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Jenn Sal
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| Posted: Oct 08 2006 at 12:24pm | IP Logged
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I am a Catholic revert for about five years now. My husband is for almost one year  ! This past year we have been able to celebrate and live our faith more as a family. It is so wonderful, that if I go on about it, I will just cry. We have been getting to know more families through my husband being involved a bit more in our Parish and I joined the local TORCH group. Over the last few months, I have found myself wondering if I'm doing enough!!! The women I am surrounded by are good women, but they are involved in soo much that I feel as though I'm not Catholic enough. I have two children, five and two (expecting our next in February)  . I do things with my children and rarely ever leave them. I have found that children aren't welcome to much. We are the odd family who keeps our children with us during the entire Mass; bring them to confessions monthly and homeschool catechism.
In a panic, I've tried to find other ways to bring the Lord into my life. Which is probably where I'm wrong (being panicky, that is). I've also hit some bumps along the way trying to figure out if I should be doing more. The latest is this, and is why I bring this to all of you women that I have learned to trust. I took my children to First Friday Mass, and I felt very uncomfortable. There was a small group of people there and the youngest was maybe sixty. I think my kids did great, but I needed to tell my 2yo to whisper every once in a while when he was repeating "Jesus. Mary. Jesus, cross, boo boo." I got looks. Not warm ones. Then that night, I signed up my entire family for Eucharistic Adoration. This was after talking to my priest and the man who organizes it to see if it was o.k. to fill up the time including my kids. My priest said if no one else signed up, that I could go in. I waited until Friday to sign up from 7-8pm, the last one. I was so excited to have this opportunity. My 5yo and I prepared for it all day, by reading about its history and meaning. We were all excited...the entire family! My husband dropped me off so that I could have about 15 min. alone time with Our Lord while he and the kids went to get gas. Before I went in a women came over to me and said she was going in. I went into to a state of confusion and explained what I had done with signing my family up. She told me that my kids weren't allowed in until after 8pm and that the Lord comes first (with her finger in my face)  and she proceeded in to pray.
I lost it. I cried for the next hour and never went in. I have hit these walls many times in my life, but it is different now. I have a family that I want to pray and learn with  . I don't feel that it's welcomed. I feel alone. I feel as though it is the norm to do things without your children.
Does anyone else feel this way out there?????
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Jennifer, Texas
Wife to Mark, Mom to Cora 13,Kade 10, Sarah in Heaven 12/05, Colette 7, Corin 5, & Kieran 2
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alicegunther
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| Posted: Oct 08 2006 at 2:51pm | IP Logged
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Jenn Sal wrote:
My priest said if no one else signed up, that I could go in. I waited until Friday to sign up from 7-8pm, the last one. I was so excited to have this opportunity. My 5yo and I prepared for it all day, by reading about its history and meaning. We were all excited...the entire family! My husband dropped me off so that I could have about 15 min. alone time with Our Lord while he and the kids went to get gas. Before I went in a women came over to me and said she was going in. I went into to a state of confusion and explained what I had done with signing my family up. She told me that my kids weren't allowed in until after 8pm and that the Lord comes first (with her finger in my face) and she proceeded in to pray. |
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I would refer that woman (and anyone else who is making you feel awkward) to today's Gospel reading, particularly the lines from Mark 10, saying:
"13 And they were bringing children to him, that he might touch them; and the disciples rebuked them.
14 But when Jesus saw it he was indignant, and said to them, "Let the children come to me, do not hinder them; for to such belongs the kingdom of God.
15 Truly, I say to you, whoever does not receive the kingdom of God like a child shall not enter it."
16 And he took them in his arms and blessed them, laying his hands upon them."
I would also see this reading (today of all days, when you are feeling so badly about this) as a signal grace. Mothers have been suffering from the treatment you've received for over two thousand years, but Our Dear Lord says to us today, as He did then, "Let the children come to me, do not hinder them."
The Lord most certainly does "come first," so let us be sure to do as He commands by encouraging our children to spend time by His side. God bless you, Jenn, for bringing your children to Mass and Adoration!
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Love, Alice
mother of seven!
     
Cottage Blessings
Brew yourself a cup of tea, and come for a visit!
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Taffy
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Jennifer,
I am so saddened to here about your experience.  Alice gave you some beautiful direction form today's gospel. I don't have as full a grasp on many church policies as do many who post here, but I've never been told that children aren't welcome in the church. I don't think that you erred and am saddened that you were discouraged from signing up for Adoration.
Keep at it, eventually hearts will be changed by your example.
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Susan
Mom to 5 on earth and 1 in heaven
Susan's Soliloquy
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Martha
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| Posted: Oct 08 2006 at 3:37pm | IP Logged
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No. You are not alone. But I certainly know it can sure feel like you are.
We have the same policy in our home. If you get me - you get 9 for the price of 1. What a great deal! You'd think Catholics of all people and places would snap us up in no time at all, but alas some people can't recognise a bargain when they see it.
