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MacBeth
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| Posted: Jan 25 2007 at 9:59am | IP Logged
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Hey folks! Based on a discussion of the book that invaded Elizabeth's High School REading List thread (sorry about that...you know how I get with book discussions  ), I figured I'd start another thread specifically to discuss this book, since Trip is reading it for English class (an easy read after Great Expectations). Here's my last post over there; it's written to Cay and Leonie, but please feel free to jump in!
MacBeth wrote:
Cay Gibson wrote:
I missed this conversation between you two elitist.  Can I throw my gloves off too? I wanna play. 
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OK. No weapons, right? Fair rumble?
I am really hoping, Leonie, that when Trip's class discusses the book, that they focus not just on the message, but on the art of writing.
Cay, I did like parts of the book towards the end very much. I think her writing matured. One funny part of the film, though, that I think was over-the-top Coppola, was after the boys were discussing Gone with the Wind, and they are standing under a red sky in a scene reminiscent of a scene in GWTW. I was laughing so hard I missed the poigniant moment, and had to rewind.
Just for the sake of full disclosure: The genre of "gang" books or films or plays just does not do it for me. I can't bear Romeo and Juliet, nor West Side Story (though I do like the music). So maybe that's just my problem with the book in a nutshell.
Leonie, as an Australian, did you get the impression that the book was a real slice of Americana? Cay, did you relate to the book? (we are going to be redirected off this discussion...let me start a new thread... ). |
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Cay Gibson
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| Posted: Jan 25 2007 at 11:10am | IP Logged
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MacBeth wrote:
| Based on a discussion of the book that invaded Elizabeth's High School REading List thread (sorry about that...you know how I get with book discussions ), |
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Same here. Sorry about that. I thought of starting a new thread but didn't know if there was enough interest in The Outsiders and I really suspect that most of us don't "do" gang-style books anyway.
But, when it comes to literature, everythings a discussion. Right?!  So I'm taking a break from school and bill paying to discuss.
MacBeth wrote:
| One funny part of the film, though,... |
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Never saw the film. 
Does it stay true to the book?
Honestly, it's been so long since I read the book that everything is hazy, hazy.
MacBeth wrote:
| Just for the sake of full disclosure: The genre of "gang" books or films or plays just does not do it for me. |
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Me either. 
And I'm not sure why it spoke to me as a teenager. I was a "good kid" and didn't even know any gang members. Perhaps it was seeing for the first time that gang members were teenagers just like I was with the same hopes and dreams, despairs and longings, hardships and emotions. I realized they weren't just "bad kids" but real people.
MacBeth wrote:
| Leonie, as an Australian, did you get the impression that the book was a real slice of Americana? |
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Oh, gee, I hope Australians remember that's just a "slice" and not the whole pie.
MacBeth wrote:
| Cay, did you relate to the book? |
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Again, I knew nothing about gangs. I don't know what spoke to me. I guess the style of writing. The characters touched me too but I don't even remember their names unlike other books I read which I remember the names vividly. It's been so long. And I probably knew it wasn't a book I wanted to keep on my shelf (due to the fact it was a gang-style book).
Again, I think what spoke to me is that I was drawn into a world totally unlike the one I grew up in and I realized that these teenagers were just like me in many facets. We just lived in different neighborhoods.
I'm rambling...
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margot helene
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| Posted: Jan 25 2007 at 12:43pm | IP Logged
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I haven't read the other thread, so forgive me if I repeat or rile!
I really like this book and I think the thing that you are remembering about it is that it what we call in writing classes: AUTHENTIC. The writing is sharp and real and the experiences the boys have full of universals about life. If you do it with your high schoolers, I definitely recommend reading it yourself. It's not "high" literature, but I think it's thought provoking and I hate to admit it, but after subbing in high school the last 4 months, more than a little slice of the pie, even though it's decades old now. The confusion of the teen years, the mixed messages, the search for oneself . . . all a function of our modern world. (Maybe teens in the MIddle Ages agonized over their life's purpose ????) I can't remember if it was on this forum or on another list, oh - it's Dr. Thursday on Nancy Brown's blog who said that the mark of a Catholic story is that it includes HOPE. Perhaps that could be the focus of a discussion of the book with your teens.
I saw the author speak once (18 years ago) and I can't remember everything she said, but one of the things I remember is her first meeting with Matt Dillon. He said, "Yo! S.E.! I thought you was a man." Keep in mind that she wrote this when she was a teenager. (I'm sure that was mentioned on the other thread.)
Margot
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kingvozzo
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margot helene wrote:
| but one of the things I remember is her first meeting with Matt Dillon. He said, "Yo! S.E.! I thought you was a man." |
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I re-read this book 2 summers ago (along with 1984 ). My neice had it for her summer reading going into her freshman year of high school. The thing that struck me most about the book is how raw it was. I thought the themes were very dark, and it bothered me a bit that the girls were being asked to read this--they struck me as young for the book. Maybe because it was very authentic? But, it was a world very foreign to this particular freshman class. I'm not sure really, what my thoughts on the book are, whether I'd recommend it to a teen I'm in charge of. I would definitely read along with them, and have LOTS of discussion. I also think it would be more appropriate for later high school. I'm going to have to re-read it again with a more critical eye.
