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HSMama
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| Posted: Nov 18 2011 at 6:27pm | IP Logged
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My son will soon be moving up from a Webelo to a boy scout. For his crossover I wanted to get him some camping basics to last during his boy scout years. The troop he will be going into camps much more often than his cub scout pack. They only go camping once a year.
So, I was thinking a mess kit would be essential. What material is best? I was thinking an aluminum one with an an aluminum cup (a lot have plastic cups) would be great. Any experience/ favorites?
So, what else? A good flashlight. Matches. Maybe a backpack- any favorite brands for types for scout trips?
Maybe A waterproof box to put matches, wallet, anything else that can't get wet? Any other rain gear?
This is my first boy scout so I'm new to this. Any advice would be great. Thanks, all!
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Bridget
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I like stainless better for mess kits, it's sturdier. Also you want plastic for the cups for hot foods and drinks. If the cup is metal the handle gets too hot.
When you invest in a sleeping bag you want one that is rated for cold temps since they camp all year. My guys are tall so I have to look for the extra length sleeping bags or they would outgrow it before they are out of scouts.
Love,love,love scouting for my guys!
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JodieLyn
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What type of camping do they do mostly? If they do actual backpacking (hiking with everything on your back) it will be different than drive up and unload your camping gear.
We found a great deal on an internal frame backpacking pack for our son. They're expensive and I happened on a sale at rei.com and got one with adjustable straps (so would work for the height my son was then to adult height).
A mess kit is great and yes!!!! get one with a metal cup.. boy scouts can do a lot of cooking with that cup.
I'd stick with some sort of metal.. and watch the weight if he'll do a lot of actual backpacking.
for raingear.. unless you'll know he'll be going out in rain, I would stick with emergency ponchos that take little space or weight.
Also consider what seasons they camp in. Our boys do winter camping and I'm thinking the next time we can do a major purchase for him that he needs a good below 0* sleeping bag.
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guitarnan
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Eagle Scout son says:
A good flashlight
Mess kit (plastic cup is okay - his lasted through all his years of Scouting)
Hiking boots if they hike on campouts (you can ask the Scoutmaster what they do on their camping trips - do they hike? Tie knots and work on woodcraft?)
Rain shell (top and pants) if you live somewhere where it rains a lot and they camp frequently. Ponchos work but rain shells work better. (You can get them at Campmor online, at Bass Pro, REI, Cabela's, etc.)
Your Scoutmaster will be your best source of information. He can tell you whether they do a lot of backpacking or mostly tent camping (for the latter, a duffel bag is okay).
Hold off on pocket knives and matches until your son gets the cards that say he's certified to use knives and start fires safely.
Welcome to the wonderful world of Boy Scouting!
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Nancy in MD. Mom of ds (24) & dd (18); 31-year Navy wife, move coordinator and keeper of home fires. Writer and dance mom.
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organiclilac
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| Posted: Nov 18 2011 at 7:09pm | IP Logged
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We got my son this mess kit for his camping trip, and he liked it. I personally prefer stainless steel to aluminum... but it does have a plastic cup. We found a collapsible silicon cup like this one at a local store, which fit neatly into the kit, so he used that instead. Although, I just discovered this carabiner mug which I also think is pretty cool!
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JodieLyn
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| Posted: Nov 18 2011 at 7:24pm | IP Logged
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 apparently we live in different climates and have some different experiences with what the scouts do 
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Jodie, wife to Dave
G-18, B-17, G-15, G-14, B-13, B-11, G-9, B-7, B-5, B-4
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guitarnan
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| Posted: Nov 18 2011 at 7:48pm | IP Logged
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Jodie, that's for sure!
Some troops really do specialize in one or more activities (backpacking, knot tying, service to community), so it's never a bad idea to ask the Scoutmaster about the troop calendar and planned campouts.
My son's troop was (and still is) a camping troop - they go at least once a month (sometimes in Jan. or Feb. with snow, but usually March-Dec.), with one Appalachian Trail backpacking trip per year. Scouts training for Philmont go on separate backpacking trips, too.
My husband's troop was a backpacking troop. They also did a lot of knot-tying activities.
My son's first troop (in Italy) did a lot of community service+camping events; they went twice each year to tidy up the American military cemetery in Nettuno and also went twice each year to help the American Benedictine nuns who run the Abbey of San Vincenzo (they are elderly, so the Scouts cleared brush, picked cherries and olives, etc.).
His second troop (post-Italy) mainly did District-wide activities and summer camp. The troop was so small that the boys and parents weren't very interested in organizing troop-only campouts.
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Nancy in MD. Mom of ds (24) & dd (18); 31-year Navy wife, move coordinator and keeper of home fires. Writer and dance mom.
