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Martha
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| Posted: June 15 2007 at 4:46pm | IP Logged
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I had read somewhere that Veritas Press was anti-Catholic? I think I read it here? Could someone point me to references?
Here's alink to the Classical Conversations' resources page as you can tell, there are a lot of Veritas Press items.
Aside from Veritas Press, does anyone have experience with this program in their community?
TIA!
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Ouiz
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| Posted: June 18 2007 at 6:20pm | IP Logged
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I had the chance about a month ago to look through the cards that Classical Conversations uses for their history class... and the card on the Council of Trent said something along the lines of "and thus the Catholic Church, by making these anti-Gospel statements, sealed its fate as a heretical and apostate church..."
I don't know about any of Veritas Press' other items, but if they are churning out junk like this, I'd stay away from them.
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Natalia
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| Posted: June 20 2007 at 7:36pm | IP Logged
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Martha,
I am doing CC next year for the first time with my 9th grader. So far I haven't seen any suspicious material at that level. In fact it looks wonderful. I am on the fence about doing CC with my K5 and 5th grader. I probably won't. I suspect that to a certain extent CC takes shape according to the group you are doing it with. Are you planning to join a group or doing it at home by yourself?
Natalia
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Martha
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| Posted: June 20 2007 at 9:31pm | IP Logged
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a fellow catholic hs-er is starting to direct one of these coops here and I am curious.
mostly idle curiousity at this point
I'm one of those hard liners for Catholic materials/providers. 
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Ouiz
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| Posted: June 20 2007 at 10:42pm | IP Logged
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The cards that I saw were for younger kids. I believe this woman's oldest child was 8 or 9.
However, I can say that the stuff she passed out for everyone to see -- which were the cards they used for Bible/history stuff -- was anti-Catholic in several places. By the time I got to the Council of Trent card, I was deeply disturbed.
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Kelly
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| Posted: July 25 2007 at 10:39pm | IP Logged
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I used to order boodles of stuff from Veritas-they have some wonderful items. However, mixed in the "Wonerfulness" is a lot of not so wondy stuff. I ordered one book entitled, I believe, "Spanish Brothers" that sounded like a great bit of historical fiction set in Spain. The book arrived and it was horrid: about two brothers, one falls away from the Faith (but he's the good brother in the book, natch) and all his efforts to "save" his dumb Catholic brother. I don't remember exactly, but I believ the Inquisition figured prominently in the book, too. I read the bit about the authro on the back of the book and it seems she was part of some group dedicated to getting people out of the Catholic Church (that wasn't the exact wording, but it was the message). Very seldom have I tossed a book in the waste bin, but this was one of those instances.
I've also noticed they sell "Foxe's Book of Martyrs"---you can't get much more inflammatory against the Catholic Church than that book. They also have a number of books about St. Barthalomew's Day massacre-a day that shall truly live in infamy-but as you might guess, the heros and heroines of their books are all Huguenots, and the bad guys are the Catholics. Seems like I counted five such books in their catalog 
Seems like there were a few other things in their catalog that were offensive-enough so that I ditched the catalog several years ago!
Kelly in FL
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hylabrook1
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| Posted: July 26 2007 at 12:53pm | IP Logged
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I agree with Kelly. We had a book about one of the Church Fathers that we ordered because it seemed like a good biography (maybe it was bio-based historical fiction? -- I haven't looked at it in a few years; can't precisely remember). The book was quick to point out that this person was worth learning about because before he had become corrupted by the Catholic Church he had been a Christian who had believed in the Scriptures. Okey-dokey. 
Some things from Veritas, on the other hand, are just what they say they are; that would cover things like Herodotus' Histories, etc. I would imagine that if you were using that in conjunction with a syllabus from Veritas, it could contain some things you wouldn't want, but if you were just ordering the text it would be okay. Still, you would be spending money someplace you might not really want to support.
Peace,
Nancy
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Macmom
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| Posted: July 26 2007 at 3:29pm | IP Logged
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(sigh) I just got Omnibus III from Veritas Press, and it is LOVELY! I mean, PROFESSIONALLY done, wonderful text and layout, interesting choices in graphics and pictures. It puts Catholic curriculum providers to shame for quality and beauty, as well as ease of use.
