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kingvozzo
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| Posted: Sept 26 2007 at 2:36pm | IP Logged
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For it? Against is?
The kids have a ped. appt tomorrow and the office was asking about vaccinating them. We do some vaccines, the ones that do not contain aborted fetal cells. The flu vaccine does NOT contain fetal cells, but I'm just not sure whether it's really neccessary.
I know the mercury is a big issue too, but I believe the vaccine they're offering is the thimerisol-free version.
What are your thoughts?
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Noreen
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folklaur
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| Posted: Sept 26 2007 at 4:34pm | IP Logged
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The only person in our family who has ever gotten the Flu vaccine was my dh. He did it one time. It was also the only year he EVER caught the flu, and he was so sick it was scary. Just a coincidence, I'm sure, but after that experience we have never considered it, especially for the kids. dh says, "No way!"
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JodieLyn
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I'm not sure how much of a coincident that might be when I've heard from many people that they got the flu only AFTER getting the shot.
But then the medical community has them convinced that "just think how bad it would have been if I didn't get the shot" 
The flu shot even if it actually worked is a gamble.. because they GUESS what the most likely strains are for that year and vacinate against those.. but that may not be the one you get anyway.. if you get any.
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Maryan
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I've never got it for myself of the kids, Noreen, but more from not knowing what it is. I haven't had the time to find out more about it, so I haven't done what I don't know enough about.
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Maryan
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Caroline
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My dh absolutely insists we must all get it. I never received one before we were married but have ever since...and so have the kids. We've never had a problem with either the vaccine or the flu.
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Anneof 5
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I have really mixed feelings about it. I have gotten it off and on over the years. My three older kids have gotten it the past few years but I have not done it for my two younger ones. My dd6 became extremely ill 45 minutes after getting it about 3 years ago. Over 104 temp and I was really worried. I called the clinic and they tended to dismiss my concerns. But at her last well child check the dr said to skip it for her. Last year in my state about 5 or 6 people died from the flu, some of them children. The media here loves to scare us to death about it and they are already having news stories covering flu shot clinics and such for this fall. None of us has ever gotten the flu...thank you God!
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Red Cardigan
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As with any vaccine, it's a good idea to look at the information out there.
First of all, the flu vaccine is an annual guessing game. Flu, of course, like the common cold, is not a single virus but a whole set of viruses, any one of which can cause flu symptoms. Each year, the medical community tries to guess which strains of flu will appear in the wild during that year's flu season. However, the vaccine is manufactured long before the annual flu season hits--so there's no guarantee that the medical researchers who make the decision as to which specific strains of flu should go into that year's vaccine will be right. In a good year, the vaccine may contain the strain that causes the most trouble that year--but in a bad year, the vaccine can "miss" completely and provide no protection whatsoever against the dominant flu strain.
Second, certain people should not receive flu vaccine. The vaccine should never be given to anyone who has a fever at the time the shot or dose is given. In addition, certain immune system problems, egg allergy, mercury allergy, and a previous history of Guillain-Barre syndrome are all contraindications for the flu vaccine--the vaccine should not be given to people who fit the above categories.
Speaking of Guillain-Barre syndrome, this syndrome is the most serious potential adverse effect of the flu vaccine, causing muscle weakness, unsteady gait, numbness, tingling, pain and possible paralysis of one or more limbs or the face. While this complication is only rarely fatal, it can lead to lingering and recurring health problems.
In addition to the above concerns, it should be noted that despite many recommendations for pregnant women to receive flu vaccine, no animal reproduction studies have been done on the vaccine, at least according to most of the package inserts of the most readily available forms of the vaccine. (If anyone knows otherwise, please let me know!) What this means is that doctors are recommending a shot for pregnant women when they have absolutely no data on possible fetal harm to work with. Also, it is not known whether the vaccine passes into breast milk, so nursing mothers should use extreme caution. Pregnant women are generally not given the nasal spray form of the vaccine.
The reason for that last is an important consideration. Like polio vaccine, flu vaccine is available in two forms: the killed virus version (which is generally injected) and the live virus version (which is the nasal spray form). Despite the constant statement that you can't get flu from the vaccine, not even the live virus version, it's important to note that the reason we no longer use the live virus polio vaccine in America is precisely because it did cause polio: every case of polio in America from the late 1970s until the live vaccine was removed from general use could be traced to the vaccine, because people vaccinated with this version would shed polio in their nasal and other bodily wastes for about two months after they received the vaccine. So I tend to take the idea that you can't get flu from the live virus flu vaccine with a grain, so to speak: you are inhaling live, but weakened, virus when you take that form of the vaccine.
Why even have a live virus version? Because the killed virus version is less effective, and may not prevent flu as successfully as the live virus version--assuming that the medical community has "guessed" correctly which flu strains will actually be circulating that year.
On the mercury question, some "mercury free" flu vaccines use trace amounts of thimerosal in the manufacturing process, but are still considered thimerosal-free because the amounts are very small by the time the finished product reaches the market. In addition, most multiple-dose vials of the shot are still being preserved with thimerosal; I'd ask for the manufacturer's name and whether the dose comes from a single-dose vial, just to be sure.
Ultimately, the risk/benefit calculation comes down to each family, and people may feel very strongly in favor of various vaccines or against them; but it can be hard to make a decision without all the information.
