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JennGM
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| Posted: June 05 2008 at 4:39pm | IP Logged
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So Maryan was so sweet to let me look over Right Start A as I'm trying to nail down some decisions for K this year.
I really, really like the concepts behind the program. I think it would work. BUT I have a few questions for those who have used this program.
1) The idea of counting in 5s and 10s, and counting the "math way" of 1-ten-1 for eleven, etc. is something I would have to learn (and dh). And I can see some other concepts that will have a learning curve for the parents.
a) how hard is it to teach the old dog Mama to learn this new trick and
b) how hard is it to get Dad on the same page if he wants to get involved in the math?
2) It mentions don't teach the real names of the numbers or counting from 1-100 until the above concepts are learned. And don't teach to count by ones. Well, we've already done the damage. How hard is it to unlearn when the child is at his prime of learning?
I'm sure I'll have other questions. Definitely some combining Montessori manipulatives with this program, but I'll tag my questions to Maryan's or Mackfarm's questions.
Thanks in Advance!
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Jennifer G. Miller
Wife to  & ds1  '03 & ds2  '07
Family in Feast and Feria
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Mackfam
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| Posted: June 05 2008 at 6:23pm | IP Logged
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And, I'd be interested in knowing if any of you (Maryan, are you out there?) have used Level A with a 3 1/2 year old who has an early grasp of numbers and math principles in general.
If you've used Level A, could you give me your opinion of it and do you think it would be too challenging for a (soon to be) 4yo? In reading about it on their site it seems like it would be a very good fit for him right now.
I'm motivated to start him early in Right Start because of some of the same concerns Jenn mentions above. He's quite a motivated little learner, and I've noticed he is already doing simple adding and subtracting. I'm afraid one more year and I'd have to backtrack like Jenn is doing. But, I don't want to use the program if it's too much too early, KWIM?
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Jen Mackintosh
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Maryan
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| Posted: June 05 2008 at 7:01pm | IP Logged
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1. I was skeptical that John Paul would catch on to "Right Start" counting since he already counted the other way. But he had no problem.
2. I would say it was ME who had the harder time transitioning to some of their methods. I definitely had to read up and sometimes practice the night before just because it wasn't what I normally did. I think I have it down and am looking forward to doing it with Bobby. (Note I did skip some of the fractile stuff cuz it took TOO long -- but that might have been 1st grade. It seemed like a classroom activity).
FYI -- Somewhere in the beginning of R.S. B, we lost counting that way. We never finished RS A -- we just started it to get a feel for it at the end of Kindergarten. So we weren't counting that way for more than 6 months I would say.
So both Jennifers -- I haven't had a son as either of yours use the program yet. Oh wait... I take that back. I just remembered... when we started RS with my oldest my 3 1/2 yo did most of it right alongside of him. He did fine. Although I think he would have gained a VISUAL advantage if we hadn't -- but it didn't hinder him. Again, we only did the beginning of A for a very little while to see if we liked it. But we only have 5 lessons of B left and we did all of it (except a FEW things that I skipped).
3. Ummm.... the Dad factor. Dan was a math teacher... and a good one. But I haven't had him do Right Start yet because he doesn't have that kind of time right now to read up on their method since most of the year involves some sort of sports activities in the evening.
And KackyK is my resident Right Start expert.
As in anything I think different kids react differently to different methods etc.
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Maryan
Mom to 6 boys & 1 girl: JP('01), B ('03), M('05), L('06), Ph ('08), M ('10), James born 5/1/12
A Lee in the Woudes
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Maryan
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| Posted: June 05 2008 at 7:04pm | IP Logged
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BTW -- I didn't have Bobby do any Right Start this year, so it was just for a few weeks when he was 3 1/2 that he did some. I think it's unavoidable to hear regular counting -- it just wasn't an issue for us transitioning.
And can you tell that I can hardly be a purist in ANYTHING with all that I have going on?!!? 
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Maryan
Mom to 6 boys & 1 girl: JP('01), B ('03), M('05), L('06), Ph ('08), M ('10), James born 5/1/12
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Mackfam
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| Posted: June 05 2008 at 8:17pm | IP Logged
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Maryan wrote:
| BTW -- I didn't have Bobby do any Right Start this year, so it was just for a few weeks when he was 3 1/2 that he did some. I think it's unavoidable to hear regular counting -- it just wasn't an issue for us transitioning. |
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Why didn't you have him do any RS this year, Maryan?
