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MarilynW
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We have recently visited the same church (Diocese of Baltimore) for a First Communion and Baptism - it has no crucifix or image of Jesus in it - or any statue of the Blessed Mother or saint in the church. (the name of the church is a title of the Blessed Mother, so there is a statue outside). I find it very odd and my kids noticed too and pointed it out. I think it is quite a liberal church given the way of dressing, the fact that there is not kneeling etc - but I have never seen a church without a Crucifix.
Does anyone else find this odd? Is there any explanation?
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Marilyn
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Angie Mc
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Here are some answers and references from Catholic Answers.
Love,
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Angie Mc
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Mary G
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It's not only odd, I think it's not right. Here's an excerpt from the USCCB's guidelines called Built of Living Stones: Art, Architecture, and Worship:
Quote:
The Cross: The cross with the image of Christ crucified is a reminder of Christ's paschal mystery. It draws us into the mystery of suffering and makes tangible our belief that our suffering when united with the passion and death of Christ leads to redemption.113 There should be a crucifix "positioned either on the altar or near it, and . . . clearly visible to the people gathered there."114 Since a crucifix placed on the altar and large enough to be seen by the congregation might well obstruct the view of the action taking place on the altar, other alternatives may be more appropriate. The crucifix may be suspended over the altar or affixed to the sanctuary wall. A processional cross of sufficient size, placed in a stand visible to the people following the entrance procession is another option. If the processional cross is to be used for this purpose, the size and weight of the cross should not preclude its being carried in procession. If there is already a cross in the sanctuary, the processional cross is placed out of view of the congregation following the procession.115
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and again
Quote:
Sacred Images: Reflecting the awareness of the Communion of Saints, the practice of incorporating symbols of the Trinity, images of Christ, the Blessed Mother, the angels, and the saints into the design of a church creates a source of devotion and prayer for a parish community and should be part of the design of the church.154 Images can be found in stained glass windows, on wall frescos and murals, and as statues and icons. Often these images depict scenes from the bible or from the lives of the saints and can be a source of instruction and catechesis as well as devotion. Since the Eucharist unites the Body of Christ, including those who are not physically present, the use of images in the church reminds us that we are joined to all who have gone before us, as well as to those who now surround us.
In choosing images and devotional art, parishes should be respectful of traditional iconography when it comes to the way sacred images are recognized and venerated by the faithful. However, they also should be mindful that the tradition is not limited to literal images. While Mary is the mother of Jesus, she is also an icon of the Church, a disciple of the Lord, a liberated and liberating woman. She is the Immaculate Conception, patroness of the United States, and Our Lady of Guadalupe, patroness of all America. Other symbols such as the crucifix, icons, or images of patron saints depicted in various ways can also draw us into the deeper realities of faith and hope as they connect us to the stories behind the image.155
The placement of images can be a challenge, especially when a number of cultural traditions are part of a single parish community and each has its own devotional life and practices. Restraint in the number and prominence of sacred images156 is encouraged to help people focus on the liturgical action that is celebrated in the church. Separate alcoves for statues or icons can display a variety of images through the year. Some parishes designate an area as the shrine for an image that is being venerated on a given day or for a period of time, such as the image of a saint on his or her feast day.
It is important that the images in the church depict saints for whom devotion currently exists in the parish. It is particularly desirable that a significant image of the patron of the church be fittingly displayed, as well as an image of Mary, the Mother of God, as a fitting tribute to her unique role in the plan of salvation. As time passes and demographics change, saints who were once the object of veneration by many parishioners may at another time be venerated by only a few. When this happens, these images could be removed, provided sensitivity is shown with regard to the piety of the faithful and the impact on the building.
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So, altho these are just guidelines, they are pretty definite about having these things in the Churches. I think a particular parish can be given a bit of leeway IF there is a monetary issue -- super poor parish that can't put in some of these things. But they should at least be processing in with a Cross with the Corpus on it that is large enough to place on the Altar ...
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organiclilac
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Churches are required to have a prominent crucifix, so yep, I'd call that odd. Although not as bad as the church I recently attended where there was no tabernacle. I blogged about that here.
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folklaur
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Hi,
my old parish used to not have a crucifix. They would carry one in for Mass. It drove me crazy. They have a new priest now and he has put one in, but it is floating...sort of....over the altar. Here is how it looked before and after:
before (it is decorated for christmas, but just imagine that the trees and white banners gone.)
and here it is how it is now:
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LisaR
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wow, Laura, it looks so much more "catholic" and grounded now, kwim? are those saints depicted in the mural?
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folklaur
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LisaR wrote:
| wow, Laura, it looks so much more "catholic" and grounded now, kwim? are those saints depicted in the mural? |
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Yes.
You can click this link and it lets you click onto it and enlarge it to see the sections up close, plus then you can click on each particular saint and read about them...
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JennGM
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My parish for many years had a "resurrectifix", which was Jesus in Resurrected form on a cross, not what was supposed to be on the altar. Our sanctuary isn't as round as Laura's, but the whole church structure is round. It looks like a spaceship to us...but I digress.
We now have a painted image of the Crucifixion behind the altar, with a crucifix that is processed in and placed on the altar for Mass, which satisfies the requirement of having a crucifix on the altar for Mass, according to the link Angie provided.
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Mary G
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JennGM wrote:
| My parish for many years had a "resurrectifix", which was Jesus in Resurrected form on a cross, |
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we call this "touchdown Jesus" ... and if it's the Church I'm thinking of, I was just noting today how meditative is the picture of Jesus Crucified and how great that y'all have that.
In our old Church in Denver, we had TD Jesus, with a Crucified Jesus on the left and a Pieta on the Right ... they too processed in with another Crucifix ... so we kind of had all styles! 
