4Real Forums: What I learned today...

Oh, Dearest Mother, Sweetest Virgin of Altagracia, our Patroness. You are our Advocate and to you we recommend our needs. You are our Teacher and like disciples we come to learn from the example of your holy life. You are our Mother, and like children, we come to offer you all of the love of our hearts. Receive, dearest Mother, our offerings and listen attentively to our supplications. Amen.

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St. Ann
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Posted: Nov 08 2013 at 1:31am \| IP Logged

St. Duns Scotus (a Franciscan from Scotland) died today 705 years ago in Cologne. He was only 43 years old. He grave is in the Minoriten church in Cologne. He was a great theologian and was especially important for his teachings on the Blessed Virgin Mary.

I learned this through the Holy Mass broadcasted daily from the Cologne Cathedral on EWTN Germany.
I am often moved when I catch a Mass for a local Saint who truly lived and walked and prayed and taught just around the corner , more or less. Visiting these Shrines is very important in deepening the relationships with the Saints and Mother Church.

What did you learn today, Mama???? Please share so we can all learn

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Stephanie

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Erin
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Posted: Nov 08 2013 at 4:19pm \| IP Logged

Just around the corner!! Impressive!

Well had a discussion with my mum, she has been making a personalised prayer/faith knowledge book for my nephew(3) Spending days and days, and $$ on it. Always one to re-invent the wheel, however it is an act of love.

Anyhow she has been researching as she goes and tells me that there is a big theological turn away from representing/picturing God the Father as an old man. Is this familiar to anyone?

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Erin
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St. Ann
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Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 6:43am \| IP Logged

Erin, do you mean as God is pictured in art/paintings? or theol./philos. speaking...???
You are right about your mother's act of love. Just wonderful.

Regarding that statement I made about being around the corner, well, it is actually a 2 hour car/train ride... but it is all relative really.

I learned something new last night. You can ask a priest to bless your candles for the cemetery before placing them on a grave. And you should think about bringing Holy Water to sprinkle on the graves too. I have to admit I have never done this. But now that I do know I will try to do this.

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Stephanie

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JennGM
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Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 10:01am \| IP Logged

I never thought about Holy Water to the cemetery! But of course! Thanks for that! We never leave candles...things seem to be so regulated around here.

I recently learned that it's much easier to earn a plenary indulgence. Instead of the traditional go to confession 8 days before and after and receive communion on the same day, since 2000 these have been relaxed to receiving Confession within 20 days! So after doing the pious act or prayer with the intention, praying for the Holy Father's Intentions, and communion, receiving confession every 2 weeks, all your indulgence obligations are fulfilled!

It's mindboggling to me. I put some links in my blog post that will explain and support this change.

ETA: I got a little confused. You still need to make the individual Communion and prayers for the Holy Father for each indulgence...but the confession counts for multiple plenary indulgences.

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Jennifer G. Miller
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JennGM
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Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 10:02am \| IP Logged

St. Ann wrote:

Awesome, Stephanie. Did you see Mary MacArthur's Coloring Page for this?

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Jennifer G. Miller
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Erin
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Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 1:26pm \| IP Logged

St. Ann wrote:

Erin, do you mean as God is pictured in art/paintings? or theol./philos. speaking...???

Well it was because of theology speaking that mum was careful not to place any pictures in the book of an old man to represent God. She ended up using a circle to represent Him. But she did say she'd read that there was a movement away from using old man pictures.

In the same conversation she said we also weren't meant to use the Shamrock picture anymore to represent the Trinity. Have we discussed that here before??

Very interested to know about cemeteries and Holy Water!

Well here is something else that may be new for some regards blessings. I've always asked the priest for a blessing when pregnant and again a pre-labour blessing. My brother recently got engaged and had a pre-nuptial blessing, isn't that lovely

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Erin
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JennGM
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Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 1:30pm \| IP Logged

I was wondering if the movement away from older depictions is more of the inclusion/feminist movement to not have God portrayed as a man?

I've never heard of this, though. I have heard this about St. Joseph.

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Jennifer G. Miller
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Erin
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Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 1:47pm \| IP Logged

Well now Jenn, have I given you a rabbit trail to venture down?

Very good point about feminists. I'll see if I can ask some priest friends if this is all true, perhaps Mum has been steered down the wrong path.

What have you heard about St Joseph?

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Erin
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JennGM
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Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 1:54pm \| IP Logged

Erin wrote:

Well now Jenn, have I given you a rabbit trail to venture down?

Very good point about feminists. I'll see if I can ask some priest friends if this is all true, perhaps Mum has been steered down the wrong path.

What have you heard about St Joseph?

St. Joseph for many centuries was depicted as an older man so as to protect Mary's virginity -- if he was too old, then there wouldn't be any kind of temptation or doubt there.

