| Author | |
SusanJ
Forum All-Star
Joined: May 25 2007
Location: New Jersey
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1347
|
| Posted: April 04 2008 at 3:23pm | IP Logged
|
 |
|
The only time I've ever worn a chapel veil was at an audience with the Holy Father but I've always thought I would wear one if I ever lived in a parish where veiling is normal. (An aside that some of you might find funny--we were on a road trip once and stopped in Front Royal, VA for a daily Mass. I was dressed like a bum--for me--in a t-shirt and khakis and, of course, didn't have a veil with me. I was mortified around all the women in veils and dresses. Probably some of you were there!)
I've been feeling an increasing desire to veil but a few concerns/questions I have:
How do you do it with babies and toddlers? Even if I pinned the veil on I think I would be in pain from having my hair pulled through Mass. Do the babies just get used to it after awhile? Is there a style that works better for moms? The veil I have is a simple triangle. I looked at Michele Q's blog and her veil is beautiful but I must be a pattern dunce because I don't see how it "doesn't have edges for little hands to pull." Maybe someone can explain this better?
Does the color of the veil signify anything? The one I have is white because I wore it with my wedding dress. I'm a bit more attracted to black or brown because that seems less obtrusive. Does it matter or is it just personal preference? I know that when veils were required that any kind of head covering "counted" but I'm still interested to know if the color of the veil carried any symbolism.
Do any of you veil sometimes but not others? I would be very comfortable veiling when we go to the National Shrine for Mass but I would really stand out at our parish. Then there is the toddler issue. We have enough behavior stress right now as it is. I might veil only when I'm at Mass alone. Also I think my family would really think I was nuts and my grandmother might be quite upset.
I've avoided veiling in the past because I didn't want to cause division or draw undue attention to myself. We have also had very painful experiences with the Tridentine community but I'm hoping that things are easing after the motu proprio.
If anyone can offer advice or encouragement I would be appreciative.
Thanks,
Susan
__________________
Mom to Joseph-8, Margaret-6, William-4, Gregory-2, and new little one due 11/1
Life Together
[URL=http://thejohnstonkids.blogspot.com]The Kids' Blog[/UR
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Mackfam
Board Moderator
Non Nobis
Joined: April 24 2006
Location: Alabama
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 14656
|
| Posted: April 04 2008 at 3:39pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Susan - I have some answers and thoughts for you, but I need to finish lessons and the baby is nursing. I'll be back. 
__________________
Jen Mackintosh
Wife to Rob, mom to dd 19 , ds 16, ds 11, dd 8, and dd 3
Wildflowers and Marbles
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
DominaCaeli
Forum All-Star
Joined: April 24 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3711
|
| Posted: April 04 2008 at 4:16pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Hi, Susan. These are all great questions, and I'm going to take a stab at them...
SusanJ wrote:
| How do you do it with babies and toddlers? Even if I pinned the veil on I think I would be in pain from having my hair pulled through Mass. Do the babies just get used to it after awhile? Is there a style that works better for moms? |
|
|
Veiling with toddlers can be tricky, but I do think that most children get used to it after awhile. My children are 18 months and 21 months, and neither of them messes with my veil at all now. When they were smaller, I just used to gently redirect their hands and whisper "no" when they would try to grab at it. They both caught on fairly quickly. My problem, actually, is keeping it from working its way off when I am constantly looking this way and that, so I use a chiffon scarf and just tie it off to the side, under my chin. (I'm going for the Grace Kelly look!  ) Chiffon scarves are easy to find at the store. I have also made my own scarves by buying a quarter yard of sheer fabric, cutting it into a neat rectangle, and hemming the sides. When I am at Mass alone, I use a regular triangle-shaped veil, since that is what I prefer.
SusanJ wrote:
| Does the color of the veil signify anything? The one I have is white because I wore it with my wedding dress. I'm a bit more attracted to black or brown because that seems less obtrusive. Does it matter or is it just personal preference? I know that when veils were required that any kind of head covering "counted" but I'm still interested to know if the color of the veil carried any symbolism. |
|
|
I have heard that traditionally, unmarried women wore white veils and married women wore dark veils. This is no longer the case, of course--I have seen people wear veils of all colors, no matter what age. I wear both light and dark veils, depending on what I am wearing and if I am going to a parish where veils are common or not. Like you, I think a dark veil blends in with my dark hair better, so I go that route at our local parish, where there are no other women who veil.
