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Waterlily
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| Posted: Oct 03 2011 at 8:49am | IP Logged
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I would love some informed opinions on this. It is a question that has been on my heart for some time and I have not found the answer anywhere.
I understand why we are called to dress modestly. BUT, what about our desire to be attractive (even s*xy, I guess) to our husbands? Do you struggle with this as I do? Sometimes I really want to get his attention. I so want to put on some tight jeans and a low-cut top (only around the house--not in public), but am I wrong in doing that? He loves it and I love to please him.
But am I setting a bad example for my sons? I don't have girls---I would probably feel very different about it if I did. But am I sending a message to my sons that dressing like this is OK--even though I only do it at home? When my boys start dating (the oldest is only 10), I surely want them to date girls that dress modestly. Would I be giving them the wrong idea?
I know I could save that desire to dress more alluringly for when my dh and I are alone, but emotionally I need some more build-up time than that, if you know what I mean. It helps my mood so much to feel like he is attracted to me all day and eagerly anticipating that alone time. Sorry for being a bit blunt here.
I also feel like, with the way most women dress today, it makes it very difficult for men to appreciate a modestly dressed woman. I know we are called to a higher standard, and our husbands are too. But sometimes I almost feel like I'm in competition with the world to keep his attention---not that he makes me feel that way, I just do. I get angry at women that dress seductively. How is he supposed to see that all day and not be affected by it? And is it a bit of a let down to come home to a wife dressed in a way that is far less stimulating? Again, he has never said anything like this, but I think it anyway.
Am I just thinking the wrong way here? Am I giving in to temptation? Where's the dividing between making yourself into an object of lust and really lovingly wanting to please your husband? HELP!
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jillian
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I too struggle with this. The best advice I can give to dressing s*xy for your husband is to find clothes that flatter you, make you feel good, but that are still modest. for example I adore button down shirts....absolutely LOVE them, however I know that very few fit me properly and end up looking extra immodest or if I go the other route to achieve modesty, they don't flatter me. I have a large chest (something the hubby loves but that not everyone needs to see) so I try very hard to dress in an attractive fashion but that still keeps me covered.
I think as long as you have an open conversation about what is appropriate...i.e. you dress that way for your husband during the times you are at home. That there is a difference between being attractive, and even s*xy for your spouse but not everyone else.
I am not sure that helped at all
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JennGM
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| Posted: Oct 03 2011 at 11:26am | IP Logged
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I think the word to use is "feminine". How can I dress in a feminine way? Truly feminine would mean flattering to curves but not revealing. I'm not meaning long flowery dresses and skirts necessarily. But there is a difference between things like boxy shirts and baggy pants and something that falls around the waist or drapes the body that hints at the woman's curves. You can wear cute, flattering jeans without cutting off circulation to show every nook and cranny.
I think so much of society's thinking does trickle into our homes without thinking. We do think dressing in an alluring way has to translate as revealing. I am in the same boat having boys around and I would definitely say that low cut or revealing or skin tight are inappropriate and sending a wrong message. It makes the woman more base and objectified. My husband regularly comments on how I need to be modest and feminine in front of my boys.
Being feminine and alluring shows hints of our female figures, but doesn't reveal. It has been said that it's more "titillating" to be suggestive rather than revealing. Showing one's body like that it becomes an object; our personal nature is more lost. Even in marriage the wife should not become an object. The matrimonial act and the sacramental covenant is so rich and deep--but between the two of you. I can't even begin to scratch the surface, but just hint at some things like your husband rejoices and is pleased with you, not just visually, but for you. It's the whole package.
And because of the closeness of husband and wife, I find I don't need anything too revealing to have him pleased. He likes certain shirts, certain colors, hair done a certain way, etc. So maybe not décolleté, but a neckline that shows a little neck and some chest area without cleavage. (a good rule for me is if I bend down if everything shows and falls out it's too low.)
To paraphrase a popular ad, What happens in the bedroom, should stay in the bedroom. Revealing oneself should only between you and your husband.
__________________
Jennifer G. Miller
Wife to  & ds1  '03 & ds2  '07
Family in Feast and Feria
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CrunchyMom
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| Posted: Oct 03 2011 at 12:07pm | IP Logged
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I'm typing one handed, but I just wanted to second that what you wear at home could affect your boys. I find that young boys are still wired like men and are highly visual even though their thoughts are not yet s*xual. I recall my oldest staring at an immodestly dressed waitress when he was three. Ime, it still objectified her in my son's eyes even though he was obviously too little for him to associate it with any feelings of lust.
