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Heliodora
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I'm trying to pick out a science curriculum for seventh grade. I'm leaning heavily on the Apologia General Science, but I'd also like to know if there are any problems with the text from a Catholic standpoint.
MODG recommends Concepts and Challenges in Science. Has anyone here used it and liked it? What is good about it? Is there another science curriculum out there that anyone has liked better?
Thanks for your opinions.
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Heliodora
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I'm surprised that I haven't gotten any responses yet on a forum of this size.
Maybe I should rephrase the question. What has everyone used for this level of work? If you've used Protestant texts, what resources have you used to counter any anti-Catholic bias? Have you gone with a secular text like those offered by Kolbe Academy? If so, how do you make them Catholic?
I really like the elementary Apologia books, but my older kids are getting a little beyond them- it's time for a little comprehensive work.
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lapazfarm
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Well, the question is hard for me to answer for a couple of reasons.
1. I cannot stand Apologia. The young earth creationist bent is just too much for me to stomach. IMO it is the antithesis of science, plus bad theology.
2. I use secular materials for science, but not textbooks, so I cannot evaluate any of them.
If you wanted specific recommendations for living books for science, than I'd be glad to help. You might also want to visit MacBeth's opinion, which has tons of resources for a living books-based science education.MacBeth's Opinion
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Kristie 4
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I would second MacBeth's Opinion and other living science books.
(Can't handle the Apologia here either...)
You could also get a text, and use it as a guide to study the different topics it contains with living books and other experiment books etc.
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Erin
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lapazfarm wrote:
If you wanted specific recommendations for living books for science, than I'd be glad to help. |
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I'd love some ideas 
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lapazfarm
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Erin wrote:
lapazfarm wrote:
If you wanted specific recommendations for living books for science, than I'd be glad to help. |
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I'd love some ideas |
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Ok, whatcha lookin'for?
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Erin
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Theresa,
More for the older child, my 13 and 14.9 yr olds. I know that my dd is older than Superboy but to tell the truth we have only done basic science as I can't find a text I or they like. Lots of them are too skimmy.
So I know we need a unit approach but just not too sure what to do, so have done nothing much. 
I was thinking of books that are interesting to read, not too dry but not too verbose. Apologia for example was discredited here on the grounds of being too long winded. The sentence structure lost even my dd and I and we are literature based learners.
That help any?
ETA:
Ds is a 7th grader and Dd a 9th grader if that makes any difference.
BTW I have poured over Macbeth's Opinion but as our library hardly has any I am reluctant to purchase sight unseen not knowing if the writing style will engage the dc.
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teachingmom
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You want the real truth? I am seriously science deficient. I have used Concepts and Challenges for the past two years for my current 8th grader. She does it all herself, so I cannot even tell you about its strengths. She is learning science, which is more than I can say for much of her earlier years.
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lapazfarm
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Well, I REALLY like the Eyewitness books for science. They are usually pretty readily available at libraries. To me, their eye-catching photos, clear, concise text, and selection of subject matter make them very engaging.So they are good as an anchor for just about any science topic.
Then it is a matter of choosing some books to go along, such as biographies, narratives, and books that go into more depth on a smaller subject within the main topic being studied.
For instance, if you decided to study insects, you would get the Eyewitness Insect book as an anchor, perhaps covering a page or two per day. Then you might supplement with a few readings from Fabre's Insect book (a narrative) or perhaps some snippets from Diversity of Life by E.O. Wilson (a famous entomologist--easily found at most libraries).
Then depending on what strikes your children's fancies while reading the snippets in the Eyewitness book, they could pick up a library book or two to go in depth into a specific subject, such as leaf-cutter ants, or honey bees, or any other thing that catches their eyes.
Add in some outside time observing an ant hill or a bee at a flower, look at some beetles under a magnifying glass, and you've got an excellent science course going!
So...what topics are you thinking about?
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Heliodora
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Thanks for your replies, lapaz and Kristie.