And it *does* hurt more at church. We are used to it everywhere else and are pretty thick-skinned about it. But it really touches a nerve when it's from Catholics. I don't know why, but it does. We believe a divided family is a conquered family. So we stick together. It is rare for us to get involved in activities that seperate everyone.
My recommendation? I would have gone in anyhow. Christ does come first. As mothers we are obligated to bring our dc to Him. To turn away a willing and joyfull child is just.. I wouldn't say sinfull...but it's certainly is wrong, imho. I hope you try to go again, and say a prayer for softening of that woman's heart.
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Martha
mama to 7 boys & 4 girls
Yes, they're all ours!
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guitarnan
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| Posted: Oct 08 2006 at 4:02pm | IP Logged
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You know, that woman is really in need of prayer. She probably forgot that in the good old days (when I was in Catholic grade school, for example), the WHOLE SCHOOL went to Benediction and Adoration, en masse. It was reasonably quiet, I suppose, but I'm sure it wasn't perfect. How are our children going to know the Lord (and how to behave respectfully) if they never are invited into His presence?
And what about those days when anyone could go into church, any time, to be with the Lord? I used to, some times, on my way home from school, and I was never made to feel that I wasn't welcome because I was a kid.
I think something has really changed...we've gone from placing children first in the parish to making parish schools nearly unaffordable and using RE classes as a way to make sure the dioceses aren't blamed if anything goes wrong. There are many parishes that need healing and should focus on the Gospels from this Sunday and last.
You're really not alone (search old threads, you'll see some of my rants), but there are some parishes that really foster a family-friendly attitude out there, too, so you may need to make sure you are part of a parish that is welcoming.
Really, I don't think it's the pastor/staff that is the problem in your particular situation, but individual people who are putting their own needs (silence) first.
I think that were I in your shoes I'd go back to the priest, explain what happened, and ask him to clarify the parish policy and tell everyone at Sunday Mass just what that policy is. I'd explain my goals (just as you've outlined them here) and ask him to find one hour during the week, at least, where children are especially welcome, or particularly invited. (Maybe that slot no one signed up for except you...)
No one should feel unwelcome in God's True Presence. That's the bottom line. I'm sure that when that woman got home she felt bad about how she treated you.
Also, it sounds as though you're doing plenty to bring your children to a full and active faith. You're with them, making sure they understand what's going on at an age-appropriate level. They see you receive the sacraments...I'll bet it won't be long before your oldest is longing to receive Jesus because she sees your joy in your faith. This is a wonderful time of year to do craft projects related to the liturgical year (All Saints, Advent, St. Nicholas, Our Lady of Guadalupe) and read wonderful books (like the ones in Catholic Mosaic or Elizabeth's Advent unit study).
Don't worry...just keep on doing what you're doing. You'll eventually meet families just like you (you know they're out there, because you've come here and found all these awesome folks!).
I'll be praying for you!
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Nancy in MD. Mom of ds (24) & dd (18); 31-year Navy wife, move coordinator and keeper of home fires. Writer and dance mom.
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Jenn Sal
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| Posted: Oct 08 2006 at 4:51pm | IP Logged
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You are all making me feel so much better. I must say that I am also contemplating on speaking with my priest. I just want to make sure that I have some good things to say. Today's reading and realizing how other parishes will be helpful to me. I am an emotional person and I don't think that will work with my priest. He's a wonderful man, but pretty non-emotional. Having a time for family Adoration is a wonderful idea.
Is there a "rule" anywhere that states it has to be quiet time. I understand respecting prayer time (and so do my children), but is there anything, anywhere that says exactly how we are expected to behave at Adoration? Nancy, I, too remember going with my mother when I was little to a few different churches one evening to pray. I had forgotten until now. It must have been Adoration! I think that is the only time I was ever at one. How I would love to introduce this to my children at a young age!
When I spoke to my priest he mentioned child care during that time. Again, I don't want to seperate my children from this. My husband and I can take turns with my 2yo, if needed, but I don't want it to be...adults in there, children out here.
Any words of advice on how to approach my priest?
Thank you for all of you support!
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Jennifer, Texas
Wife to Mark, Mom to Cora 13,Kade 10, Sarah in Heaven 12/05, Colette 7, Corin 5, & Kieran 2
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Rachel May
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Jenn Sal wrote:
| My priest said if no one else signed up, that I could go in. I waited until Friday to sign up from 7-8pm, the last one. |
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When I used to do Adoration with my kids, we were signed up for a time and during that time it was our obligation(and joy) to be present during that full time. Everyone was welcome to come and pray, but we were those who were trusted to remain with Our Lord the whole time until the next assigned person showed up/He was reposed. So if this were your official time, you could point that out.
