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MarilynW
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For some reason I have always avoided abridged novels. But I have looked at some Classic Starts books and they seem fairly well written - and my almost 7 year old picked some up at the library and loves them.
Can anyone remind me as to whether there is a reason children should not read abridged? Do they fall into Charlotte Mason's definition of "twaddle?"
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Marie
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I"m not sure what Charlotte would say, but my almost 9 year old is plotting though the Stepping Stones Classics (I think the classic starts are nicer but these are the ones my library has). I figure at his age, he's getting an idea of the story that will help him when he reads the original later
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CrunchyMom
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I hope someone can speak to this. I read an abridged Les Mis in middle school and just loved it. A friend gave me a real copy, and when I admitted to a well educated English friend my embarrassment over having never read the full novel, she assured me that if any novel was improved by abridgement, that was it  She said that there is only so much about the sewer systems in France that one can slog through.
And of course, the adaptations of the hefty classics are good in their own right (thinking Alfred J. Church, Rosemary Sutcliff, etc...), but then, I suppose that is different from an abridgement.
I am intrigued because it never occurred to me to consider a series like this, but in glancing at amazon, I see titles like The Three Muskateers where I think my children would like the story but some of the content is inappropriate, so it isn't just the challenging nsture of the read at question.
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guitarnan
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When I was a girl, my parents had a book series called Journeys Through Bookland - it began with (complete) fairy tales, then excerpts from myths and legends, and then chapters/abridgements from novels (Robinson Crusoe had chapters, for example). I loved this series! Every year I read a bit more, as my reading improved.
I think that sometimes we think "bowdlerized" when we hear "abridged," and I would agree that changing stories completely so that women and children won't be "harmed" by them is very silly. A well-done abridgement of a classic isn't necessarily a bad thing, particularly if said classic is very, very long or contains mature content.
I feel a bit differently about current works, particularly children's books. Why abridge what was written for young readers in the first place?
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Aagot
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I think some would object to abridged books because once a person reads them they may think they read the book and not be interested in finishing the unabridged book in the future.
That said, I read abridged books as a kid and think they helped me get through the longer version. I already new the plot so I could pay more attention to the details.
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Mackfam
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CM would not give a child an abridged book. Her reasons would be pretty straightforward - an abridged version does change the original in some way. The goal of a living book is that the child meets the author - and that can't happen if the child meets someone who is interpreting the author.
In Phil of Ed, Vol 6 - she does briefly bring up abridged editions, saying that there was discussion of including them and their potent ion use in the Elementary Forms.. Here are her words:
CM wrote:
| There has been discussion in Elementary Schools as to whether an abridged edition would not give a better chance of getting through the novel set for a term, but strong arguments were brought forward at a conference of teachers in Gloucester in favor of a complete edition. Children take pleasure in the 'dry' parts, descriptions and the like, rendering these quite beautifully in their narrations. |
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I tend to agree, but I admit that I haven't looked at the Classic Starts books that you mention, Marilyn. And of course, you'll do what's best for your family...that goes without saying...but you asked for Miss Mason's thoughts - so now you have them for consideration. 
Here are a couple of reasons that I don't use abridged versions of literary classics:
** In reading a novel, I want a child that is ready to approach that material - spiritually, intellectually, and with a growing maturity. If I hand a child an abridged version of a classic to a child at a younger age (because I wouldn't give that child the novel at the child's current age) - the child isn't being given an opportunity to grow and stretch into that meaty reading, probably won't have a chance to meet many of the big ideas presented (because they will have been re-interpreted or removed entirely through the abridgment), nor is the child going to be able to narrate the beautiful and rich details the author gives in the book.
** Abridged versions of classics may dull the reading attention span I'm working hard to grow through our reading.
** But mainly...I don't use them because there's so much that's really GOOD out there - really good living books for all ages - that I have just never reached for them as books I would hand to the kids.
So...that's my dissenting view. For what it's worth. I do use books that may have an excerpt from a story. That's different from an abridgment though. And - full disclosure - I do use some retellings like Nesbit and Lamb (Shakespeare) and I use Long, Gould, Kaufman, etc. (Plutarch).
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MarilynW
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Thank you Jen. You answered my question. And yes - I think there is a difference between excerpts and abridged. We do read Nesbit and Lamb, Gould etc.
