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Elizabeth
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| Posted: May 26 2008 at 4:59pm | IP Logged
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..why I am endeavoring to nurse through this pregnancy in order to tandem nurse? This gigantic "baby" girl who previously was pure joy now looks like an enormous leech with teeth every time she comes near me  . She wants to nurse incessantly. If I sit or crash on the couch she wants on--NOW. And I really don't have the energy to dance around and divert attention. We are working on beds and sleeping and she has now slept through the night exactly once in her life. I feel like all I do is foist her onto her siblings and really what I want to do is sit with her on my lap and snuggle and read stories--without involving my br*@sts every time. Am I too old for this? I've tandem nursed four other times. I don't remember pregnancy being so hard wrt nursing. I'm only half kidding with the subject line. I find that my babies who nurse well into their third year really benefit. I'm just growing weary in the stretch here and I have 28 weeks of pregnancy (that will more likely be 30) and then the juggling of newborn and toddler nursing. If you are a proponent of tandem nursing, tell me why. And how?
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Elizabeth Foss is no longer a member of this forum. Discussions now reflect the current management & are not necessarily expressions of her book, *Real Learning*, her current work, or her philosophy. (posted by E. Foss, Jan 2011)
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Louise
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| Posted: May 26 2008 at 5:56pm | IP Logged
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Elizabeth, You need to think of yourself. Pregnancy when we are older is harder on us. I have tandem nurse almost all of my children and know and believe in the advantages, but I really don't think it is as important as taking care of yourself.
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JodieLyn
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| Posted: May 26 2008 at 6:07pm | IP Logged
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Sounds like you might be having supply issues.. that's usually when the littles want to nurse so much.. trying to keep up your supply.
Maybe if you do what you can for that you can get her to slow down some.
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Jodie, wife to Dave
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hylabrook1
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| Posted: May 26 2008 at 6:38pm | IP Logged
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Elizabeth -
This sounds like when ds was 2 and I was newly pg again (would that be re-pregnant?  ). Anyway, the OB said, "Oh, he'll give up soon. The pg hormones will decrease your supply and/or change the flavor of the milk. He'll find those things discouraging." Right! He didn't find anything discouraging until the start of the third trimester. And then what he found most discouraging was the lack of a lap to sit on!
No actual advice, just "I feel your pain.."
Peace,
Nancy
ETA: This all happened when I was 38/39.
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Angie Mc
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| Posted: May 26 2008 at 7:19pm | IP Logged
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Poor dear! It sure can be challenging to nurse while prenant, Elizabeth. When I read your topic title, I quickly thought...
You are doing this because you want to share the benefits of breastfeeding with your little one *today* and you are willing to suffer now anticipating benefits in the *future*.
And...
You are feeling the real, and sometimes amazingly strong, physical sensations that can scream, "Get away!" Which then can contribute to emotional challenges and intellectual questioning.
Here are some things that have helped me...
Talk to a friend who understands, a friend who will say "Poor dear" to you (and mean it) and not try to solve your problem by saying, "Just wean her already!"
Don't get too ahead of yourself. Collect different ideas from mothers who have been there and try them out. A few changes may be just enough to bring relief and ride out this wave.
General Strategies:
Don't offer, don't refuse.
Avoid the nursing chair.
Stand a lot.
Change routines connected to one nursing session at a time until you feel some relief.
Offer distractions.
Increase child's access to food and drink.
Shorten nursing times.
Sit child next to you instead of on your lap.
Increase other physical contact through backrubs, bathtime, etc.
Praying you find just the right fit for you and your babies  .
Love,
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Angie Mc
Maimeo to Henry! Dave's wife, mom to Mrs. Devin+Michael Pope, Aiden 20,Ian 17,John Paul 11,Catherine (heaven 6/07)
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Cheryl
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| Posted: May 26 2008 at 8:20pm | IP Logged
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Elizabeth,
I feel your pain too. I just felt it ten minutes ago. I'm almost 32 weeks pregnant now and I thought for sure my happy, outgoing little dd 2 would have weaned on her own by now. She was so less needy than my dd 5. But no, she still wants to nurse.
Why am I doing it? Because she wants to. I can't give you any technical reasons. It just feels like the right thing to do.