More recently there has been a point to portray St. Joseph as a virile, strong man in his prime. This movement is in respect to St. Joseph who was a virtuous man, and also in keeping with what would have been typical of a man to marry (30s) in the Jewish culture of the time. It also raises up both Joseph and Mary as mutually agreeing and accepting the grace and working together to remain celibate.

I love the images of St. Joseph as a younger man, a strong loving foster father and husband.

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Jennifer G. Miller
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Betsy
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Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 2:08pm \| IP Logged

I have never heard of using holy water at a cemetery, however, it makes perfect sense in light of this beautiful practice for the Holy Souls in Purgatory!

Holy Water as an Aid to the Holy Souls of Purgatory
Holy water is a sacramental that remits venial sin. It benefits the soul and body for the living and brings consolation to the souls of the departed. The holy souls long for holy water. If we desire to make a host of intercessors for ourselves, let us always remember the holy souls at the holy water font. The holy souls nearest to heaven may need the sprinkling of only one drop to release them.

Use Holy Water as follows: Dip your fingers into the holy water and say,

"By this holy water and by Thy precious blood, wash away all my sin, O Lord, and relieve the souls in purgatory,"

and then make the sign of the cross.

Holy water is a powerful sacramental to aid the holy souls. Several times a day St. John Macias' would sprinkle holy water on the ground, a practice he insisted was a great help to these unseen sufferers in purgatory.

The above excerpts were taken from:

Tassone, Susan, "Praying with the Saints for The Holy Souls in Purgatory", Our Sunday Visitor, Inc., Huntington, IN, 2009.

Tassone, Susan, "Thirty-Day Devotions for the Holy Souls", Our Sunday Visitor, Inc., Huntington, IN, 2004.

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JennGM
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Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 2:17pm \| IP Logged

My mom had something similar over our Holy Water font at home, except not the line about the Poor Souls.

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Jennifer G. Miller
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St. Ann
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Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 2:36pm \| IP Logged

JennGM wrote:

Awesome, Stephanie. Did you see Mary MacArthur's Coloring Page for this?

(with love from Helena!)

Thanks Jenn! No , I hadn't seen this before.

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Stephanie

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St. Ann
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Posted: Nov 15 2013 at 1:17am \| IP Logged

Today, in the year of Our Lord 1280, St. Albertus Magnus died in Cologne. His relics are in a sacrophagus in a church in Cologne. (...just around the corner...) He was the teacher of St. Thomas Aquinas. and so much more

St. Albert the Great
pray for us!

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Stephanie

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Willa
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Posted: Nov 15 2013 at 9:15am \| IP Logged

This week was the feast day of St Frances Cabrini. I never knew much about her, but I read in Stratford Caldecott's "Beauty in the Word" that she had a concept of "education of the heart." So I looked it up and found this PDF

It reminds me a little of John Bosco and perhaps a little of Charlotte Mason. Very interesting rabbit trail.

I'm grateful for the information about indulgences, Jenn! How is this not more widely known? I've researched indulgences so many times!

Erin, I love that story of your mum making a handmade prayer book. That is the kind of granny I would want to be.

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Willa
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JennGM
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Posted: Nov 15 2013 at 3:27pm \| IP Logged

St. Ann wrote:

Today, in the year of Our Lord 1280, St. Albertus Magnus died in Cologne. His relics are in a sarcophagus in a church in Cologne. (...just around the corner...) He was the teacher of St. Thomas Aquinas. and so much more

St. Albert the Great
pray for us!

So close to you! So neat! In a two year cycle we've bumped into him and saw his influence on our nature study: November Planning Thread and my blog.

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Jennifer G. Miller
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JennGM
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Posted: Nov 15 2013 at 3:44pm \| IP Logged

Willa wrote:

THIS IS EXCELLENT! I see a lot of Charlotte Mason here, but embued with the Faith, so it's much more appealing. Especially this:

Quote:

Additionally, Green extracted the essential elements of Mother Cabrini's pedagogy and deduced a simple, but profound, formula from the Cabrinian method of teaching which she expressed as:

Teacher's Zeal-> Pupil Interest-> Adjustability-> Flexibility

The teacher who is intellectually prepared must be able to communicate knowledge to students, "must generate the sparks which motivate the student to respond with what is termed 'self-motivation' and even 'self-activity.'" Green explained that "this 'self-activity' involves the setting in motion, as it were, of the physical, intellectual, moral, and spiritual powers of a human personality" through the stimulation and guidance of the teacher. The teacher must love the student and adjust teaching methods to show a genuine interest in the student's progress and to respond to individual needs. Green concluded that teachers who follow the Cabrinian example, "communicate their knowledge on a personal-interest basis which activates the flexibility of a failure preventive system."

