make some mistakes and enjoy your time with him.
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Melinda, mom to ds ('02) and dd ('04)
SQUILT Music Appreciation
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Land O' Cotton
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| Posted: July 18 2007 at 7:27am | IP Logged
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Funny that this is the topic I'm reading this morning!
I had the same kind of "uh-oh" feeling after reading in my Michael Olaf catalog yesterday (which I have to say is a great resource for Montessori ideas). At the back of the catalog I came across this heading: Parenting and Teaching; "Montessori Materials", then the category "Didactic Materials". The catalog says this, "These are materials that were developed by Dr. Montessori for use in schools. These include the sensorial (color tablets, red rods, etc.) and math (bead frame, square root materials, etc.) materials... They are not useful in the home because they are of no value without a teacher trained on the relationship of their use to the needs of and development of the child."
Wow! And I've been busy making my own color tablets here too!
I think what the catalog (and teacher) is trying to say is that in order to have a deep understanding and application of knowledge a person would have to be trained in the Montessori method. I know I'm certainly no match for a person who's gone through extensive training, but I do think I am able to comprehend to the best of my ability the thought process behind some of these materials. I can (hopefully) discern what will work best for my child and then apply myself to reading as much as possible about the methods I use.
I'm learning lots by just reading here and printing off some of the threads that I find are real gems loaded with ideas of how to incorporate this Montessori style into my homeschool. I also have to put in a plug for the book Montessori in the Classroom by Paula Polk Lillard. It's really helping me to see more of the "big picture". I'm still in the process of figuring out which supplies to order, and which I can pass up due to age of my child.
I am looking into the online class that Karen Tyler will be teaching for the elementary level this fall. If funds permit, I'll certainly do it! If not, I'll keep plugging along, finding as many books as possible at the library and ordering others used.
So all this is to say that, yes, you can do it! We're all here doing just the same! Keep reading here, 'cause these women are full of ideas and help.
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Vicki
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Mackfam
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Amber,
I thought Melinda summed it up absolutely beautifully! I don't want to dimish the great value it must be to have Montessori training, it is valuable! But, it is not the only exclusive club from which Montessori thoughts can spring.
You are an unqualified expert in your son. No one else on the face of the planet can come close to that. No one else will be as motivated as you will be to seek out his best interests, apply ideas, stumble, get back up, tweak, and try again. Your home is a unique and un-duplicatable environment in which exists a special unconditional love - it is a place that is fertile, and your son's mind will be lovingly nourished here. So, you know how I feel about bringing it home! You should try to educate yourself as much as possible, particularly in Montessori's philosophies, then begin studying some albums. Ask God for wisdom and guidance, and leave the rest to Him! This can be done at home!!
Now, to answer your question directly - What would you do if your dc did have some outside access to the Montessori materials? I don't know that I would present materials at home and still send my son to preschool. That could be confusing to him. If you want to leave him in the preschool setting for awhile, now might be a good time to be an eager learner. Take a class, observe the habits your ds is learning so you can enforce them in the same way, read on Montessori's method, begin to keep track of the different materials and presentations your ds is doing in preschool. When you pull him out and bring him home, you'll know right where he's been, and you'll be ready to pick up from there. There will be a learning curve, home is different from classroom, it will not be the same for him or for you. Remember that Montessori is about making connections! Your home is a wonderful environment for offering opportunities to make connections, but it is a different environment than the classroom, and no amount of materials neatly stacked will change those dynamics. Don't try to change them, be relaxed enough to be open to his cues. Be gentle, and the learning moments will come naturally.
HTH Amber. Enjoy the opportunities you have with your young son. 
