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MarilynW
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We were at a family dinner dance last night - and people found out we were having #5. At one point during dinner someone turned to me and said "Will you be done after this?" - there was an expectant hush - and then my dh - who is a fairly reserved British man - said without batting an eyelid - "we are maybe half way there" - nobody really knew what to respond!!! And then one of my kids chipped in with - "Mom is going to be like Saint Catherine's mum and have 25 children" - again no comments!!!
There was lots of other questions - the thing that really surprised me though is how many people (who do not need to financially) had returned to work when their infant was only 6 weeks old. Also that Catholics take the downs syndrome test - people were shocked that I do not take the blood tests for Downs etc - I think that the 20 wk sonogram shows what is necessary for the health of the baby - why do people take the 12 week test?
Enough rambling...
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Lisbet
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Oh Marilyn, how rude of them! Are you done? Is one of the most common questions we get after "Are they all yours?" (we often get the twins question b/c some are so close in age) Just last night we were out for supper and someone across the isle asked my husband very loudly "So are you gonna stop now??" I braced myself for his repsonse, because he can sometimes be 'too funny', but he simply said "Why stop now?" It's embarassing to me when people ask some of those questions.
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Martha
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Well we've said many things...
We'll accept whoever God sends.
I have no idea. (the honest one. i really don't know if we're done or not as it's not up to me!)
We figure every 5th will be a girl and dd really needs a sister so.... (and I've seen people actually count on their fingers and then get that stunned "OMgoodness! that 10 look)
Now, we say
We've decided we need to shoot for an even number of boys and girls. So that's at least 4 more....
(and it makes me chuckle to see them count on fingers again)
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Elizabeth
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Marilyn,
At twelve weeks, it is possible to almost entirely rule out Down Syndrome by measuring the nuchal fold during a sonogram. This means of assessment isn't reliable at the 20 week sonogram.Twelve weeks is the window of oppoprtunity. Lots of people who would never abort find the information useful. If I were having a a baby with Down Syndrome, that information, early in the pregnancy, would help me gather support and resources.
Kim, whose first child had spina bifida, has pointed out the the AFP test, which can give you the heads up for SB is very valuable for the health of the baby at delivery. Sonograms didn't show SB in her case. Combined with AFP and careful sonographic monitoring, the early diagnosis of spina bifida is the difference between a vaginal delivery and a c-section. According to Kim, delivering an SB baby via c-section can mean the difference between that child ever walking or being confined to a wheelchair all his life. That's a pretty compelling argument for a prenatal test.
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Elizabeth Foss is no longer a member of this forum. Discussions now reflect the current management & are not necessarily expressions of her book, *Real Learning*, her current work, or her philosophy. (posted by E. Foss, Jan 2011)
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MarilynW
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Elizabeth wrote:
Marilyn,
At twelve weeks, it is possible to almost entirely rule out Down Syndrome by measuring the nuchal fold during a sonogram. This means of assessment isn't reliable at the 20 week sonogram.Twelve weeks is the window of oppoprtunity. Lots of people who would never abort find the information useful. If I were having a a baby with Down Syndrome, that information, early in the pregnancy, would help me gather support and resources.
Kim, whose first child had spina bifida, has pointed out the the AFP test, which can give you the heads up for SB is very valuable for the health of the baby at delivery. Sonograms didn't show SB in her case. Combined with AFP and careful sonographic monitoring, the early diagnosis of spina bifida is the difference between a vaginal delivery and a c-section. According to Kim, delivering an SB baby via c-section can mean the difference between that child ever walking or being confined to a wheelchair all his life. That's a pretty compelling argument for a prenatal test. |
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Wow - I had absolutely no idea! I thought the 20 wk sonogram told all. I had the AFP for the first, it was not relevant for twins (seen as nonconclusive) and think I did not have it for the last. I did not realize that Spina Bifida cannot be detected by sonogram.
But apparently there is some new blood test at 12 weeks?
I have a phone consult with the Midwife practice on Tuesday - I will bring up. And if I stay with the current OB I will be sure to mention - I will be 12 weeks on Jan 10.
I guess I was just really put off by the AFP with my first - I had no idea what it was, and before having it I was taken aside and given advice on my termination options should the test be unsatisfactory.
Thanks for illuminating me. Having been through the whole high risk rollercoaster of sonograms and tests every week, I am trying to have a "simple pregnancy" - but have to be careful not to overlook important things.
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Martha in VA
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Whenever asked if we're done, I joyfully reply, "Oh, I hope not!" 
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Kim F
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Yep - we encourage the AFP, with the disclaimer that it has a high false positive occurrence. So its strictly a screening which will indicate a need for further testing if necessary. I have had it with the last 8. (never had a false pos either fwiw)
If the baby has SB then a section is warranted to preserve the exposed spinal cord nerves which would be compressed during vaginal delivery. I would never recc. the test to someone who would consider abortion but for the rest of us it can help determine the best method of delivery to protect the baby.
As for Downs I would want to know that too due to the chances of heart problems so we could plan accordingly to be near a children's hospital.
Regardless we are still in baby years for a bit more yet hopefully! And we tell people we are trying to remain open to life. For whatever reason they shut up then because I guess the alternative is to say you are NOT open to life. Also it seems like we got WAY more grief after the 4th than now. People do eventually write you off as a lost cause. ; D
Kim
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MarilynW
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Thanks Kim and Elizabeth for the info. I just feel so tearful with all this - must be first trimester hormones. I guess I feel a little defensive about people making comments about me being nearly 39 - and I try to gloss over it by avoiding the tests. After having the mono mono twin pregnancy when we found it hard to find a doctor who would even take us - and then being told they would not make it to 24 weeks, and would have a host of problems (they made it to 31 - no problems) - it was so stressful and so I think I almost want to be ignorant. I need to remember the miracles that I have and that God is in control - but find tests so stressful.