How am I doing it?
secretly gritting my teeth
trying to pin down her arms so she can't rub, squeeeze and tickle me
no longer nursing in church - I tell her we'll nurse when we get home
sending her outside with her siblings as much as possible
realizing that she wouldn't be asking to nurse if I wasn't on the phone or at the computer
offering her a snack or some milk
negotiating - "How about just for one minute? OK two."
lots of whining to my dh - "It's taking forever." "I don't enjoy nursing when I'm pregnant." "I'm sore." Wah. Wah.
It doesn't sound like you're going to stop. I probably won't either. I'm looking forward to nursing a newborn again. I honestly don't enjoy nursing a toddler or a preschooler  and I really wish dd would give up the nursing while I'm pregnant. It would have been nice to have a little break. But I'm doing it because she's so sweet and I love her. 
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Cheryl
Wife to Bob ('97)
Mom to Matthew 13, Joseph 11, Sarah 10, Rachel 6, Hannah almost 4 and Mary 1
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Dawnie
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| Posted: May 26 2008 at 9:18pm | IP Logged
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Elizabeth,
I can sympathize with your frustrations! My "baby" is 18 months old, and I'm a bit tired of nursing her and I'm not even pregnant (but I would LOVE to be!)! I've been nursing for most of the past 9 years...I've had a 2 breaks that were several months long. Sometimes, I think I'd like to be done with this nursing thing for a while.
But, when I get tired of sitting in our nursing chair, wrestling with a wiggly toddler, I consider the reasons that I keep doing this...
1. Because when she gets sick, I know she'll nurse even if she won't eat or drink anything else. Then, I won't worry about her getting dehydrated.
2. Because as long as I'm nursing her, she probably won't get sick as often, and if she does get sick, the illness will probably not be as severe as it would be if she weren't nursing and getting all those great antibodies. There are still LOTS of antibodies in the milk a mother makes for a nursing toddler!
3. Because it's an easy way to get her to go to sleep at night and to get her to sleep for a nap. Because I can lay down with her and sleep (or at least rest), too, if I need to, at naptime.
4. Because I know from experience that it really won't be any easier to mother her if I wean her now. She will still need the same amount of attention from me, but I will have to come up with different (and probably more tiring) ways of giving it to her.
You can probably think of your own reasons to add to this list, but those are the reasons that I am continuing to nurse my toddler.
Dawn
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Donna Marie
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| Posted: May 27 2008 at 8:59am | IP Logged
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{{{{{Elizabeth}}}}}
I KNOW how you feel. My dd (3) just weaned herself. It was a sad day for me. I don't know how much this would help you, but I will share what she did...She was slowing down some and started not to climb in my lap as soon as I sat down...was just starting to... with the warm weather and new adventure with older siblings she got a real burst of independence.
She then started to realize what she was missing and want to nurse all of the time... I was sooo sore and soo sensitive that I could not take even the slightest touch anywhere around where I distribute the milk ..not to mention how much worse I felt during the GREEN months... I remember one evening with her on my lap I was tapping my foot on the floor to try to handle the feeling of "sensory overload" and then I looked down and saw her peering at me and I realized she was bouncing up and down with my foot and grinning with milk dribbling out of the corners of her mouth...she thought it was funny...I was just trying to bear with it...
I then began to ask her if she was hungry OR thirsty. (it was like giving her choices to read how she was feeling) I had little things around for just her ...simple things made special like a few fruit slices or veggie slices in a little cup that just fits into her hands...and after awhile she just wanted a quick snuggle and have me acknowledge her and she was off again. She used to nurse herself to sleep and I asked her if she would like to snuggle and cuddle first and because she was running so much during the day, she would fall asleep rather quickly missing a few nursing sessions here and there. I knew it was a good time of the year for this to happen as we are now into the healthier months of the year and I knew the need to nurse through sickness was pretty much done for now.
All of my other children were self-weaning...well except for my one son and he was almost done..the same week as his 4th birthday. I could not tandem nurse 2 and the baby...it was too much on me and I think he really knew it was time....he just knew he had a good thing going and didn't want it to stop!