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Lindsay
Five Boys(6/04) (6/06) (9/08)(3/11),(7/13), and 1 girl (5/16)
My Symphony
[URL=http://mysymphonygarden.blogspot.com/]Lost in the Cosmos[/UR
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Waterlily
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Jillian,
I'm glad to know someone else struggles with this, too!
Jenn,
I know you're right. But I sense that you and your dh have reached a higher level of purity than I and mine!
But I'm trying. Help me to understand more.
Right now I'm reading "Heaven's Song: Sexual Love as it was meant to be" by Chistopher West. It's based on JP II's Theology of the Body, but goes into more detail on the male-female relationship, based on the Song of Songs. It is so very beautiful and I'm learning a lot. I'm trying to get dh to read it too. He has glanced at it a bit.
I guess my problem is my vanity? I love the attention I get from him when I dress in a more appealing way. He is a very visually stimulated type of guy, and has NEVER urged me to dress more modestly.
Maybe his attitude is a problem also? If so, what can I do to change it? I remember the first time he saw me in a swimsuit. He had a very disappointed expression and I think he said something like "That's it? that's your swimsuit?" I guess he was expecting "Sports Illustrated". And I had tried so hard to find something modest but appealling!
But I don't want to give the wrong impression. He is a good Catholic guy. We had waited for each other for a long time, getting married at the ages of 36 (him) and 31 (me). He is loving and respectful. I guess we both still have some worldly attitudes though. Maybe prayer and fasting is the only way to deal with this!
Lindsay, I know both you and Jenn are right about the boys. I do not want to do anything inappropriate in front of them.
I'd appreciate any more thoughts and opinions.
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organiclilac
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My husband works on a college campus, talk about being assaulted with immodest dress all day long! However, I know that he appreciates very much when he comes home to find me in a skirt instead of yoga pants, with a little makeup on and even a little perfume. It really is the effort to be feminine, and especially when I make that effort just for him, and not because we're going out, that has an effect on him.
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Tracy, wife to Shawn, mama to Samuel (4/01) and Joseph (11/11), and Thomas (2/15)
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anitamarie
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| Posted: Oct 03 2011 at 2:21pm | IP Logged
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A few random thoughts, FWIW. I'm typing quickly so it may come out jumbled.
First, immodest dress incites lust, not love. While we want our husbands to desire us, that's not the same as lusting after us.
We should all look on our spouses as human beings first, then as someone to give ourselves to, not as someone to possess for sex, a paycheck, a housekeeper, etc.
I would agree with your assessment that wanting to be incite lust by dressing immodestly is vanity. It is exactly what our culture puts out there for us. The message from the culture is that we are powerful when we make men weak with our sexuality, and that our value is in that power. It is a misuse of our sexuality, but very easy in this day and age to be susceptible to. I know many older women who are thoroughly depressed that they have lost that power over men, hence the plastic surgery industry and women always trying to look younger.
It's a journey to purity for all of us, and not an easy one in this day and age.
As far as changing your dh's attitude, you can't do that. Only he can, when he wants to. Fasting and praying for him are all you can do.
I agree with JennGM about looking feminine, and emphasizing the feminine without revealing too much. Unfortunately, men have become accustomed to women revealing too much.
God Bless,
Anita
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jillian
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| Posted: Oct 03 2011 at 2:38pm | IP Logged
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Waterlily wrote:
Jillian,
I'm glad to know someone else struggles with this, too!
Jenn,
I know you're right. But I sense that you and your dh have reached a higher level of purity than I and mine!
But I'm trying. Help me to understand more.
Right now I'm reading "Heaven's Song: Sexual Love as it was meant to be" by Chistopher West. It's based on JP II's Theology of the Body, but goes into more detail on the male-female relationship, based on the Song of Songs. It is so very beautiful and I'm learning a lot. I'm trying to get dh to read it too. He has glanced at it a bit.
I guess my problem is my vanity? I love the attention I get from him when I dress in a more appealing way. He is a very visually stimulated type of guy, and has NEVER urged me to dress more modestly.
Maybe his attitude is a problem also? If so, what can I do to change it? I remember the first time he saw me in a swimsuit. He had a very disappointed expression and I think he said something like "That's it? that's your swimsuit?" I guess he was expecting "Sports Illustrated". And I had tried so hard to find something modest but appealling!
But I don't want to give the wrong impression. He is a good Catholic guy. We had waited for each other for a long time, getting married at the ages of 36 (him) and 31 (me). He is loving and respectful. I guess we both still have some worldly attitudes though. Maybe prayer and fasting is the only way to deal with this!
Lindsay, I know both you and Jenn are right about the boys. I do not want to do anything inappropriate in front of them.
I'd appreciate any more thoughts and opinions.