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Erin
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I read this book back in highschool not too many years ago really it was on our prescribed list.
I would have to say that I wouldn't even bother for my dc to read it. I think the issues in it for my dc are so irrelevant. I do think the issues are for an older audience, I think we read it in grade 8 or 9. I know my dc wouldn't be ready for it at that age but many children today 'know it all' long before then 
It is an emotional heart tugger but it is depressing in many ways. Hinton writes well and I guess it may make some really think. As Trip has to read it I would be discussing it with him at home as well, just in case the school doesn't bring out all the issues....
BTW- We watched the film and it was true to the book.
Macbeth, you ask whether Australians thought it was a slice of Americana, well yes in highschool I did. And now... well I would still have the impression that it is an accurate picture of inner city gang life. Would I be wrong?
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Paula in MN
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Erin wrote:
| BTW- We watched the film and it was true to the book. |
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I loved the book, and the film even better. Maybe that was because it was filmed in St. Paul? And a group of us went to watch? And supposedly we are in the movie? I never saw myself, but some of our friends did!
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MacBeth
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PaulaL wrote:
| I loved the book, and the film even better. Maybe that was because it was filmed in St. Paul? And a group of us went to watch? And supposedly we are in the movie? I never saw myself, but some of our friends did! |
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Hey Paula! No fair! You're and Outsiders insider!!
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Cay Gibson
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margot helene wrote:
| but one of the things I remember is her first meeting with Matt Dillon. He said, "Yo! S.E.! I thought you was a man." |
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This cracks me up. I just discovered recently (while scooping out Christmas books) that one of my favorite picture book illustrators is a man. I always thought he was a woman.
kingvozzo wrote:
| I'm going to have to re-read it again with a more critical eye. |
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Noreen, I've found my mothering eye is much pickier and warier than it ever was. Things that went right over my head as a child are picked up like radar now.
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Leonie
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I did not see the movie but have liked the book. Why? Some of it is the writing style - raw but you can see how it could be developed.
For my teens, it has been a picture of a different life - we certainly haven't seen it as US culture more as a look at, perhaps, a sub culture within any Western society?
As I mentioned before, our discussions also centred on writing style and on characterization.
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guitarnan
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You know, where I live the gangs are recruiting right down into middle school classrooms. I don't think most homeschooled teens realize this...and that's a good thing...but gangs are everywhere. We just moved back here after 2 years in WV, as many of you know, and the Shenandoah Valley of VA also has a huge, huge gang problem. (You know, the place you see in Blue Ridge magazine, all full of cute Mennonite buggies...)
Sad, but true.
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Cay Gibson
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| Posted: Jan 25 2007 at 9:11pm | IP Logged
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You make a very powerful observation, Nancy.
Just today I heard that a police officer was shot to death in our Lake area (the large city near our town). He responded to a robbery on a very popular business street (where our dear Books-A-Million is housed on) and he followed the three men to the mall where he got out of his car and was shot to death. 
They are looking for these three suspects right now.
We've always lived in a peaceful area. I'm not blaming anyone from New Orleans. I really don't mean to make it sound like New Orleans is the whole cause of it all (lots of people here blame the casinos and gambling to be the root problem) but the fact is that Hurricane Katrina caused a huge derangement and influx through the whole state and Texas. The bands of Hurricane Katrina have not settled yet. 
We were told they had to close Astroworld (might have been Six Flags but it will always be Astroworld in my mind as it was when I was a child) in Houston down because the gangs from Houston and the gangs from New Orleans merged and it became a nasty thing. The park could not control the warfare. Not sure if that's whole truth or part truth...but I know there's some truth.
I'm thinking I read this book back in middle school. That was---gosh, do you really want to know ---30+ years ago.
Gangs! That this book would still serve as a semblance of the times is sad. So sad.
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marihalojen
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Okay, I was suppose to read this book in Jr. High at a public school. Our school had recently put in metal detectors, had a police officer stationed there and lots of gang activity. I thought it was very confusing (or I was confused?) as the symbol of one of the gangs was Our Lady of Guadalupe. Here I was, naive parochial school girl, all excited to see such an open display of Our Lady.
So with the above mentioned additions to the school, and me bringing home the Outsiders to read, (and many other reasons, of course) we were pulled and homeschooled fairly quickly (this was when we used Our Lady of the Rosary School). And I never got to read very far into the book, but I remember the cover!
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MichelleM
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I read the Outsiders in Jr. High and developed a huge crush on Ponyboy after watching the movie in class.
Hmm...maybe that explains my attraction to boys in black leather jackets when I was a teenager...
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4Real Forums : Living Literature
Topic: The Outsiders