I am having a hard time finding enough living books for this child - he has been through all the easier living book chapter books and picture books that I own, and I am trying to come up with a summer book basket for him. He loves nature and birds and animals - and he has been reading a few of the YC books on kindle.
If you get a chance Jen - please post a list of living books for the younger reader - ds is 6 going on 7 and an avid reader.
He loves audio - so he has been listening to the Chronicles of Narnia on CD. Dh just finished reading all the Swallows and Amazons books to the younger kids (3rd time round!!)
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MaryM
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Oh, this is such an interesting and thought provoking topic. It reminds me of the Picture Book forum discussion from a few years ago.
Abridged versions. I didn't jump into that discussion though I though about the topic quite a bit. When I have a little more time, I will be back.
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CrunchyMom
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MarilynW wrote:
Thank you Jen. You answered my question. And yes - I think there is a difference between excerpts and abridged. We do read Nesbit and Lamb, Gould etc.
I am having a hard time finding enough living books for this child - he has been through all the easier living book chapter books and picture books that I own, and I am trying to come up with a summer book basket for him. He loves nature and birds and animals - and he has been reading a few of the YC books on kindle.
If you get a chance Jen - please post a list of living books for the younger reader - ds is 6 going on 7 and an avid reader.
He loves audio - so he has been listening to the Chronicles of Narnia on CD. Dh just finished reading all the Swallows and Amazons books to the younger kids (3rd time round!!)
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My 5 and 8 year old just listened to The Wizard of Oz and Peter Pan last week. They love listening to Carry On Mr Bowditch perpetually in the van
Has he read all of Thornton Burgess? Mother West Wind as well as the bird and animal books? I think it came up in another thread, but old issues or anthologies from St. Nicholas Magazine might fit the bill. What about the Dillingham "Among the ___People" series? Those are in the YC e-book collection. Ds also liked Toomy Smith's Animals from that collection.
My 10 year old who loves Thornton Burgess also loves Lester's retelling (with Pinkney's illustrations) of the Uncle Remus stories. They are supposedly very faithful to the originals in terms of characterization and plot, but the heavy dialect that is dated and controversial is revised. I did not intentionally buy this copy ( picked it up as a library sale in a hurry) and have not read the originals, but ds has plowed through this hefty volume of short stories two or three times! I suppose this counts as an abridgement, but it is well written.
Have you done the Ralph Moody books? A great one for Dad to read aloud. We just bought Little Britches for ds8's birthday this week, and this will be dh's second go around (first time from library).
The Great Brain, My Father's Dragon trilogy, and Ginger Pye come to mind. Marguerite de Angeli books were all popular at that age. Alice Dagliesh, Marguerite Henry, Roald Dahl, Eleanor Estes, and Elizabeth Enright are authors I trust. We like the series Five Little Peppers, All of a Kind Family, My Side of the Mountain, and The Mitchells.
I know I am not Jen, but maybe there are some names to help you find some new titles. I think my oldest started reading the Landmark books at that age, too, those maybe he was a little older.
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guitarnan
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The Great Brain!!! Thank you for mentioning this series, Lindsay! I have most of the books on my shelf downstairs. I loved those books as a child - historical fiction, set in Utah (a state I'd visited), in a Catholic family's home.
My son loved My Side of the Mountain and the subsequent titles. He also liked Bears of Blue River (an Indiana classic, which must explain why he is in college in the Hoosier Heartland!).
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MarilynW
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Thanks Lindsay.
The problem I have is not so much with read alouds and audio - but trying to find things he can read on his own at 6 going on 7. The YC things on Kindle you have mentioned are on his list. I was thinking that Eleanor Estes, All of a Kind Family etc may be too hard for him - but he has just read Henry and Ribsy and Misty of Chincoteague - so maybe he will be OK with these. I have done Elizabeth Enright, the Mitchells series and My Side of the Mountain trilogy as read alouds recently. I could try the Little House books - he listened to them all on CD with his little sister last summer, but he is probably ready to read them.
Thornton Burgess is a favorite here. Our copies are just falling apart. He LOVES them.
You know - we have never read Little Britches. I have it on ds's birthday list (coming up soon) - as I keep seeing recommendations for it. Cindy Rollins mentions it a lot!
