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teachingmyown
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| Posted: Oct 16 2006 at 11:03pm | IP Logged
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I wasn't sure if I should post this here or in the teen forum, as these are high school religion books, but here goes:
I am currently reading The Mass and the Sacraments with my 10th grader as part of Seton's 10 grade. It seems that most of the Catholic "programs" use this book.
I find it quite dull and hard to read. My son says it is too repetitive and has taken on a "yeah, yeah, next paragraph" attitude towards it.
I would much rather be reading Scott Hahn with him, where not only would he learn the facts about each Sacrament but an understanding and hopefully a sense of awe.
I am worrying that the other Fr Laux books will be similar. (We aren't there yet.) Am I the only one who feels this way? Has anyone made it through these? If so, do you have suggestions to make it more interesting? Has anyone ditched this book in favor of a more vibrant study of the Sacraments?
Thanks for listening and for any ideas!
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Molly
wife to Court & mom to ds '91, dd '96, ds '97, dds '99, '01, '03, '06, and dss '07 and 01/20/11
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MacBeth
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| Posted: Oct 17 2006 at 5:32am | IP Logged
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I think I'd agree with you, Molly, though Libby loves the straighforwardness of Laux, but thinks Hahn can be a bit silly and light sometimes. Perhaps she, having read Hahn, needs something more meaty (which Laux is at times).
How is Seton on substituting things? And don't they have problems with Hahn? 
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Willa
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| Posted: Oct 17 2006 at 9:47am | IP Logged
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Laux is hard going -- all his books are like that. My oldest and I really liked them because they were so methodical and precise in wording. My other children, not so much. We had to do a lot of discussion to make them come alive in their minds at all. My daughter really likes to read This Rock and Envoy as supplements to her religious education.
We supplemented a lot -- Kolbe where we are enrolled has you do half a year of Laux and half a year of Catholic classics like Story of a Soul etc.
Some ladies on the CCE list recommend the
Didache highschool textbooks -- I do not have experience with these but they look very nice and I understand Scott Hahn recommends them. Review from Catholic Culture here
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Cay Gibson
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| Posted: Oct 17 2006 at 9:57am | IP Logged
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I had my oldest read "living books" for his religious education. A good friend loaned him all the Laux books but they were over his head and he found them dull (ie: he wasn't getting anything out of them ).
I have the list somewheres if you'd like it.
I think Willa hit on a good substitute...magazines.  I think my ds would have preferred this had I thought of it.
I also had him watch videos and listen to cassette tapes.
I have to say though, my ds has learned more about his faith from asking us questions when he needed the information and from a good friend "talking" to him about the faith than from anything he "studied" during his school years.
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teachingmyown
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| Posted: Oct 17 2006 at 10:39am | IP Logged
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MacBeth wrote:
I think I'd agree with you, Molly, though Libby loves the straighforwardness of Laux, but thinks Hahn can be a bit silly and light sometimes. Perhaps she, having read Hahn, needs something more meaty (which Laux is at times).
How is Seton on substituting things? And don't they have problems with Hahn? |
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I have a hard time even getting a reply from the high school counselors.  I am already substituting Geometry and I put in a request last week to switch Biology programs. I'm really good at this canned curriculum thing, huh? 
I love Scott Hahn because he is silly at times, and because his awe and devotion are so obvious. We were doing alright with Laux until we got to the section on the Eucharist. It is very long and repetitive. The last thing I want is to make studying the Faith a chore to a kid who at this stage states he doesn't care about his Faith anyway. And if I am finding Laux's books a chore, I know it is that much worse to a teen with a bad attitude!
I will look into those other books that Willa mentioned.
Thanks!
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Molly
wife to Court & mom to ds '91, dd '96, ds '97, dds '99, '01, '03, '06, and dss '07 and 01/20/11
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lapazfarm
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| Posted: Oct 17 2006 at 12:25pm | IP Logged
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I don't know if this is helpful, but I do take a sort of living books approach with my dd(16), depending on her interests. She just finished reading The Aquinas Catechism and really like it. She also read Domestic Tranquility and enjoyed that, too, but it is more aimed at women than men. She has asked for a "Lives of the Saints" or Church History for Christmas so I am currently looking into a good version of those for her.
I would definitely not hesitate to go with Hahn for a teen boy. My dh loves his books, also.
When I talked to my Priest recently about goals for religious ed for ds(11) and encouraging vocations, he said the most important thing is to make sure to convey the BEAUTY of the Church, and to take care not to make it a chore to learn her teachings.
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teachingmyown
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| Posted: Oct 17 2006 at 9:56pm | IP Logged
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The Didache series looks great! I still worry that if I deviate from Seton, I will lose the edge that it gives me as the higher authority.
Please pray for me as I wrestly with this decision.