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I do struggle with this. I have gone both extremes, dressing baggy/sack-like in ill fitting clothes, and crazy lust-inciting clothing. I struggle a lot too because I am young, only 25, so I have to work to find appropriate clothing that still suits my age/style/etc kwim?
I also only have a dd not sons so maybe it's a bit different. DH doesn't really care one way or another either but I feel so so much better when I am dressed appealingly for him and myself (clear as mud)?
eta: femininity is way different than s*xual as another poster pointed out. I also loved Dressing with Dignity was very informational/inspirational to me
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JennGM
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I think what has to happen is a paradigm shift within yourself and your husband, and it will come through perseverance and purity. You don't need to wear mumus or jumpers. There are many choices to be attractive and attracting to your husband without compromise.
Society thinks looking "hot" has to mean immodest. There are so many accepted things every day -- cheerleaders on the sidelines, beer and car commercials using the scantily clad chick to sell the car. It saddens me to be near a middle school or high school (even elementary) and see what the girls are wearing. They have been clearly given a wrong message.
A great book It's So You to help on the dressing side. I am struggling myself finding something that looks nice while I'm overweight. The well-endowed look is not easy! This book really gives some great and practical tips.
I think it's important if you have girls and/or boys. While boys are visually taking it all in, the girls aren't immune to seeing how Mommy dresses. They imitate. One of my sisters was horrified to see her daughter dressing dowdy all the time -- grabbing comfy big t-shirts and shorts. Then she realized she was totally copying Mommy -- my sister would just get into the comfy clothes at home.
A former moderator at 4Real had made a point long ago about making sure she doesn't bring things home send mixed messages. Home is the sanctuary, and we are creating an atmosphere to nurture our children. If within the family there is a level of dressing inappropriately, even only at home, this is what is considered "home" for the children, and they will gravitate to that when they leave the nest.
There are mixed messages being sent. A child doesn't see the home as a borderline for clothing apparel. If we are saying "you need to be modest, stay covered, be feminine" and teaching purity, but it is not always at home, there is a "do as I say but not as I do".
It is a daily struggle with purity for all of us, I'm no better than you!
As far as the swimsuit, if there are times you have private swims or hot tub at night, you have more room to have fun suits. But like Anita pointed out, so much of the industry is pushing lust and objectifying women.
__________________
Jennifer G. Miller
Wife to & ds1 '03 & ds2 '07
Family in Feast and Feria
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JodieLyn
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Finding appropriate clothing is a very difficult thing these days. Be glad you’re not dressing a teenage daughter. 
I find looking online tends to yield much better results than going to the store. You can look through so many options so much faster at so many different stores. When I’ve looked for a dress for my daughter we literally find one or two options PER STORE. That would be nuts if we were going out and into each store and trying to sort through all the rest of the muck. I’ve found that Kohl’s tends to have slightly more options than most stores.
Thank goodness layering is fashionable. If you have a body type that looks best in a V neckline you may have problems finding one that isn’t too low cut. But a close fitting pretty camisole underneath and you can wear the pretty top and not be falling out either.
Close fitting is actually way more attractive than tight: tight is bulgy and has no grace to it. Close fitting can follow your curves smoothly and stay smooth when you move and has a grace to it that is very attractive. I’ve seen the first. The tight and too revealing clothing on a pretty woman ignored by a room full of people while a woman wearing a dress that was not low cut, was tea length, not too tight but close fitting through the bodice with a flared skirt could walk in and have every eye in the room on her. And the first ends up looking slightly trashy next to the other.
If you have any space at all, making an attractive space in your bedroom for the things you do in the evening prior to bed, watching tv or whatever it is, would allow you as a couple to relax in your room and have many options open as to what you can wear while alone with your dh; just have a robe to grab when you go into the rest of the house. Those little boys won’t be little for long and even if you could put them to bed now and have free reign in the rest of the house, they’ll be teens before you know it and your level of privacy will depend greatly on a closed (and lockable) door.
There’s many perfectly fine ways to be alluring too: pretty shoes, painted toes, hair up off the neck (the bare neck can be very alluring) or the opposite, hair loose, dangly earrings, subtle perfumes. The colors and textures of the clothes you choose. Certain colors can evoke different emotions not to mention people are attracted to their favorite colors as long as it’s a color that makes you look good too. Velours and velvets and silks and satins just invite touch to those wonderful feeling fabrics, even a soft flannel can be attractive in that way. If it makes you want to reach out and touch the fabric then you have a good idea which those are.
But the MOST attractive thing in the whole package is YOU. If you aren’t convinced you’re attractive no matter what you’re wearing, you won’t be as attractive to those around you. You are beautiful women and you don’t need to prove that by exposing yourselves in public and outside of your bedroom and the bathroom, the other rooms are the “public rooms” in your house.
