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Angie Mc
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How do you encourage your children to take initiative? For example, how do you encourage older siblings to pick up after a toddler  ? No really it's bigger than that...I'm looking more at the broad habit of initiative...SEEING what needs to be done and DOING it.
Could the flip side of this be...how do you, as the mom, NOT SEE what needs to be done and/or NOT DO what needs to be done in order to encourage others to take initiative?
Thanks!
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Wendi DeGrandpr
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Angie - this is a good one. I would love it if someone noticed the trash was full and just changed it; or if they just folded clothes because it had to be done. The failing I see in my own endeavor is the "chore chart". I love the idea and the "order" that a chore chart brings to my planning, but I hate to hear the ever popular "I can't empty the trash that is not my chore", "that isn't on my list - how much will you pay me to do the "extra" work". Ahhhhhhhh! Where is the sense of family? of chipping in? The older my kids get the harder I find a chore chart because people are not always at home when the chore needs to be done.
Anybody just get cooperation and teamwork? or is that just an unattainable ideal?
I am curious how others handle this.
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Dawnie
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Wendi DeGrandpr wrote:
Anybody just get cooperation and teamwork? or is that just an unattainable ideal?
I am curious how others handle this. |
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No, I don't always get cooperation and teamwork, and maybe I'm naive, but I think it is an attainable ideal!
My kids are only 7, 4, and 2, so take this with a grain of salt, but when we do chores, we tend to talk. My 7yod has frequently commented that I'm making her "a slave" by requiring her to help out. I've been rebutting with, "No, you're helping with the work of our family In a family, each person does what he can to help the family." This is starting to sink in. At times recently, this same 7yod has said, "Am I helping my family, Mom?" during chore time. Tonight, while she was washing the dishes she said, "I really don't want to do this, but I'm doing it anyway." She seemed to be proud that she was choosing to persevere in a task she wasn't fond of. I've tried to choose chores for my girls that they are easily able to do and I let them have some choice in the matter. "Would you like to wash the dishes or wipe the table?"
My hope is that they will grow up seeing the work that has to be done as our work. Not "my chores" and "Mom's chores." I want them to see the work we do as something that serves the entire family. I hope that as they grow older, they will pitch in when they see things that need to be done, even if it is not their regular chores, b/c they believe in the importance in working together as a family.
We've been reading the Little House books by Laura Ingalls Wilder and I've found that the Ingalls family is a GREAT example of a family who loves and serves one another. The girls do their chores w/o complaints and they pitch in and offer help when they see that help is needed. They love their parents, they love their siblings, and they make sacrifices in serving one another. I'm hoping that by reading these books to my girls, the character's examples will reinforce my own instruction and that they will want to imitate Mary, Laura, and Carrie.
Is this a pie-in-the-sky vision? I don't know. But I'm shooting for it anyway!
Dawn
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Angie Mc
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What I'm looking for is something different from obedience and cooperation. This is tricky! For example, if I ask a child to do something, he or she will (out of obedience) but then they haven't had the chance to practice initiative because I asked first. See what I mean? So...any specific ideas about helping children to SEE and do first?
I'm not frustrated with my children's lack of initiative as much as I'm wanting to wean the older ones from my direct guidance. I see taking the initiative as a leap in maturity and I want to help them make the leap and not hold them back with my constant doing and habit of directing traffic. It's part of this "letting go" transtion I'm wrestling with...
Love,
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Elizabeth
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Angie Mc wrote:
Could the flip side of this be...how do you, as the mom, NOT SEE what needs to be done and/or NOT DO what needs to be done in order to encourage others to take initiative?
Thanks! |
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You get pregnant and you're so sick you CAN'T do it. Suddenly, from your vantage point on the couch, you realize you've literally been picking up the slack for everyone all the time. So you start to change habits from your horizontal position. And it works for some time--until you're fully recovered,atually and then you start enabling again.
So, you have two choices: get pregnant again and start the process over, hoping the habits stick this time or consciously start training them without the benefit of being physically UNABLE to to do it all yourself.