That MacBeth's website looks like a good resource, thanks.
lapaz wrote:
| 1. I cannot stand Apologia. The young earth creationist bent is just too much for me to stomach. IMO it is the antithesis of science, plus bad theology. |
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I'm undecided on a lot of what creationists say, and some things I just don't agree with, but I'm surprised that you think it is the antithesis of science. There are so many theories that are at odds with certain dogmas, that I would think Catholics should welcome alternatives to the agnostic mainstream. I'm just curious what it is that you think is wrong. It is difficult, for example, to read any archeology book that doesn't assume that we descended from various species of man/apes, and there is no mention of God or attempt to connect history and science with the Faith. Our Faith should inform all of the sciences, after all. It's just too bad that there don't seem to be any Catholic texts. If this is a too controversial subject for this forum, then my apologies ahead of time.
Kristie wrote:
| You could also get a text, and use it as a guide to study the different topics it contains with living books and other experiment books etc. |
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Yes, ideally I'd like to do it this way. I've been doing nature and unit studies this way for a while now, but my children are getting older (and more numerous, lol.) My problem is, that I just don't have the time any more to devote to designing all of my own courses. We're also going to be moving the household twice in the next year, and dh is returning from a 14 month tour in Iraq- something has got to give, (whine, whine.) I was just hoping there would be an easy solution for this area of study.
I wonder if the MODG syllabus gives detailed plans for supplements to the Concepts and Challenges? I've never ordered any of them. I only ever have used the "Designing Your Own" book.
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lapazfarm
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It's the "Young Earth" part that I was referring to. Bad science. Just plain bad.
And no, it is not too controversial for this forum. We've discussed it here before. I like to think we are adult enough here to discuss controversial topics without resorting to the type of flame-fests I've seen elsewhere.
And I agree that our faith should inform our science. Luckily the Catholic faith allows for an old earth worldview, which is in line with scientific evidence.
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SharonO
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The Concepts & Challenges books give a broad overview of the different areas of science. You can find the books devoted to one subject like Life Science or Earth Science or there are books that take 4 different areas and spend about 7-8 weeks on each. Each lesson is a two page spread with short paragraphs and questions to answer. There are "try this at home" experiments also. It is very self-taught, but not super exciting. For 9th grade we are using MODG Earth Science syllabus that I REALLY like. It studies 4 areas of Earth Science- Geology, Oceanography, Weather and Astronomy. The "spine" are Miliken worksheets and transparencies, but then there are suggested activities to go along with it and the "meat" of the subject is writing 400-600 word essays on each topic. It forces the student to understand the subject well enough to explain it on paper and then they are to illustrate the topic too. My ds usually would just copy a picture from the worksheets, but I can see my dd really spending a lot of time doing this.
My ds really did not enjoy the Apologia books. He said they were too "wordy". But we are going back to the high school level biology book because he can do it in a co-op setting.
Hope this helps-
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We have used Rainbow science for my oldest 2. It is quite pricey, but when you spread the cost over a couple of kids we decided it was worth it. The program contains every single thing needed to complete all the experiment.
LeeAnn
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KellyJ
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We have used the C & C in Life Science (older edition, as recommend by MODG). From what I understand, MODG uses the C & C books to emphasize locating topic sentences within a paragraph and on writing topic sentences (i.e., the answers to the questions). The books have a lot of good and mostly timeless scientific information ("back to basics").
You could do it without a syllabus. The typical approach is to do one lesson a day, answering the questions in blue and doing/reading most or all of the other sections in the lessons. It is not difficult to correct the work, as the information is all right there in the lesson.
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Heliodora
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Ok. I think I'm going to skip on the C & C. I'm also less enthusiastic about the Apologia now. I don't want them to sit through long-winded explanations, and I don't want to have to worry about an anti-Church bias. I don't have time to look up ten references to refute the text, lol.
Now that Rainbow science, on the other hand, looks quite intriguing. I'm hesitant, however, since it is sort of new. And it is expensive, especially since I need texts for two students. That's a lot of money to gamble with, but I might just try it.
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Heliodora wrote:
It is difficult, for example, to read any archeology book that doesn't assume that we descended from various species of man/apes, and there is no mention of God or attempt to connect history and science with the Faith. Our Faith should inform all of the sciences, after all. It's just too bad that there don't seem to be any Catholic texts. If this is a too controversial subject for this forum, then my apologies ahead of time.