__________________
Jen Mackintosh
Wife to Rob, mom to dd 19 , ds 16, ds 11, dd 8, and dd 3
Wildflowers and Marbles
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AndreaG
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Just my opinion (and of course as a montessori homeschooler I just might be biased!) but I think that all the warnings about needing to be trained go back to Maria Montessori herself and stem from the fact that her educational approach was so different. She wanted to be sure people "got" her philosophy and her approach to children and weren't just using her materials in a non-montessori way and calling it montessori. And the presentations are detailed and there are alot of them- so understanding montessori and teaching it is complicated. I can see how a trained teacher who went to years of schooling (and payed big bucks for tuition!) would be skeptical that you could just pick it up in a few weeks of reading online
But I would not let that discourage you- as Melinda said above- teaching a child to sweep is not rocket science! It's really up to you- you know your child best, if there are some materials that he enjoys or some that he needs more work with you could purchase/make those - or you could focus on extensions following his interests (dinosaurs, space or whatever). If you are planning to homeschool for elementary, it might be worthwile to invest in some primary materials as many of the sensorial and math items are used in elementary also.
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Andrea
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CatholicMommy
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| Posted: July 18 2007 at 8:22am | IP Logged
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I do NOT think I would worry that duplicating the Montessori school experience at home is a bad thing - your son is only there 2 mornings a week you said, and most children are there 5 days a week, therefore having more time to work with the materials anyway!
By having the materials at home, there will be a greater range of possibility for real-life applications/extensions than found in the school. You'll know what your son is learning and how to extend that knowledge into elementary and later years. Also, you may decide you are comfortable enough with it all to have Montessori at home for your younger ones as well - no school at all for them, maybe.
The preciseness of presentations, as others have already mentioned, came with lots of trial and error on the part of Maria Montessori and others. Your child will not fall apart if you do something wrong - just take your time learning the materials yourself. Do some practice presentation on your husband, if nothing else, it'll get you to laugh at yourself :)
I can attest that YES the movements have to be precise. I have had many many many instances where the first time a young child has seen something done, it is done incorrectly and THAT is what sticks! It's amazing! I keep telling my own 3yo - I'm sorry, I made a mistake; here is how to do it appropriately. Takes a lot to undo it. NOT to scare you at all! Just to point out my own discoveries:
to avoid too many words in a presentations, aim for NONE, and then only speak when necessary. That way YOU are focusing on careful movements. Sometimes, just starting to do a work yourself, the children come over and watch and learn (they get this experience at the school - no reason it can't be done at home - I use this technique sometimes to 'test' if a child is ready for the next step - if they come over and stay for my whole work cycle, I will then present it to them).
Move SLOWLY. Excruciatingly slow, if need be. This way, you have the opportunity to correct mistakes before making them.
Make all movements obvious - exaggerated - make it obvious you're looking at the size of something, by obviously turning your head, not just your eyes when looking, and move/point your finger to the places you are looking.
In your case, your son has already some of those initial presentations, so YOUR presentation won't be so crucial - he may correct you, which is not a bad thing, because it will show that he's already learned it to an extent. Present anyway, so he can show you what he knows and you can see where he might want to head next with it, based on what he says/does.
And definitely come back here for support and ideas!
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Meredith
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SeaStar wrote:
I'm not a Montessori expert, but I do want to say this: the more I read about Maria Montessori, the more I'm convinced that she would be shocked and even discouraged that her methods have taken on an "elitist" nature.
I mean- my goodness! It certainly doesn't take years of extensive training to teach a child how to sweep.
Also, Maria Montessori was a trail blazer- she was the first female doctor in Italy. She landed a job of caring for children who were seen as mentally "inferior", and she used her own ingenuity to help them learn. She made up all this stuff as she went along- it was all about trial and error and what worked.
Were she still alive today, I"m sure she'd still be tweaking her system. I think she would rather see us use her methods at home the best we can rather than send our children off to schools that we find lacking for whatever reason. And I'm sure she would frown heavily on anyone who said, "No, YOU can't do this. It would be impossible." How many times did people say that to her during her lifetime? Probably often.