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HSMama
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Thanks for all the ideas! We will definitely talk to the scoutmaster and see what he recommends. Seems like there is not a general agreement about plastic/metal cup. I guess we'll just see what we can find... I figured I might as well pick this stuff up while Christmas shopping because I HATE shopping!
Will the whittling chip card from cub scouts pass over to boy scouts so he'll be able to carry a knife immediately? I think it's amusing that they need permission to start fires considering he wakes each morning to start the wood stove. Better safe than sorry, I'm sure a lot of kids don't have the experience my kids have.
We're really hoping that boy scouts is a much better experience than cub scouts. They are quite bored in cub scouts. The boy scout troop is all catholic and father even comes to campouts to say mass!
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jawgee
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I shop from www.scoutstuff.org almost every Christmas for my oldest. He's a first-year Webelo this year, and on his Christmas list is a 2-person tent and a nicer pocket knife. Last year he got a sleeping bag.
Check the Scout Stuff clearance section. I can almost always find something my DS needs in that section.
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mom3aut1not
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Can I put in a plug for a headlight-type flashlight? It's great when you are going to the (primitive) toilet facilities in the middle of the night. I am so happy to avoid holding a flashlight while I go and then try to clean my hands.... I prefer the kind where you can aim the light down so you don't blind all the people you meet.
My son is a relatively new scout, but because he is a "scout with special needs," I go along on all activities. Thus, I have discerned my own favorite things for a Mom Scout. The headlight is one of the top ten. A nice chair for car camping is another. We have a dedicated chair for each camper in the family. Our scoutmaster also has several, but I like having my own.
The other things mentioned are great too. Some others (depending on climate)
-spork (I like to travel light). Maybe for the Christmas stocking...
-extra mug for grownup 
-coolmax liner for sleeping bag -- this will keep his sleeping bag cleaner at all time, warmer in cold weather, and more comfortable in summer (moisture is wicked away). Last summer it *was* my sleeping bag most of the time at summer camp. They are awesome.
-Depending on the amount of camping you do or the climate, he may need a couple of sleeping bags. One that is good for 40 degrees won't cut it for 0, and vice versa. Unless he will be backpacking, you can get the less expensive non-down bags. Bags with synthetic fill also work better when wet; down bags don't insulate well when wet. (Down bags apparently last longer and are much lighter and stuff down smaller, but they are much more expensive.)
-Good quality hiking day pack (Unless they go backpacking, you probably won't need more). I got an adjustable one for my son that he can use for years. In a couple of years he may need one for backpacking (and thus, I will need one as well), but I'll put that off for a while. If you want to use a water reservoir (Camelbak is common), make sure he can use it with the backpack. It'd have small holes for the plastic tube to go through. Get it fitted. A well-fitted backpack is great; I carried mine for twenty miles, and it wasn't a burden at all -- it was completely comfortable. My feet were a teeny sore after 20 miles, but properly fitting hiking shoes helped there too. However, I would wait until he is actually close to hiking before buying them; you wouldn't want him to outgrow them if you can avoid it.
-Hiking socks if they go to summer camp or go hiking. Preferably at least two pairs for a hike so he can change socks. (Can you tell my son earned the Hiking merit badge in the last year?)
-Good quality long underwear -- not cotton! -- if he will be cold weather camping or engaging in cold weather activities.
-first aid kit. There is a nice one now from Adventure Medical that contains all the items required for the First Aid merit badge and rank requirements.
-water bottle! I like Kleen Kanteen and Camelbak. I recommend having two per person unless you have a water reservoir. Then I recommend one. Another item for the Christmas stocking...
I do like REI. A lifetime membership costs $20 and gives you two great coupons each year, access to the Attic sales (apparently a great way to get deals -- I've never gone), and 10% refund* in March. They also have a staff that is pretty knowledgable which is great for a newbie like me. I love, love, love the tent they recommended to me. I make good use of their coupons, sales, and knowledge. My bil prefers Campmor. Our scoutmaster likes REI if he needs expert advice and Campmor for the lower prices if he knows what he wants. Also, you can rent some stuff (sleeping bags and a few other things) if you want to try something out before buying.
*This is 10% of most of the merchandise that was not bought with a coupon or on sale.
This sounds like a lot, but you won't buy it all at once... unless you want to buy a lot of the stuff his scoutmaster says he'll need in the backpack and put it all under the tree.... It costs more for for us because we need two or three of each category for both adult Scouters and our special needs Boy Scout.
FWIW,
Deborah
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guitarnan
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| Posted: Nov 18 2011 at 9:58pm | IP Logged
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The Cub Scout card won't translate to Boy Scouting. He'll have to earn the Boy Scout cards for pocket knives and fire starting. Most troops emphasize these processes on the first couple of campouts where new Scouts participate.