And it does have all of the anti-Catholoc problems mentioned. Its a stupendous history, literature, composition (progymnasmata) course. Its got all sorts of books and documents I want my eighth grader to wrestle with. (Bradford's journal of life in Plymouth colony, the Federalist Papers, Rousseau's "The Social Contract," "A Tale of Two Cities," "Tom Sawyer," "Killer Angels," etc!) Thats what I REALLY want. But I have had to go through it and note all the anti-Catholic statements, so my 8th grader and I can discuss them. I look forward to that. But oh, how perfect it would be if there were a Catholic, classical, professionally done curriculum that combined those disciplines (history, lit, and comp) with easy daily lesson plans and mid-terms all done for you.
I'm guessing Veritas Press can justify printing this lovely, professional, expensive hardcover textbook because they can also sell to Christian schools who share their (rather orthodox) worldview.... but few Catholic schools would purchase such orthodox materials from a Catholic curriculum supplier.
It is a lot of work to make this swallowable. It can be worthwhile work, as the first thing Omnibus III has the child read is the Westminster Confession. Well, I have already laid out the sections in the CCC that deal with the same topics (Salvation, the Church, and the Mass) and our first assignment will be to write an essay (or make a chart) comparing them. I'll let ds choose his method. This sets the stage for having the proper worldview of history and literature.
(sigh) Lots of work ahead.
Peace,
Macmom
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Martha
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Thank you Macmom for that wonderful review! It's exactly my concern with these things. I want that deep thought and discussion of real history and literature and issues as you describe, BUT...
That is lOTS of work and that's when you already know all those false teachings and bias as you come upon them. For parents who are not as confident of that knowledge, it's even more work.
Which makes me doubtful that it's worth it to go that route. For *me*, I'd rather put that work into just doing my own thing. 
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vmalott
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Macmom wrote:
| Its got all sorts of books and documents I want my eighth grader to wrestle with. (Bradford's journal of life in Plymouth colony, |
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Have you read Bradford's journal Of Plymouth Plantation? If not, be sure to pre-read it before deciding to hand it over to your 8th grader. Not surprisingly, Bradford held a lot of misconceptions and negative opinions on the Catholic Church (popery), which takes up a good portion of the beginning of the book. So, it's not just the Veritas materials you need to set right... 
Valerie
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Macmom
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Yes, I am familiar with it. And I think it's important to show how our nation (which was, to a great extent, founded on intolerance!) has grown to be such a great nation because of the great religious faith of Americans and their ability to discuss religion without burning each other at the stake or having to change beliefs based on the whim of the rulers.
Hey, I've read and discussed St. Thomas More's "Utopia" with my co-op class of 7th-9th graders, and their opinion was "THIS was written by a SAINT?" It's got some ideas against the Faith as well.
But it's all fodder for discussion, and forming a Catholic worldview. JavaScript:AddSmileyIcon('')
Peace,
Macmom
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nissag
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VP is well known to have very anti-Catholic leanings. We did use their History materials for acouple of years. It requires some pre-reading by the teacher in order to weed out anti-Catholic sentiments, or prepare a rebuttal for your children.
I found the program sorely lacking. It's very cumbersome and confusing. Maybe History of the World by Susan Wise Bauer would be a better choice? I'm thinking of reviewing it for my children.
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Macmom
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I am using Omnibus with my 8th grader, and plan to start History of the World (it just arrived yesterday!) with my 1st, 3rd, and 4th graders.
Bauer's book is for little kids, not logic and rhetoric level students.
I wish there was a CATHOLIC Omnibus.
Peace,
Macmom
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nissag
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Ah, thanks for the info on HOW. Perhaps I'll still review it, but for my middlins. I wish there was a Catholic Omnibus, too. I just don't have the desire to wade through another VP curric and re-constrct, or augment. Bummer.
We're going through Harvard Classics with my 13 yos Jack and GBWW with my 15yod Cate. Perhaps we won't need anything else. Or at least nothing terribly comprehensive. I think we can easily build on the material we have.
I agree that VP has *beautifully* put together materials. It's one of my complaints about Catholic publishing. We're getting better, though. It's just that the Protestants have got a jump on us. I guess we're about 20-25 years behind in many respects. We'll get there!
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4Real Forums : Philosophy of Education
Topic: Veritas Press & Classical Conversation?