Maryan wrote:
| And can you tell that I can hardly be a purist in ANYTHING with all that I have going on?!!? |
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I'm relieved to hear that! I *adjust* everything I use as well so I was wondering how I'd like something very scripted. I know I HATED Saxon for that reason.
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Jen Mackintosh
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KackyK
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| Posted: June 05 2008 at 8:20pm | IP Logged
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Yes, you will learn and you will think...why didn't anyone ever show me how to think like this before!!! This year it was 2nd and 3rd graders who did it, they also completed RS in their 1st and 2nd grades respectively...so basically this was their 2nd year doing it.
Anyways...I'm amazed by how well they can do mental math and how quickly they know their facts...way better than their older brother and sister.
Now here is alittle something, I started my 5 yold in Sept with RS A. He wasn't too into it. He went a little ways and then balked. He didn't want to use any of the manipulatives. He's my "just show me how to do it and I'll just do it" kind of kid. So, I went ahead and purchased an Abeka K math book. He was so happy to just sit there and ask for the directions, then he'd do it.
But the funny thing was...when he'd come to something he was hung up on, I'd whip out the abacus, show it to him with that, and he'd be back on his way again. So I don't know what his 1st grade year has in store for us. I am going to buy the Abeka 1 book, but I'm sure we'll be using some of those "tricks" and helpful hints I have learned through RS.
Just for the sake of tmi this upcoming year will be my 3rd (now 4th grade I guess) ds's last year with RS. So I'm very interested to see where he can go from there!!!
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KackyK
Mom to 8 - 3 dd, 5ds & 4 babes in heaven
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JennGM
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| Posted: June 05 2008 at 8:59pm | IP Logged
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Well, thanks y'all! Very helpful. I'm no purist, so that was probably my underlying question (very perceptive, Maryan). Do you have to be for RS? I appreciate the honesty.
Jennifer, your son sounds like mine. He's been doing adding and subtracting for a while, and has some grasp of the abstract.
Kacky wrote:
| why didn't anyone ever show me how to think like this before!!! |
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And I'm so glad you shared that, Kacky! When I was reading the summaries, I thought I really want to learn this way myself. I didn't struggle in math, but I know it was more memorization than actually understanding the concepts. And I still need way too many crutches and visualizations to do simple things, it's embarrassing.
I'm eager to hear about the transition to the next level for your children, Kacky!
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Jennifer G. Miller
Wife to & ds1 '03 & ds2 '07
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KackyK
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| Posted: June 05 2008 at 9:29pm | IP Logged
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Oh and I forgot to respond to the dh portion of your question.
On one of those federal holidays that come in the middle of the week this past fall, dh was doing school with the boys. They handed him the RS manual and he kind of stared at it for awhile. Then he did manage to do their warmup section...easy, no new concept. But then when it came to the lesson, he passed it off to me.
I gave him a hard time, said, "can't you do it??" He ofcourse said yes, but didn't want to mess up the direction the book had been taking and that I was already use to doing.
(And as an aside, my dh has a science phD background and he had no problems with the RS methods whereas he is not so keen with some Saxon)
So unless your dh plans on doing ALOT of the math with him, it will be hard to jump in. I think it's not just about the fact that it is "different" math, but just when you are in a groove, and RS will put you in a groove, it's hard to just step in and out. KWIM?
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KackyK
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JuliaT
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| Posted: June 05 2008 at 10:06pm | IP Logged
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We have been using RS for four years. I started my oldest on RS when she was just shy of 5 years of age. She had already finished MCP K and it was not a pleasant experience so we jumped ship and went with RS. I had her do Level A just because I wanted her to be comfortable with the RS way of doing math. She had no problem changing her mindset when it came to visualizing numbers instead of counting or in counting the RS way. She was able swing back and forth whenever she needed to. My ds has had the same experience.
It was not difficult at all for me to learn how to count the RS way. Now that we are in Level D, I can see the beauty of counting in this way. The difficulty I had was wrapping my mind on how to add with the various strategies that RS offers. That was a learning curve for me. I had to go over those lessons beforehand. I am still having problems with this.
I can't address the husband question as my dh works long hours and he is never around when we do math and it just doesn't come up in coversation (it probably should, but it doesn't.)
As to starting a 3 1/2 yr. old with Level A, many have done it but I would encourage you to go very slow. If your child doesn't get a lesson and it is a foundational lesson, then it would probably be wise to park there until understanding sinks in.