Highlight mine, although I'm failing at the CM quote I'm thinking to compare and contrast, but basically allowing the child time and freedom (Masterly Inactivity) to let the ideas form and become their own and a part of them.

Willa wrote:

I'm grateful for the information about indulgences, Jenn! How is this not more widely known? I've researched indulgences so many times!

I don't know how I have missed this for so long!!! But it's time to shout it from the rooftops, isn't it?

My spiritual director was suggesting that we should offer up things for the Poor Soul who struggled with the same struggles I do. So if you can't get out of bed or lose your temper, offer indulgences to the Poor Soul who that same struggle. Once they are in heaven they can pray for you to overcome those weaknesses!

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Jennifer G. Miller
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St. Ann
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Posted: Nov 16 2013 at 8:04am \| IP Logged

JennGM wrote:

Willa wrote:

I'm grateful for the information about indulgences, Jenn! How is this not more widely known? I've researched indulgences so many times!

Just last Friday this same topic came up (when I learned about the Holy Water and candles...). We moms were wondering if a false sense of ecumenism lead to ignoring certain topics in catholic circles. I mean, the subject of indulgences is probably one of the most misunderstood teachings, I don't really think I totally get it! This was a major issue for Luther, wasn't it. I am in Germany and praying for the dead is certainly practiced and the care of the graves!!!! wow! just wow! immaculate! (Just like the care of most front gardens here in Germany

) But the teachings on praying for the poor souls/arme Seelen and how is no longer heard. There are just certain traditions that still live on, but for how long?

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Stephanie

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JennGM
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Posted: Nov 16 2013 at 1:57pm \| IP Logged

JennGM wrote:

Willa wrote:

THIS IS EXCELLENT! I see a lot of Charlotte Mason here, but embued with the Faith, so it's much more appealing. Especially this:

Quote:

I should probably start something in philosophy forum on this, but I just wanted to come back with a few simple thoughts rolling around in my head.

I am always struck on the educational philosophies that ring true to me have the common threads of recognizing the child as a person, an individual, with individual strengths and weaknesses. There is also recognition of the preparation and interior disposition of the teacher, and that there is a unique relationship with the child and the teacher, both learning from each other.

And with the Common Core standards being on topic lately, these simple threads are completely missing.

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Jennifer G. Miller
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Willa
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Posted: Nov 16 2013 at 2:18pm \| IP Logged

JennGM wrote:

I am always struck on the educational philosophies that ring true to me have the common threads of recognizing the child as a person, an individual, with individual strengths and weaknesses. There is also recognition of the preparation and interior disposition of the teacher, and that there is a unique relationship with the child and the teacher, both learning from each other.

And with the Common Core standards being on topic lately, these simple threads are completely missing.

Me too. I am struck by that too. This is one of the strong points of the homeschool, that has made up (in my home) for so many missteps, and initial complete inexperience.

Almost every time I read about the educational philosophy of a saint it involves this respect for children as persons and an understanding of the need for personalization and flexibility.

To me there seems to be a great deal of mystery in it, this idea of relationship and its role in learning. I can see it happen in my own homeschool but usually not in a given moment, only in retrospect.

I wish I understood it better so I could channel it better but I suppose that's exactly the mistake the country's falling into -- trying to make it into some kind of mechanism, taking all the uniqueness and relationship out of it.

I think it comes back to what you say about the preparation and interior disposition of the teacher, Jenn, and thus ultimately to the graces God provides.

A nice resting place, if I could only remember to keep trusting

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Servant2theKing
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Posted: Nov 16 2013 at 4:16pm \| IP Logged

Thank you dear ladies for all that you shared about praying for the Poor Souls.

For many years we've had a family tradition of praying and leaving luminaries on the graves of loved ones on Christmas Eve or Christmas Day ~ ever since we read that more souls are released from Purgatory on Christmas Day than any other time! Lately I've felt an even stronger nudge to be better prepared for this year's Christmas cemetery visit ~ perhaps because I visited the cemetery the day after the Feast of All Souls', where I was able to drive very slowly through the entire cemetery praying the St. Gertrude prayer for all the souls buried there and for all holy souls in Purgatory. It was especially touching to witness many others visiting the cemetery that day! I was especially moved to pray at the graves of several priests and nuns who had served the people of God in our hometown. The experience gave me renewed appreciation for the practice of praying for the dearly departed!

This site has prayers, including the St. Gertrude Prayer and a most inspiring story and prayer associated with St. Mecthilde (scroll to the bottom of the page). There's a link on the page where you can register the names of dearly departed loves ones so volunteers can pray for them.

Thank you again for sharing about the use of holy water, as well as the tradition of having a priest bless candles to be left at gravesides ~ both will be a real blessing when we visit the graves of loved ones this Christmas.

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