You know what is best for your ds. Give yourself permission to have some fun and make some mistakes and enjoy your time with him. |
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I couldn't have said this better myself Amber, you are in good company here, the mommy lion instinct clearly has it's place here and for her to tell you that it would be a mistake for you to try and do this at home is ridiculous  . Bravo to what everyone else has said, my goodness!
We love it that you brought your concerns here as well, we can truly *see* what the influences of the outside may have on our own children. Many blessings to you 
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Meredith
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helene
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I think Melinda has a beautifully written response. I just want to say that while you may not be a Montessori expert, youare an expert on your child and the way he learns (in a way that no one else could be, so there). The same would be true in high school when you suddenly realize you are not an Algebra expert. Who cares? Pull up a chair beside your child and learn along! This is another great blessing of homeschooling. I am suddenly able to fill in some gaps from my previous education (in many subjects) even while raising a large and busy family. Lovely opportunities for Martha and Mary moments abound in our living and learning lifestyle! Lucky us!
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Happy Mom to five girls (20,17,13,11and 4) and five boys (19, 15, 10, 8 and 6)
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lapazfarm
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I don't think there is a subject in the world in which I could not educate myself if I were motivated to do so. To claim that a simple, straightforward teaching method is beyond our comprehension is absurd. Sure, the M method is rich and unique and detailed, but it is NOT rocket science. And even if it were, well, I think I understand rocket science pretty well, too.
I would have been highly insulted by this teacher's remarks.
You can do whatever you set your mind to and do it well. Plenty of resources are available to you. Don't let her stop you if this is what you have determined is best for your child.
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Theresa
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ambermelody
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| Posted: July 18 2007 at 5:59pm | IP Logged
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What wonderful advice & wisdom. I could reply individually ... but really I just want to show my appreciation for all of the confidence you bring to this forum.
And I just loved teresa's passionate response : "I don't think there is a subject in the world in which I could not educate myself if I were motivated to do so... Sure, the M method is rich and unique and detailed, but it is NOT rocket science. And even if it were, well, I think I understand rocket science pretty well, too." I'm going to live in THAT spirit!
And I really liked Jessica's ideas on the presentations - esp. trying to use NO words & working back from there. That's brilliant.
I am buoyed by your words & feeling stronger in my decisions every day. I think I will make my planned purchases & continue with my plans & gauge ds's "confusion factor" (if there is any - yes, he'll probably just tell what I'm not doing right!) & go from there.
Smiling in Australia
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Celeste
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I agree with what's been said above, but I'm going to propose a slightly different slant to the teacher's response. She quite probably was coming from an elitist viewpoint. But she might not have.
It's possible that the child will lose interest in the materials before he has gotten full benefit from them if they're at school and home. I have my younger children in a Children's House; and the same (AMI) directress who counseled against having duplicate material at home has also sold me used Mont elem classroom material for use in our homeschool.
She and her husband (also a Montessori teacher) give classes for parents to implement the Montessori philosophy in the home, focusing mostly on care of the environment, care of self, making the home child-friendly, and parental attitudes etc. So they're very much about training the parents and unifying the school and home environments.
I guess what I'm bumblingly trying to say is this: Not all true Montessorians oppose doing it yourself at home; but it isn't necessary (and may be counterproductive) to replicate the primary environment at home if your child is in a Children's House.
I hope that makes sense and doesn't sound offensive, because I'm truly not disagreeing, just offering a different perspective.
Celeste
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montessori_lori
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ambermelody, this is just my opinion based on being a Montessori teacher for 10+ years and a mom who currently homeschools with Montessori.
I understand what this assistant meant, and perhaps she went too far (or was unkind), but the basic idea is sound. If your son has access to many of the Montessori materials at home, it will be harder for him to concentrate at school. The freshness and novelty will not be there, and in a classroom with many children, the "irresistibility" factor of the materials is very, very important or the kids are too easily distracted.