SusanJ wrote:
| Do any of you veil sometimes but not others? I would be very comfortable veiling when we go to the National Shrine for Mass but I would really stand out at our parish. Then there is the toddler issue. We have enough behavior stress right now as it is. I might veil only when I'm at Mass alone. Also I think my family would really think I was nuts and my grandmother might be quite upset. |
|
|
I have gone through periods like this. When I first began to veil, I was going to a Tridentine-rite parish on Sundays and daily Mass at our local, rather liberal parish. In those days, I veiled only at Sunday Mass--that's all I felt comfortable with. As I have become more accustomed to the veil, I now feel a bit naked at Mass without it. So I wear it all the time. And I can understand your concern over your family's response. I am a convert, so my parents are still evangelical Christians and have never attended Mass with me except at our wedding. I am sure I gave them a shock in my veil for my daughter's baptism.
SusanJ wrote:
| I've avoided veiling in the past because I didn't want to cause division or draw undue attention to myself. We have also had very painful experiences with the Tridentine community but I'm hoping that things are easing after the motu proprio. |
|
|
I am really sorry for this, Susan, and I do hope that, as our Holy Father has wished, the Motu Proprio eases any tensions there may be among various groups in the Church. I am definitely the kind of person that hates having attention drawn to me too--I am really quite shy. Having the full support of my husband in my veiling, as in so many things, has been extremely helpful.
Anyway, I am happy to discuss any of these issues further!
__________________
Blessings,
Celeste
Joyous Lessons
Mommy to six: three boys (8, 4, newborn) and four girls (7, 5, 2, and 1)
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Mackfam
Board Moderator
Non Nobis
Joined: April 24 2006
Location: Alabama
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 14656
|
| Posted: April 04 2008 at 4:36pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Susan -
I have to be brief. I'm sure there must be others here that can throw their 2cents in as well.
I've been veiling (both at Novus Ordo and TLM) for three years now, ever since I consecrated myself to the Blessed Virgin. Like you, I just felt pulled in that direction, so I read everything I could get my hands on. I began on the Feast of the Assumption. It was a discipline I was convinced the Blessed Virgin was calling me to. It is not, as you know, dogma. I am such a visual person, and I believe the Blessed Virgin uses the veil to help me with humility and distraction.
How to with babies and toddlers...Sometimes I tie under my chin, but usually I just toss a section of the veil over my shoulder towards my back instead of allowing it to fall over the front side of my shoulder. That is what I do with the baby. My toddler likes to veil himself under whatever side of the veil he happens to be on. When they start to pull, and they do, I just gently pull back and when they're old enough to understand, I tell them no. It has never been a big issue. I do pin my veils. Some days the veil is a bit disheveled, but who cares.
The color...It really doesn't matter as long as you're veiled. I wear black during Lent and Ordinary time, white or cream during Easter and Feasts of Our Lady. A hat is fine too.
I always veil. In our Novus Ordo Mass, I'm sure I stood out/continue to stand out. Dd and I are the only ones veiled. First, let me say, I never judge anyone who does not veil. As I said earlier, I really felt called and truly believe the Blessed Virgin wishes this of me. My dh is supportive. My motives were never for anyone else to see me in the veil, so I really don't care about standing out. I just don't even think about it.
I veil out of respect for Our dear Lord. It is an outward symbol of an interior disposition (that I try to have.) I veil out of respect for my husband, under whose authority I am. It helps shield me from visual distractions which I am particularly weak when it comes to avoiding. Because these are the reasons I veil, I decided that they are not more present at some Masses than at others, therefore I veil if I am in the presence of Our Lord - period.
I was a little unsure at first too Susan. You will be able to discern the best course for you through prayer.
__________________
Jen Mackintosh
Wife to Rob, mom to dd 19, ds 16, ds 11, dd 8, and dd 3
Wildflowers and Marbles
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
DominaCaeli
Forum All-Star
Joined: April 24 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3711
|
| Posted: April 04 2008 at 4:43pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Mackfam wrote:
| I've been veiling (both at Novus Ordo and TLM) for three years now, ever since I consecrated myself to the Blessed Virgin. Like you, I just felt pulled in that direction, so I read everything I could get my hands on. I began on the Feast of the Assumption. It was a discipline I was convinced the Blessed Virgin was calling me to. It is not, as you know, dogma. I am such a visual person, and I believe the Blessed Virgin uses the veil to help me with humility and distraction. |
|
|
Jennifer, I felt the very same call, and, oddly enough, I began veiling on the Feast of the Assumption too, two years ago!
Mackfam wrote:
| I veil out of respect for Our dear Lord. It is an outward symbol of an interior disposition (that I try to have.) I veil out of respect for my husband, under whose authority I am. It helps shield me from visual distractions which I am particularly weak when it comes to avoiding. Because these are the reasons I veil, I decided that they are not more present at some Masses than at others, therefore I veil if I am in the presence of Our Lord - period. |
|
|
I just wanted to add that you said this beautifully, Jennifer. This is exactly how I feel, word for word.