But this doesn’t preclude you from intimacy with your dh in the public rooms of the house. Whisper in his ear about later. Give him winks. Whatever can help create anticipation but also respects the others in the house that don’t need to hear or see the form of that intimacy.
__________________
Jodie, wife to Dave
G-18, B-17, G-15, G-14, B-13, B-11, G-9, B-7, B-5, B-4
All men who have turned out worth anything have had the chief hand in their own education.
-Sir Walter Scott
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Erica Sanchez
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I was going to write something along the lines of what Jodie wrote at the end of her post. I think that no matter how you are dressed, if a husband knows that you desire him in that way, that is enough and probably better than all the rest. I read a protestant book on this issue. I believe the author had interviewed many husbands and this was the number one thing that was important to them - the desiring of them by their spouse in this way.
I think this is easier said than done. :) We are moms and we are tired. I guess my advice would be not to worry too much about what you are wearing (although I love, love, love ALL of the thoughts shared above), but really focus on your desiring of your husband and letting him know this in fun and creative ways.
I really do love everything written above and am so blessed to be a part of group of such amazing women. And, this is a huge reminder to me to be more careful about what I wear around the house, so thank you for that.
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Have a beautiful and fun day!
Erica in San Diego
(dh)Cash, Emily, Grace, Nicholas, Isabella, Annie, Luke, Max, Peter, 2 little souls ++, and sweet Rose who is legally ours!
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knowloveserve
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An excellent and edifying topic; thank you!
(I second the "It's So You!" book; it's very, very good-)
Being modest does not mean being piously frumpy. It doesn't mean always wearing denim jumpers with tennis shoes or boxy floral dresses circa 1973 or rubbing soot on your face while wearing sackcloth---)
The goal for women should be to look attractive-- not attracting. (*Check out the dresses on www.shabbyapple.com. These are an excellent example of what I'm talking about*)
And I absolutely agree that it is YOU who will attract your man more than what you wear. Yes, the world is disordered and men are visually assaulted at every turn, but we ought not to go down to that level. If he's not able to appreciate a modest, diginified woman... he will someday. Our spouses will be sanctified by our efforts at holiness. Strive to be the woman in Proverbs 31.
Find a scent he loves. Put mascara on. Have fresh breath. Greet him with a smile and a big hug and kiss when you see him, dropping whatever you're doing to let him know he is the most important thing to you. Make him his favorite foods. Be playful and even a little sassy with him. Comment frequently on what a great man he is or on something he does. (Men need to be admired even MORE than they need to be loved... it's true.)
The women men lust after aren't usually the kind of women men want for wives. Be the kind of WIFE your man would want...
"I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercy of God, that you present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, pleasing unto God, your reasonable service. And be not conformed to this world; but be reformed in the newness of your mind, that you may prove what is the good, and the acceptable, and the perfect will of God." - Romans 12:1-2
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Ellie
The Bleeding Pelican
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JennGM
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| Posted: Oct 04 2011 at 9:30pm | IP Logged
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knowloveserve wrote:
| The women men lust after aren't usually the kind of women men want for wives. Be the kind of WIFE your man would want... |
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That reminds me of the movie "Cheaper by the Dozen".
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Jennifer G. Miller
Wife to & ds1 '03 & ds2 '07
Family in Feast and Feria
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Waterlily
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I'll check out "It's so You," and if you could recommend some other books on being a woman, being a wife, feminitity, modesty, etc., I'd greatly appreciate it. I know I need a big attitude adjustment here.
I'm deeply grateful to all of you for sharing your thoughts.
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jillian
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| Posted: Oct 05 2011 at 1:15pm | IP Logged
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I loved Dressing With Dignity.
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BrendaPeter
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knowloveserve wrote:
Greet him with a smile and a big hug and kiss when you see him, dropping whatever you're doing to let him know he is the most important thing to you. Make him his favorite foods. Be playful and even a little sassy with him. Comment frequently on what a great man he is or on something he does. (Men need to be admired even MORE than they need to be loved... it's true.) |
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The best thing you can "wear" around your husband is a spirit of KINDNESS. Read Fr. Lovasik's book ""The Hidden Power of Kindness" for a few minutes everyday and meditate on his teachings. Pray to Our Lady always. She has picked out my entire wardrobe, one that is modest yet elegant and attractive. Ask my husband  .
Trust in the Lord in all things! Sending you hugs & prayers!
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Blessings,
Brenda (mom to 6)
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4Real Forums : Tea and Conversation
Topic: Modesty/Attractiveness