I need to go and look at my booklist binder (built up over years) and all various reading logs. I am all set with summer book baskets for all the other children, just seem stuck on this one.
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Kelly
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At ages 6 to 9 all my kid enjoyed:
My Fathers Dragon
Phantom Toll Booth
Rabbit Hill
Smiling Hill Farm
Mighty Men
All the Thorton Burgess Books (tho I see you're already a fan!)
Cubby in Wonderland (oop of course but @a little black bear living in Yellowstone-very Thorton Burgessque)
The Shy Stegosaurus
Freddy the Pig series
Hank the Cowdog series
Shiloh and it's 2 sequels
Voyage of the Frog
The Timbavati Patrol
Redwall series
If your ds liked Misty of Chincoteague, he might also like:
King of the Wind
The Black Stallion series by Walter Farley
Justin Morgan had a Horse
The Blind Colt
Trying to keep up with a voracious reader is a good problem to have! 
Kelly in FL
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Oh, I'm so glad others already jumped in with great recommendations!
MarilynW wrote:
If you get a chance Jen - please post a list of living books for the younger reader - ds is 6 going on 7 and an avid reader.
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I'll add a few (some of which have already been mentioned so consider this just me...underlining them! ). Some of these would be perfect for him now and others might be borderline...but if he's a voracious reader it would be good to have them at the ready.
Little Britches - favorite, FAVORITE here for boys! MUST HAVE on the shelf, IMO. I think there is only one book in the series that is difficult/expensive to find, though you might be able to find it at the library. The rest are pretty easy to pick up used.
Swallows and Amazons - too difficult for independent reads right now probably, but you can always go audiobook.
Tin Tin
Asterix and Obelix
Tom Swift books - we have the 25 book mega pack.
Tom Playfair series - might be a series that is a little beyond him...but he'd be ready for them soon.
Happy Hollisters - oop, but typically fairly easy to find. Are great around the age of 6 - 8 with new independent readers
Homer Price series
Alvin Fernald series
Billy and Blaze series
Paddington Bear series
Just So Stories - you can get a free version for ereader that is nice
Jean Craighead George has written a lovely series - The Thirteen Moons - and they're wonderful. Might be a good fit for him now. Scroll down on this page and you'll see a list of them.
------------------------------
Ok...the following are on my preview list. I don't have them, but they look good so I'm copying my list for you. (Also, I haven't yet researched to see if I can find these free. Links go to Amazon for review details, but do check - these may be free elsewhere)
The Rick Brant Science Adventure series
The Rover Boys - complete series of 20 novels
Frontier Boys Collection
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Also, if you have a kindle/ipad/tablet, the YC ereader package is so worthwhile!! There are several in that series that are great for this age! These are just a few that we really enjoyed that might fit his age/reading ability that are in this collection
Famous Stories series
The Twins series
Dooryard Stories
The Among the...Meadow, Forest, etc. series
The Natural History Story Book
The Sandman Stories
The Just So Stories - I mentioned these above and they're in this collection
The Harriette Taylor Treadwell readers included in this collection are very good!
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CrunchyMom
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Great List Jen! Some I missed, but others are new to me.
FYi, Little Britches is now back in print, so easy to purchase on Amazon.  The titles are also available on Audible.
We also really like Ralph Moody's The Story of Sea Biscuit read by Jim Weiss. I want to collect his other titles as well. I picked up his book about the Pony Express at a library sale.
But that reminds me of the Holing C Holling books. Aside from the popular books of his in print, we have his Book of Indians and have his Book of Cowboys on our wishlist. I think it has been read more than once.
I have not personally read Rick Brant or Rover Boys, but my voracious reader loves them. I think he likes them even better than Tom Swift, which he also loves. I will have to add the Frontier Boys to our list. The kindle is such a lifesaver for keeping up with this guy!
I know you said you aren't looking so much for books to listen to, and you might want to just hold out until he is able to read them, but my oldest nature and science fan just loves Jules Verne, and it might be a good audio option for your son since it would a little bit beyond him now. I guess my son had just turned 8 when he started reading them. We were at a museum summer program where they had the original N C Wyeth painting for the cover of The Mysterious Island, and he recognized it from home and started reading it. It was a challenge, but it is still his favorite though he has read others. Perhaps he was uniquely motivated? Idk.