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Jen L.
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Kim F wrote:
| Yep - we encourage the AFP, with the disclaimer that it has a high false positive occurrence. So its strictly a screening which will indicate a need for further testing if necessary. I have had it with the last 8. (never had a false pos either fwiw) |
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The stress you're talking about can be in high gear with the AFP test, Marilyn, which is why I didn't have one with my first (and hopefully not last) three. I didn't have Elizabeth's info back then, though, and it might make me put up with the roller coaster now.
That said, no matter what you decide, remembering that "God is in control" (as you said) will carry you through.
My prayers are with you.
 ,
Jen
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Liz D
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Marilyn,
My husband's reply (with a big grin on his face) to the question "are we done now": "Yes, we are- until the next one!" 
BTW, my 24 old dd is in her first trimester of her first pregnancy and due with twins and she and her husband have already been told several times that hopefully the babies will be a girl and a boy so they can be done having kids! All I can think is who would want to be done having kids at 24. I am 49 and wouldn't mind having another one.
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Alice R
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I have every test that does not pose any risk to the child.
I would NEVER abort but there are things that can be treated in-utero, things that are necessary to know for the health of the mother & child and if you are having a baby with special needs, you are better prepared with your own life and getting the medical help for the baby ASAP.
I have the tests and say "you can test me for whatever you want but I'm not aborting no matter what" My OB is fine with that-he just likes to have all the info. Me too.
People ask me if I'm done all time. I tell them "I have no idea-only God knows that" and then I laugh.
Blessings,
Alice R
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PDyer
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My husband's mother and father presented all their children and spouses with painted welcome signs for Christmas last night. After we all opened our very similar gifts my MIL went on to explain her rationale for what was painted on each sign. Imagine my surprise when she stated she knows we (my husband and I) are done having children so she had our two kids' names painted permanently on the gift. My husband's two younger siblings, on the other hand, did not have their children's names painted on the gift because she expects they will (hint, hint) be having more children.
I was stunned and stammered something like "that door is not closed", but my comment was lost in the other couples' vehement assurance to my MIL there were going to be no more grandchildren from them.
 
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Elizabeth
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I was at my sister's house Christmas night when a man (who might be related to me somehow--I still can't keep all my sister's third husband's relatives straight) asked how many more we are going to have.
I said, "Only God knows."
He replied, "All with the same husband?" This was a new one (though given the company I guess I should have seen it coming).
I smiled and said, "Oh, absolutely!"
He said, "Incredible."
And then, I (who can never think of anything to say in these situations)said, "Oh, yes, he IS incredible. How else to explain all these children?" I thought my mother would burst!
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Elizabeth Foss is no longer a member of this forum. Discussions now reflect the current management & are not necessarily expressions of her book, *Real Learning*, her current work, or her philosophy. (posted by E. Foss, Jan 2011)
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Martha in VA
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Elizabeth wrote:
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Oh, this made me laugh out loud!
Your comeback sounded perfectly fine to me. I fear I wouldn't have been so gracious. 
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Carole N.
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Elizabeth, you gave me such a chuckle! What an excellent comeback.
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Maria B.
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Elizabeth:
I love it! You gave me a good laugh!
Maria
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If you take the AFP test and Downs or SB show up as a possibility, then do you feel comfortable taking an amnio to confirm the results? Its not the AFP I worry about. No risk involved. But Amnios carry a risk of miscarriage, and I am nervous about that. Does an OB even consider AFP tests conclusive without another testing confirming or denying the original results?
Just curious...this is new info. for me. I've always refused the AFP test based on old information.
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Elizabeth wrote:
"All with the same husband?"
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Oh, I was stunned the first time I heard this, but I get it on a fairly regular basis.
I'll never forget the walmart checker that asked me, "Are they all yours?" and when I said yes, turned to my dh and asked him, "Are they all yours too?!"
I was floored, but dh just laughed and said, "That's what she told me and I believe her!"
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We've gotten the same husband question before. My husband says I should point to one of the middle children and whisper, "Except for that one." He figures ask a rude question, get an uncomfortable answer. I've never had the guts to do it.
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Elizabeth
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PDyer wrote:
My husband's mother and father presented all their children and spouses with painted welcome signs for Christmas last night. After we all opened our very similar gifts my MIL went on to explain her rationale for what was painted on each sign. Imagine my surprise when she stated she knows we (my husband and I) are done having children so she had our two kids' names painted permanently on the gift. My husband's two younger siblings, on the other hand, did not have their children's names painted on the gift because she expects they will (hint, hint) be having more children.
I was stunned and stammered something like "that door is not closed", but my comment was lost in the other couples' vehement assurance to my MIL there were going to be no more grandchildren from them.
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Patty,
This is really sad and I'm so sorry that you had to endure that kind of pain at Christmas. I'll pray today for your family's change of heart, all the way around.
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Elizabeth Foss is no longer a member of this forum. Discussions now reflect the current management & are not necessarily expressions of her book, *Real Learning*, her current work, or her philosophy. (posted by E. Foss, Jan 2011)
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Topic: Will you be done after this...!!!