I have constantly nursed since my twins were born (almost 14.5 years ago) I have LOVED tandem nursing through the years. It helped so much to have the little one bond with the baby. This is the very first time that I will be going into labor without anyone nursing. I can't believe how HARD it was to nurse during this pregnancy. I was highly sensitive. I wonder if it has anything to do with age and the pregnancy demand on my body. I was thinking that it was my body's way of telling me what it needed and that was a hard thing to even consider. I almost hated to pray for the best answer to this. God and my 3yo showed me what I needed to do. It was very gentle and natural and it was at her pace with a little encouragement from me, so I felt at peace with that...even though it is a little sad....my baby is growing up! We still spend a LOT of time together but it is more like spending time with a little lady now. She is my "helper" and will be when the baby comes in October.
I don't know if this helps or not. It is just a struggle that I had recently. I am also very very sleep deprived so I hope that I am clear enough. I wanted to respond to let you know that I feel for you! I will keep you in my prayers!
God love you!
Donna Marie from NJ
hs momma to 7dc +one more due 10/08!
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Donna Marie from NJ
hs momma to 9dc!!
Finding Elegant Simplicity
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missionfamily
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Because you could have the opposite situation and have a 13 month old who screamed at you and shook his head when you tried to get him to keep nursing beyond his first birthday  and who refuses to be cuddled in any way shape or form or to sleep with you at all and you could spend all day looking at him and wondering what you did differently to this child that he really doesn't need you that much...I'm just saying.....
And because you know that this too will pass and you will feel better and Karoline will still be a baby when it does and you will not want to have forced her to grow up before she was ready.
And because it's not so that you desire to tandem nurse as that you desire to continue to meet Karoline's needs as best you can even with this new little one on the way. And you have no way of knowing how the next few months will pan out. Karoline may just surprise you.
But you CAN start to set limits if you need to for your own sanity and physical well-being. When I had a nursing toddler driving me crazy, I always found it helped to make a rule that story time was different from nursing time...no nursing while reading...I could offer a book without committing to nurse. It helped to feel like there was some bonding time that I was in control of...and it helped to have that established when the baby came so that baby's nursing time could be toddler's story time. And I made a conscious effort to start training that toddler to nurse hands-off iykwim...so that when baby came I was not nursing one and fending off the other's roving hands all the time...some were more persistent than others about the hands, but it helped to try...I think feeling like you have a little control helps it seem less intrusive than it all of a sudden does.
Oh well, at least you know there are people who understand!
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Colleen
dh Greg
mom to Quinn,Gabriel, Brendan,Evan, Kolbe, and sweet St. Bryce
Footprints on the Fridge
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Marie
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| Posted: May 27 2008 at 4:40pm | IP Logged
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You ladies are amazing. You advice and encouragement warms my heart. I'm not preganant but I am nursing my almost 3 year old and my 14 month old. I get so sick of nursing some times but your words encouraged me. I never dreamed that I would nurse a 3 year old but here I am! Thank you for your words....
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jdostalik
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| Posted: May 27 2008 at 4:54pm | IP Logged
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I understand, Elizabeth, I really do.
I've been tandem nursing since 1997 with no breaks. It is always the hardest for me in my first trimester when I am so very nauseated and tired and do not have the energy for all the distractions necessary to buy myself some "nurse-free" time! 
That said, two years ago when I was pregnant with my now 16 month old, I had the HARDEST time perservering through nursing. My breasts and nipples were so sensitive and raw. I was in such PAIN when I nursed. Literally, I had to sometimes hold onto the arm of the chair with a clenched fist just to get through a short nursing session. I think that my age (40) at the time really affected me. I did make it and was so happy that I did. As you know, there is nothing more wonderful than a grateful toddler who knows she can still nurse when the baby is done!
I have found that either reading or watching TV while I nurse has helped me to distract myself from the unpleasantness of nursing when pregnant. I don't always feel terrible when I nurse but when I am feeling less than stellar and distractions don't work for the toddler, they sort of work for me...helps to get my mind off having my life blood sucked right out of me!
So far this pregnancy, nursing the baby isn't a problem most of the time, it's the 3 year old who is driving me mad. We are working on very short nursing sessions--"just for a minute" or "okay, you can nurse until I count to 10 and then we'll get a drink or read a book or get a cookie..." I have never nursed three at once and though I should never say never, I realllly don't think I could do it at the ripe old age of 42!!
Hang in there and know that I'm praying for you.