Speaking of which, there is one final piece of information that is important to note. While the CDC says that 36,000 people die every year from the flu, that is an estimate that is based on data models, NOT on death certificates! The CDC assumes that more people die of heart attacks, pneumonia, etc. in the winter because they had the flu, and use these assumptions to come up with this number, but there's no way to verify that flu was even an associated cause of death in the majority of these cases--in other words, no one checks to see if the patient actually had the flu. The largest number of ACTUAL deaths from flu recorded in the recent past was 3,006 in 1981. While each of these represents a human tragedy for some family, the total number is off by a factor greater than ten as compared to each year's annual "estimate" of flu deaths.
I'm sorry this is so long--but it can be hard to put all of this together, and I'm hoping that at least some of the info will be useful.
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mary theresa
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| Posted: Sept 27 2007 at 12:25pm | IP Logged
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JodieLyn wrote:
I'm not sure how much of a coincident that might be when I've heard from many people that they got the flu only AFTER getting the shot.
The flu shot even if it actually worked is a gamble.. because they GUESS what the most likely strains are for that year and vacinate against those.. but that may not be the one you get anyway.. if you get any. |
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This is exactly what I have heard, too. I have never and will never get the flu vaccine.
Also, I actually avoid being around those who have gotten the flu vaccine, as sometimes they are contagious with the flu, though they may not show symptoms. I know many in my family (myself included)who have gotten sick after spending an extended period of time with ppl who have rec'd the vaccine.
On a side note -- thanks Red for all the info! I knew some of what you discussed but it's good to know more.
Oh, also here's a link to a site I found while researching a bit. I haven't read all of it and I don't personally know the reliableness of the information (my pro-all-vaccines pediatrian is fond of telling me that anyone can post anti-vaccine stuff on the interenet and it doesn't mean a thing  ) but you can take it FWIW.
Good luck deciding!
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PDyer
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I've been advised to get the flu vaccine because of the effects of the medication I take for my autoimmune condition. I have not done so (and I've declined them for my children) for several years because of my concerns about thimerosal. Reasonably or not, I don't trust the vaccination makers to give us full disclosure on this matter, so we decline the shots. I'll save my toxic risk for a pandemic flu, should that concern ever come to be.
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aussieannie
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The scary thing is Patty (and you are obviously aware of this) mercury triggers autoimmune diseases (and further fuels them? I wonder..) I have suffered severe mercury posioning and ended up with an autoimmune disease...needless to say I am vehemently anti-vaccination.
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vmalott
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I'm glad this thread is here, as the topic came up at my prenatal appt today. Apparently the hospitals in my area are requiring children under the age of 14 be vaccinated against the flu (w/documentation) before being allowed to visit their newborn sibling in the hospital. This goes for families who will be due anywhere between November and March--I'm due in January.
My OB asked if I was thinking about getting the vax myself, but in a no pressure way.
Honestly, I think this requirement is so incredibly arbitrary. Kids under 14 need a vax to visit mom and baby in the hospital, yet there's no requirement for dads, relatives, older sibs, or doulas (or doctors/nurses for that matter)??? This issue is enough to make me consider birthing at home again, or planning on an early release. ::sigh::
Valerie
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JennGM
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vmalott wrote:
I'm glad this thread is here, as the topic came up at my prenatal appt today. Apparently the hospitals in my area are requiring children under the age of 14 be vaccinated against the flu (w/documentation) before being allowed to visit their newborn sibling in the hospital. This goes for families who will be due anywhere between November and March--I'm due in January.
My OB asked if I was thinking about getting the vax myself, but in a no pressure way. |
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What a shame! I don't know if that's the policy here--I hope not. My son can't even have the flu vaccine because he's allergic to egg.
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Lori B
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Our family gets the flu vaccine (not the live one)because our 6yo has a compromised immune system- we need to take every precaution we can. Also, since my son has severe asthma it's a good idea for him anyway.
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vmalott
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| Posted: Oct 19 2007 at 8:12am | IP Logged
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JennGM wrote:
| My son can't even have the flu vaccine because he's allergic to egg. |
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In that event, I'm sure a waiver letter from his doc would be sufficient.
It has been nearly 5 years since I gave birth in a hospital (end of November), and it wasn't an issue then. I don't know whether to try to fight this rule, or just hope that we can get dismissed ASAP. I do know that a hospital visit is NOT worth potentially harming my other 6 children by getting them all the flu vax.
Valerie
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Mary Chris
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The last time I got the vaccine was about 7 years ago, my youngest was a nursling then and he woke up the next morning with a rash all over his body. 
I only took the vaccine because Carter was going through chemo. They had actually drawn the vaccine for him, but decided not give it to him because he was on IV chemo and it would probably have been a useless shot, so they gave it to me instead.
My dd may have also gotten the vaccine that year, because she was in school, but I think in subsequent years we avoided it. Because of Carter we could have gotten it even when it was rationed. If my kiddos had been in school while Carter was on treatment I probably would have gotten it for them.
I don't have them get it these days. I think our risk of the flu is pretty minimal since they are at home. I did have the flu two years ago and I was miserable but not enough to get a shot. 
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dollylima
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I get the flu vaccine at work, because I work in an ICU and I feel I owe it to my patients and to my family to not pass the flu along in either direction...especially since my father, with whom we reside right now, has heart issues and would be seriously in danger were he to contract the virus.
My son has allergy-induced asthma. He gets a shot each year. I request they give him the mercury-free one. We have never had any problems.
If I felt I had a choice, I think we would abstain, but I don't think it would be ethical for me to not get vaccinated.
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4Real Forums : Our Lady of Good Remedy and Care
Topic: Flu vaccine