Deborah makes some great points. I love my headlamp. My son says a flashlight is better as you can aim it somewhere besides where your head is pointing, but I know he loves his headlamp!
Another great idea is a cool-max shirt (short sleeved) for summer - this is a great spring/summer birthday idea. My son's Philmont crew bought two per Scout for their trek and they really worked. (See, Scouting inspires year-round gift suggestions!)
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Nancy in MD. Mom of ds (24) & dd (18); 31-year Navy wife, move coordinator and keeper of home fires. Writer and dance mom.
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HSMama
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Great advice, thanks. Some of you mentioned gear for camping in the cold. What are some essentials for camping in the cold? My son will be camping with the scouts in December. It shouldn't get below 20 degrees on a December night around here. We never go camping past the first of October and when we do, 50 degrees at night seems ridiculously cold ;)
The mama bear side of me just wants him to stay home during the cold campouts, but I know it'll be a good experience for him.
Besides a decent sleeping bag- what should he bring? A beanie hat to sleep in? Since so much heat is lost through your head I assume that would be a good thing.
A coolmax liner for the sleeping bag was mentioned. Is there anything else that would be similar to that since it's a bit of money. Would you suggest a sheet or extra fleece blanket to go in the sleeping bag for extra warmth?
What should he wear to bed? Long Johns? Sweatshirt? Warm socks? Beanie? Someone told me that to keep warm while camping in the cold you should sleep in your underwear with just your sleeping bag. BUT I know that at home I get warm best with layers- socks, sweatpants, sheet and a couple quilts. I'd assume it would be the same outside.
Can you tell I'm nervous here?
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mom3aut1not
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Mama Bear,
Here is a list of tips from our scoutmaster (and yes, the boys do complain about the cold when not wearing a coat or hat or mittens):
- The coat you’re wearing has zipper for a reason – so zip it UP
- Those gloves in your bag – they’re not keeping your hands warm
- That hat in your bag – it’s not keeping your head warm
- Sitting on top of the fire – that just makes you sweating and colder later on
- Change your clothes before going to bed – all of them even your underwear
- Cover your big old melon when you go to bed with a knit cap
- Those real thin sleeping bag liners really do give you extra warmth
From a BSA pdf (I cut chunks out):
LAYER YOUR CLOTHING. Wear several layers of lighter clothing rather than a single layer of heavy clothing.
KEEP DRY – both from the weather and from perspiration.
WEAR LOOSE FITTING CLOTHES.
WEAR WINTER SHOES/BOOTS – NO SNEAKERS!! Your feet need proper insulation too!
BRING EXTRA SOCKS! It may be necessary to change your socks several times
during the day.
WEAR WOOL. Cotton loses its insulating value when wet. Wool and many synthetic fibers, however, will continue to provide insulation even when wet. THIS INCLUDES DENIM JEANS – THESE ARE COTTON TOO!!
WEAR MITTENS INSTEAD OF GLOVES.
WEAR A WOOL CAP WHICH COVERS THE EARS. Most heat loss is through the head and neck – 50% at 40°and 75% at 15°F! Turtlenecks and scarves covering the neck are also important. Consider also a ski mask which covers the face (cheeks, nose, forehead, etc.)
IF PROPERLY DRESSED, A FIRE IS NOT NECESSARY TO KEEP WARM!
A GOOD WINTER WEIGHT BAG IS ESSENTIAL! Sleeping Bags rated at 15°F or below are recommended. If necessary, double-up two bags (putting one lightweight bag inside another).
MUMMY STYLE BAGS ARE GENERALLY WARMER THAN RECTANGULAR BAGS. This is because there is less “dead air” space to warm.
NATURAL FIBER BAGS (INCLUDING GOOSE-DOWN) LOSE INSULATING PROPERTIES WHEN WET. Synthetic fibers are less susceptible to this problem.
DRESS FOR SLEEP AS YOU WOULD DRESS FOR THE OUTDOORS – IN LAYERS. When bedding down for the night, make sure you have CLEAN, DRY Socks, sweat pants, t-shirt and loose fitting sweatshirt, and wool cap.
BRING AN EXTRA (WOOL) BLANKET OR TWO. These can be used as further insulation over or under your bag, inside your bag, or around your shoulders for added insulation. A blanket can also be wrapped around your feet inside your bag.
BREATHING INSIDE YOUR SLEEPING BAG WILL SOAK IT WITH HUMIDITY AND REDUCE THE INSULATING PROPERTIES OF YOUR BAG AND CLOTHING!! It is best to keep your mouth and nose outside of your bag.
INSULATE YOUR BAG FROM THE COLD GROUND.
To keep boots from freezing up overnight, lie them on their sides beneath your sleeping bag under your butt with the soles sticking out. Put one on each side of you and tie the laces together with a simple knot. There should be enough heat escaping there to keep the frost out, plus the placement will help keep you from rolling of your mat.