__________________
Blessings,
Celeste
Joyous Lessons
Mommy to six: three boys (8, 4, newborn) and four girls (7, 5, 2, and 1)
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
CrunchyMom
Forum Moderator
Joined: Sept 03 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6385
|
| Posted: April 05 2008 at 12:49am | IP Logged
|
|
|
I hat. I've never had an issue with toddlers pulling them off. I've also seen people use regular scarves tied under the chin or behind the head.
I'm not sure how long the lace mantilla has been the head covering of choice. There seems to be some debate over that and its possible that particular head covering became more popular in the 50s and 60s because ladies stopped wearing hats as much in general.
__________________
Lindsay
Five Boys(6/04) (6/06) (9/08)(3/11),(7/13), and 1 girl (5/16)
My Symphony
[URL=http://mysymphonygarden.blogspot.com/]Lost in the Cosmos[/UR
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
LucyP
Forum All-Star
Joined: Aug 05 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 791
|
| Posted: April 05 2008 at 3:17am | IP Logged
|
|
|
I started to wear a veil when we started going to an anglo-catholic church, and of course carried on when we started at a Catholic church - I did it because I felt that if Jesus is physically present here, I must do it - it was a growing inner conviction that I could not shake.
I wear black because it blends in well - I bought a larger mantilla, and usually wear it tied uner my chin, at the nape of my neck, or with the ends pulled over opposite shoulder - that way baby can't pull it off so easily. And to be honest, I am not that hyper about it - I will readjust before I go up to the altar, but if it slips a bit, it slips a bit. I don't feel that the heavenly court will reel if they see an extra inch of hair!
In our church, some ladies wear hats - but whether they do when it is not cold, I'm not sure. We seem to be the minority who strip off coats and cardies when we get to our pew - other people are still in full outdoor wear! There's a nun who obviously veils, and sometimes some African ladies who wear scarves.
But I think it doesn't matter. I try very hard to not notice! I don't think it is naughty of other women who don't veil, and I was so worried that I was making them think I did that I considered not veiling myself but I know if I did that I couldn't get myself in through the door. (I always keep a smaller mantilla in my handbag so I can pull that out if I forget my larger one.)
I think it's lovely you feel this pull,Susan. Your attitude will make the difference of perceptions of distraction, pride, division etc - if you are obeying a call on your spirit and doing so humbly I think that will show and be felt in a spiritual sense. May the Lord bless you!
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
SusanMc
Forum Pro
Joined: Jan 21 2008
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 192
|
| Posted: April 05 2008 at 10:01am | IP Logged
|
|
|
I experimented with veiling a few years ago and often used a "stealth veil" for Sunday Mass i.e. a printed scarf or bandana tied at the nape of my neck. My head was covered and it didn't feel too conspicuous.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Lisbet
Forum All-Star
Joined: Feb 07 2006
Location: Michigan
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2706
|
| Posted: April 05 2008 at 11:01am | IP Logged
|
|
|
I have veiled for years now. I wear a chapel cap with a baby rather than a veil most of the time. I do love the look of a drapey veil, but, well, it's not about looks, right? 
__________________
Lisa, wife to Tony,
Mama to:
Nick, 17
Abby, 15
Gabe, 13
Isaac, 11
Mary, 10
Sam, 9
Henry, 7
Molly, 6
Mark, 5
Greta, 3
Cecilia born 10.29.10
Josephine born 6.11.12
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
SusanJ
Forum All-Star
Joined: May 25 2007
Location: New Jersey
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1347
|
| Posted: April 05 2008 at 12:07pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
What is a chapel cap, Lisa?
__________________
Mom to Joseph-8, Margaret-6, William-4, Gregory-2, and new little one due 11/1
Life Together
[URL=http://thejohnstonkids.blogspot.com]The Kids' Blog[/UR
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Lisbet
Forum All-Star
Joined: Feb 07 2006
Location: Michigan
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2706
|
| Posted: April 05 2008 at 12:38pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Susan, It's a round lacy type thing. I pin it to the top of my head and it just covers my hair. (which is very short.)
__________________
Lisa, wife to Tony,
Mama to:
Nick, 17
Abby, 15
Gabe, 13
Isaac, 11
Mary, 10
Sam, 9
Henry, 7
Molly, 6
Mark, 5
Greta, 3
Cecilia born 10.29.10
Josephine born 6.11.12
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
SusanJ
Forum All-Star
Joined: May 25 2007
Location: New Jersey
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1347
|
| Posted: April 05 2008 at 1:00pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Ahh, yes. My dh's little brother calls them doilies. 
Thanks for the encouragement, everyone!
__________________
Mom to Joseph-8, Margaret-6, William-4, Gregory-2, and new little one due 11/1
Life Together
[URL=http://thejohnstonkids.blogspot.com]The Kids' Blog[/UR
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
|
|
4Real Forums : Domestic Church
Topic: more on chapel veils