I think he also read The Hobbit for the first time around then.
On the topic of abridged books helping to know the plot for later, I think that the Jim Weiss story recordings do a great job of familiarizing and whetting the appetite for more without one thinking they have read the book. I recall reading an abridged/adapted version of Swiss Family Robinson that had belonged to my dad, and I went to take the Accelerated Reader test and did poorly. Until then, I did not know there was such thing as an abridged book. I really thought I had read it. With Jim Weiss, aside from being quality entertainment in its own right, there are no misconceptions that way, kwim?
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MarilynW
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We love Jim Weiss!
Thanks for the suggestions - I have walked round my bookcases and looked at the books and reminded myself of what I have. We have the YC package for Kindle - and all my kids love it. (I wish that I could enjoy the Kindle too)
I am glad you mentioned Happy Hollisters Jen. We have never read them - and I have been looking for them in used book sales. They look fun. I love vintage books and stories!
We own Jules Vernes - some of my older boys enjoyed him - I will have to scatter some. I am not a huge fan.
The way our reading works for the summer:
1. Mom read aloud basket - I have some Bethlehem Books, picture books, saint books, poetry etc - usually for all the 12 and younger crowd.
2. Independent reading book baskets - everyone has their own.
3. Dad read alouds - usually after dinner, or before bed sitting on the deck in the summer. He does "harder" stuff but even the littles sit in - Dickens, Austen, Hobbit, LOR etc
4. Audio basket - for quiet rest times, car trips. I am trying to figure out getting things on mp3. I am looking at Librivox, My Audio School, Books Should be Free and Lit2Go. Some favorites have been the Little House Series on CD, Narnia on CD, Jim Weiss, Johnny Tremain, On to Oregon, the Hobbit, EB White, Little Women, Anne of Green Gables.
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Kelly
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Another fun series -sort of a Happy Hollisters meets Swallows &Amazons- is the "Famous Five" series by Enid Blyton.
Thank you marilyn for reminder about "On to oregon"... Great book! Im driving w my kids "on to oregon" this summer so that one goes in my Traveling Library for sure! 
Kelly in FL
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CrunchyMom
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MarilynW wrote:
We own Jules Vernes - some of my older boys enjoyed him - I will have to scatter some. I am not a huge fan.
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Me.neither. Well, here's where I admit I've never read him  , but I never cared for the movie versions enough to have much desire. It is the happy accident of my picking up the beautifull NC Wyeth llustrated version of The Mysterious Island and our trip to the museum that my son discovered him on his own.
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Lindsay
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[URL=http://mysymphonygarden.blogspot.com/]Lost in the Cosmos[/UR
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SeaStar
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OK-
How does "The Swiss Family Robinson" fit in all this talk of abridged/adapted books? Is there an original version?
I researched this a bit a couple of years ago and was not able to find an original.. evidently it is the most "liquid" book out there... written and rewritten and changed multiple times.
There are so many versions floating around... it's kind of interesting, really.
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Mackfam
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As far as I know, you cannot find the original Johann Wyss authored book of The Swiss Family Robinson. Wyss wrote the book as sort of a *natural history meets moral lessons based on family life* book for his sons, but the book was quickly taken and edited and added to and re-arranged because that style of book was very popular at the time (early 1800's - very Rousseau influenced!) and everyone wanted to add some new spin on the book.
Most agree that the best English translation of Wyss' book is William Godwin's translation (written in 1816 - Wyss wrote the original in 1812). The 2007 Penguin Classic version is the William Godwin translation. The Godwin version is generally considered a "translation" not an "adaptation."
Hope that's a help, Melinda!
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SeaStar
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Yes, that does help- thank you. I have an illustrated Classics version, plus a couple of versions for younger kids, including one about 80 pages long and one from Disney. I have been trying to sort out whether to keep any/all of these or try to hunt down a more authentic version.
The IC version I have has some really nice illustrations in it.
We read one of the shorter versions a couple of years ago as a read aloud, and my dc really liked it. I would probably go for the Godwin version as a book on tape... have to see if I can find one first, though.
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4Real Forums : Living Literature
Topic: Classic Starts/Abridged novels?