Also, while it is certainly possible for you to learn the presentations at home with much research and practice, they will probably differ from what/how he is being shown at school, and could be confusing either to him or to other kids who might see him doing the work in a different way.
There are *tons* of activities that you can do in the home without buying a pink tower, brown stair, beads, etc. There are games, practical life activities, crafts, etc. If you were going to keep him home and do Montessori yourself, then I would say by all means, purchase as many quality Montessori materials as you can. But it doesn't sound like that is the case for you right now.
Books like Montessori Play & Learn: A Parent's Guide to Purposeful Play from 2 to 6 by Lesley Britton have dozens of Montessori things to do in the home, and most important, this book gives a very clear idea of how to set up your home in a Montessori way.
Truly, if you dedicated yourself to simply making your home "Montessorified", that could take up much of this next year for you and reap untold benefits for your son. This is completely separate from the materials and the presentations; it would involve the way your house is organized and arranged, the kinds of things you do with him, the way you approach everyday tasks of cleaning and personal care.
That's the place to start, and if after that you feel like there are some materials that you'd like him to experience that his school doesn't have, you could purchase some things and do them with him.
The other most important thing you can do with him now is read, read, read! That will compliment the materials he is working with in the classroom extremely well.
Again, just my opinion!
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Eleanor
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[Hmm, I just realized that I cross-posted with Lori... but I think most of the following still stands. ]
According to Amber's post, her son's teacher said,
"Don’t buy any of the Montessori materials. That would just be repeating what we do here. He can do the Montessori work here & you can provide him with lots of practical examples of the work in his own home environment."
Some people seem to be interpreting this to mean that she's discouraging floor-sweeping at home. I don't get this sense at all.... I mean, that's a practical example if ever there was one. It sounds more like she's advising parents not to buy and use the specialized Montessori apparatus, like the brown stair or sandpaper letters. I think this is generally wise advice, for reasons that transcend the question of whether or not Montessori is "rocket science." 
Amber has chosen to send her son to school for the primary level, at least for the time being. So, at this point, I'd say that her role is to support the teacher's work... not to try and match it. According to the parent education materials I've seen from places like NAMTA, "support" would mean things like facilitating the child's independence in daily tasks, giving him chances to make meaningful contributions to family life, providing appropriate toys and books, exposing him to beautiful music and art, going on fun and educational outings, and all those other things that caring and knowledgeable "Montessori-compatible" parents who don't homeschool are likely to do with their young children. I'm inclined to think that the mother of a schooled child would be far better off spending her time, energy, money, brainpower, and shelf space on these sorts of activities, than on duplicating the materials and presentations that the child would already be receiving at school. And this would still be true even if he were only attending part-time.
We have a somewhat similar situation with regard to music. Although my husband is quite an accomplished musician, and could probably teach our children himself, we've chosen to enroll them in a music program with a very definite philosophy (Suzuki -- actually similar to Montessori in many ways). As part of the program, he's required to attend a series of "parent education" classes, where he'll be taught how to support the teachers by encouraging music appreciation, modeling good practice habits, and so on. But he will *not* be supplementing this by reading up on Suzuki teacher training materials, trying to figure out how he can teach the program. That's the teachers' job, and we respect that they're able to do it very well. (Otherwise, we wouldn't be paying through the nose for the privilege! )
OTOH, as someone whose Montessori homeschooling plans were temporarily "shelved" for various reasons, I can completely relate to Amber's eagerness to get started with her son. It's really hard to learn about all these amazing materials, and not have a chance to use them.
Amber, if you don't have younger children (or if you have someone who can watch them), would you consider volunteering part-time as an assistant at your son's school, or another local Montessori school? They would probably be glad to have you, and I'd bet that this would be a great experience.
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montessori_lori
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Great post, Eleanor. I had just returned to say something similar - parents should try to complement, not reproduce, what the teachers are doing in school. Otherwise, as you say, what is the point of paying to send kids to school?