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In Christ,
Molly
wife to Court & mom to ds '91, dd '96, ds '97, dds '99, '01, '03, '06, and dss '07 and 01/20/11
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Willa
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| Posted: Oct 18 2006 at 9:43am | IP Logged
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I see what you mean, Molly. I am not sure what I would do either. Interesting that all the major Catholic homeschool schools use Laux; I wonder why that is. Laux seems very Thomistic to me and I try to explain that to my kids as a justification for using it. Anyway I will pray for your good counsel on this.
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Willa
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jackiemomof7
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| Posted: Oct 18 2006 at 9:55am | IP Logged
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I am currently using 2 of the Didache series, Church history and understanding scripture (which Scott Hahn wrote for this series). My older children did Fr. Laux and I knew that these 2 boys would not enjoy the reading so that is when I gave this series a try. Now we attend the Latin Mass and I have always stuck to traditional like Laux and the series Our Quest for Happiness so I was afraid the Didache series would be kind of "lighter" than what I am use to. But the aren't fluff they are very well done and they have learned alot from them so far. And the test are not easy either you really need to study for them. Now Our Quest for Happiness series might be one Seton would switch too and it is a little more readable than Fr. Laux books.
Just my thoughts!
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ALmom
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You could just have him memorize the lists - and then take Seton tests and supplement with whatever you want that works for your son. My dd did 10th grade Seton and saved religion for the last week of school because she had learned the system. I'm not sure how flexible they are on their history (which is deadly dull, memorize Ann Carrol's texts and be sure to spew it all back) or religion - but you can ask. I do know they always say that the only things you have to do are the things handed in to them for grading - the rest you can give grades for based on your own assignments and criteria.
Our experience with Fr. Laux is that we appreciated the precision of language - but liked having something else to go along. It is repetitive at times, sometimes out of date and can sometimes get old. Kolbe plans now include documents from the Holy Father (may not be up your son's alley based on what you've said). We did not like Setons approach of memorize and regurgitate a whole lot. (Oh, we did tons of religion activities while enrolled with Seton so I didn't totally freak when dd pulled the 1 week to memorize all the lists and take the tests stunt, though I would much preferred her to ponder a bit more - which is why we moved to Kolbe. You might ask if you could see some sample religion plans from Kolbe and just supplement here or with something more interesting for your son. I forget what topics are covered - does Scott Hahn cover the same basic topics?
Janet
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Mrs.K
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| Posted: Oct 19 2006 at 1:16pm | IP Logged
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Willa wrote:
| My oldest and I really liked them because they were so methodical and precise in wording. My other children, not so much |
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Same here - I am using the Laux books with my methodical, Latin-loving eldest ds, but I am already doubting their efficacy if I were to try them with my super-right-brain next ds. My diocese recommends the Didache series, so I was thinking of switching to that for my next ds. Anyone else have experience/opinions regarding Didache?
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teachingmyown
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| Posted: Oct 20 2006 at 2:41pm | IP Logged
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ALmom wrote:
You could just have him memorize the lists - and then take Seton tests and supplement with whatever you want that works for your son.
Janet |
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Janet,
I had to laugh when I read this! I was thinking of doing just that, or let him use his notes during the test, and thought it would "cheating" somehow. What is the criteria for an open-book test anyway? Really. These tests are long and exacting.
Can I do this and then like you said supplement with something more likely to sink in?
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Molly
wife to Court & mom to ds '91, dd '96, ds '97, dds '99, '01, '03, '06, and dss '07 and 01/20/11
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ALmom
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| Posted: Oct 21 2006 at 9:23pm | IP Logged
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Seton gets pretty upset if you do open book - but you can divide the test in two parts if needed. We didn't but I do know many who did do that particularly in history. The reason I said memorize the lists is that our dd, without ever seeing the tests ahead of time, actually recognized a pattern. They seemed to favor all the list questions - and she did do quite well just memorizing all the lists. I will say that she is a very good memorizer - she memorizes lengthy pieces of music, etc. so this was not terribly challenging for her - just annoying to me. It is also perfectly acceptable to them for you to make a study sheet for them - not copying test questions but something like what a traditional classroom teacher would hand to a class as a study guide.
I don't know what they have changed since 4 years ago when my dd did this, so look at all the written instructions that come with the course. Some of the courses now have time limits on tests and such, I think.
But I do know Seton has always repeated that the only stuff that HAS to be done for a grade are the few things you hand in to them. So if you can teach the same concepts better a different way, go for it. I will say they want almost verbatim from the text - so that was a game we played (I hated it and it annoyed me no end, but dd was quite good at memorizing text books, regurgitating and then being done with it (and forgetting most of it)).
Do you need the grade from them? If you don't, then you have a lot more flexibility.
Janet
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4Real Forums : Domestic Church
Topic: Fr Laux books