AIR MATTRESSES ARE GENERALLY LESS EFFECTIVE THAN CLOSED- CELL FOAM PADS. The air inside the mattress will get cold overnight, and your body will work harder trying to warm it. The same is generally true for cots.
DO NOT WEAR THE SAME CLOTHES TO BED THAT YOU WORE DURING THE DAY!! You may not notice it, but these clothes are damp with perspiration.
EXERCISE LIGHTLY BEFORE GOING TO BED. Not enough to perspire, just enough to get the body core warm.
SMALL VENTILATION OPENINGS IN YOUR TENT WILL PREVENT MOISTURE FROM CONDENSING INSIDE YOUR TENT.
This really is true. I didn't realize this a couple of months ago, and we had condensation everywhere. I ventilated our tent last month, and we were much dryer and more comfortable.
AIR OUT YOUR NIGHTCLOTHES AND BAGS DURING THE DAY. Allow these to dry while you are out for the day so they are nice and dry for the next night. Remember to air out and hang up your bags after the weekend too – this will prevent musty mildew and promotes the longevity of the insulating properties of the bag better than when stuffed away for long periods of time.
WARM YOUR CLOTHES INSIDE YOUR BAG IN THE MORNING. Have the clothes you need for the next day handy so you can warm them inside your bag before getting up in the morning.
IF YOU GET COLD IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT AND CANNOT GET WARMED UP, SEEK HELP AT ONCE!! DO NOT WAIT UNTIL THE MORNING – WAKE UP AN ADULT LEADER.
DRINK PLENTY OF WATER THROUGHOUT THE DAY. You may not realize it, but you can quickly dehydrate outdoors during cold weather. Drink 2 quarts of water per day in addition to what you drink at mealtime. Early signs of dehydration include severe headaches; dehydration can also contribute to the onset of hypothermia. DRINK LOTS OF WATER!
IT’S BETTER TO DRINK COOL WATER THAN HOT DRINKS DURING THE DAY! Drinking hot beverages throughout the day raises the body’s core temperature and consequently reduces the tendency of the body to warm itself. Better to drink cool water during the day. By the same token, drinking coffee, tea, hot chocolate or other caffeinated beverages reduces the body’s ability to warm itself.
Our boys were told to wear sweats, socks, knitted cap, and fresh undies for cold weather camping. (We are missing a current campout because my son is starting to get sick. He is very disappointed.) Liners are great as I mentioned above. Get non-cotton long undies for daytime wear along with more wooly hiking-type socks. Avoid cotton if possible.
Btw, REI has a winter sale this weekend IIRC. Campmor has some specials now too.
In Christ,
Deborah
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guitarnan
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| Posted: Nov 18 2011 at 10:38pm | IP Logged
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What Deborah said. Excellent tips.
Also, tall boys may have trouble with mummy bags...they are usually long enough but may not be comfortable. My 6'1" son has a cold-weather mummy bag he uses as needed but doesn't get the same good night's sleep as he does with our 20 degree extra-long Coleman bags. It's a trade-off if you're tall.
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Nancy in MD. Mom of ds (24) & dd (18); 31-year Navy wife, move coordinator and keeper of home fires. Writer and dance mom.
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SallyT
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Did anyone mention a waterproof pack cover? My son learned the hard way how important this is . . . wet clothes on a campout are no fun. And whether they're car camping or backpacking, the boys in our troop always use their packs.
We got our son a military Alice pack off Ebay for Christmas last year, and also a small rucksack-type military bag which he uses to carry his first-aid kit. He loves and uses both these items constantly.
Also, somebody probably already said this, but for camping in the cold, insulation *underneath* the sleeping bag is crucial. As somebody who did a good bit of winter camping in my pre-kids days, I can attest to the amount of body heat that's lost through the ground. A Thermarest or similar thermal pad will do more to keep body heat in than a blanket or liner in the bag.
We LOVE Boy Scouting. It really is a whole different world from Cubs, though my 9yo enjoys his pack. My 14yo is up for his Life level soon and has already gained an incredible amount of leadership experience in our small troop, having just finished his term as Senior Patrol Leader. Cubs tends to be very safe and adult-directed, but in our experience the boys really blossom once they hit the more boy-led world of Boy Scouting. Not that the leaders don't keep the Boy Scouts safe, but they also trust the boys themselves to have a grain of sense. Besides, they just do more and have more opportunities for adventure. Scouting has been a huge influence in my older son's life, all for good, and I look forward to the day my younger son leaves the Cubs behind, too.
Excited for your son to be moving up to the big time, and wishing him many happy years of adventure.
Sally
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Topic: ?? for scout moms