Also, while it's true that Montessori isn't rocket science, would you send your son to a Montessori school where the teachers weren't formally trained in Montessori? You are paying big $$ for their expertise - and it is expertise, as the Montessori training is extremely difficult and rigorous.
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ambermelody
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wow,
since i added my last post there have been some very thought provoking comments. i really appreciate this other side of the story too... I guess even though I do want to START NOW - maybe I need to decide whether to just 'supplement' his classroom experience until he's 5 when we have thought we'd actually start homechooling - or whether to start homeschooling him exclusively now. When I enrolled him I was just enthralled by the idea of Montessori & hadn't considered homeschooling him with the method (although I have always loved the idea of homeschooling) so this has been a big year for me & our plans.
i can see positives and truths in both arguments so i guess i need to really think, think and think some more!
Thanks for such rich food for thought. There has been such an amazing response to this post.
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lapazfarm
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Actually, when I responded, I was responding merely to the claim that without extensive specialized training "it wouldn't be possible" to do the presentations properly. Ummm...if I believed that why would I even be on this board?
The other matter at hand,whether or not it is wise to supplement a classroom education at home with genuine Montessori activities, is purely a matter of parental discretion.
I would caution against telling a parent not to teach a child at home because it might "interfere" or conflict with his classroom activities. Imagine telling a publicly schooled child's parents not to teach them at home using school materials because they might explain it differently than the teacher and confuse the child! Clearly that is absurd. Why is it any different with Montessori?
Keep in mind this child is only in school 2 days a week.He is at home the other 5 days. If a parent sees the benefit of a Montessori education, is willing to educate herself in how to do it properly, and carries through with it, then couldn't the classroom time actually be seen as supplementary to the home education, and not vice versa?
Not meaning to sound argumentative, but I still just don't see why a Montessori education is seen as something so sacred that parents are cautioned to take a "hands-off" approach with their own children. In fact that really does smack of the elitism that we all profess is "not" what Ms Montessori would have envisioned.
Just my 2 cents, and probably not worth that.
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Theresa
us-schooling in beautiful Fairbanks, Alaska.
LaPaz Home Learning
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JoJo
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That's a great post Lori. I tend to agree - I would not spend my monies on buying the specialist equipment you mentioned above and on Montessori preschool fees as well.
My dd attended a Monty preschool for 2.5 years (4 to 5 mornings per week) so she had plenty of experience using those materials. I did however make a few things to supplement her experience (that were easy to make and she was particularly interested in) and she did enjoy doing them at home when she chose to.
However, the main things we did were to provide child size things for her, did lots of cooking (so she could put in place those practical life skills), heaps of art and craft (which they did not do a lot of at preschool), lots of reading and provide plenty of opportunities for free play at home and outside. This way it does keep things "fresh and new" - both at school and at home.
And the book Lori mentioned (Montessori Play and Learn) is fantastic - it will give you lots of play and game ideas that will supplement what your child is doing at preschool. I would definitely recommend it. (In fact I just pulled out my notes on it the other day and made a mental note to do some of those things with my 3yo.)
And buy and read lots of books, books, and more books - as per Lori's post too! 
So I guess what I'm saying is that I found it better to supplement, rather than replicate the Monty preschool at home. Hope this helps you Amber.
Jo
Mum of 4dc (13 to 0)
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montessori_lori
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ambermelody, it sounds like you are leaning towards homeschooling. That would be great! If the Montessori materials are that exciting to you - and it sounds like they are - then you would have a blast with it.
If you do decide to keep your son in school, check out the Montessori Services website. They have a ton of beautiful materials that you can put in your home to complement his Montessori education - child sized things for cooking, cleaning, pouring, and Montessori-friendly games, outdoor activities, etc. I drool every time I open their catalog.
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4Real Forums : Nurturing the Years of Wonder
Topic: Buying Montessori materials for the home