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Elizabeth Foss is no longer a member of this forum. Discussions now reflect the current management & are not necessarily expressions of her book, *Real Learning*, her current work, or her philosophy. (posted by E. Foss, Jan 2011)
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Wendi DeGrandpr
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Dawnie wrote:
Is this a pie-in-the-sky vision? I don't know. But I'm shooting for it anyway!
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I don't think it is "pie-in-the-sky" Dawn. I think it is worth the effort and I think you are on a great track with how you are training your children. I honestly think it is a better way to build cooperation and help them learn to jump in because they are part of the family than chore charts. As I said before I really think it has been our down fall. At least in this house it has taught something I now wish to "unteach". 
Just time to pull up our boot straps and adjust.
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Wendi DeGrandpr
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Ahh - Angie I lost the first half of my post when I added a quote - no time to re-write the entire thing right now but the point was basically about not doing the work - or even the reminding. Just letting things sit (within some reason) until the kids take initiative. Are we too quick to point something out - not giving them sufficient time (for their maturity level) to see that something has to be done. I think I am too quick in that way.
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mary
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Angie Mc wrote:
What I'm looking for is something different from obedience and cooperation. This is tricky! For example, if I ask a child to do something, he or she will (out of obedience) but then they haven't had the chance to practice initiative because I asked first. See what I mean? So...any specific ideas about helping children to SEE and do first?
I'm not frustrated with my children's lack of initiative as much as I'm wanting to wean the older ones from my direct guidance. I see taking the initiative as a leap in maturity and I want to help them make the leap and not hold them back with my constant doing and habit of directing traffic. It's part of this "letting go" transtion I'm wrestling with...
Love, |
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a friend of mine once said that there are 2 parts to doing a job: seeing what needs doing and actually doing it. the hardest part is the first and you don't really OWN a job until you demonstrate that you can see what needs to be done.
i talk about this to my kids all the time, but i don't see that it's sinking in yet with regard to chores. my oldest does do it with regard to his outside toys, the birdfeeder and his digital camera. so, it must be possible to get them to do this with household chores. i think they have to be interested in the outcome, kwim? there must be a reason for them to own the job. unfortunately, i'm not sure how to make a kid own seeing that the trash can runneth over without my pointing it out. looking forward to hearing other pple's insights.
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Willa
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Elizabeth wrote:
You get pregnant and you're so sick you CAN'T do it. Suddenly, from your vantage point on the couch, you realize you've literally been picking up the slack for everyone all the time. So you start to change habits from your horizontal position. And it works for some time--until you're fully recovered,atually and then you start enabling again. |
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So very true! Everything was running like a ship when I was preg with Paddy -- because I had no choice but to rely on the kids and follow up. And they knew it, and responded to the need.
Now I will put my Pollyanna spin on that and say that I think the core reason is because people learn and do better when there's a REAL need.
Guess when my kids take the most initiative? It's either when they have some direct motivation to help me -- eg I am not going to take them to the library until the house is clean, or whatever -- OR when they can clearly see that I am overloaded. Unfortunately, they don't always see that unless I am clearly losing my temper OR unless I am very verbally transparent that they are necessary and I am overloaded.
Other than that, they are very willing to do their customary jobs but just don't see beyond that; not even my 20 year old, who is perfectly meticulous with what is in his range of duty. My daughter will occasionally step in to help nowadays -- she is 16 and this is encouraging and recent.
Another way to foster initiative, in my experience, is to have the kids visit someone else or do a job for someone else. This works especially if you have social, interactive kids who want to be pleasant. Chari's kids often ask me if they can be of any help, when they are visiting here. Even the little ones do this. What a great habit! But mine don't have the natural motivation to do this.
Anyway, I'm glad you're getting a range of answers -- good question!
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StephanieA
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I once read about the differences between men and women.
Men will walk into a room. If there are toys in their way and they have to step over them, then the place is a MESS. If they walk into a picked-up room, but the carpet needs to be vacuumed, room needs to be dusted, or couch pillows need to be mended, well, men don't notice.
This is a broad generalization, I know. But I see this is the case for my kids too, male and female. Do they really see what needs to be done before chaos ensues? Do they notice the little things that need to be attended to? Can they see the toddler needs his shoe tied before he starts to scream about it? How about a little proaction action here!