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CrunchyMom
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JennGM wrote:
My parish for many years had a "resurrectifix", which was Jesus in Resurrected form on a cross, not what was supposed to be on the altar. Our sanctuary isn't as round as Laura's, but the whole church structure is round. It looks like a spaceship to us...but I digress.
We now have a painted image of the Crucifixion behind the altar, with a crucifix that is processed in and placed on the altar for Mass, which satisfies the requirement of having a crucifix on the altar for Mass, according to the link Angie provided.
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We have a ressurectifix, too  We attend the TLM, but the church changed pastors a few years ago and the pastor is not very receptive to us (basically, he ignores those who attend the TLM and a visiting priest comes in and says it every week). Anyway, he won't even let us put a smaller real crucifix on the altar for our mass!
I find the ressurectifix (great word, did you make it up, JEnn?) distracting; so, I keep meaning to find a good holy card of the crucifixion to take with me since I find I am so easily distracted, I really rely on the crucifix to help me focus on the sacrifice of the mass. Maybe if I had that to look at...
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CrunchyMom
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Oh, and Marilyn, I might write the pastor and then if you don't hear anything, write the bishop. I have heard that the newish bishop of Baltimore is quite orthodox.
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Lindsay
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JennGM
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CrunchyMom wrote:
| I find the ressurectifix (great word, did you make it up, JEnn?) distracting; |
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My family did...it sounds like resurrexifix the way we say it, my spelling is just made up.
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Jennifer G. Miller
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JennGM
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Mary G wrote:
JennGM wrote:
| My parish for many years had a "resurrectifix", which was Jesus in Resurrected form on a cross, |
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we call this "touchdown Jesus" ... and if it's the Church I'm thinking of, I was just noting today how meditative is the picture of Jesus Crucified and how great that y'all have that. |
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Yep, it's the church. That painting was done by a former priest in the parish. Around Easter there's the resurrection painting he did...we call it the "Stayin' Alive Jesus" because of the way his arms go. You'll see it later.
And if you want to see the old resurrectifix, it's in the gym. They can't "get rid" of donated items (In Memory Of...)
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Jennifer G. Miller
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LisaR
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JennGM wrote:
My parish for many years had a "resurrectifix", which was Jesus in Resurrected form on a cross, not what was supposed to be on the altar. Our sanctuary isn't as round as Laura's, but the whole church structure is round. It looks like a spaceship to us...but I digress.
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then that would be "blast-off Jesus" - what we call the resurrectifix, and aptly named because he usually is present in the spaceship Churches. (lest you think I am a Church snob, our parish falls under the spaceship category, thankfully, Crucifix and tabernacle are front and center, though...)
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Lisa
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LisaR
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cactus mouse wrote:
LisaR wrote:
| wow, Laura, it looks so much more "catholic" and grounded now, kwim? are those saints depicted in the mural? |
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Yes.
You can click this link and it lets you click onto it and enlarge it to see the sections up close, plus then you can click on each particular saint and read about them... |
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very cool!! I always love a "happy ending" to some of these churches...we've had friends leave parishes because they did not look "catholic" enough, only to have a good Priest come in a year later and right all of the wrongs...
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Lisa
dh Tim '92
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MarilynW
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Thanks everyone for all the info. The parish is not mine (it actually made my fairly liberal parish look orthodox  ) - but I was amazed at how it affected my children. The funny thing was that many people at the baptism were saying "what a beautiful building" and my kids kept whispering to me "mum, it is so empty with nothing holy. Jesus is not here, Mary is not here, the saints are not here!!!"
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Marilyn
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CathinCoffeland
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We are finally getting one!
We have had this awful sixties weaving of a sort of combo touchdown Jesus/silver surfer.
It is so bad.
But they have been remodleing and the #1 request was a crucifix.
We are getting a big lovely one.
it is sort of a "triumphant" looking corpus but it is wonderfully handcarved and very nicely done.
No more pastel Jesus Yeah!
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Carole N.
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Our church in Oklahoma had a crucifix, but someone replaced it with a resurrection Jesus ... he was not even on the cross. They carry up a crucifix for the masses. We do have statutes and holy water and all that, however, just no crucifix. It was my understanding that the crucifix was given to the current priest, but once again, because someone "donated" the resurrection, it remains in the church. It will take a really strong priest to make that change!
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sarahb
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Our church doesn't have alarge crucifix. Its a big blank space bhinmd the altar and way at the top is a round stained glass window with the Blessed Mother and The child Jesus. Its really gorgeous but...
We have a carry it in smallish crucifix- like 2 ft or so. a little small and hard to see.
But our church has almost 5 million in mortgage debt, we are behind in bills, and we tithe 4% of our collection away every week anyway. We support a Haitian parish. We aid two sister parishes in the US.
IOW, all in God's time. Maybe someday we will have a proper crucifix. now we are meeting so many needs as a church family that my desire for a really large crucifx
seems incidental to all the good things.
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juststartn
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Wow...well, the two parishes we attended in NC had traditional crucifixes...
The one here, has mosaics...a big mosaic crucifixion that is kind of difficult to explain--kind of a cross between Byzantine and disco...sigh. There are matching mosaics behind the statues of the Holy Family and behind a male saint I cannot recognize (a religious, only I don't know which one, and I KNOW it isn't our parish patron saint).
But the crucifix is dead and center, over the tabernacle...thanks be to God. The building itself looks like a giant spaceship slammed into the earth, or maybe a butter sandwich cookie...with a chunk out of it.
Just don't get me started on the really 60s stained glass (fortunately, its at the back of the church, so only the celebrant and those looking to the back of the church have to look at it...)
Rachel
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4Real Forums : Domestic Church
Topic: Church without a crucifix?!!