Some of our time was quiet, but there was usually a point when they would play with the littlest one by crawling around the room including through the altar. (We were in a small room where the altar was not raised.) Of course I encouraged them to be still and prayerful, but at the same time I was comforted by a something our priest had quoted to me from The Way of the Lamb by John Saward. It said something like "the Holy Innocence, all unaware of God's Glory, sit at His feet and play with their crowns." I came to see Our Lord on the altar as looking on with an understanding smile for me and a tenderness for them because they came to Him. I know that's not an official guideline, but it helped me.
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Rachel
Thomas and Anthony (10), Maria (8), Charles (6), Cecilia (5), James (3), and Joseph (1)
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Martha
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| Posted: Oct 08 2006 at 7:26pm | IP Logged
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Rachel May wrote:
| "the Holy Innocence, all unaware of God's Glory, sit at His feet and play with their crowns." I came to see Our Lord on the altar as looking on with an understanding smile for me and a tenderness for them because they came to Him. |
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That's one of the most beautiful things I've 'heard' in some time. thank you!
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Martha
mama to 7 boys & 4 girls
Yes, they're all ours!
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momwise
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| Posted: Oct 08 2006 at 8:40pm | IP Logged
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Jenn Sal wrote:
How I would love to introduce this to my children at a young age!
<snip>
Any words of advice on how to approach my priest?
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Here Jennifer,
Fr. Antoine wants to speak with you...
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Gwen...wife for 30 years, mom of 7, grandma of 3.....
"If you want equal justice for all and true freedom and lasting peace, then America, defend life." JPII
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ALmom
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Our parish has a particular Holy Hour when children are particularly expected to be present and part of the time was spent in praying the rosary in the Lord's presence using an adoration book for children based on Fr. Matteo's Sacred Heart devotional books. It is a very old booklet, probably reprinted. If you like, I can try and find out who publishes it.
At other times, I have taken all my children for short visits. (I hesitate to actually sign up for an hour but mostly because our schedule is so erratic - something we're trying to work on). Sometimes people seem annoyed, but many others have been touched by my 3 yo blowing kisses to Jesus. I try to ignore the criticisms while being sensitive to not overstaying. If a child is restless, I usually let them show Jesus they love Him (genuflect, blow kiss, short ejaculation) and then go out. But if they are praying quietly and simply moving up close to pray as close to Jesus as possible, we stay until I see signs of restlessness and then we exit. Other older children will follow me out as they finish praying and might entertain a toddler for me to go in for a few extra minutes of quiet.
As far as at Mass, I got some funny looks in one parish because I nursed, had many toddlers and did not use the nursery. I worried about it and asked our pastor. He told me to come up and sit in the front pew - which is what we have tried to do ever since. The children generally are behaved but when they were little, I did have to occassionally take someone out. I tried to be considerate - not be bopping back and forth a ton (if we had to go out more than once, then I didn't come back in the second time but stood in the back or in the cry room) and not staying in once a child was fussing - trying to do our best to anticipate any major crying spells. Obviously, we exited with a screaming baby occassionally - but most of the time I exited before it got to that point. I have not had a lot of trouble, though one single woman told me things that annoyed her - children climbing over her in Mass (something we never let our children do - they might climb over us, but never our neighbor in the pew), food and juice sprayed on her, etc. These are not problems with my children and I could fully appreciate someone having a bit of a reaction to a bunch of children sitting near them if that had been her previous experiences. I shared with her my annoyance with people talking while I was trying to pray, etc. so that I think there was some appreciation that this is not an issue of bringing children in or not - but simply a matter of us all having common courtesy for one another. It may take time to break down the bad experiences, etc. but you should not feel pressured to have your children anywhere but with you in Mass or Adoration.
On one occassion, one of the people who was very critical turned out to be everyone's critic - not just against children.
Janet
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Jenn Sal
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| Posted: Oct 09 2006 at 8:34am | IP Logged
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Thank you, everyone! Gwen, what a wonderful letter from Fr. Antoine.
Last night, I recieved a phone call from the gentleman that organizes the Adoration day. He is the one I spoke with and knew I would be bringing my children. He saw that I became upset with this woman and wanted to talk with me. She is older and apparently is not doing well. Her husband is the Deacon and he has explained to people that she has the tendancy to just go off without any warning and tell stories that he doesn't understand. So, we came to the conclusion that the devil took advantage of this aging woman to get to me.
He was very supportive of me coming with the children, again. I will do this next month, but I do think I may ask our priest to talk to the Parish about the importance of children experiancing this beautiful way to be close to Our Lord. Maybe other parents just write it off, because they assume they can't bring their children? I know I thought this. I am determined to turn this act of evil into a way to bring more to Our Lord!!!
Thank you, again for your support and encouragement!
__________________
Jennifer, Texas
Wife to Mark, Mom to Cora 13,Kade 10, Sarah in Heaven 12/05, Colette 7, Corin 5, & Kieran 2
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4Real Forums : Domestic Church
Topic: Living Faith w/ children?