Like Willa said, I do get this rare insight from them when I am really bad off AND so's the house.
But, honestly, it's usually the last resort type of thing. The only child here who has this initiative is the 8 year old girl (she's 5th in line). So I tend to think it may be something someone is actually born with or matures into. I am just not sure.
She gets these wild inspirations and goes around the house cleaning for an hour. But afterwards she gets very aggravated if someone even gets a toy out of a box and leaves it unattended. And mercy to the person who drinks out of a glass and leaves it on the table 
The 18 year old can also go on spurts of cleaning, organizing, etc. But it is VERY sporatic and short-lived.
I washed the 14 year old's bed sheets yesterday, but was too ill to finish the job. So guess what? He slept on the mattress pad last night. We had a little talk about initiative. Hope it sunk in.
Blessings,
Stephanie
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aussieannie
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Dawnie wrote:
| We've been reading the Little House books by Laura Ingalls Wilder and I've found that the Ingalls family is a GREAT example of a family who loves and serves one another. |
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When our family has periods of immersing ourselves in the daily reading of The Little House Series, it has a imitative effect, more than any book I have ever been aware of. I feel that I become a little more 'Ma-ish'  (That's a good thing!  ) It just seems to seep into you a bit. I suppose it shows you the power of books for good or for bad.
The Ingall's family plus Corrie TenBoom's family are the two protestant examples that I find particularly inspiring - very, very saintly.
THAT's what I need to do at present! Get back into our Laura Ingalls books. (Haven't finished them completely with my children as yet.)
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Nina Murphy
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I know I am not doing this question justice, but I will throw into the mix one thought on this to add to the conversation. Besides what Willa said being true in my experience----- about the times when the need to help is extreme and OBVIOUS do to almost complete incapacitation on my part -----! , I have found that nothing I have done or not done has ultimately made that much of a difference with certain individuals. In other words, they have an intrinsic blind spot and difficulty with internal motivation.
I know that sounds like a cop out, but have you considered the temperaments playing a role here? A helpful book for me was Litauer's Personality Plus for Kids (as well as the other temperament books). I have the kind of household where I NEED everyone to contribute. But no matter what lectures/training/rewards/punishments/inducements/you-name-i t over the years, I have found that certain children just SEE the need and put themselves to work, and others need to be asked or assigned.
My 10 year-old daughter could run this house: cleaning, meals, childcare (and has always been this way) and I never "trained" her, just gave my own example by living and she was observing! But my 18 year-old just does NOT have the impetus, despite always being a thoughtful, obedient child. I STILL have to work on teaching her, pointing things out, getting her to be self-motivated. My followers are just not my leaders and vice versa. But they do need to be challenged to grow and see outside their own boxes! I have to run...
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Dawnie
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I have been thinking about Angie's question a lot today--how do we train our children to SEE what needs to be done and then to DO it? Hmmmm...
One thing I thought I might do in the future is to let my daughters take turns being "Mom for the week." Not as a punishment, but as a learning experience. Maybe if they "own" the job, b/c they have the responsibility of running the household for a week, they will be able to see better what needs to be done.
Personally, I never cared about housework until I had my own house. I'd leave books, papers, dirty clothes, and whatever else scattered all over my bedroom until Mom and Dad told me to pick it up or I'd be grounded. Once I had my own household, I cared a lot more about how everything looked. I "owned" the job, then.
I think this is a great question to think about, b/c we want to prepare our children for real life. Part of being an adult is being self-motivated. Most grown-up kinds of jobs require a certain amount of initiative on the employee's part. Running a household and homeschooling definately require initiative. If I don't see that dinner needs to be prepared and the clothes need to be washed and lessons need to be planned, who else is going to do it? (Ok, dh might do some of that, but usually only if I ask him for help! )
Great thoughts here, looking forward to reading more!
Dawn
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Willa
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Maybe you could set up a "volunteers" system, Angie-- I read about the idea in a hsing book once, haven't tried it, but it might have some benefits.