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okay - speaking as both an Anthropology/Archaeology Major, but also as a Catholic who loves her faith....
The problem with the idea of mentioning God in science is that it just isn't Science then anymore, it is religion. Science can't really address religion/faith. Science studies the natural world. God, by definition, is part of the Supernatural.
oh, and my dd used the MODG Science at one point I think - that is the one with the overhead projector pages, isn't it? She didn't detest it, but didn't love it.  She never really felt she liked science at all until she took a Chem Class at the local school (Guess that means I am a rotten General Science teacher  - she knows all about Archaeology sites though, and has been on digs, so I don't feel too awful, I guess....
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Heliodora
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Quote:
| The problem with the idea of mentioning God in science is that it just isn't Science then anymore, it is religion. Science can't really address religion/faith. Science studies the natural world. God, by definition, is part of the Supernatural. |
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Thanks for responding, cactus mouse.
Yes, I agree that theology is not the same as the natural sciences, but I believe that theology must inform all pursuits of knowledge and that all the sciences must be brought into line with doctrine. I don't believe in compartmentalizing the Faith so that we put away all thought of God once we start our study of the natural- indeed it is through our knowledge of the natural world that we come to much of our knowledge of its Creator. The Catholic person studying science cannot ignore that part of him that is Catholic. Revelation gives us supernatural knowledge that we would not be able to come to with our reason alone. Revealed truth gives us short cuts, so to speak, to help us with any study.
There is a problem, for instance, in the way modern scientists approach common questions. When their hypotheses are based on error, then it is the Catholic's duty to refute the errors which made the hypotheses arise- such as the theory that there were more than one pair of first parents. As Catholics, we know as a fact that God created only one mother and father of all the human race- Adam and Eve. So when scientists conclude from their data that there were more than one pair of first parents they should rather immediately realize that their conclusions are wrong. Instead, they often insist upon their theories as fact, as a religion in its own right that must be believed.
The reality today, of course, is that these agnostics dominate science, and so deference has to be made to them in any pursuit of it. Catholics then, must not only study science as it should be studied and should learn the most updated information, but they also have to refute the errors of agnostic scientists to understand why they are wrong. During some of that refutation, certainly, one is not strictly doing "science," but certainly this is a necessary part of it. Forming a counter hypothesis and testing it, certainly is within the realm of science.
And so for that reason, I lament that there doesn't seem to be a good Catholic text out there.
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I would be happy to answer any questions about Rainbow science. As I said, we have used it for our 2 oldest sons and really enjoyed it. The lab book is nice. It is written for the children and includes every step needed to complete the lab on their own. Every lab ends with "now put all of your equipment away and clean up your workspace" Also, it truly includes everything you need to complete every lab. If you need a 4 inch square of construction paper it is there, etc.
It has been great for me, as I am guilty of failing to prepare for the labs, and then never getting to them.
Also my textbook phobic 13 year old son, enjoys reading this one. It is wrtten to the child and is engaging. It is complete enough that my oldest tested out of Freshman science when we enrolled him in school this year.
LeeAnn
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Heliodora
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Thanks, LeeAnn. Yes, I was impressed with the sample provided online. He goes right into Newton's Laws, explaining them very clearly and succinctly. His humor is kind of geeky, but he is a geek afterall, lol. That's encouraging that your son did so well. I honestly don't mind spending the money, because it will get used with lots of kids. I just hate it though when I fork out dough for something I think is going to work for all the kids and it bombs. The scope and sequence did look very good. Was there anything in it that you found to be too Protestant?
Do you know if Mary Pride has reviewed this curriculum? I've been thinking about picking it up from the library.
ETA: ...picking up Mary Pride's book, that is.
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LLMom
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Actually, the Catholic faith allows for either a young or old earth theory. The encyclical Humani Generis talks about it and the Kolbe center has a lot of information on the traditional teaching and creation.
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4Real Forums : Exploring God's Creation in Nature and Science
Topic: Science 7th grade Apologia vs. Concepts