My youngest will be starting K in the fall. I have decided not to do a formal curriculum with her, rather just do living math. Due to the fact that I have done Level A twice already, I am confident in the fact that I can teach her the RS way of doing math on our own. I am looking forward to this year.
Blessings,
Julia
mom of 3(8,7,5)
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Mackfam
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| Posted: June 05 2008 at 10:45pm | IP Logged
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Have any of you used, or do you plan to use the Geometry program?
I am considering using it with my 7th grader next year. Do any of you have it? Would it be way too easy for a 7th grader? It looked promising. She'll be doing Algebra I next year - very, very slowly though, so there would be time for supplementing with a fun geometry course (which is what I thought this might be from the description online.)
Anyway, their Geometry program looked really neat. I'm just second guessing now...is it too young for her? It didn't look that way online. I suppose I was wondering because Kacky says she'll be done with the regular programs of RS after next year. I'm not looking for an advanced placement geometry course, just a basic course that is fun.
I really appreciate hearing how all of you are using this! Very helpful to me.
Any opinions on their Geometry?
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Jen Mackintosh
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Maryan
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| Posted: June 06 2008 at 6:36am | IP Logged
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Mackfam wrote:
| Why didn't you have him do any RS this year, Maryan? |
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Simply because RS B was to advanced for him and due to many things (pregnancy and then newborn included), I had limited times to do one-on-one presentations (my 4th child was a climber and things could get interesting around here  )... so I opted to make sure I found one on one math time for JP since it was most important that he did math formally and decided Bobby would just start RS when he was in K.
And yay Kacky for coming in with answers!!
And Jenn -- all her games DO take the place of flashcards BUT you do have to remember to play that many games. Not a problem for John Paul he loves them -- it's just a bit harder to find time away from babies who like to attack cards, etc.
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Maryan
Mom to 6 boys & 1 girl: JP('01), B ('03), M('05), L('06), Ph ('08), M ('10), James born 5/1/12
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KackyK
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| Posted: June 06 2008 at 7:07am | IP Logged
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I think a great thing about the games is that they are totally reinforcement. So sometimes when one my ds's really get a concept and things are crazy we skip the game. But it's always there for fun and like I said for that reinforcement. I've found my younger ds loves the games and the other is up for one time around and then he is done (but he's my "I get it I get it" kid)
And Jennifer I think I am oblivious to RS having an older geometry program. I have a friend who lurks around here and this is something I'm betting she has at least heard of...I'm going to check with her and I'll get back to you!
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KackyK
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Mackfam
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| Posted: June 06 2008 at 12:19pm | IP Logged
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KackyK wrote:
And Jennifer I think I am oblivious to RS having an older geometry program. I have a friend who lurks around here and this is something I'm betting she has at least heard of...I'm going to check with her and I'll get back to you! |
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Thank you, Kacky!
I did some reading on their Right Start Forums this morning and found a lot of helpful information. The Geometry program is meant to be used after completing level E - sometime in 5th or 6th grade. If you're looking to continue Right Start after Level E, you might consider looking at their Geometry program. I love how it's set up, and so does my math major husband.
I'd still love to hear from you Kacky, or anyone else if they have input on it.
I'm not sure whether or not to order Level A for JP or not. Julia had some great points, and though I'd never be inclined to push at such a young age, I am concerned. This is the same as approaching reading - he's ready and asking, but I keep thinking he's too young to start anything formal. I may go with my gut on this one.
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Jen Mackintosh
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Marcia
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| Posted: June 11 2008 at 6:03am | IP Logged
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IMHO (as we are finishing up Level D) it's okay to just do living math applications through preschool. If you can print and make any of your own Montessori manipulatives from montessori free places online, you will let your child discover math rather then make it a lesson. The time for "formal" math lessons will come soon enough!
I have an 8 year old and 6 year old that I started both on Level B when they were 5. We never did Level A on Ruth Cotter's (the writer) recommendation. Because we had and used counters, spindles, and a zillion other math manipulatives that we keep around the house for math time, she thought we were at Level B already. Both of my girls (and now my 4 year old boy) do math problems outloud with me throughout the day...for example there were 7 ravioli last night and the 8 year old announced that we would each get 1 and 1/2 and 1/4 more if we split it evenly. And then we discussed how to add 1/2 and 1/4.
Good luck! I am VERY HAPPY with RightStart.
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4Real Forums : Living and Loving Numbers
Topic: Right Start Thinking