For this, you have a requirement that each child do X amount of "volunteer" jobs around the house. Some people have a list of jobs with age ranges but if you wanted to work on the children's ability to see things for themselves, you could leave it to them to discover the jobs. I think it would be interesting to see what jobs my kids found if left on their own.
I know the term "volunteer" sounds sort of ironic but if the idea is to teach children to look for jobs to do more or less on their own, it might help train their vision. My guess is that as Dawnie said, most kids (and even dhs) simply aren't tuned in to what's to be done around the house, because they don't own the responsibility.
I was like that myself until I had a house of my own, I have to say 
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Angie Mc
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Elizabeth wrote:
| So, you have two choices: get pregnant again and start the process over, hoping the habits stick this time . |
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Works for me!
WJFR wrote:
| Another way to foster initiative, in my experience, is to have the kids visit someone else or do a job for someone else. This works especially if you have social, interactive kids who want to be pleasant. Chari's kids often ask me if they can be of any help, when they are visiting here. Even the little ones do this. What a great habit! But mine don't have the natural motivation to do this. |
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This IS interesting. My children are quick to offer help at other's home too. I remember enjoying helping out at my friends' homes when I was young.
StephanieA wrote:
I once read about the differences between men and women.
Men will walk into a room. If there are toys in their way and they have to step over them, then the place is a MESS. If they walk into a picked-up room, but the carpet needs to be vacuumed, room needs to be dusted, or couch pillows need to be mended, well, men don't notice.
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This reminds me of when I was newly married and someone suggested that in order for my dh to take more initiative in the home, I needed to do less. Made sense. So...I didn't scrub the toilet, waiting for him to notice the need (you can see where THIS is going) and sure enough, I broke first! That toilet (the only one in our very tiny apartment) got SO nasty. I'm convinced that he NEVER would have noticed. He didn't see...he didn't think it was his work...he had never cleaned a toilet...well, just remembering this story helps me feel better because we've come a LONG way since then .
aussieannie wrote:
| When our family has periods of immersing ourselves in the daily reading of The Little House Series, it has a imitative effect, more than any book I have ever been aware of. |
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Yep. I find myself thinking...if Laura didn't feed and water the cow, she knew it would die and the family would go hungry...if Laura wasn't obedient to her dad immediately, she knew a cougar might eat her for lunch! So much of our children's lives have such abstract goals like college and, well, heaven! If they don't put their socks away, it just isn't connected in a very tangible way to important, concrete, matters.
Nina Murphy wrote:
I have found that nothing I have done or not done has ultimately made that much of a difference with certain individuals. In other words, they have an intrinsic blind spot and difficulty with internal motivation.
I know that sounds like a cop out, but have you considered the temperaments playing a role here? My followers are just not my leaders and vice versa. But they do need to be challenged to grow and see outside their own boxes! I have to run... |
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Well phrased! And some of it is connected to God's calling for them, their talents, their experiences...
So for some, taking the initiative comes easily (a talent or gift,) for some they may grow into it (through maturity and experience) and some may need to look at taking the initiative as a skill to be learned and practiced. Hmmm....
Dawnie wrote:
| One thing I thought I might do in the future is to let my daughters take turns being "Mom for the week." Not as a punishment, but as a learning experience. |
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Very concrete! Recently we went to the zoo and due to some problems caused by the children, we only had two hours to spend there. I parked the van, handed the tickets and map and said, "We're here, now show us a good time." Normally, I would have plunged into emergency mode, analyzing how to spend the two hours in the most efficient and effective manner! Let me tell you, they did a great job and we had a blast.
WJFR wrote:
Maybe you could set up a "volunteers" system, For this, you have a requirement that each child do X amount of "volunteer" jobs around the house. Some people have a list of jobs with age ranges but if you wanted to work on the children's ability to see things for themselves, you could leave it to them to discover the jobs. I think it would be interesting to see what jobs my kids found if left on their own.
...it might help train their vision. My guess is that as Dawnie said, most kids (and even dhs) simply aren't tuned in to what's to be done around the house, because they don't own the responsibility.
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This is sure worth a try! I'll let you know how it goes .
Thanks, ALL!
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Angie Mc
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4Real Forums : Tea and Conversation
Topic: encouraging initiative