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God Bless,
Jennifer in TX
wife to Bill, mom to six here on earth and eight in heaven.
Let the Little Ones Come
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time4tea
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Elizabeth,
When I was expecting our last baby, now 9 months old, my 4 YEAR OLD as still nursing like a maniac! She stopped during the pregnancy, because she said the milk tasted different, and that I should "change it back, Mommy!" I told her, "I can't; your new little sister needs it the way it is," and she finally just got tired of it all and stopped  . I was very relieved because I found it painful to nurse during pregnancy. Bottom line: you need to take care of yourself here. If it works to tandem nurse, so be it. If it doesn't, don't, by any means, feel guilty about stopping!
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Blessings to you!
~Tea
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Vanna
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HUGS!!!
I have never tandem nursed (my kids are 10 years apart) but I am still nursing my 2 1/2 year old. Often. Very Very Often. I feel your pain there. I know it's not my milk supply. I think I have enough milk to feed a small continent. It's just a comfort/closeness thing. Just remind yourself that you are providing the most loving, nurturing early childhood that a mother can provide for her children.
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amyable
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This is the first time I've tandem nursed, so take this with a grain of salt since I don't have a whole lot of experience.
I'll jump right in with the "how" - I had a lot of trouble getting through the pregnancy with it. But I read here and on other forums that that feeling of wanting to crawl out of your skin, of wanting to wean and never nurse anyone ever again , is totally normal and even common. So I kept telling myself it's just something to get through. Something to offer up for the health of the baby, or whatever intentions are on your mind (I think I carved off a lot of purgatory time for myself and others it was that bad ).
I also set limits on nursing, especially when I was at my most tired/sick. I offered "joyfully" at times I wanted to lie down and sleep (like her nap) and didn't mind so much because I was so tired I slept through some of it. I tried to make it more routine (i.e. first thing in the morning, after lunch, before nap, etc) so that both she and I knew what to expect. Yes, there were tears! Really, I think that's OK. Sad for both of you, but OK nonetheless. Maybe at my DD's age (she was about 18 months when I first got pg) she didn't totally understand when I said, "No, not now, Mommy is feeling sick/too tired but I'll nurse you before lunch" ...but she eventually understood the message.
Why do I tandem? Well, because I *can* this time! (various reasons for other times not being able) Because when she's three and says "I'm saving some for baby Jeffrey" (who weighs almost as much as she does ) my heart melts. Because when a stomach virus passes around the house and she doesn't get it, I am thankful. Because she is an extremely strong willed little girl and it's one way we can connect and be allies instead of adversaries! Because who knows the millions of health benefits they haven't discovered yet - especially for my atopic/asthmatics. Maybe a bit because I'm lazy and it's easier to just keep on keeping on, than to struggle with a change! And because I knew it wouldn't always be the "constant" nursing and even if I didn't put limits on it, it would limit itself soon enough.
Well, my 3yo nursling and her sister just climbed up to me with new books from the library, so I'd better run. We'll pray that you can get through this time without too much trouble.
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Amy
mom of 5, ages 6-16, and happy wife of 
The Highly Sensitive Homeschooler
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StephanieA
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I have been nursing non-stop for the last 20+ years, either tandem nursing or nursing all the way through the pregnancy. (One toddler nursed her last the night I left to give birth to her sister).
Honestly....I dislike tandem nursing. But even nursing while pregnant, the emotions, the discomfort, (OK....pain), just does me in some days. The last pregnancy I was so sick I had to find serious coping strategies.
1. Offer a drink first. So if the toddler wants to nurse, at least she/he isn't sucking the guts out of your nearly empty breast.
2. I pray and offer it up for the safely and health of the new baby. So if I sit down to nurse, I tell myself, "OK, this will be a decade (rosary) nursing session. Ready, Set, NURSE" and away both of us goes.
Sometimes it is just a "Hail Mary" or "Our Father"
slurp
3. I do try reading, distraction, etc., but if the toddler has nursing on his mind, I can't seem to refuse him while he cries. I have to remember that I am building a relationship here. The medical benefits aren't that overwhelming at the age of 2, but I think the emotional ties are. I will reap the benefits (hopefully) when the child is 15 or 16.
Blessings,
Stephanie
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4Real Forums : Mothering and Family Life
Topic: Somebody please tell me again...
